Azure Striker vs Yellow Flash

[Smashtwig]

Nope, he can still indeed attack while Prevading, sorry, I should have asked my guy to record it while Gunvolt is shooting. That's my fault. But the profile DOES say he can do it while attacking. (Here's a quick and easy clip in the Prevasion vid above, he clearly is attacking while Prevading here. Do you want me to find more examples?)

Uh... I thought Eight Sign Sealed was for the Nine Tails, I knew you would say this eventually, but...

"Four Symbols Seal: The sealing formula is carved into a human body or an object, and is mainly used when a giant enemy or evil spirit needs to be sealed. To use it, the user must have remarkable natural skills."

Prevasion is entirely based on equipment and psychic abilities, not some evil spirit stuff (like the Nine Tails) sir. And yes, the equipment does become intangible too

 

[Razor]

Well yeah Minato's endurance is insane, In that nine tails feat above I'm pretty sure that right after that he had to deflect a bijuu dama with FTG and after that he had to fight obito and then after that he got his stomach ripped wide open by the kyuubi and even after that he had enough strength to use the reaper death seal

 

[Smashtwig]

Stamina is pretty even to me, yeah, holding off the N I N E T A I L S and warping its T A I L E D B E A S T B O M B is fricking insane, but Gunvolt fights through entire nights all the time, every day, whereas people like Minato might actually get sleep for once. So, it's pretty even to me

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Nope, he can still indeed attack while Prevading, sorry, I should have asked my guy to record it while Gunvolt is shooting. That's my fault. But the profile DOES say he can do it while attacking. (Here's a quick and easy clip in the Prevasion vid above, he clearly is attacking while Prevading here. Do you want me to find more examples?)

Uh... I thought Eight Sign Sealed was for the Nine Tails, I knew you would say this eventually, but...

"Four Symbols Seal: The sealing formula is carved into a human body or an object, and is mainly used when a giant enemy or evil spirit needs to be sealed. To use it, the user must have remarkable natural skills."

Prevasion is entirely based on equipment and psychic abilities, not some evil spirit stuff (like the Nine Tails) sir. And yes, the equipment does become intangible too

Mk, cool.

"Mainly," not exclusively. It doesn't really make sense for it to have such a narrow restriction. Even if it did, he should have other fuinjutsu of that level for humans.

 

[Razor]

Eh, Fighting through nights isn't that much special in the naruto verse even for Regular Jonins plus minato Wasn't showing any signs of tiring in the feat mentioned above either (aside from getting eviscierated by the kyuubi's finger). Also he also solo'd whole nations in the war before he was even kage.

 

[Smashtwig]

Mk, cool.

"Mainly," not exclusively. It doesn't really make sense for it to have such a narrow restriction. Even if it did, he should have other fuinjutsu of that level for humans.

If that's the case, why can't Minato just power null literally any one he fights? I believe it is NLF to assume it can do anything else (even though I assume he would have something for other people's powers). However, again, Prevasion is technology based, Minato lives in a time where the most advanced piece of technology is like... a radio... communicators? And that's in Shippuden, Minato comes from an age at least two decades ago. I absolutely disagree with the idea that Minato has ability to seal things NOT ONLY for other's powers, but TECHNOLOGY that comes from the far future of our own world. He likely wouldn't even know how it works to even make an attempt, especially with something primarily specialized in Sealing Spirits, the exact opposite of technology

We don't assume Gilgamesh can teleport just because he should have a Noble Phantasm that does that, or the ability to manipulate vectors because he should have a Noble Phantasm to do that.

Stamina
That's true, but healing can still offset that advantage anyways, plus, I still argue that Gunvolt's Stamina is still comparable to the point where it won't make all that much a difference, especially healing. As well, while Chakra is a limited resource all Ninja must keep track of, Gunvolt's Septimal Power is completely psychic and rechargeable. The more Jutsu Minato uses, the more Chakra and Stamina he drains. And we can all agree that if Minato runs out of Chakra, he's done. Meanwhile, all of Gunvolt's abilities are more mental, not physical, which means that theoretically he can keep using his powers. (After all, he can recharge his EP, Electro Psycho Energy through concentration alone, yes, that's how he charges EP). As well, GV didn't show any signs of tiring either in his stamina feat, just like Minato.

