8-B Tournament Semifinals: Kamen Rider Ixa vs Gene

[Armorchompy]

7.5x is the one-shotting range.
I'm pretty sure the gap that big allow you to ignore whatever kind of hit the opponent trying to make (unless it's Dura neg or some ability that dont focus on destruction).
If it's simply shrugging off the attacks then i pretty sure it's smaller.

It's not this small lol, 2x (which I have to repeat again, is actually way less than 2x since Gene upscales a lot)

Even if we assume the 2x gap isnt big enough for Ixa to shrugg off, he still has high pain endurance which allow him to shrug off the attacks on his level, so enduring Gene's attacks wont be a problem at all because Ixa already has AP advantage.

Yeah, he shrugged off throwing knives, which have basically zero stopping force, while he was running at full force against them, no shit, Gene attacks you while you're off-balance from preparing your own attack and strikes the best possible targets such as the head or the feet.

How do they work? Cause Nago is already stronger than Gene, and he’s actually fought against stronger opponents like Dogga Kiva and still survived. So like a super powerful attack wouldn’t be something new for Nago to
handle

Head slicer allows him to cut stuff with his hands, Daisy Cutter makes weakened enemies explode.

In the previous videos we linked, you can literally see the setting being normal and then straight to the Sol Flasher. Not only that, it literally light.

Which one? Also the fact that the light moves at SoL doesn't mean it intensifies that fast.

I said "swatting away, pushing away, throwing anything", not resisting blows. From the gameplay, Gene's grapple and ability to manhandle opponents is a big part of his arsenal and his combos, Gene won't be don't anything that here. He will have to rely on strikes more than anything.

Not really, you can't actually willingly grapple enemies in God Hand at all, it's just something he does to stunned enemies to inflict the max damage possible. Generally he's weaker in LS than basically every boss so he can't abuse it much, his combat is all strikes.

Ehh, comparing humans to races like legendoras that have Tiers 5-A warriors in their clan is not it.

Clearly he didn't beat the 5-A ones in this key lol. Plus, did you miss the fact that this is like, Gene's least impressive skill feat? He can instantly master hella hard martial arts moves just by reading a scroll about them, forming in the span of what must be at most a couple weeks an arsenal of what's at least 4/5 fighting styles combined, and that's without going into his sheer versatility which I've talked about enough already.

ope, get well soon

thanks

Well, let just treat it as a hax rather than an AP thing, since Toei's website treat it as such :v

No... Candelas are a measurement of energy. One that is straight-up incorrect for this kind of statement, mind you, but it's still energy, you can't pretend it isn't.

 

[IxaSaga2]

Not really, you can't actually willingly grapple enemies in God Hand at all, it's just something he does to stunned enemies to inflict the max damage possible. Generally he's weaker in LS than basically every boss so he can't abuse it much, his combat is all strikes.

Hmm, even then it but really hard to pull that off based off Ixa's versatility. Ixa has Ixa Calibur which saps life and will decrease Gene's fighting ability. When things get bad, he can get on Ixalion and play a long range game, shooting Gene with Ixa Calibur while driving around or use Broken Fang.

Clearly he didn't beat the 5-A ones in this key lol. Plus, did you miss the fact that this is like, Gene's least impressive skill feat? He can instantly master hella hard martial arts moves just by reading a scroll about them, forming in the span of what must be at most a couple weeks an arsenal of what's at least 4/5 fighting styles combined, and that's without going into his sheer versatility which I've talked about enough already.

the Legendoras has generals that are 8-B too that are really skilled like the Medusa, Mandrake and Mummy Legendoras. Although not to the extent of Gene. Ixa does get out skilled but not to the extent that Gene will hit combos after combos.

Edit: Ixa's own Explosion Manip is equal to Gene's but Ixa has more AP going for him and it works for all his moves so while Head Slicer is Gene's option to go for Explosion Manip, Ixa has tons more to go to his.

 

[MagiSinbad]

It's not this small lol, 2x (which I have to repeat again, is actually way less than 2x since Gene upscales a lot)

Please tell me how do you sure it is less than 2x ? Since it's unknown amount stronger then there is no guaranteer that it is less than 2x or still more than 2x.

