8-B Brackets Semifinals Part 2

[Firephoenixearl]

> Has no counter to the blitz argument

Yes I do though. My argument is Hunter drugs anyways. You haven't countered literally any of my points, though, which is interesting. Grace has ended and no new discussion is being had, so we're literally just waiting for the next match at this point.

He cannot use drugs if he gets 1 shotted before he even takes it out. Your argument is not a counter argument, it's a win condition. Hunter can drug, now rather than saying drug gg. Do make an actual argument and say how will hunter bring up the drugs, uses them and puts ouma to sleep before getting blitz 1 shotted. As more than me have pointed out ouma blitzing stella means hunter cannot do anything at all, i explained why with the huge reaction speed difference, and will therefore get hit.

Even if somehow the drug is activated in that same instant it means hunter dies while ouma just goes to sleep and wakes up moments later. It's still a win for ouma.

 

[Wokistan]

Metabolism can protect against poison though. That determines how fast the body processes it.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

''if you read what I said you would understand my point Earl''

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Metabolism can protect against poison though. That determines how fast the body processes it.

To a degree. It would still depend on how well your liver/kidneys/blood can process it; something that just can't be processed to begin with would screw you over regardless of metabolism.

And you'd still be under the effects of the poison; it just wouldn't last as long.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Why is this still going?

Seriously, no other thread does this. If people have opposing votes, we add them to the overall tally and see who comes up on top in the end. Bambu's points are as valid as Earl's, I see no reason this shouldn't be added.

 

[Psychomaster35]

Agreed. Will we move on? Grace is already over anyways, no offense.

But one more question, Dargoo. About that "blitz" Phoenix is talking about... is it valid, or equalized?

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Speed amplifications are sadly allowed in speed equal matches.

However matches where the slower charcter blitzes the faster character are not allowed to be added in that case.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

As I've said, it doesn't matter here. Hunter's tranq bomb is actrivated by hitting the ground. That should be enough.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

As I've said, it doesn't matter here. Hunter's tranq bomb is actrivated by hitting the ground. That should be enough.

Blitz before activation and it can still be avoided by holding your breath hitting hunter and then leaving. But again it's not a valid argument if your vote is "hunter takes out a bomb, activates it, throws it, ouma will inhale it and the drug will take effect before someone who blitzes people 10x faster than hunter hits him"

Bambu an argument is not valid if you say ch will activate a bomb before goku blitzes him.

This debate is literally going like:

- hunter can active the drug

- he can't do that against someone that fast

- hunter still activates drugs

No bambu no he doesn't. People 10x faster can't get into a stance before getting blitzed, you can't argue hunter can take out drugs and use it before getting blitzed the same way.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

As I've said, it doesn't matter here. Hunter's tranq bomb is actrivated by hitting the ground. That should be enough.

Except it's not. He has to take out the bombs too.

 

[TacticalNuke002]

1. Ouma keeps his armour for dura.

2. Ouma takes it off for speed.

Choose one.

It seems that he prefers 1 initially and will go for 2 if pushed. However, seems like Hunter is gonna tag him in stage 1 itself, so stage 2 doesn't really matter.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

1. Ouma keeps his armour for dura.
2. Ouma takes it off for speed.

Choose one.

It seems that he prefers 1 initially and will go for 2 if pushed. However, seems like Hunter is gonna tag him in stage 1 itself, so stage 2 doesn't really matter.

Indeed that is correct. Im not saying Ouma will remove the armor though, according to what bambu said Hunter would null Ouma (which would result in the armor being released due to not being able to manipulate the air around him anymore), and then go for the gas.

So it goes like this:

Hunter nulls Ouma

Hunter tries to get out the bomb from his pocket

Hunter gets blitzed before completing the action.

 

[TacticalNuke002]

From my understanding, the Hunter's equipment doesn't outright p.null. Ouma's wind. It will still be there, just that the hunter can hit through it like it isn't there. And this also applies to projectiles.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

From my understanding, the Hunter's equipment doesn't outright p.null. Ouma's wind. It will still be there, just that the hunter can hit through it like it isn't there. And this also applies to projectiles.

Nope, it's outright nulling the ability to wind manip. You can read power null on elemental powers on his profile.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Yes Earl, yes he does, because the drugs literally activate with or without Hunter's input so long as it is dropped.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Yes Earl, yes he does, because the drugs literally activate with or without Hunter's input so long as it is dropped.

It still needs to be taken out from Hunter's pocket though. He doesn't have them ready in his hands.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Why not though

 

[Sir_Ovens]

The null is asssuming Hunter uses an Elderseal Weapon.

If he doesn't, he can use Windproof + Flashbug combo to blind Ouma before tranquing.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Like yeah I'm aware Hunter has many means of incapping but

This one just outright hasn't been dealt with

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Why not though

What do you mean why not? It's not the type of standard equipment to stay out at all times. The only exceptions to these are things that would logically be out (like reinhard's spear since he holds it in his hand all the time). You have to prove the hunter would have the right drug out at all times and keep it in his hand (not any of his bullets, or whatever, only this drug). I know he doesn't keep the drugs in his hands at all times, considering a lot of monster hunter fights usually use swords to kill dragons (usually), so if there is any standard equipment that's already out it would be the main weapon, not the drugs.

