Maou Gakuin Downgrades are Back Again (For the Second Time)

[EldemadeDityjon]

There is a slight mechanical difference, where resurrection is activated (in this case, using Ingall), while regeneration is passive. So if you can do something to prevent someone from using magic, it'd effectively negate their ability to resurrect, while the same wouldn't be true if it were regen.

Rimuru literally has HGR because of a spell.

Taking Example from Regeneration page only.

Regeneration

Regeneration, often referred to as a healing factor, is the ability to passively heal oneself from wounds at an accelerated rate, with many characters proving capable of regenerating from wounds that would be lethal to normal humans. It has several different levels that range in potency from...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Reiner04]

Well

It used both actually

You can just have both written actually. Mid Godly regenration and mid Godly resurrection, unless source is incapable of any from either (like anti feat?)

No anti feats so far. Both seems fine

Snip

Needs a evaluation regarding having both, mid Godly resurrection and mid Godly regenration.

 

[ImmortalDread]

There is a slight mechanical difference, where resurrection is activated (in this case, using Ingall), while regeneration is passive. So if you can do something to prevent someone from using magic, it'd effectively negate their ability to resurrect, while the same wouldn't be true if it were regen.

The scan explicitly stated “regeneration”, he got regenerated.

You ain't really trying to tell me that the author need to use vsbw term and say “he got regenerated passively".

So ah, both can be written.

 

[Vietthai96]

Any form of reforming, regenerating, recovering is considered as Regeneration, it could well via some other mean such as using healing ability, via resurrection, etc.....it doesn't suddently invalidate the feat in question being Regeneration

Needs a evaluation regarding having both, mid Godly resurrection and mid Godly regenration

both is the same thing anyway

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Rimuru literally has HGR because of a spell.

Taking Example from Regeneration page only.

Regeneration

Regeneration, often referred to as a healing factor, is the ability to passively heal oneself from wounds at an accelerated rate, with many characters proving capable of regenerating from wounds that would be lethal to normal humans. It has several different levels that range in potency from...

vsbattles.fandom.com

I'm pretty sure he doesn't? lmao

The scan explicitly stated “regeneration”, he got regenerated.

You ain't really trying to tell me that the author need to use vsbw term and say “he got regenerated passively".

So ah, both can be written.

We judge abilities based on their mechanics, not what the authors call them. In this case, because a spell needs to be cast in order to come back from death, it fits resurrection better than regeneration.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

I'm pretty sure he doesn't? lmao

Check the CRT which accepted it and supporters literally claimed it a skill/spell. Anyway this is from Vs wiki page giving example so I take it credible that spells can be Regeneration also.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

We judge abilities based on their mechanics, not what the authors call them. In this case, because a spell needs to be cast in order to come back from death, it fits resurrection better than regeneration.

It can be both

Any form of reforming, regenerating, recovering is considered as Regeneration, it could well via some other mean such as using healing ability, via resurrection, etc.....it doesn't suddently invalidate the feat in question being Regeneration

both is the same thing anyway

You are right

When in the hands of a character who uses resurrection on themselves, giving them some degree of Immortality, this ability often co-exists with Regeneration, though the process can take some time. This ability is not to be confused with Necromancy, the ability to raise the dead as undead beings, but it also covers Reincarnation, characters who, upon death, eventually reincarnate the bodies of others - not as a mechanic of the verse, but through their own powers.

 

[Shmooply]

this ******* shit again
In Rimuru's case the spell is passive.

 

[Reiner04]

Does the page states spell healers can't qualify for regenerate/healing?

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

this ******* shit again
In Rimuru's case the spell is passive.

Passive or not if someone disabled it then it's useless as Fuji says anyway even resurrection page states it can be both.

Resurrection

Resurrection is the ability to revive oneself or others after they have died. Often, characters can do one or the other, not both, but others can perform both. The limits of this ability vary from fiction to fiction and from character to character; some may be only able to resurrect those who...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[ImmortalDread]

Shmooply is defending Rimuru, rare to see that.

 

[Reiner04]

Anyway, ability can be passive and non passive that doesn't matter to a ability to exist unless specifically stated.

 

[Shmooply]

Shmooply is defending Rimuru, rare to see that.

My first posts on the forum were about him, I literally started out as Generic WN Rimuru fanboy#394939594 what the **** are you-

That's enough derailing.

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Regeneration is, by definition, passive. I cannot think of a single character in fiction who needs to turn on their regen. Which I guess calls Anos' HGR into question but I won't bother with that.

