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EliminatorVenom

EliminatorVenom

VS Battles Thread Moderator
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  • LuffyRuffy46307
    If you have some time, could you take a look?
    vsbattles.com

    Dragon Ball Conceptual Manipulation End Closing

    Nothing about the scans proves that time/space is conceptual in general, Daishinkhan could get Type 3 for creating space and time in the WoV though, pending the validity of the statements about it lacking the concepts. That just sounds like pocket reality creation. Also, I’m sure there are...
    vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
    MrCricket8464
    Could you provide input for this CRT?
    vsbattles.com

    Murder Drones Speed Upgrade

    So on Uzi's page, her speed is listed as Hypersonic due to Psychomaster35's calc. However, this calc shouldn't be valid in the first place, as we never actually see the Workers used for the calc dodge or outspeed the explosions, it's more likely that the missile simply barely missed it's mark...
    vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
    Apollonir.Scale
    Can you look at this when you're free?

    vsbattles.com

    Reversion dragon city part1

    Hello everyone, today I'm here to make a post featuring characters from the game dragon city. This one is just a page explaining cosmology. Let's start getting into the content. We'll divide it up like this: Different levels of Rarity are the higher marks. Each level will have the following...
    vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
    TheUnshakableOne
    Whenever you have a spare moment, would you be willing to give input on this CRT? its not tier 1 or 2 stuff just powers and abilities that need to be evaluated. Thank you!

    vsbattles.com

    Saint Seiya Verse-Wide Revision pt. 1

    Huge thank you to @TheUnshakableOne who worked on this CRT with me and all the other Saint Seiya supporters who helped both directly and indirectly. Hello everyone. The long-awaited pt 2 of my verse overhaul has come, it's a long one but it should be relatively straightforward. The goal of...
    vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
    DaReaperMan
    So, now that RotMG is 8-C and 8-A, you have any matches you really want to do? Lol
    Reiner04
    Hey can you take a look at this thread? Thanks in advance.
    vsbattles.com

    Time dimension standard elaboration and a bit of change (whatever guess yourself)

    FAQ: A: The relationship between the spatial dimensions of a universe and the additional temporal dimension(s) may be visualized as something akin to the frames of a movie placed side-by-side. Basically, the time-like direction may be thought of as a line comprised of uncountably infinite...
    vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
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    EliminatorVenom
    EliminatorVenom
    Sorry for the long time I took to check this out, I had a very busy weekend.
    Reiner04
    Reiner04
    NP, it's understandable. Also sorry for asking again but my this thread is lacking few staff inputs.. can you check it for once?
    vsbattles.com

    Ben 10: Re-justification of Low 1-C.

    New standard: This structure can then be generalized to any number of dimensions, which is why destroying a spacetime continuum is a greater feat than destroying only the contents of the physical universe (Low 2-C, rather than 3-A or High 3-A). For example, a higher spacetime continuum with two...
    vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
    Reiner04
    Reiner04
    Thanks Venom 🙏
    First_Witch
    Hey ho, I remember you having a interest in the fields of combat skill, you wrote a Blog about right? Well I also took a stab at it and wrote one and wanted to hear your opinion, if you have the time obviously. Its a rough draft and im not even sure if I will ever finish it, considering that i dont have the abilities necessary to write a proper information blog. But I also dont want it to rot in one of my many sandboxes.

    See post below for link, forum bad
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    EliminatorVenom
    EliminatorVenom
    Hey! Yes, I did write one a loooong time ago, and I'd love to check yours!

    Gimme a second-
    EliminatorVenom
    EliminatorVenom
    Sorry for the long time to answer.

    An in-depth answer of mine and my thoughts on the analysis would take a very, very long time and an equally large answer, so I will try to be as succinct as possible.

    On the topics and aspects of skill taken into account, I agree on the topics and on the sections it was analysed in, and therefore, on the applications skill could and does have in battle through the different powers that may be expressed therein. I particularly like the Senses part as that is the easiest example of superhuman skill being doable. Giving a very basic example, Tex Willer is a character that has very acute, if not outright superhuman vision and he can see precisely even people who are very far away, and using that, combined with his incredibly steady hand and sheer experience and subconscious calculations in the usage of a rifle, he managed to land a headshot with a rifle despite being at more than twice the rifle's maximum effective range, and rather quickly at that. I'd add intellect on that section, as sufficient intellect can translate into skill as well, either the actively thought about kind and the more instinctual one. Tex is an instinctual example, and giving an active intellectual kind being used as skill, consider the Vindicare Assassin from 40K. If I am not mistaken, there is one tale in the lore about a Vindicare tasked to eliminate a target on the moon of a planet he was on. His gun could reach said target, but even its super-advanced optics could not really find their target. However, the Vindicare had access of their exact coordinates on the moon, and using that info, and meticulously calculating all variables and possibilities, they made a shot that managed to hit and kill their target.