This isn’t even taking into account Blade’s Feats, who uses Gunvolt’s powers (yes, they can be scaled to each other, Gunvolt states that the Azure Striker Septima grants him a boost in physical capabilities, and Blade was a normal human before she got her Septima, it’s pretty clear that without the Septima Blade wouldn’t have the stamina feat I’m going to mention now). Blade was continously having her Septima go berserk for at least several days as she was non stop searching for her target, no breaks at all.

As well, in the gap between GV1 and GV2 (half a year I believe), Gunvolt was CONSTANTLY on the move to get away from Sumeragi, which is a company that effectively rules the entire nation and overthrowed the nation’s actual government a long time ago. Now I don’t think he was doing it straight, but he can’t afford to rest for long at all.

 

[Xmark12]

Mk, cool.

"Mainly," not exclusively. It doesn't really make sense for it to have such a narrow restriction. Even if it did, he should have other fuinjutsu of that level for humans.

He hasn't shown that right? Pretty sure VSBW does things where only stuff that's shown are used, not really things that are implied. All of GV's things for example are pretty cut and dry because you literally play as him in a video game.

 

[Smashtwig]

What is his teleportation like?

Minato's AP could be greater with SM.

At the absolute best, I could see GV having a 3-4x speed advantage. Dedinitely not 5 or 6.

You could sorta quantify it by saying 30% Kisame and Base Guy are relativish in speed, and Kisame could somewhat react to 6GG who's more than 5x faster. Yet MS Sasuke couldn't react to V2 Ay. So you could infer that V2 Ay and by extension Minato are more than 5x faster than 6th Gate Guy.

Does he really? The difference between Edo Madara (0.28c) and GV's reactions is like 3.5x. Juubidara is far far far faster than Edo Madara, and Minato could still react to him pretty casually with no arms which nerfs his physical energy and chakra. GV does have the reaction advantage, but it's not massive.

You forgot that Minato also spent several hours supressing Kurama during childbirth.

Eh, Fighting through nights isn't that much special in the naruto verse even for Regular Jonins plus minato Wasn't showing any signs of tiring in the feat mentioned above either (aside from getting eviscierated by the kyuubi's finger). Also he also solo'd whole nations in the war before he was even kage.

also it’s best we add these feats to Minato’s page (I’m not gonna be that guy that says “huh dur not allowed cuz not in page”, but we should do it anyways)

Legit tho “He has a considerable amount of chakra in his Base Form” does NOT do our guy justice are you kidding me bro

 

[Razor]

I agree

 

[Smashtwig]

I agree

I can’t tell if it’s just to that last message or the messages above those too

 

[Razor]

Oh I meant like I agree that simply saying "High reserves of chakra" isn't doing minato's stamina any justice

 

[Smashtwig]

O. E.

Still my points about Minato not being able to Seal Technology from far into the future and GV’s Stamina still stand

 

[Razor]

Wait prevasion is by equipment right? Does the equipment turn into electrons too? (if prevasion is used)

 

[Smashtwig]

Yep, it sure does, otherwise it’d drop to the floor and GV won’t be able to use it again after all. Plus, I’m pretty sure someone must have tried to just, take it away at some point… and if they succeeded I’m pretty sure Prevasion would just be obsolete and just never used again- which clearly isn’t the case

 

[Razor]

Ah, so the only discussion to be had now is who's stamina is higher?

 

[Smashtwig]

Stamina
That's true, but healing can still offset that advantage anyways, plus, I still argue that Gunvolt's Stamina is still comparable to the point where it won't make all that much a difference, especially healing. As well, while Chakra is a limited resource all Ninja must keep track of, Gunvolt's Septimal Power is completely psychic and rechargeable. The more Jutsu Minato uses, the more Chakra and Stamina he drains. And we can all agree that if Minato runs out of Chakra, he's done. Meanwhile, all of Gunvolt's abilities are more mental, not physical, which means that theoretically he can keep using his powers. (After all, he can recharge his EP, Electro Psycho Energy through concentration alone, yes, that's how he charges EP). As well, GV didn't show any signs of tiring either in his stamina feat, just like Minato.

