8-B Tournament Round 2, Match 2 (Redone): Ken Kaneki vs Killua Zoldyck

[Rez]

It requires a touch, and killua is also hella mobile and acrobatic, A touch isn't asking much from killua imo

I will argue kaneki is the more mobile fighter here also he has the range advantage thanks to his Kagune and combine that with analytical prediction the single touch part is looking quite unlikely

 

[Rez]

Image is broken for me

It's working for me

 

[Razor]

I will argue kaneki is the more mobile fighter also he has the range advantage thanks to his Kagune and combine that with analytical prediction the single touch part is looking quite unlikely

if killua can't even touch him ain't this a stomp? Also killua is a massive prodigy, His senses are nuts too, I'd argue he can land at least one touch, Plus he can turn his aura into electricity too so simply being close to kaneki is enough

 

[Razor]

It's working for me

 

[Rez]

if killua can't even touch him ain't this a stomp? Also killua is a massive prodigy, His senses are nuts too, I'd argue he can land at least one touch, Plus he can turn his aura into electricity too so simply being close to kaneki is enough

Killua hasn't been shown to be capable of paralysing people with just transmuted aura and again kaneki flights with his Kagune which gives him an decent range advantage

 

[Razor]

Killua hasn't been shown to be capable of paralysing people with just transmuted aura and again kaneki flights with his Kagune which gives him an decent range advantage

Does he keep range in character though? cause he shouldn't know killua can end him with one touch. Also I didn't know the electric aura part my bad. Also if killua can't hit him once ain't this a stomp?

 

[Rez]

Well here is an different scan it might work

 

[Razor]

Well here is an different scan it might work

My wifi is just ass I think, Can you send the imgur link instead? (if it is on imgur)

 

[Rez]

Does he keep range in character though? cause he shouldn't know killua can end him with one touch. Also I didn't know the electric aura part my bad. Also if killua can't hit him once ain't this a stomp?

He does actually unless he is forced into close quarters. No not really a stomp the hitting part is very unlikely but not impossible

 

[Rez]

My wifi is just ass I think, Can you send the imgur link instead? (if it is on imgur)

https://imgur.com/ a/jPl9rup

 

[Razor]

brug

 

[Razor]

Kinda disagree on the part where killua can't touch him a single time, I think its likely but even then, if he sees that he can't touch this dude he'd just use fear hax won't he?

 

[Rez]

brug

You might wanna try a vpn also remove the space before a in the link

 

[Rez]

Kinda disagree on the part where killua can't touch him a single time, I think its likely but even then, if he sees that he can't touch this dude he'd just use fear hax won't he?

Yeah he wins instantly if he fear haxes

 

[Razor]

I give up, anyways. I have killua either way, Like I said if ken's res is less potent than killua's electricity then he either paralyzes with a touch or if he can't hit ken he'll eventually resort to fear hax. Same case with the other scenario tbh. Its just, Killua gets overwhelmed - Killua resorts to fear hax - killua wins

 

[Rez]

Also killua actually has a limit on how electricity he can use he will eventually run out of nen so fear hax is his only wincon but if he runs out of nen he can't fear hax so it depends on which scenario is more likely to happen. Personally I agree with you killua wining via fear hax one way or another is more likely to happen

 

[RandomGuy2345]

So do you two vote for Killua?

 

[Razor]

Yeah, depends on how quickly he runs out, His intelligence is high so he should be able to deduce quickly that ken will likely best him if he doesn't use fear hax

Also killua actually has a limit on how electricity he can use he will eventually run out of nen so fear hax is his only wincon but if he runs out of nen he can't fear hax so it depends on which scenario is more likely to happen. Personally I agree with you killua wining via fear hax one way or another is more likely to happen

So do you two vote for Killua?

I do

 

[Rez]

Yeah voting for kill via fear hax

 

[Sero]

Hmmmm, how often does Ken use his shapeshifting hax?

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Tch, nen crush auto-win

 

[RandomGuy2345]

3 for Killua I guess?

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Waiting on UchihaSlayer to explain his previous statement on Killua not using Nen crush.

