Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
She/Her- 9,828
- 12,453
I have been given permission to post this thread in staff discussion by @Deagonx. Do not comment unless you are staff or have been given permission to comment.
Background
In 2021, Devil May Cry: Peak of Combat was announced. It was to be a Chinese-only mobile game, officially licensed by Capcom and containing story elements that would cement it within the canonical timeline of DMC.
On July 22nd, 2021, the “Bloody Feast” game mode was released. Within this mode, there were reported to be numerous scans that would upgrade the verse significantly, such as beings lifting the entire Demon World, or souls being 9-dimensional and existing in a higher dimension.
These scans were quickly used to upgrade the verse. Problem is, the scans are fake.
The Problems
The scans used on VSBW for the upgrades seem fine at first glance, but upon investigation there are multiple discrepancies between the fake scans and the game’s actual content. For instance:
In the actual gameplay, these screens consistently have tips that correspond to the location, and give you a description of that location. None of the VSBW scans do this, it’s just random lore information. We’ve looked through many loading screen traditions in the game and in authentic gameplay videos, and there’s never any lore.
Further, the lore information in the scans used for the upgrade can’t be found anywhere outside of VSBW, at all. Suffice to say, these are major red flags and points to forgery.
For instance, the “narrative, void” stuff that if taken at face value makes DMC 1-A. They are full of battleboarding lingo that we never see in the series itself. For instance:
This is setting aside the blatant inconsistencies this has with DMC’s own lore, such as the heavy focus on meta-narrative elements which DMC has never incorporated into its story in any way. The combination of the lore inconsistencies and use of tiering lingo uncommon to the series makes them a certain forgery.
Across the 2 years of videos you can clearly see that bloody feast uses the same bosses over and over. This means that there are no time gated bosses or anything like that, meaning that the idea that they can’t get scans from this seemingly hard to access mode is somewhat suspect.
An announcement post for the mode can be found here, and it explains pretty well how it works (it’s in Chinese, obviously).
But What About the Discord Mods?
Whenever one brings into question the validity of the stuff used for PoC on Vs Battle Wiki, many of the supporters are quick to point towards the official discord that exists for PoC. In that server, there are people who supposedly have ties to the development of the game and can verify the existence of the scans used. In theory, this would be fine, but the problem is that the sources that many of the DMC folks have used are dubious at best, for the simple reason that their credentials are insufficient.
The supposed devs of PoC in the official discord have never once given their actual credentials or proven their identities, and have explicitly stated they don’t work on the Chinese version of PoC. Another mod frequently used as a source, Revolthell, is just a mod and is not a dev in any capacity (they clearly state this in their server roles lol), and so his words should not be used as gospel. His twitter account also has multiple posts showing he has no insider knowledge on the game.
Further, many of their responses to questions are answered with “maybes” or uncertain responses, implying that they aren’t 100% filled in as far as the PoC stuff goes. Their input should clearly be taken with a grain of salt. Even if we did take their claims at face value, we’d run into a major contradiction. According to them, the scans are real, but they also claimed that the global version would have everything the Chinese version did… except the global version obviously lacked the scans.
But What About the Footage?
As shown here and here, there exist a small number of videos that depict a player entering the Bloody Feast mode, with the loading screen displaying the supposed scans.
However, we can reasonably say that this footage is faked. The main issue is how no other footage can corroborate what is shown here; Countless videos of Bloody Feast gameplay exist on Bilibili, many of which showcase the same boss fight as shown in the 9D soul scans. However, none of those videos show the scans in question - rather, they show a rather generic team display, showing who you’re playing with and what character they’re playing as. This was originally claimed to be added in a later update, but this is not the case, as we can see from the dates these videos were uploaded. Some of these gameplay videos are dated July 23rd, 2021. This is a single day after the release of Bloody Feast, meaning the team display was in the game from Bloody Feast mode’s launch all the way until days before it was closed prior to the 2.0 update. The inverse is true as well. It’s unlikely that this content was added later, because we have gameplay videos from around the time the “scans” were dropped (October 2021), ranging from September to November 2021, and none of those showcase the scans, either. So we can reasonably say that no gameplay footage actually confirms the existence of these scans.
These videos also showcase an odd quirk of PoC’s loading screens. See, when the game loads, it usually loads the UI on the right side first (such as the “now loading” text), leaving the right side blank. The right side then displays a piece of related artwork shortly after. You can go frame by frame in any video and see that this is how it works; I could gladly give more examples from the videos linked above. Basically, there’s always a gap between the “now loading” text and the artwork on the right side of the screen. This can be displayed in countless videos, all from 1.0, regardless of the date posted. It’s simply how the game’s loading screens work. However, the supposed video proof of these scans doesn’t display these properties - The “now loading” text and the artwork appear on the same frame. This is a small discrepancy, but on top of everything else, helps to solidify that the evidence at hand is completely incongruent with everything the actual game shows.
TL;DR
The PoC scans are almost certainly fake for the following reasons:
-They are wildly inconsistent with everything else in the game.