Yeah, he shrugged off throwing knives, which have basically zero stopping force, while he was running at full force against them, no shit, Gene attacks you while you're off-balance from preparing your own attack and strikes the best possible targets such as the head or the feet.

It does look like having zero stopping force without context, yes.

But no, Rook (the lion fangire that is fighting Ixa) is considered as a threat by everyone in the same arc, and in the video, he is fighting to kills, so the attacks flying from his body are meant to kill Ixa, but Ixa still endure and shrugg off them like nothing.

And when Ixa is off balance or off guard? He alway either shoot the hell out of the opponent if the range is long, or charge full force at the opponent to attack them like you see in the video.

And again, if Ixa can endure and shrug off the attacks that are comparable to him then what chance do the attacks that weaker than him has? I can only see Gene tries to flinches Ixa with his combo attacks then get shrug off and get counter back with Ixa's own combo of attacks.

No... Candelas are a measurement of energy. One that is straight-up incorrect for this kind of statement, mind you, but it's still energy, you can't pretend it isn't.

Context matter. Most of us dismiss it as some kind of AP feat is because Sol Flasher is never a tool of destruction, it has one job and that is blinding the enemies.
Beside, the official site just uses it to describe the intensity of the Sol Flasher's light, so i dont see why we dont stick with just that aspect of 3 milions candela.

Or you suggest we upgrade the fangires for have tanked that much intensity of candelas focused on a single point?

 

[IxaSaga2]

Context matter. Most of us dismiss it as some kind of AP feat is because Sol Flasher is never a tool of destruction, it has one job and that is blinding the enemies.
Beside, the official site just uses it to describe the intensity of the Sol Flasher's light, so i dont see why we dont stick with just that aspect of 3 milions candela.

Or you suggest we upgrade the fangires for have tanked that much intensity of candelas focused on a single point?

To add to this, things in fiction sometimes don't work the same way in real life.

 

[BERRIES555]

Head slicer allows him to cut stuff with his hands, Daisy Cutter makes weakened enemies explode.

Which one? Also the fact that the light moves at SoL doesn't mean it intensifies that fast.

That shoudnt really work on Ixa tbh. He’s already stronger than Gene

I mean, in the videos we sent, the Fangires immediately try to cover their eyes as soon as the flasher comes out.

 

[Armorchompy]

Hmm, even then it but really hard to pull that off based off Ixa's versatility. Ixa has Ixa Calibur which saps life and will decrease Gene's fighting ability.

It's a sword, Gene's gonna be killed by a good hit anyway, life manip is redundant and Gene would be able to avoid it anyway

When things get bad, he can get on Ixalion and play a long range game, shooting Gene with Ixa Calibur while driving around or use Broken Fang.

If Gene allows him to get on that, which I'm not so sure. Also he could Chain Yanker the bike to swipe it away from under his feet, I assume it doesn't have LS feats?

the Legendoras has generals that are 8-B too that are really skilled like the Medusa, Mandrake and Mummy Legendoras. Although not to the extent of Gene. Ixa does get out skilled but not to the extent that Gene will hit combos after combos.

Eh, I'm not so sure, it's not just a skill thing, the most likely counterplay to Gene's fighting style is being able to prevent him from putting you in a bad spot, the second he gets that one good hit in you're basically at his mercy, at least for a while- that counts even for Azel who's almost Gene's equal.

Edit: Ixa's own Explosion Manip is equal to Gene's but Ixa has more AP going for him and it works for all his moves so while Head Slicer is Gene's option to go for Explosion Manip, Ixa has tons more to go to his.

No, like, if enemies are weakened they are what explodes.

Please tell me how do you sure it is less than 2x ? Since it's unknown amount stronger then there is no guaranteer that it is less than 2x or still more than 2x.

There's no "being sure", it's not an exact science but considering it's two fairly sizable steps above the base feat and Gene is barely below 2x, I'm pretty damn sure of it.

It does look like having zero stopping force without context, yes.

But no, Rook (the lion fangire that is fighting Ixa) is considered as a threat by everyone in the same arc, and in the video, he is fighting to kills, so the attacks flying from his body are meant to kill Ixa, but Ixa still endure and shrugg off them like nothing.

