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SCP Foundation: Settling the Verse's Dimensionality

Kepekley23

VS Battles
Retired
15,332
7,563
There is no peace. There are only threads wasted between VS battles.
~ Kepathon of the Threadtakers​
Introductio

Currently, we rate the SCP Foundatio 1-Bs as having "at least 196,884 dimensions, with countless more unobservable vectors" based on both the tale Nobody Dies and SCP-2637's description. Seems fine at first glance, but let's dig deeper and see if it still holds up, shall we?

The Revision
Let's analyze the quote that puts the verse's God-Tiers at countlessly beyond 196,884-D:

He looked deeper, beyond the coating, into the metallurgical structure of the disc. The internal flow seemed to twist and turn through impossible spaces, incredible tension pulling the fabric of reality taut within the hardened disc. He looked deeper, into the molecular structure; there he saw five-dimensional warping that should, by all accounts, cause the disc to shatter into dust. The atomic structure was bent through eight dimensions, beneath that, the protons were pulled across eighteen; the constituent quarks below were crackling across twenty six and below that he could feel the tension of uncountable vectors in uncountable spaces.
~ [scp-wiki.wikidot.com/nobody-dies Nobody Dies]​
Notice that this quote is specifically and exclusively referring to uncountable dimensions below the twenty-sixth mark. This tale isn't even the source of 196-884 dimensional SCP, so the profiles's justification is incorrect. It's fusing two different articles into one. The tale "Nobody Dies" supports the existence of an uncountable number of dimensions below the 26th spatial dimension, but that's literally it. Using it to support the existence of an uncountable number of dimensions beyond 196-884, when the tale only refers to dimensions beyond 26 and the 196-884 d statements were conceived years after it was written is...inaccurate, to say the least.

That said, this also brings up a new question. Where is 196,884-D SCP from? Well, there are two different sources. Let's look at 'em:

The nature of the entities which elaborated the message within SCP-2637-1 as well as the purpose of the message are not revealed within the elucidated parts of message16. Numerous segments suggest the entities are aware of the two-dimensional nature of their reality, and are trying to eventually contact 196,884-dimensional beings.
~ SCP-2637​
The most notable difference between point of views comes when the spatial dimensions of geometry are brought up and analyzed in-depth. While mainstream science widely accepts the existence of at least four dimensions, the library supports and lists evidence of the existence of at least 196,884 observable dimensions; that is, the number of dimensions that can be safely cataloged. However, the number of dimensions that form the entire space-time are stated to be layered in sets of countable infinities; that is, there is an infinite number of dimensions in the unobservable universe; said infinities are themselves layered in countable sets. The number of layers is said to be unknown.
The second source is the most notable, and we've already discussed High 1-B SCP based on this before. Notice the explicit statement that the universe can only be confirmed, prove and safely cataloged to have 196,884 spatial or chronal dimensions, with anything higher, such as the existence of infinite dimensions beyond the observable layer being mere speculation. It wouldn't be referred to as "unobservable" if it could actually be observed, afterall.

And, as we all know, we don't tend to use in-universe speculation for...well, anything here. We tend to rate our profiles based solely on what can be confirmed.

My Proposal
Remove the "countless-D" and replace it with a straight-up "196,884 D" rating, since that's the highest value that can be safely confirmed in the series. Anything higher than that would be speculative.
 
You and Azzy are talking about the canonicity difference between Tales and Articles.

The verse's cosmology has nothing to do with it.

If changes are necessary, they're necessary.
 
This seems a good proposition, it is definitely more clear than the vague countless-dimensional of before.
 
I am calm though? already asked Kep to stop making massive SCP revision threads after the last one and he went and made another

Me and Azzy are supposed to work on a full scale revision for everything in SCP including the cosmology which is why threads like this shouldnt be made at the moment
 
Largely speaking, I agree with this as well. But I'm open to wait and see if anything else is brought up before accepting the whole thing. One missed detail can shoot an entire argument in the knee, and I don't know enough about this verse's cosmology to tell whether or not there are any missed details here.

Taken by itself, it seems to make sense though.
 
You are not discussing everything in the verse.

From the High 1-B thread, Azzy himself stated he was discussing how the Canons stacked up against each other and nothing more.
 
Necessary changes that will be brought up and discussed beteween me and him when we revise the verse. Your impatience isnt helping.
 
@Kep Since Me and Azzy are going to be discussing the thing youre bringing up here and will be sorting it out

@Matt Because it will be handled by me and Azzy when we revise the whole verse
 
Kepekley23 said:
Also, the same way The Dark Tower revisions aren't bound to King and Naruto revisions aren't bound to me, SCP revisions aren't just bound to you and Azzy either, with all due respect.

Necessary changes are necessary changes regardless of discussion.
There's a hell of a lot of truth in this statement. I can say right now that no single person (or even two lone people) should be the only ones overseeing a verse of this scale. If others have proposals regarding the maintenance of the pages and their content, about topics that are necessary to iron out, then they should post them as close to "immediately" as they are able. Letting work pile up because a specific person/set of people are putting something together is the last thing that should happen imo.

This seems like one of those cases where the topic is a necessary one that needs to be set straight as soon as possible.
 
Except it wouldn't have been handled by you since the reason why I made this CRT was because you repeated the "countless-D" speculation in a Star Trek thread 1 hour ago and I wanted to correct that.
 
@Ever Because me and Azzy will be discussing whether or not the infinite dimensional statements would be taken as legitimate when we rescale the verse, as well as some other statements that back up a higher end 1-B from other tales regarding the Tree of Knowledge and the realms of the Low Elder Gods
 
Which doesn't scale to anyone because it was a temporary spatial anomaly. Already seen that one before.
 
Also, it goes without a saying I disagree heavily with High 1-B SCP based on that statement. Only reason why I agreed with it the last time was because I didn't know we rejected speculations completely if there was no evidence backing them up. In this case, the characters acknowledge that it's speculation.
 
@Kep It would scale to the Brothers who transcend the reality in which said anomaly was able to take place
 
Except it was a temporary anomaly that lasted for finite time.

That's like saying Yal transcends 3812 because he can destroy all of existence.
 
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