6-B upgrade for the Ascended and characters who scale to them.

[Rocker1189]

Or it means that his body is still too human to have High 6-B power. Since he actually does survive that leads me to be live that it at least starts with High 6-B power and maybe detoraites over time before he renews it.

 

[RegisNex1232]

I have given proof, ive given you quotes that support it, you have yet to give any evidence that proves it doesnt scale to physicals

You have given vague quotes and assumptions which you insist are correct despite the lack of evidence. I have given a few quotes suggesting that he didn't get all the power and that he isn't as capable as a Darkin, given that they don't age physically.

 

[RegisNex1232]

@Regis And yet youre against Trynd and Jax scaling even though Aatrox said their bodies CAN handle the power

I literally posted quotes where it was said that Trynd couldn't handle the power, while Jax is a big question mark. You haven't given anything about those two either.

Ignoring earlier posts to lie about such stuff isn't good.

Rocker, even if he dies renew it, he only has a limited amount of Darkin flesh to use, and it's not even mentioned or specified anywhere that he does do so. Having to make many assumptions just to excuse this isn't good when a simpler solution would to not upgrade his physicals until later stories give more proof that he is 6-B in all stats.

 

[Rocker1189]

He does not renew himself with Darkin fleash all the time he does it with humans via a ritual. He has already consumed all the Darkin flesh at the start and it is why he keep having to renew his bodies since he just uses rando humans.

And it is not many assumptions it is just 1 if that is even an assumption.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

@Rocker I mean thats what all Darkin do with their hosts...

 

[WeeklyBattles]

@Regis The only one making assumptions here is you my guy

 

[Rocker1189]

Yeah I really meant to counter the whole continually absorbing Darkin flesh and also the fact that he does not use worthy humans like other Darkin possibly limiting him further.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Almost none of the Darkin have worthy humans as hosts tho, the only one to date who does is Rhaast, with Trynd and Jax being worthy hosts for Aatrox if he gets ahold of them. Aatrox constantly mentions how none of his hosts to date are worthy hence why he needs to get more and more hosts and people to absorb

Varus' body is more sturdy because of how it was created but its slowly being destroyed as well

 

[Rocker1189]

Then never mind lol.

 

[RegisNex1232]

@Regis The only one making assumptions here is you my guy

Says the person who has only posted quotes that I have and hasn't explained much more than "They do scale, because ??".

Meanwhile the simpler solution is right where I posted it:

a simpler solution would to not upgrade his physicals until later stories give more proof that he is 6-B in all stats

With maybe adding some Possibly Higher by using Darkin flesh.

 

[RegisNex1232]

You still haven't proven anything for Trynd or Jax via Aatrox quotes.

 

[Wokistan]

Wasn't this the thing I was arguing against in that message wall from like a month ago?

I can't really go deep into the lore for a game I don't really have any investment in for this right now, I just don't have the time. I can see about getting you guys another opinion on things in maybe a week or two.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

https://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Aatrox/Quotes

"I thought you my next vessel, Tryndamere. Pity, you failed even to become a slave."

"A worthy vessel! Come, Jax!"

 

[RegisNex1232]

Taunts? Really? Especially when one is bemoaning that Trynd wasn't good enough.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Says the person who has only posted quotes that I have and hasn't explained much more than "They do scale, because ??".

Meanwhile the simpler solution is right where I posted it:

a simpler solution would to not upgrade his physicals until later stories give more proof that he is 6-B in all stats

With maybe adding some Possibly Higher by using Darkin flesh.

How is the simpler solution to make things up rather than giving stats which are plainly shown and blatantly stated to be present in the lore?

 

[RegisNex1232]

This is lying. If it was blatantly shown then where is it? You have given only your assumptions based off vague quotes.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Again, the only one making assumptions is you my guy. Youre the one arguing that it doesnt scale without giving any reason as to why and trying to make up stuff that doesnt exist like 'X tier via Darkin Flesh' to try to justify your argument

 

[RegisNex1232]

Again, the only one making assumptions is you my guy. Youre the one arguing that it doesnt scale without giving any reason as to why and trying to make up stuff that doesnt exist like 'X tier via Darkin Flesh' to try to justify your argument

You're the one arguing it does scale despite the lack of evidence simply because you think that partial absorption = Gains in every physical stat despite zero proof. If that's not assuming stuff to justify tiers then what is?

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Its not assuming, he is blatantly stated to absorbed the Darkin's power granting him a physiology and power of a Darkin. The burden of proof is on you to prove he does not scale yet all you do is shift the argument and avoid posting anything that supports your argument.