 

[RandomGuy2345]

Bump

 

[RandomGuy2345]

Bump

 

[NikHelton]

How strong is hax with insanity? Kaneki was eventually able to resist the madness that comes in the state of kakaja and was able to continue to fight when he fell into absolute despair, when even fear was not standing by.

 

[Imaginym]

How strong is hax with insanity? Kanaki was eventually able to resist the madness that comes in the state of kakaja and was able to continue to fight when he fell into absolute despair, when even fear was not standing by.

There are 3 types of Madness Manipulation: Biology, Mind Manipulation, & Cognition (Madness induced from the nature of the being.), & from what I remember of Tokyo Ghoul (Cannibalistic, mutated humans with superpowers.), I would assume the Madness/Insanity induced by Kakaja is Biological.

Killua's quote for Fear Manipulation in his Powers & Abilities is:
Enhanced Fear Manipulation (Scared Rammot into paralysis and caused him to hallucinate even though Rammot is a powerful Nen user who is able to use Ten)

But I don't know if Killua did that with the help of Nen, & IIRC, he has shown himself as being able to be quite a scary individual, IIRC.

But more relevantly:

Nen

Nen (念ネン or ネン, Nen, "Sense"; "Mind Force" in the Viz translation) is the manipulation of the life energy within every living being and is the overarching term for many techniques regarding the manipulation of life energy in the world of Hunter x Hunter. It can also be called Aura. A person...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Ren - Fear Manipulation, Limited Paralysis Inducement, Madness Manipulation (Type 3) and Limited Death Manipulation (It has been stated that without Ten, a Nen User is capable of inducing crippling fear, paralyzing people, causing insanity and even outright killing them with Nen alone, this is through malicious aura attacks), Statistics Amplification (Ren also enhances physical characteristics)

IDK if Kaneki's is a Type 3 Madness Manipulation. I'd assume it's Biological or Mind Manipulation related, as opposed to the exposure to something with an inherent madness-inducing effects like bloodlust-containing Nen.

& even if Ken DOES Resist Madness Manipulation of the correct type, Madness, AKA, going insane doesn't necessarily mean Fear (Though, in Nen's case, it has been shown to be fearful insanity, but IDK about in Tokyo Ghoul.), & it doesn't mean he resists Fear or Paralysis or straight up dying.

 

[NikHelton]

In that case, isn't it a stomp? The maximum that Kaneki can do is resist biological insanity and resist fear. However, there is no way he can counteract mind control or killing with the aura.

 

[Imaginym]

In that case, isn't it a stomp? The maximum that Kaneki can do is resist biological insanity and resist fear. However, there is no way he can counteract mind control or killing with the aura.

So what are the stats? Kaneki one taps 16 tons or so while Killua is ???, both have massive pain tolerance but Kaneki has regen to help out with the wounds that cause said pain, extra limbs greatly aid mobility and combat but Killua’s lightning Aura has paralysis I think, also speed amps him iirc. No clue on the skill and do either even have range options?

Killua's AP is 22.13 tons I believe.

If I'm not mistaken, Kaneki has the stat advantage by an unknown amount (He one-shots 16 tons, but I don't know the one-shot range Tokyo Ghoul uses, & the 7.5x is only for determining the value to One Shot within Versus Threads in the absence of known ranges, IIRC.), unless Killua scales sufficiently above his 22.13 tons scaling point.

Kaneki also has Regeneration, & Resistance to Electricity Manipulation, & Killua will probably lead with Electricity Manipulation, especially in this key; Part of his training was developing an individual Nen ability, & he developed the ability to Transmute his own Nen into Electricity, as well as absorb & harness it from external sources, so he'll probably lead with that.

Killua likely won't try to "Nen Crush" until after he realizes Electricity Manipulation isn't effective, so Ken probably still has a window of opportunity where he can win before that.
I mean, presuming it isn't always active.

& even if Ken CAN'T perceive where the Nen is (Mind you, you don't need to be able to see Nen to be affected by it.), it's still possible he could avoid the effects by being out of range. He might know nor be inclined to do so, but it's a possibility, & usually, Nen users don't spread their Aura out very far unless it's for part of an ability, or for sensory purposes like using En to detect stuff; Since Nen is what you also use to defend yourself in some ways, &/or augment your attacks & such, I doubt Killua would be inclined to spread it out very much early on.