 

[Reiner04]

Regeneration is, by definition, passive. I cannot think of a single character in fiction who needs to turn on their regen. Which I guess calls Anos' HGR into question but I won't bother with that.

As I said, non passive abilities exist. There can be a character who have regern but have to activate them when needed. I can see your point but that doesn't stop Anos to get MGR.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

My first posts on the forum were about him, I literally started out as Generic WN Rimuru fanboy#394939594 what the **** are you-

That's enough derailing.

I knew you were real.

Also, yeah, lmao Rimuru’s regen is passive lmao, doesn’t matter if it’s a skill.

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

As I said, non passive abilities exist. There can be a character who have regern but have to activate them when needed. I can see your point but that doesn't stop Anos to get MGR.

Can you give an example that isn't Anos?

 

[Reiner04]

Can you give an example that isn't Anos?

Why actually I have to give an example? I don't know more than 7 verses and none of them have anything beyond MGR. If there is a note/quote/statement on regen page stating that non passive regen doesn't qualify, I'll back off.

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Why actually I have to give an example? I don't know more than 7 verses and none of them have anything beyond MGR. If there is a note/quote/statement on regen page stating that non passive regen doesn't qualify, I'll back off.

So you don't have an example, and Anos is miraculously the only person to get regen from this. Got it.

 

[Reiner04]

So you don't have an example, and Anos is miraculously the only person to get regen from this. Got it.

That doesn't really answer my question but that's you and the other me then. Leaving it to staff.

 

[Shmooply]

"you dont need x to classify for y"
"give me an example"
"uhh actually why should i"

Real.
Let's just save the HGR thing for another thread. This thread and the previous one already got too derailing and off-topic-y.

 

[Theglassman12]

@Dereck03 Is that a web novel scan or a light novel scan? Also not really sure this is to be taken literally as him being able to feel fear flies in the face of lacking emotions, it’s the same dumb logic of people arguing that being able to soul hax someone who literally has no soul is a thing that makes sense because reasons.

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Real.
Let's just save the HGR thing for another thread. This thread and the previous one already got too derailing and off-topic-y.

Well, this is technically on topic since this will still decide whether MGR stays or gets replaced with resurrection.

 

[Dereck03]

@Dereck03 Is that a web novel scan or a light novel scan?

We are currently using the LN, but I got someone who is a Japanese speaker to translate an excerpt of the feat to prove that Anos' fear feat is valid, don't mind if I share it here?

The part that is in the scan is from V4 part 2 which will be released in a few months.

Also not really sure this is to be taken literally as him being able to feel fear flies in the face of lacking emotions, it’s the same dumb logic of people arguing that being able to soul hax someone who literally has no soul is a thing that makes sense because reasons.

Lmao, I knew you were going to take the time to find some excuse to dismiss the feat as such, the context is clear, there are no emotions, no fear, no empathy, nothing, the gods never felt fear of anos nor venuzdonoa and that's why Nosgalia is shown like that in the scan.

I wouldn't question you if they had only said it once, but they even said it on more than one occasion and different gods.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Eh, about the fear hax I do agree with @Dereck03, it's kinda explicit that they lack emotions here

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Well, this is technically on topic since this will still decide whether MGR stays or gets replaced with resurrection.

Already linked the resurreccion page where it stated resurrection and regeneration can co exists.

When in the hands of a character who uses resurrection on themselves, giving them some degree of Immortality, this ability often co-exists with Regeneration, though the process can take some time. This ability is not to be confused with Necromancy, the ability to raise the dead as undead beings, but it also covers Reincarnation, characters who, upon death, eventually reincarnate the bodies of others - not as a mechanic of the verse, but through their own powers.

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Already linked the resurreccion page where it stated resurrection and regeneration can co exists.

Yes, can coexist. Doesn't mean every instance of self-resurrection is regeneration.

 

[Starfeldway]

rimuru's case is passive tho it's not asif it's a unique skill or smt but intrinsic it's called infinite regeneration

Passive or not if someone disabled it then it's useless as Fuji says anyway even resurrection page states it can be both.

Resurrection

Resurrection is the ability to revive oneself or others after they have died. Often, characters can do one or the other, not both, but others can perform both. The limits of this ability vary from fiction to fiction and from character to character; some may be only able to resurrect those who...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Starfeldway]

so anos case he needs to cast a spell to regenerate? I'm neutral but what if he dies before activating it or smt

 

[Dereck03]

I don't know who was the genius who came up with the idea of bringing Rimuru to a Maou thread.... They seems to like war.