 

[Blackcurrant91]

Ouma is smart enough to hold his breath if he sees a mysterious gass on the battlefield. This should give him extra time to speedblitz.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Um... Tranquing all monsters that aren't Elder Dragons is a legitamate strat and favoured over killing the monsters.

There is no reason why Hunter wouldn't have tranq bombs in the fight. Plus, Ouma has no counter to getting blinded as soon as the round starts.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Not saying he doesn't have them. He does, just not in his hands. He has them in his pockets and can use them, he won't have them ready though. Drop it.

Tell me something Ouma hasn't dealt with. And for real do not change what he does. You're just saying "he does this"

Me: "doesn't work"

"Ok then he does this other thing"

What would happen if i made Ouma do whatever i want during fights too? You said it was null then bomb, stop bringing up other things.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Why would I stop bringing up other things if it's literally part of Hunter's arsenal? Hunter has tons of ways to open and one way not working doesn't mean that Ouma instantly wins.

Hell, ghillie mantle not working is iffy at best, since all monsters have senses way above human capability and they still can't find Hunter with it on.

Ouma blitzing due to Elderseal is one one of many different ways Hunter could open the fight and the way I see it, Hunter wins more times than not with his openers than Ouma. Any fight where Hunter doesn't bring an Elderseal weapon into battle is almost always his win.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Are we having hunter bloodlusted here? Is that really what's happening? Just you guys choose the perfect combination for Hunter to win and then using that as in character?

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Hunter has no set starting option. He is literally player controlled. So what we do is see is how many variations of Hunter's opening he can beat to see if he wins overall. It's like running a test, you can't just do it once and expect that result to be truth, you have to run it multiple times and get the mean result.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Hunter has no set starting option. He is literally player controlled. So what we do is see is how many variations of Hunter's opening he can beat to see if he wins overall. It's like running a test, you can't just do it once and expect that result to be truth, you have to run it multiple times and get the mean result.

Tell that to my graduation tests, i scored a pitiful 9.64/10 in a B2 test, how lame is that?

Without null hunter cannot do anything. Ouma will just get close and zap him the same way. Without the null, the gasses will disperse, Ouma will have his own invisibility, wind manip, oxygen manip etc.

With the null Ouma has the blitz.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Also yeah

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iK2UT801wbo

In the fight cutscenes im seeing they don't go for drugs that they can instantly deploy even in cases where it would have been the only useful option, not with invisibility cloak etc. They literally open up by running away. And where is the proof that they start with windproof mantel on?

 

[Sir_Ovens]

You can just use the cutscenes for MHW since they 1) don't show Hunter using his equipment, and 2) aren't Hunter's set uses because he's a player controlled character.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Plus, you completely glossed over the Windproof Mantle and Temporal Mantle that literally allow Hunter to get to Ouma without power null.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Yes i can. Being a player controlled character doesn't mean you open up with whatever you want, if there are cutscenes where the hunter acts it means that would be what the hunter without being controlled would use.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Plus, you completely glossed over the Windproof Mantle and Temporal Mantle that literally allow Hunter to get to Ouma without power null.

He would know to use them how? He doesn't know Ouma uses wind. And he doesn't use any of what you mentioned in cutscenes.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Because the whole point of Monster Hunter is choosing the right equipment to fight monsters. If you you followed the cutscenes, Hunter is literally brain dead. He has no set character besides, "do whatever I have to to survive".

In the scenarios where he does use them, which is very likely given how windy it will be, he can close the gap. Plus, opening with Temporal Mantle is a legitimate strat against Monsters you've never hunted before.

 

[Blackcurrant91]

Isn't that like saying 'video game characters will use whatever ability they have to best abuse in the situation' isn't that a dangerous precedent?

 

[Sir_Ovens]

That's how we've been treating video game characters with no set character traits though.

 

[TacticalNuke002]

That's how we've been treating video game characters with no set character traits though.

Only TES characters have that tho.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Not really. Even other characters like warframe characters have been treated like they appear in cutscenes. Not how the player uses them.

 

[Psychomaster35]

Bump

 

[Mr. Bambu]

The fight cutscenes you see in game are fighting enormous monsters that generally need to be caught or beat up before drugged, whereas a human opponent has no such stipulation.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

The fight cutscenes you see in game are fighting enormous monsters that generally need to be caught or beat up before drugged, whereas a human opponent has no such stipulation.

Why so? The only difference between a dragon and ouma is their size. And you don't go from they open up by running away to they do whatever i waver cus i say so. They will be fighting against a dude who crushes the ground by stepping on it during dash. So again, hunter opens up by getting out of immediate danger.