    Now, onto the quantification of skill. Here, I am in slight disagreement with you. I do appreciate the quantification, and it isn't an entirely inapplicable concept, but it is something that needs to be done incredibly carefully. Skill is so very incredibly subjective in an infinitely fractal way that it really is impossible to quantify it aside from very general terms or when the difference is very blatant. Even something like Analytical Prediction can be very subjective. A real life, personal example of this is something I have noticed through my life practicing martial arts, and in my case, boxing. Even the less skill-oriented boxers I trained with could somewhat consistently predict punches as long as they were in a calm situation. However, the same was not true with kicks, pushes or even clinching - so there we have decently good Analytical Prediction, but mostly limited to punches, to the point that they could get the wrong tells from attempting to predict a kick at the times I saw myself and some colleagues friendly sparring with some Muay Thai practitioners. This is a very simple example, but I could go far, far beyond in complexity and in situations.

    I also must point out a certain disagreement with the Limitations category. Skill is absolutely tied to powers as well, and the correct usage of powers and the appropriate reaction to them is fundamentally a part of skill, even if sometimes it is verse-specific, and commonly cross-related to other forms of skill. Avatar: the Last Airbender is a good example of simple, elemental powers being wielded skillfully, tied with skill in martial arts and acrobatics in a very explicit way. In fact, Superhuman Skill is a conceivable ability given inhuman levels of the same abilities described in your post, or with even minimal additions. One with Energy Manipulation, even if restricted to just manipulating how energy spreads from their own blows, can potentially grow into practically Durability Negation with sufficient precision if they concentrate all energy on the fractally small point of space at the tip of their blow, and even a Wall level strike that has all their energy concentrated on that infinitely small point can cleave through far greater levels of durability. Just to be clear, I am not saying that such cases are always due to sheer skill instead of some misinterpretation of the author - but even said feat, unless explicitly made easy by verse-specific mechanics, is a very remarkable level of skill in self-control, energy manipulation and, most importantly, precision.

    Lastly, I really enjoyed the section about the false friends of skill and the way you tackled the issue. The rationale you expanded upon in that section is something I wish way more people read and thought about.
    First_Witch
    First_Witch
    Heyo, thanks for your reply.

    Intellect is basically on it the list under combat related Knowledge.

    It is true that Quantification AND Qualification of Skill is a hard endeavor, but it is important to remember that we are talking about fictional skill here;

    A real life, personal example of this is something I have noticed through my life practicing martial arts, and in my case, boxing. Even the less skill-oriented boxers I trained with could somewhat consistently predict punches as long as they were in a calm situation. However, the same was not true with kicks, pushes or even clinching - so there we have decently good Analytical Prediction, but mostly limited to punches, to the point that they could get the wrong tells from attempting to predict a kick at the times I saw myself and some colleagues friendly sparring with some Muay Thai practitioners. This is a very simple example, but I could go far, far beyond in complexity and in situations.
    Click to expand...

    While this is perfectly true, in fiction, you don't assume such a weakness for fictional characters until it was stated as such. The same way we dont take into account fire manipulators to randomly have days or situation in which they dont have access to their fire abilitites if such a weakness wasnt stated.

    So if we take a boxing series for example, if the tells which they use to predict incoming attacks are generic, such as gaze, muscle movement and more, there would be no reason to assume their analytical prediction stops working just because kicks are involved. Obviously, if the series gives its Analytical Prediction such a weakness, it should be taken into account.

    So I personally think that the basic assumption should be that skill ability A should work until reasons to believe that it wont are givin. Under such assumptions, quantifications become a bit easier. Determining exact quantities and qualities are obviously impossible. You are right in that skill can technically be broken down to infinite edges and corners. But I believe rough estimation are enough to fulfil the basic idea behind a Skill debate; Whose more skilled between character A and B. If you take the variable X and Y respectivly, standing for the skill level of 2 characters, it would suffice to find out which of the variables is bigger. Even if knowing the exact number would solve this debate instantly, that is thankfully not required. The biggest hurdle is obviously comparing the abilities, but thats what debating is for ultimately.