 

[ImmortalDread]

Yes, can coexist. Doesn't mean every instance of self-resurrection is regeneration.

Everyone predicted that you are going to say this.

So obvious your counter-arguments you are. Are you aware, you ain't refuting him right?

 

[ImmortalDread]

so anos case he needs to cast a spell to regenerate? I'm neutral but what if he dies before activating it or smt

He does not even need Ingalls to come back lol.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Yes, can coexist. Doesn't mean every instance of self-resurrection is regeneration.

Change the standards then. Here scans literally stated as both Regeneration & Resurrection. Character who uses resurreccion themselves can get immortality and regeneration.

rimuru's case is passive tho it's not asif it's a unique skill or smt but intrinsic it's called infinite regeneration

Well passive or not skill is a skill anyway drop that topic my bad for bringing that up in this thread and now i checked Rimuru Regeneration doesn't even qualifies for current Standards. So let's just stop that here.

so anos case he needs to cast a spell to regenerate? I'm neutral but what if he dies before activating it or smt

Standard Never states it as Passive. Character can use resurreccion spells and get regeneration. Explanation page clearly mentioned that so anyone Disagrees should change the wiki explanation page. Though he has feats and statements for solid MGR & HGR in Volume 8.

When in the hands of a character who uses resurrection on themselves, giving them some degree of Immortality, this ability often co-exists with Regeneration, though the process can take some time. This ability is not to be confused with Necromancy, the ability to raise the dead as undead beings, but it also covers Reincarnation, characters who, upon death, eventually reincarnate the bodies of others - not as a mechanic of the verse, but through their own powers.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

I don't know who was the genius who came up with the idea of bringing Rimuru to a Maou thread.... They seems to like war.

I checked the Regeneration page for example and mistakenly brought up that . My bad. I should have picked other characters as example.

 

[Starfeldway]

I kinda disagree with the downgrade of the regeneration part, I mean i watched the anime and I saw his source being destroyed and he still came back after disappearing this would still count as HGR or smt if the

He does not even need Ingalls to come back lol.

y novel contradicts it then eh

 

[Starfeldway]

if you want to downgrade it go

I checked the Regeneration page for example and mistakenly brought up that . My bad. I should have picked other characters as example.

make a thread or smt

 

[StrymULTRA]

Can't we just put it as "Immortality (Type 4) and Regeneration (Mid-Godly)", with the P&A justification saying that it resurrects from regenerating the damage?

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

I kinda disagree with the downgrade of the regeneration part, I mean i watched the anime and I saw his source being destroyed and he still came back after disappearing this would still count as HGR or smt if the

That's not what the downgrade is for.

Change the standards then. Here scans literally stated as both Regeneration & Resurrection. Character who uses resurreccion themselves can get immortality and regeneration.

Standard Never states it as Passive. Character can use resurreccion spells and get regeneration. Explanation page clearly mentioned that so anyone Disagrees should change the wiki explanation page. Though he has feats and statements for solid MGR & HGR in Volume 8.

That isn't even what it says though... It says they can coincide, not that every instance of self-resurrection is regeneration. I'll ask again, is there a single character besides Anos who gets regen from self-resurrection?

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

if you want to downgrade it go


make a thread or smt

Not interested in Tensura. Well sometimes later if I feel like it. Anyway let's drop the topic.

Btw you checked the page explanation which i put. Character can use resurreccion on themselves and get regeneration and Immortality. That alone should be enough to get Regeneration.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

That's not what the downgrade is for.

That isn't even what it says though... It says they can coincide, not that every instance of self-resurrection is regeneration. I'll ask again, is there a single character besides Anos who gets regen from self-resurrection?

Next time you say something like this I am just gonna report you. The page stated character can use Resurrection themselves and get immortality and regeneration it didn't says anything you claimed this is clearly bias you are showing right now.

Can you read now ? This is the biggest size in wiki you can see I can't help you if you keep ignoring this.

When in the hands of a character who uses resurrection on themselves, giving them some degree of Immortality, this ability often co-exists with Regeneration, though the process can take some time. This ability is not to be confused with Necromancy, the ability to raise the dead as undead beings, but it also covers Reincarnation, characters who, upon death, eventually reincarnate the bodies of others - not as a mechanic of the verse, but through their own powers.