Stopping force doesn't directly relate to AP, a gun is very deadly but it's not gonna blow a running man away or something, while a kick might be less dangerous, but do a better job at stopping that.

And when Ixa is off balance or off guard? He alway either shoot the hell out of the opponent if the range is long, or charge full force at the opponent to attack them like you see in the video.

They start at extended melee range so he won't do either.

And again, if Ixa can endure and shrug off the attacks that are comparable to him then what chance do the attacks that weaker than him has? I can only see Gene tries to flinches Ixa with his combo attacks then get shrug off and get counter back with Ixa's own combo of attacks.

Addressed already. Also Gene has access to special attacks that always put the opponent in a dizzy state, for several seconds even. Anyway "character can shrug off attacks that are comparable to him" is literally nonsensical as an argument.

Context matter. Most of us dismiss it as some kind of AP feat is because Sol Flasher is never a tool of destruction, it has one job and that is blinding the enemies.
Beside, the official site just uses it to describe the intensity of the Sol Flasher's light, so i dont see why we dont stick with just that aspect of 3 milions candela.

Nah, mate, it's not a context thing, light is energy, simple as that. It's not some magical force that can ignore the laws of physics if you so choose. If it doesn't cause a certain level of destruction, it's not 3m candelas.

Or you suggest we upgrade the fangires for have tanked that much intensity of candelas focused on a single point?

You can do that yeah. Not sure how you'd go about calculating it since candelas don't work that way, but you can try.

That shoudnt really work on Ixa tbh. He’s already stronger than Gene

Piercing damage blah blah, it even allows him to cut through multiple comparable opponents at once.

I mean, in the videos we sent, the Fangires immediately try to cover their eyes as soon as the flasher comes out.

Which video?

 

[RandomGuy2345]

I'm liking this debate...

 

[Armorchompy]

i'm not it's a 3v1

Nah jk, this is a really good match

 

[Shmooply]

Also FYI I've gotten kinda sick so responses might get a bit slower.

and on the same day i recovered from covid what a coincidence amirite

Alright, I'll finally follow this thread and give input. I haven't touched God Hand in some time, so I'll likely get things wrong.

 

[Armorchompy]

and on the same day i recovered from covid what a coincidence amirite

You doing ok? Heard the fallout can be a bitch

 

[BERRIES555]

Piercing damage blah blah, it even allows him to cut through multiple comparable opponents at once.

Which video?

I don’t really think piercing damage would do much, Ixa has already powered through Rook’s needles like it’s nothing. Rook being a Fangire comparable to Ixa. And Ixa’s even continued after fighting Kiva in his Dogga Form

(0:18) you can see as soon as the Sol Flasher activates, the Fangire tries to cover his eyes

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

You can do that yeah. Not sure how you'd go about calculating it since candelas don't work that way, but you can try.

Even so i doubt it would even be accepted

 

[Armorchompy]

bro i'm a calc member i think i can guess what kind of calc is acceptable lol. Illumination calcs are fine to use although often they end up being outliers.

I don’t really think piercing damage would do much, Ixa has already powered through Rook’s needles like it’s nothing. Rook being a Fangire comparable to Ixa. And Ixa’s even continued after fighting Kiva in his Dogga Form

(0:18) you can see as soon as the Sol Flasher activates, the Fangire tries to cover his eyes

It seems to me like the flash comes several seconds after the thing on the chest activates, Gene can easily interrupt that. Not only that but the monster's hands aren't actually covering his eyes so it doesn't really matter that he tried.

Also, again, weak to light.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Illumination calcs are fine to use although often they end up being outliers.

See? Thats the thing, it might be outliers so honestly i don't think we can use that

 

[Armorchompy]

... If it's an outlier, then the 3m candela statement is an outlier. The two are directly tied, you can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

[BERRIES555]

The thing on his chest comes from Ixa Judgement which is his finisher, not the Sol Flasher, they’re two separate things. Ixa Judgment increases his AP. Also, like, what are you talking about him not covering his eyes. He outright covers his entire face when the shot cuts.

Also, like I said, Fangires are weak to light. It’s just a general idea that they are due to them essentially being vampires.