This isn’t even taking into account Blade’s Feats, who uses Gunvolt’s powers (yes, they can be scaled to each other, Gunvolt states that the Azure Striker Septima grants him a boost in physical capabilities, and Blade was a normal human before she got her Septima, it’s pretty clear that without the Septima Blade wouldn’t have the stamina feat I’m going to mention now). Blade was continously having her Septima go berserk for at least several days as she was non stop searching for her target, no breaks at all.

As well, in the gap between GV1 and GV2 (half a year I believe), Gunvolt was CONSTANTLY on the move to get away from Sumeragi, which is a company that effectively rules the entire nation and overthrowed the nation’s actual government a long time ago. Now I don’t think he was doing it straight, but he can’t afford to rest for long at all.

I added onto my Stamina arguement

Blade’s Stamina is stupid good, and GV’s likely comparable since she’s using HIS very specific Septima, not just “the same type of Septima” or “A Septima with the same power and name”, literally “EXACTLY GUNVOLT’S FROM HIS VERY CORPSE”

 

[Razor]

If that's the case, why can't Minato just power null literally any one he fights? I believe it is NLF to assume it can do anything else (even though I assume he would have something for other people's powers). However, again, Prevasion is technology based, Minato lives in a time where the most advanced piece of technology is like... a radio... communicators? And that's in Shippuden, Minato comes from an age at least two decades ago. I absolutely disagree with the idea that Minato has ability to seal things NOT ONLY for other's powers, but TECHNOLOGY that comes from the far future of our own world. He likely wouldn't even know how it works to even make an attempt, especially with something primarily specialized in Sealing Spirits, the exact opposite of technology

We don't assume Gilgamesh can teleport just because he should have a Noble Phantasm that does that, or the ability to manipulate vectors because he should have a Noble Phantasm to do that.

Stamina
That's true, but healing can still offset that advantage anyways, plus, I still argue that Gunvolt's Stamina is still comparable to the point where it won't make all that much a difference, especially healing. As well, while Chakra is a limited resource all Ninja must keep track of, Gunvolt's Septimal Power is completely psychic and rechargeable. The more Jutsu Minato uses, the more Chakra and Stamina he drains. And we can all agree that if Minato runs out of Chakra, he's done. Meanwhile, all of Gunvolt's abilities are more mental, not physical, which means that theoretically he can keep using his powers. (After all, he can recharge his EP, Electro Psycho Energy through concentration alone, yes, that's how he charges EP). As well, GV didn't show any signs of tiring either in his stamina feat, just like Minato.

This isn’t even taking into account Blade’s Feats, who uses Gunvolt’s powers (yes, they can be scaled to each other, Gunvolt states that the Azure Striker Septima grants him a boost in physical capabilities, and Blade was a normal human before she got her Septima, it’s pretty clear that without the Septima Blade wouldn’t have the stamina feat I’m going to mention now). Blade was continously having her Septima go berserk for at least several days as she was non stop searching for her target, no breaks at all.

As well, in the gap between GV1 and GV2 (half a year I believe), Gunvolt was CONSTANTLY on the move to get away from Sumeragi, which is a company that effectively rules the entire nation and overthrowed the nation’s actual government a long time ago. Now I don’t think he was doing it straight, but he can’t afford to rest for long at all.

Why would he be using jutsus? He'd find out he can't circumvent gunvolt's Prevasion and try to think of a strategy to hit him, he wouldn't mindlessly use jutsus.

 

[Smashtwig]

That’s very true, but I imagine it would be hard to not use Jutsu to test Gunvolt’s defenses. I would assume he would still use FTG a lot to do a lot of trial and error (FTG uses a little chakra, so it’s spammable). But Minato isn’t gonna get anywhere by standing still, he’ll have to try something (like well, throwing out Jutsu to see what works- but he would eventually stop yeah) instead of just constantly dodge the entire time.

Also the points about Healing and Blade’s Stamina Feat still exists

 

[Razor]

That’s very true, but I imagine it would be hard to not use Jutsu to test Gunvolt’s defenses. I would assume he would still use FTG a lot to do a lot of trial and error (FTG uses a little chakra, so it’s spammable). But Minato isn’t gonna get anywhere by standing still, he’ll have to try something (like well, throwing out Jutsu to see what works) instead of just constantly dodge the entire time.