 

[RegisNex1232]

Its not assuming, he is blatantly stated to absorbed the Darkin's power granting him a physiology and power of a Darkin. The burden of proof is on you to prove he does not scale yet all you do is shift the argument and avoid posting anything that supports your argument.

That is all you. The text only specifies that power was absorbed. The rest is your assumptions, which aren't supported. Meanwhile, there's the simpler solution of only upgrading his AP, as that is the only thing confirmed to have been increased.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

If his Ap increases his dura increases as his AP increases physically, something you have yet to disprove

Stop shifting the argument away from your lack of evidence and actually post something for once

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Anything?

 

[RegisNex1232]

He uses magic, and his Durability increasing as his magical power increases is not noted anywhere in his bio. He also has no physical AP feats, and killing the Darkin isn't one, as it's left vague as to what exactly killed him.

Given that Vladimir at that point knew a powerful magic, what exactly makes you think, without any supporting evidence, that he would attack and kill a Darkin with a regular weapon? Especially when at that point he shouldn't even have been strong enough to do so physically.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Because the lore says he physically struck the Darkin down and THEN used magic only to absorb his power, which gave him all the powers of the Darkin he killed which would include physical stats. The only one who thinks its vague is you.

So again, provide actual proof, not just speculation and an argument of 'hes a mage so he doesnt scale'

 

[RegisNex1232]

Because the lore says he physically struck the Darkin dow and THEN used magic only to absorb his power, which gave him all the powers of the Darkin he killed which would include physical stats. The only one who thinks its vague is you.

So again, provide actual proof, not just speculation and an argument of 'hes a mage so he doesnt scale'

Headcanon =/= actual lore. His bio is not specific about any of this, instead, it is all from your own imagination so that you can twist the bio to suit your thoughts.

Again, you still have zero proof and are relying on very specific assumptions that totally ignore other valid theories. Maybe get some proof yourself and stop assuming stuff just for better ratings and then we can actually talk.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

It is very specific actually, both me and Rocker have pointed it out multiple times exactly where it was stated, though its nice to see you still cant make an argument or post scans to prove your point and have to rely on insults and accusations to try to discredit others.

Calling it an assumption doesnt make it an assumption, youre the one who is making the assumptions here trying to think of any other possible way that would make the feat not scale to physicals rather than doing the logical thing and using what is actually stated to have happened in the lore.

As you have yet to post any evidence against it, and everyone else agrees with it, i am going to apply the agreed on changes now. If you disagree feel free to report me, let the staff read through everything youve said in this thread.

 

[RegisNex1232]

You haven't pointed out or proven anything so far. Everything involving Vlad scaling relies on you specifically interpreting the lore one way to pretend that Vlad fully scales. The lore itself is vague. That isn't logical, it is misinterpretation and misleading.

I actually gave info, or have you deliberately missed my posts where I pointed out the flaws in your reasoning?

 

[Assaltwaffle]

Imo "struck down" implies a physical kill, as I haven't heard someone being "struck down" when referring to a ranged or magic attack. That's just my opinion, though, and I can see both sides.

 

[Wokistan]

I have seen struck down in a more generic context, but someone should probably find the message wall thread where the argument over that started.

 

[RegisNex1232]

Imo "struck down" implies a physical kill, as I haven't heard someone being "struck down" when referring to a ranged or magic attack. That's just my opinion, though, and I can see both sides.

"Struck down by lightning" is a common phrase in various texts and lightning isn't exactly physical. This is still ignoring the context behind the kill though. Vlad is a hemomancer, who deliberately learnt his magic from the Darkin and through a lot of effort was good at it. Now, his cruel master is weakened, and it's easier to believe that he would use a waepon over his magic? That I find difficult to beliece, given Vlad's character.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

@Regis You do realize that is referring to the AP of the lightning yes?

The lore explicitly states that he only used magic after he killed his master, and nowhere in the lore does it say his master was weakened

 

[RegisNex1232]

Way to miss the point. Pointing out that "struck down" doesn't imply anything about the nature of the attack one way or the other and you focus on the AP.

Lore says nothing about him using magic only after the killing, this is all your headcanon, which isn't evidence. And by weakening I was referring to the fall of the Darkins and the rebellion as a whole in that his 'power' over the humans is weakened to the point where he is accepting help from Vlad to counter attack.

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

I am not knowledgeable about this verse, but imo if you "strike down someone" it means you literally strike them down. For magic it would be written as "struck down by magic", and for lightning it would be written as "struck down by lightning".

 

[WeeklyBattles]

@Spino Would you like the exact quotes from the lore so you can decide for yourself? And so you have context as to what we're talking about?