 

[RandomGuy2345]

130+ comments, and not 1 vote casted yet lol.

But fr, it's very hard to vote for someone here.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

... If it's an outlier, then the 3m candela statement is an outlier. The two are directly tied, you can't have your cake and eat it too.

This whole candela thing is confusing as heck lel, my brain can't take it

 

[Shmooply]

You doing ok? Heard the fallout can be a bitch

All I know is that I'll need an oxygen tank attached to my face if my coughing gets worse. Besides that, I've lost my sense of smell and taste, which likely explains why I've been listening to modern hip hop artists.

But fr, it's very to vote for someone here.

I don't see why people have to vote immediately if we are still discussing some stuff here and there.

 

[MagiSinbad]

... If it's an outlier, then the 3m candela statement is an outlier. The two are directly tied, you can't have your cake and eat it too.

To be fair tho, we only uses the "cause the blindness to normal people" part.

And not really outlier, since the top strongest members of the tribe is like 5-A.

Im going to sleep now, so can only reply that much, see you guy later.

 

[BERRIES555]

130+ comments, and not 1 vote casted yet lol.

But fr, it's very to vote for someone here.

We’ve been through worst

 

[RandomGuy2345]

I don't see why people have to vote immediately if we are still discussing some stuff here and there.

But fr, it's very to vote for someone here.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

130+ comments, and not 1 vote casted yet lol.

But fr, it's very to vote for someone here.

Kamen Rider supporters always prioritized debating over vote so we would'nt have a FRA trains

I don't see why people have to vote immediately if we are still discussing some stuff here and there.

Yeah, lets just leave it to the both sides until we can finally reaching out conclusion

My Akaza vs Ixa was same as this, even reached 3 pages

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Beside this debate was fun and no negativity/hostile aspect, which is another plus

 

[IxaSaga2]

It's a sword, Gene's gonna be killed by a good hit anyway, life manip is redundant and Gene would be able to avoid it anyway

I guess that's true but the thing is, even if Ixa hits a shot that's mediocre, it can cause a lot of damage. I don't think he will be dodging legit every slash since Ixa is skill enough to force a position where dodging is impossible. (Like if Ixa backs Gene into a corner)

If Gene allows him to get on that, which I'm not so sure. Also he could Chain Yanker the bike to swipe it away from under his feet, I assume it doesn't have LS feats?

Nothing a quick jump won't fix. Ixalion has electromagnetism that binds it to Ixa so yanking it is a no go and Ixa can hold on to it.

Eh, I'm not so sure, it's not just a skill thing, the most likely counterplay to Gene's fighting style is being able to prevent him from putting you in a bad spot, the second he gets that one good hit in you're basically at his mercy, at least for a while- that counts even for Azel who's almost Gene's equal.

Upon further digging up info on Fangires. Ixa tanked attack from this Fangire that has piercing attacks. So Gene will still need a good amount of piercing attacks to hurt Ixa.

No, like, if enemies are weakened they are what explodes.

Ah, so both of them have the same things.

I don’t really think piercing damage would do much, Ixa has already powered through Rook’s needles like it’s nothing. Rook being a Fangire comparable to Ixa. And Ixa’s even continued after fighting Kiva in his Dogga Form

(0:18) you can see as soon as the Sol Flasher activates, the Fangire tries to cover his eyes

hmm. that's looks like a mix of both Sol Flasher and Ixa Judgement so my first point about it being just Ixa Judgement seems to be wrong.

Also, I have plugged the statement to another translator and it comes out like this. "The flashing is so intense, that if a normal person were to look at it directly, they would go blind in a single shot" should cover the only effective to Fangire part even if the 3 million candela statement is not true.

 

[BERRIES555]

I mean, the Sol Flasher comes from the shoulders. The chest has nothing to do with it.

 

[IxaSaga2]

WAIT NO SHOT, there's a song for both series in this debate that are both named "Rainy Rose".

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

HOLY F*** THAT EVEN MAKE THIS MATCH MORE CINEMATIC THAN EVER!!!

 

[BERRIES555]

Have that song play in the back

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Right my way! On the way to add it to the OP!