Also the points about Healing and Blade’s Stamina Feat still exists

FTG doesn't drain his chakra that much, He has feats of soloing entire nations and platoons of elite ninjas so much so that he earned a name for himself and basically carried konoha into victory against 3 other nations, And he didn't have good AoE either, He took these soldiers out with one attack each, even if you say he simply had the swing his kunai thats still impressive due to the sheer numbers of the soldiers and the fact that he had to FTG to each and every one of them.

Idk if blade's stamina is better and healing won't recover his stamina, just his injuries

 

[Smashtwig]

Yeah I know, FTG doesn’t drain much, that’s why I’m saying he can spam it.

Blade’s Stamina would be Several Days (could be a week). I would assume Minato would at least have to sleep after a day.

Plus the half a year or constantly running from the GV side is also pretty wack. To be honest I think Minato would be smart enough to retreat back to the village to get support but SBA so eee

 

[Razor]

Blade's feat is really vague, Searching for targets doesn't drain your stamina nearly as much as having to actually kill ninjas, albeit minato shouldn't have any trouble killing these ninjas as they are fodder to him, he still had to teleport and slice, teleport and slice to each and everyone ninja he killed cause he doesn't fight with AoE. And He did this in the middle of the war so Idk if he got a lot of sleep if any

 

[Smashtwig]

I’m sure Minato must have some sleep. He was camping with his team during the war. Also, this isn’t just searching, we’re talking about going all Broly “KAKAROTTTTTTTT” the entire time at full power, just going completely Berserk and killing any human in your way type of searching. Like, she’s literally holding her head in agony the entire time (that’s her idol animation, and she’s fighting people like that with out ANY signs of tiring)

 

[Razor]

Considering he was essentially the backbone of konoha at that time, even if we say he had some sleep he must've had minimal, this is a war after all. Eh? I don't really think that makes much of a difference, its still not the same as using jutsus like a thousand times and then slicing each and every one of your opponent. Minato didn't show any signs of tiring in the war either

 

[Smashtwig]

Well, that just gives off 2 unquantifiable staminas then, Gunvolt’s doing the same thing running away from Sumeragi

But I’m not sure you quite get it, Blade’s channeling her Septima at full power the entire time, boosted, in agony. I already explained how Septima are primarily psychic and mental based, so that means she’s basically going at full power at all times. It’s like retaining… Super Saipan Blue for days on end.

Minato getting sleep makes a huge difference, even if it’s not much, it would recover a ton of his Chakra, that he uses on spamming the small costing FTG

 

[Razor]

That Doesn't really make any sense to me. Just cause she was angry doesn't mean she was exerting herself.

 

[Smashtwig]

Oh, she’s like, definitely exerting herself. Like, Berserk Trigger’s effect basically spikes and amplifies her Septima. In her case it’s going berserk since it’s just too much for her to handle, to the point where’s she’s holding her head in constant pain and you can quite see the Septimal Energy like, radiating from her body violently. Heck, when Copen copies this Berserk Trigger to use for himself, he’s constantly taking damage from it. It’s safe to say that the same effect will happen to her too

 

[Razor]

Oh, she’s like, definitely exerting herself. Like, Berserk Trigger’s effect basically spikes and amplifies her Septima. In her case it’s going berserk since it’s just too much for her to handle, to the point where’s she’s holding her head in constant pain and you can quite see the Septimal Energy like, radiating from her body violently. Heck, when Copen copies this Berserk Trigger to use for himself, he’s constantly taking damage from it. It’s safe to say that the same effect will happen to her too

I don't know if that really equates to stamina, I'm still really confused on how it works. if its too much for her to handle then why is it a stamina feat for her

 

[Smashtwig]

By too much to handle, I mean too much to handle safely. Again, it’s quite literally causing her to hold her head in pain, and the same thing when used by Copen constantly damages him

 

[Razor]

Wait, If the berserk trigger is amplifying her septima then wouldn't it not scale?