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

Sure.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Quote 1:

"Believing himself above other mortal vassals, and therefore worthy of such power, Vladimir was the first of his kind permitted to study this terrifying magic. His devotion earned him a place of favor in his patron's warhost, and the right to practice hemomancy and enforce the darkin's will on lesser beings. Over time, the god-warrior watched with amusement as Vladimir came to govern his subjects with as little mercy as the darkin themselves.

The fall of these cruel tyrants is, likewise, the stuff of legend. An account of it, written in the dead High Shuriman language, is kept hidden within the Immortal Bastion. It speculates that Vladimir's master was not imprisoned like so many of his kin, but instead died at the hands of his own warhost. The few surviving mortals fled, taking what knowledge they had of blood magic with them.

Unknown to all but Vladimir himself, it was he who struck the killing blow. Scarred, blinded, driven mad by the radiance of a darkin's undoing, he absorbed enough power to renew flesh that was never meant to last beyond a mortal lifespan.

And he has done this countless times since, through rituals too vile to speak of."

Quote 2:

""Once, a long, long time ago," said Vladimir, and Maura felt ice enter his words. "I was an unneeded heir of a long-vanished kingdom, in an age when gods made war on one another. Mortals were pawns in their world-spanning strife, and when the time came for my father to bend the knee to a living god, I was given up as a royal hostage. In theory, my father's loyalty would be assured by the constant threat to my life. Should he break faith with his new master, I would be slain. But like all my father's promises, it was empty. He cared nothing for me, and broke his oath within the year."

The story Vladimir was telling was strange and fantastical, like the Shuriman myths Konrad told when they shared scare stories on the roof of the studio at night. Konrad's tales were thinly veiled morality plays, but this… this had a weight of truth behind it, and felt uncontaminated by sentimentality.

"But instead of killing me, my new master had something altogether more amusing in mind. Amusing for him, at any rate. He offered me the chance to lead his armies against my father's kingdom, an offer I gladly accepted. I destroyed my father's city and presented his head to my master. I was a good and faithful hound on a leash."

"You destroyed your own people? Why?"

Vladimir paused as though trying to decide if her question was serious.

"Because even if the god-warriors had not come, my father's kingdom would never have been mine," he said. "He had sons and heirs aplenty, and I would never have lived long enough to claim my birthright."

"Why would your master make you do that?"

"I used to think it was because he saw a spark of greatness within me, or the potential to be something more than a mere mortal," said Vladimir with a soft sigh that sent warm shivers down Maura's spine. "But more likely he just thought it would be amusing to teach one of his mortal pets some tricks, as the mountebank teaches a monkey to dance around his stall, to attract the gullible."

Maura looked back at the image of the young man in the picture, now seeing something dark lurking deeper in the eyes. A hint of cruelty perhaps, a glint of festering bitterness.

"What did he teach you?" asked Maura. As much as she wasn't sure she wanted an answer, something in her needed to know.

"My master's kind had the power to defy death—to sculpt flesh, blood, and bone into the most wondrous forms," continued Vladimir. "He taught me something of their arts, magic he wielded as easily as breathing. But it took every scrap of my intellect and will to master even the simplest of cantrips. I was later to learn that teaching their secrets to mortals was forbidden under pain of death, but my master delighted in flaunting the mores of his kind."

Vladimir's sourceless laughter echoed around her, yet there was no mirth to the sound.

"He couldn't help challenging convention, and in the end, it was his undoing."

"He died?" she asked.

"Yes. When one of his kind betrayed them, their power over this world was broken. My master's enemies united against him, and he looked to me to lead his armies in his defense. Instead, I killed him and drank in a measure of his power, for I had not forgotten the many cruelties he had inflicted upon me over the years. Taking his life was my first step on a road far longer than I ever could have imagined. A boon and a curse in one bloody gift.""

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Huh, some aspects are surprisingly similar to IRL Vlad.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

@Dragon would you like links to his lore? He's actually very well written

 

[RegisNex1232]

I am not knowledgeable about this verse, but imo if you "strike down someone" it means you literally strike them down. For magic it would be written as "struck down by magic", and for lightning it would be written as "struck down by lightning".

Authors not clarifying stuff =/= it not being a possibility. Especially when people seem to be ignoring that Vlad was a decent hemomancer at that point and has no qualms about using his powers.

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

I do not know about the context of the feat, but if it is literally said to "strike down" someone it implies something physical, as Assaltwaffle said. It would be Vlad's magic or Vlad's spell striking it down if it was magic. If you have a book that the author describes a magical attack as "Character A was struck down by character B", be my guest.