-No gameplay footage outside of what’s been provided by DMC supporters shows these scans.
-DMC supporters cannot substantiate where the scans even come from, or the nature of the source in question.
-The only official source confirming them as real does not have sufficient knowledge or authority, and the scans being real would contradict another claim made by that source.
-The videos are clearly edited to some degree.
Conclusion
So what should be done now that we can confidently claim that PoC’s high end claims are bunk? For starters, those who participated in the creation and spreading of the fake scans - @Galens and @Sevil Natas, respectively - should be banned indefinitely. All content relating to PoC should, for the time being, be deleted - the game does have some usable content, but until that content can be independently verified to be real, it’s better to be cautious and not run the risk of hosting fabricated content. I also believe it’s reasonable to disallow the use of the 1.0 version of the game entirely. It’s no longer online, nobody can access it, which means any information from it is subject to be faked like the scans shown above. Everything from 2.0 is fine, as long as it’s met with a heavy degree of skepticism and scrutiny.
Background
In 2021, Devil May Cry: Peak of Combat was announced. It was to be a Chinese-only mobile game, officially licensed by Capcom and containing story elements that would cement it within the canonical timeline of DMC.
On July 22nd, 2021, the “Bloody Feast” game mode was released. Within this mode, there were reported to be numerous scans that would upgrade the verse significantly, such as beings lifting the entire Demon World, or souls being 9-dimensional and existing in a higher dimension.
These scans were quickly used to upgrade the verse. Problem is, the scans are fake.
The Problems
The scans used on VSBW for the upgrades seem fine at first glance, but upon investigation there are multiple discrepancies between the fake scans and the game’s actual content. For instance:
- The Discrepancies In Loading Screen Tips
In the actual gameplay, these screens consistently have tips that correspond to the location, and give you a description of that location. None of the VSBW scans do this, it’s just random lore information. We’ve looked through many loading screen traditions in the game and in authentic gameplay videos, and there’s never any lore.
Further, the lore information in the scans used for the upgrade can’t be found anywhere outside of VSBW, at all. Suffice to say, these are major red flags and points to forgery.
- The Discrepancies In Language
For instance, the “narrative, void” stuff that if taken at face value makes DMC 1-A. They are full of battleboarding lingo that we never see in the series itself. For instance:
- “Infinitely small compared to the demon world and its inhabitants, was part of the demon world until the arrival of the Demon King. The cradle of humanity is governed by all concepts of causality, probability and duality.”
- “Made of the thoughts, dreams and desires of the beings that inhabit the Void. With an infinity of countless dimensions, concepts and the mortal brain cannot quantify. A place that is all, nothing and unique at the same time. Its energy is the point of origin of reality, the phenomena existing in its interior, the energy used and the plot that manipulates the events of the worlds, everything begins and ends here.”
- “A dangerous place that transcends beyond the limits of Primordial Chaos, unstable, without laws and concepts of any kind. It is the habitat of creatures who are willing to observe, create and control every event of their imaginary plots for the sole purpose of satisfying their amusement, avoiding eternal boredom and new conflicts between them.”
- “The beings that inhabit it create and manipulate the plot of the worlds for their personal entertainment. It's like writing a story in their heads, as long as they don't imagine it, the show doesn't exist.”
This is setting aside the blatant inconsistencies this has with DMC’s own lore, such as the heavy focus on meta-narrative elements which DMC has never incorporated into its story in any way. The combination of the lore inconsistencies and use of tiering lingo uncommon to the series makes them a certain forgery.
- The Discrepancies In Transparency
Across the 2 years of videos you can clearly see that bloody feast uses the same bosses over and over. This means that there are no time gated bosses or anything like that, meaning that the idea that they can’t get scans from this seemingly hard to access mode is somewhat suspect.
An announcement post for the mode can be found here, and it explains pretty well how it works (it’s in Chinese, obviously).
But What About the Discord Mods?
Whenever one brings into question the validity of the stuff used for PoC on Vs Battle Wiki, many of the supporters are quick to point towards the official discord that exists for PoC. In that server, there are people who supposedly have ties to the development of the game and can verify the existence of the scans used. In theory, this would be fine, but the problem is that the sources that many of the DMC folks have used are dubious at best, for the simple reason that their credentials are insufficient.
The supposed devs of PoC in the official discord have never once given their actual credentials or proven their identities, and have explicitly stated they don’t work on the Chinese version of PoC. Another mod frequently used as a source, Revolthell, is just a mod and is not a dev in any capacity (they clearly state this in their server roles lol), and so his words should not be used as gospel. His twitter account also has multiple posts showing he has no insider knowledge on the game.
Further, many of their responses to questions are answered with “maybes” or uncertain responses, implying that they aren’t 100% filled in as far as the PoC stuff goes. Their input should clearly be taken with a grain of salt. Even if we did take their claims at face value, we’d run into a major contradiction. According to them, the scans are real, but they also claimed that the global version would have everything the Chinese version did… except the global version obviously lacked the scans.