    I also must point out a certain disagreement with the Limitations category. Skill is absolutely tied to powers as well, and the correct usage of powers and the appropriate reaction to them is fundamentally a part of skill, even if sometimes it is verse-specific, and commonly cross-related to other forms of skill. Avatar: the Last Airbender is a good example of simple, elemental powers being wielded skillfully, tied with skill in martial arts and acrobatics in a very explicit way. In fact, Superhuman Skill is a conceivable ability given inhuman levels of the same abilities described in your post, or with even minimal additions. One with Energy Manipulation, even if restricted to just manipulating how energy spreads from their own blows, can potentially grow into practically Durability Negation with sufficient precision if they concentrate all energy on the fractally small point of space at the tip of their blow, and even a Wall level strike that has all their energy concentrated on that infinitely small point can cleave through far greater levels of durability. Just to be clear, I am not saying that such cases are always due to sheer skill instead of some misinterpretation of the author - but even said feat, unless explicitly made easy by verse-specific mechanics, is a very remarkable level of skill in self-control, energy manipulation and, most importantly, precision.
    Click to expand...

    An excellent point, but I have to rebuke this one as well. The problem with not viewing skill feats under the stated limitations is the issue of unquantifiability; Taking Analytical Prediction as example again, the reason why I believe AnaPre is both quantifiable and qualitfiable is precisly because the ability finds its roots in real life. You can reduce the ability to its lowest possible showing and start stacking up quantities and qualities onto that so long a logical link exist;

    So for example, we assume the lowest and most basic showcase of AnaPre is being able to predict a offensive move is incoming. Not wether or not its a punch, a kick or a aggresiv repositioning, just that the next move is offensive in nature. You can upscale the quantity of that by saying "The next level would be able to predict the next 2 moves". At a certain level, it is basically impossible to claim a higher quantity in real life, but not in fiction. And we know that this is a upscale in skill because we have the connection in reallife. Fiction can reach those levels because its logic doesnt correlate with that of reallife. The same goes for Quality.

    So the reason i put such huge emphasize on the laws of physics and biomechanics is because it helps us ground a ability withhin the confines of skill. I dont necessarily believe that a feat that does not follow those laws are strictly nonskill, I just reject the notion that they are more impressive. Worse, I find them unquantifiable, because you dont know how much exact mastery over a given foundational aspect of skill it requires. How much blade mastery is required to cut space and time apart with skill? A ton? Not more than real material? None? Whereas the hard limit of existing material being cut apart, discounting pontential strength arguments, is known and logically scaleable.

    The issue hereby dosnt lie in "Is this skill", but rather in "how much skill".
    EliminatorVenom
    Hey guys!

    For anyone that might see this, I have returned to the wiki after a long absence due to mental health issues and, to a lesser degree, to focus on university.

    I cannot dedicate a lot of time to the wiki, at least not for now, but I intend to take my return seriously, and attempt to check the wiki for at least one, two hours a day as I work on some lower assignments on uni.