 

[Smashtwig]

Ergh, it’s hard to explain. But think of it this way. Her own power is being controlled and forced to become overwhelm to the point where she is struggling to control it- it’s like say, Naruto trying to control Nine Tails chakra without succumbing to it. Just replace Nine Tails with the Muse Septima, and there you go. (Basically the classic dark Power the MC needs to frantically control to make sure he doesn’t do the big bad thing)

either way she‘s in great pain this whole time, I don’t think Septima amping would like…. Help that

 

[Razor]

Ergh, it’s hard to explain. But think of it this way. Her own power is being controlled and forced to become overwhelm to the point where she is struggling to control it- it’s like say, Naruto trying to control Nine Tails chakra without succumbing to it. Just replace Nine Tails with the Muse Septima, and there you go. (Basically the classic dark Power the MC needs to frantically control to make sure he doesn’t do the big bad thing)

either way she‘s in great pain this whole time, I don’t think Septima amping would like…. Help that

If the stamina feat comes from her just enduring the pain I don't think its really that potent and would be unquantifiable, I thought the stamina feat comes from her moving around. If its her enduring the pain I don't think that is stamina. But idk how we treat enduring pain in the site

 

[Smashtwig]

oh she’s still moving to search for Copen while doing all of this, as well as likely killing everyone in her way at full power (though it’s not confirmed, given the setting of the game being about Adepts like her constantly killing non-Adepts as their primary objective without hesitation, likely)

 

[Razor]

oh she’s still moving to search for Copen while doing all of this, as well as likely killing everyone in her way at full power (though it’s not confirmed, given the setting of the game being about Adepts like her constantly killing non-Adepts as their primary objective without hesitation, likely)

Eh I think thats just her moving, killing everyone in her way is vague unless we know who those "everyone" is, otherwise she could've just been killing fodder people who she one taps

 

[Smashtwig]

Also, quick Stamina Summary for the two

Short Term
Minato during the Nine Tails Attack: Basically fighting the entire night at full power, no sign of fatigue
Gunvolt during Eden Raid/Firmament Raid: Basically fighting the entire night at full power, no sign of fatigue

Only difference: Septima is a mental thing that is recoverable, Chakra is body/spiritual thing that isn’t recoverable until a good rest… but not really all that important

Long Term (not exactly relevant since sleep is involved)
Minato during the War: Constant teleport and slashing- can operate fine, minimal sleep
GV after GV1: Constant running and mental fatigue (mostly emotionally and likely mentally)- can operate fine despite Septima being a mental thing (shown in a DCD), minimal sleep


The fact remains that, yeah they’re in the same ballpark

 

[Smashtwig]

Eh I think thats just her moving, killing everyone in her way is vague unless we know who those "everyone" is, otherwise she could've just been killing fodder people who she one taps

I guess, but same can be said for Minato cuz he’s such a chad that he also one taps everybody lol

But if she’s killing even fodder, since she’s in Berserk Trigger she’s likely gonna overkill it anyways and spend unneeded win sauce

 

[Razor]

I guess, but same can be said for Minato cuz he’s such a chad that he also one taps everybody lol

But if she’s killing even fodder, since she’s in Berserk Trigger she’s likely gonna overkill it anyways and spend unneeded win sauce

Yeah but minato is constantly using FTG To teleport from person to person, Even one platoon would make him use it like 20 times

 

[Smashtwig]

Yes, but FTG is very low on Chakra expending, it’s pretty much nothing for him

I should also mention that technically Gunvolt can still theoretically damage Minato, yeah, not a main factor, but seriously this stamina battle is close as heck and any scrap of points can make this more even

 

[Smashtwig]

I think it’s pretty safe to say “they’re comparable”, especially when what matters is their fighting all night feats instead of their minimal sleep feats

 

[Razor]

Yes, but FTG is very low on Chakra expending, it’s pretty much nothing for him

I should also mention that technically Gunvolt can still theoretically damage Minato, yeah, not a main factor, but seriously this stamina battle is close as heck and any scrap of points can make this more even

Its low yes but it doesn't but he uses it so much that its still so impressive (Nations can have thousands of jonins ready to fight in the war and minato basically solo'd a shitton of them, there were 3 nations)

 

[Smashtwig]

I suppose yes, that still would equate to “fighting all day”, and then resting. Similar to GV’s “fighting all night”

This is pretty much a circular loop- They’re in the same ballpark, I don’t think there is a need to make minor nitpicks about stamina arguments when it boils down to the same general thing

(technically Minato won’t be physically moving aside from his stabbing so… he’s not really running all the way to stab each dude)