 

[Armorchompy]

I guess that's true but the thing is, even if Ixa hits a shot that's mediocre, it can cause a lot of damage. I don't think he will be dodging legit every slash since Ixa is skill enough to force a position where dodging is impossible. (Like if Ixa backs Gene into a corner)

Eh, maybe at the beginning Ixa can sneak in a lucky shot but I think Gene's smart enough to not let himself get cornered, and with the speed amp hitting him is going to be unlikely- not impossible, definitely not, but I wouldn't count on it.

Nothing a quick jump won't fix. Ixalion has electromagnetism that binds it to Ixa so yanking it is a no go and Ixa can hold on to it.

I see.

Upon further digging up info on Fangires. Ixa tanked attack from this Fangire that has piercing attacks. So Gene will still need a good amount of piercing attacks to hurt Ixa.

Speaking of ignoring the armor, Gene has access to the one-inch punch which

Ah, so both of them have the same things.

Damn this really is a surprisingly thematic match huh? Almost wanna say they just decide not to fight and become demon-fighting homies instead lol

hmm. that's looks like a mix of both Sol Flasher and Ixa Judgement so my first point about it being just Ixa Judgement seems to be wrong.

So wait, which part is Sol Flasher?

Also, I have plugged the statement to another translator and it comes out like this. "The flashing is so intense, that if a normal person were to look at it directly, they would go blind in a single shot" should cover the only effective to Fangire part even if the 3 million candela statement is not true.

Alright, fair point, but it doesn't necessarily refer to permanent blindness here.

Right my way! On the way to add it to the OP!

The best part is that neither song fits the battle at all

 

[BERRIES555]

So wait, which part is Sol Flasher?

Alright, fair point, but it doesn't necessarily refer to permanent blindness here

It’s the shoulders

Bishop remained blind even after 1 week of recovery.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

The best part is that neither song fits the battle at all

For the comedy!!!

 

[Armorchompy]

Speaking of ignoring the armor, Gene has access to the one-inch punch which

... which can apparently be used to destroy only the third plank of wood in a stack of three (Roughly 3:25), which means it might be able to strike Ixa's human body within the armor. I think. I have no idea how this works, it's cool as shit that it does, but I have no idea.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

... which can apparently be used to destroy only the third plank of wood in a stack of three

I almost wheezed from that

 

[RandomGuy2345]

This might be the most cinematic matchup I've seen so far on this wiki.

 

[IxaSaga2]

Eh, maybe at the beginning Ixa can sneak in a lucky shot but I think Gene's smart enough to not let himself get cornered, and with the speed amp hitting him is going to be unlikely- not impossible, definitely not, but I wouldn't count on it.

That's true. Ixa Calibur gun mode would do much better here then.

Edit: Also from further digging, the gun mode's spray thing is able to hit multiple people at once so it's more likely to hit horizontally.

Speaking of ignoring the armor, Gene has access to the one-inch punch which

... which can apparently be used to destroy only the third plank of wood in a stack of three (Roughly 3:25), which means it might be able to strike Ixa's human body within the armor. I think. I have no idea how this works, it's cool as shit that it does, but I have no idea.

pretty sure one inch punch requires a bit of concentrating and a sturdy stance to execute.

Damn this really is a surprisingly thematic match huh? Almost wanna say they just decide not to fight and become demon-fighting homies instead lol

They would

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

This might be the most cinematic matchup I've seen so far on this wiki.

Which mean i still have my touch, even after many events happened in past years (forum migration and mental dropout/temper issue)

 

[Armorchompy]

That's true. Ixa Calibur gun mode would do much better here then.

Issue is that at the beginning of the fight they're basically in melee range so attempting to use the gun might end up backfiring horribly since you can't really use it easily if Gene is close enough to punch comfortably.

pretty sure one inch punch requires a bit of concentrating and a sturdy stance to execute.

It does, but Gene can probably think of some way to set up into it such as stunning Ixa with Granny Smacker- which is admittedly a little slow itself, but it's not the only way, maybe he can uppercut Ixa upwards and meet him with a OIP as he's falling back down, or something like that. Not that it's gonna be his first thought but it is definitely a wincon.

 

[BERRIES555]

It’d actually be cool to see them play off of each other. With their very different personalities