    For some personal updates that someone might be interested in, such as a few personal projects:
    • I have been making gradual but consistent progress in developing a tabletop RPG system. I've always played with several systems and developed some simple ones, but this is the first great undertaking I've ever done, and I am liking a lot how it has been coming along. Thematically, it is inspired by Fear & Hunger, Anima: Beyond Fantasy and general tropes and works of the survival horror genre. Mechanically, it is rather unique - the closest reference I can think of is Dark Heresy with a splash of Kult and Don't Rest Your Head. It is an unorthodox d20 system, in which instead of using a d20, one uses a d10 and a d2 for most rolls, with the d2 being a "luck" roll, to sum it up, that usually won't matter, but the times that it does, it can be downright deadly.
      The system is highly lethal, tracking the vitality for each limb, the torso and the head - all have 5 wounds, except for the torso, which has 7. Any limb that reaches 5 or exceeds it is instantly lost. If the head or torso reaches/exceeds their limit, the character instantly dies. And most weapons deal 1d6 damage. And the game tracks attrition from stress, hunger, thirst and exhertion. Fighting even a random enemy is extremely dangerous and should be weighted if worth the risk.
      Lastly, I intend the system to have multiple scenarios similarly to how D&D does it, with a "base" scenario to serve as the main thematic inspiration. The main scenario is a curious mix of high and low fantasy - it is high in the sense that magic is common, as are magical beings and there are great works of magic and impossible, explicit fantasy. However, it is a low magic setting in the sense that the greater stuff gets exponentially rarer the greater the differenceis from the baseline, societies work realistically and every single bit of the worldbuilding deliberates of the consequences of a high fantasy setting. Oh, and the scenario is not medieval - it is an early industrialization with holdovers of the recent medieval-ish past. While knights do exist, for example, they are relegated to small, elite fighting forces either at the service of a leader or as a mercenary guild. Swords and armor are relatively common and more prevalent than they would be in the real world at that time period, but gunpowder weaponry are getting more and more common, and cities in general are more urban and larger than the typical medieval landscape.
    • My graduation is coming along, and as long as the stars align, I am pretty sure that I will graduate from college by the end of this year or by the beginning of the next one. I am graduating in history, with my thesis being an analysis on how romans from the time period of Tacitus analysed the germanic people as a way to criticize roman society.
    • Also, I'm slowly making progress on an idea for an indexing wiki similar to VSBattles and Liber Proeliis (a portuguese VS site I had helped stablish years prior). I don't think I'll ever put the idea into a website, but I'd like to make public my proposal and how said wiki would work like, as my approach to the indexing would be, while inspired, very different from both wikis I have for a major inspiration.
    • As for VS stuff, even as I stayed away from the internet world at large, out of sheer habit I kept indexing and registering my thoughts and analysis on the different fictional works I've come to read, watch, play and interpret. Here is a non-exhaustive list of topics I consider myself now apt to comment about, from the time I spent on my two year long absence:
    1. Magic: The Gathering.
    2. Conan the Barbarian.
    3. Condemned.
    4. Sinjid.
    5. Underrail.
    6. Fallen London. (Moreso than ever)
    7. Realm of the Mad God.
    8. Ori.
    9. Ocean's Heart.
    10. My Time At Series. (Mostly Portia though)
    11. Lamentum.
    12. Lakeview.
    13. La-Mulana.
    14. Inmost.
    15. Jill of the Jungle.
    16. Grim Dawn.
    17. Grand Theft Auto.
    18. FAITH - The Unholy Trilogy.
    19. Fear & Hunger.
    20. Dollars Series.
    21. King Arthur V.S. Dracula.
    22. Chzo Mythos
    23. Call of Duty.
    24. Armed with Wings.
    25. A Song of Ice and Fire.
    26. Punisher (MAX).
    And probably a few others I'm not remembering. I feel tempted to comment on a few others, such as Caves of Qud and Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead, but those are still going to take a while to complete. For now, suffice to say that my priorities will be in Fallen London, Swords and Sandals, FAITH, Call of Duty, GTA and Realm of the Mad God, with the small verses being included as I work by them.

    I also want to thank you guys for all the memories and the warm reception to my return. Y'all rock!
    XitSign
    Hello! When you get the chance (seems you've been busy and away, very understandable) could you swing by this thread and give your opinion?

    A single character had an update to their loadout, making their current page a bit out of date.
    Pikaman
    If you’re planning on joining the 9-B tournament we kinda need a character soon, we’re opening up second picks soon so the 2 spots left will be taken very quickly
    RandomGuy2345
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    EliminatorVenom
    Ooooh, I'd love to join!

    The only thing though is that, checking the 9-B characters I do know at hand that I am confident to use, they're all too high or too low for this, or are entirely calcless.

    I'll try to finish this profile up to tomorrow, but don't hold out a spot for me - if I manage to, I'll join!
    Smashtwig
    Armorchompy
    Yo, congrats on your promotion, man
    RandomGuy2345
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    RandomGuy2345
    RandomGuy2345
    Bumpity
    RandomGuy2345
    RandomGuy2345
    Bumpity
    EliminatorVenom
    EliminatorVenom
    Oop, sorry for checking this out so late!

    I'll be watching the thread, but there isn't much I can contribute - the only WWE games I played were the Smackdown V.S. Raw series, which could be interesting for the Undertaker, but not much for the other fighters, at least as far as I can remember. Nonetheless, I am willing to rewatch the game storylines to help!
    EliminatorVenom
    Hello to whoever may see this!

    I've been mostly absent - still checking on things occasionally, just not taking the time to reply as I've been mostly focused in university.

    I intend to return soon, to tackle some projects that are looong overdue. I am happier than I've been in a long time with my perdormance at uni, and I intend to do some writing that, I hope, will be useful for the people of the wiki.

    Thanks for all the support y'all!
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