But What About the Footage?
As shown here and here, there exist a small number of videos that depict a player entering the Bloody Feast mode, with the loading screen displaying the supposed scans.
However, we can reasonably say that this footage is faked. The main issue is how no other footage can corroborate what is shown here; Countless videos of Bloody Feast gameplay exist on Bilibili, many of which showcase the same boss fight as shown in the 9D soul scans. However, none of those videos show the scans in question - rather, they show a rather generic team display, showing who you’re playing with and what character they’re playing as. This was originally claimed to be added in a later update, but this is not the case, as we can see from the dates these videos were uploaded. Some of these gameplay videos are dated July 23rd, 2021. This is a single day after the release of Bloody Feast, meaning the team display was in the game from Bloody Feast mode’s launch all the way until days before it was closed prior to the 2.0 update. The inverse is true as well. It’s unlikely that this content was added later, because we have gameplay videos from around the time the “scans” were dropped (October 2021), ranging from September to November 2021, and none of those showcase the scans, either. So we can reasonably say that no gameplay footage actually confirms the existence of these scans.
These videos also showcase an odd quirk of PoC’s loading screens. See, when the game loads, it usually loads the UI on the right side first (such as the “now loading” text), leaving the right side blank. The right side then displays a piece of related artwork shortly after. You can go frame by frame in any video and see that this is how it works; I could gladly give more examples from the videos linked above. Basically, there’s always a gap between the “now loading” text and the artwork on the right side of the screen. This can be displayed in countless videos, all from 1.0, regardless of the date posted. It’s simply how the game’s loading screens work. However, the supposed video proof of these scans doesn’t display these properties - The “now loading” text and the artwork appear on the same frame. This is a small discrepancy, but on top of everything else, helps to solidify that the evidence at hand is completely incongruent with everything the actual game shows.
Addressing Potential Counterpoints
And again, this is if we are following the same thread of considering this point as a truth, rather than considering this as just an unreliable claim (which it is).
Of course, there’s another reason why this doesn’t make sense, and it’s PoC’s nature as a game. PoC is a live-service mobile game, meaning it requires constant updates and maintenance. Doing that as a game company is hard enough as it is - maintaining two separate versions of the game and arbitrarily shuffling off all the lore into only one version (changing the loading screen UI to be less coherent in the process) is, from a development standpoint, fucking insane.
Another issue here is one of quantity - there are dozens of videos of Bloody Feast, none of which show the scans and all consistently showing the same loading screen, same gameplay, and same UI. Are we really supposed to believe that every single recording of this game that contradicts the scans - of which there are dozens if not hundreds - just so happens to be from one specific version, while only the DMC supporters have recorded the version that has the scans?
- “The loading screens were in the game, however they were removed during global release”
And again, this is if we are following the same thread of considering this point as a truth, rather than considering this as just an unreliable claim (which it is).
- “The loading screens are indeed real, however they are on a different build of the game”
Of course, there’s another reason why this doesn’t make sense, and it’s PoC’s nature as a game. PoC is a live-service mobile game, meaning it requires constant updates and maintenance. Doing that as a game company is hard enough as it is - maintaining two separate versions of the game and arbitrarily shuffling off all the lore into only one version (changing the loading screen UI to be less coherent in the process) is, from a development standpoint, fucking insane.
Another issue here is one of quantity - there are dozens of videos of Bloody Feast, none of which show the scans and all consistently showing the same loading screen, same gameplay, and same UI. Are we really supposed to believe that every single recording of this game that contradicts the scans - of which there are dozens if not hundreds - just so happens to be from one specific version, while only the DMC supporters have recorded the version that has the scans?
- “We can’t just ignore IMPORTANT INFORMATION because there are doubts about it!”
- “We should wait until the official release comes to make any changes”
- “We recorded everything when we played it. Obviously this is real!”
- “We don’t know chinese. Why are we going to manipulate anything at all?”
- "Hitchens Razor"
TL;DR
The PoC scans are almost certainly fake for the following reasons:
-They are wildly inconsistent with everything else in the game.
-No gameplay footage outside of what’s been provided by DMC supporters shows these scans.
-DMC supporters cannot substantiate where the scans even come from, or the nature of the source in question.
-The only official source confirming them as real does not have sufficient knowledge or authority, and the scans being real would contradict another claim made by that source.
-The videos are clearly edited to some degree.
Conclusion
So what should be done now that we can confidently claim that PoC’s high end claims are bunk? For starters, those who participated in the creation and spreading of the fake scans - @Galens and @Sevil Natas, respectively - should be banned indefinitely. All content relating to PoC should, for the time being, be deleted - the game does have some usable content, but until that content can be independently verified to be real, it’s better to be cautious and not run the risk of hosting fabricated content. I also believe it’s reasonable to disallow the use of the 1.0 version of the game entirely. It’s no longer online, nobody can access it, which means any information from it is subject to be faked like the scans shown above. Everything from 2.0 is fine, as long as it’s met with a heavy degree of skepticism and scrutiny.
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