& of course, this probably isn't accounting for the close quarters match-up.

 

[RandomGuy2345]

If I'm not mistaken, Kaneki has the stat advantage by an unknown amount (He one-shots 16 tons, but I don't know the one-shot range Tokyo Ghoul uses, & the 7.5x is only for determining the value to One Shot within Versus Threads in the absence of known ranges, IIRC.), unless Killua scales sufficiently above his 22.13 tons scaling point.

Kaneki also has Regeneration, & Resistance to Electricity Manipulation, & Killua will probably lead with Electricity Manipulation, especially in this key; Part of his training was developing an individual Nen ability, & he developed the ability to Transmute his own Nen into Electricity, as well as absorb & harness it from external sources, so he'll probably lead with that.

Killua likely won't try to "Nen Crush" until after he realizes Electricity Manipulation isn't effective, so Ken probably still has a window of opportunity where he can win before that.
I mean, presuming it isn't always active.

& even if Ken CAN'T perceive where the Nen is (Mind you, you don't need to be able to see Nen to be affected by it.), it's still possible he could avoid the effects by being out of range. He might know nor be inclined to do so, but it's a possibility, & usually, Nen users don't spread their Aura out very far unless it's for part of an ability, or for sensory purposes like using En to detect stuff; Since Nen is what you also use to defend yourself in some ways, &/or augment your attacks & such, I doubt Killua would be inclined to spread it out very much early on.

& of course, this probably isn't accounting for the close quarters match-up.

Who is your vote for?

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

@UchihaSlayer96 Need to clarify this, otherwise Killua need to be disqualified because the dumbass Nen Crush

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Also btw Random, i never voted in first place

 

[Imaginym]

@UchihaSlayer96 Need to clarify this, otherwise Killua need to be disqualified because the dumbass Nen Crush

I already explained how it's possible for Kaneki to win despite Nen Crush.
A match is a stomp when a character lacks reasonable win conditions, not when they're not the more likely participant to win.
Not to mention Killua's "Nen Crush" seems to only be likely to be come up because Kaneki resists his Electricity, is very durable, & Regenerates; He might not have obstacles provoking such in other matches.

Also, @UchihaSlayer96 has not posted in this thread so far.
IDK if they are knowledgeable, but dunno why people are deferring to the argument of someone who hasn't participated in this thread so far. Have they been contacted to be asked to input?

Who is your vote for?

The current matter feels a little bit contentious, so I'd prefer to abstain from voting before it's resolved.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Eh, i'm not sure

Nen crush is basically auto-win and none of the combatants here have the answer regarding that, yes he would'nt use it in characters but when got cornered he likely going to use that and vice versa

I mean, @UchihaSlayer96 is the one who suggested Killua, so he take the responsible here

 

[Imaginym]

Eh, i'm not sure

Nen crush is basically auto-win and none of the combatants here have the answer regarding that, yes he would'nt use it in characters but when got cornered he likely going to use that and vice versa

Not entirely auto-win. They have to make contact with the Aura, which usually requires being close, the Aura has to have "bloodlust" in it, & verse equalization may help (Nen is akin to a Ki system, IIRC.), plus, I'm not sure all of the effects (Death Manipulation) are guaranteed.

Plus, defeating or sufficiently exhausting (Not enough Nen for exposure may help.) Killua before he uses it may help prevent it defeating the opponent too soon, especially if it's the case that Killua probably isn't going to use it early on.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I'm....still not convinced

 

[Oblivion_Of_The_Endless]

Killua uses bloodlust often, especially because he is an assassin trained for that and have been scaring the shit out of people way before he got his Nen

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Killua uses bloodlust often, especially because he is an assassin trained for that and have been scaring the shit out of people way before he got his Nen

Well shit....i guess Killua need to be disqualified

 

[RandomGuy2345]

Well shit....i guess Killua need to be disqualified

No. Please no...

Not this again...

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Sadly what OOTE said, if he use bloodlust often then he casually use Nen crush pretty often too, and we know Nen Crush are such of problematic mechanic just like Reiatsu Crush