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1-A threads (yet again...)

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Sera_EX

Sera_EX

She Who Dabbles in Fiction
VS Battles
Retired
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5,102
I'm gonna keep this short, straight, and to the point. I've seen quite a number of 1-A threads lately and all of them are poorly debated, far worse than even your crappiest stomp thread.

3/4 of the people debating have no idea what they're talking about. The other 1/4 only appeal to authority for obvious reasons I won't even get into here. Even worst, the matches seem to be being added...

I'm sorry but it's gotten bothersome at this point. I'm not the only one that thinks this way either, I'm just the one vocal about it.
 
Just about everyone beats Hajun in these threads. I know for a fact that most of these people haven't even read Kajiri Kamui. It's untranslated after all...
 
It goes even worse when you hear stuff like "His law is a weakness"
 
And why the hec Tenma Yato winning against Michael is added i would never know
 
The DC Comics downplay is also annoying...
 
My point:

It is against the Versus Thread Discussion rules to make highly controversial topics. 1-A fights fit that category. We can't make Saint Seiya vs. Dragonball, or Marvel/DC vs Dragonball, so why make 1-A matches?
 
I still think they can be debated. People just need to know what they're talking about. You wouldn't take an astrophysics test when you only know basic physics would you?
 
People just need to know what they're talking about yes, but quite frankly, almost no one does, and even then, those who do are outweighed by those who don't.
 
"poorly debated"

"3/4 of the people debating have no idea what they're talking about."

How is this any different from a good portion of the matches we tend to have going on a day-to-day basis?

I'll explain this in a manner that's less blunt in a moment, if I need to.
 
MrKingOfNegativity said:
"poorly debated"
"3/4 of the people debating have no idea what they're talking about."

How is this any different from a good portion of the matches we tend to have going on a day-to-day basis?

I'll explain this in a manner that's less blunt in a moment, if I need to.
Click to expand...
I agree with this. Heck, High 1-B matches are far worse in this regard. In my experience at least.
 
Sera Loveheart said:
My point:
It is against the Versus Thread Discussion rules to make highly controversial topics. 1-A fights fit that category. We can't make Saint Seiya vs. Dragonball, or Marvel/DC vs Dragonball, so why make 1-A matches?
Click to expand...
Because DC vs DBZ and the like are far more controversial then a 1-A match could ever be.
 
MrKingOfNegativity said:
How is this any different from a good portion of the matches we tend to have going on a day-to-day basis?
Click to expand...
Because.... Umm....


Oof.
 
That's not the point, and you're right High 1-B matches are bad too. 1-A matches are worst though. This is experience talking, not opinion.
 
Sera Loveheart said:
That's not the point, and you're right High 1-B matches are bad too. 1-A matches are worst though. This is experience talking, not opinion.
Click to expand...
And this is my experience talking. 1-A matches aren't any worse then regular matches. I've made a few 1-A matches and they went fine. Do they go wrong sometimes? Yes. But not nearly as much as Superman vs. Goku does.
 
Obviously, but the difference is that results in fanboy flamewars.

In the case of 1-A, it's literally knowing nothing about the subject and simply appealing to authority when even they don't know what they're talking about.
 
Sera Loveheart said:
Obviously, but the difference is that results in fanboy flamewars.
In the case of 1-A, it's literally knowing nothing about the subject and simply appealing to authority when even they don't know what they're talking about.
Click to expand...
Again, that's most match-ups on this site. People follow what the admins are saying because they are the ones you would expect to be knowledgeable on this sort of thing.
 
Sera Loveheart said:
That's not the point, and you're right High 1-B matches are bad too. 1-A matches are worst though. This is experience talking, not opinion.
Click to expand...
Not to gripe, but your experience formed your opinion, so it is an opinion. Until you have hard and fast numbers comparing the two your anecdotal evidence is nothing more than a feeling.
 
I was speaking bluntly but, yeah.
 
And in Tier 2 threads, usually it comes down to a matter of abiltities. In 1-A matches it's always "who is above more 1-As" which is relative depending on the mechanics of the verse.
 
Well, my main problem with 2-B matches have been that people will put Goku up against people who are either extremely more haxxed than him, like Simon the Digger, and/or people who just oneshot him like Hiori's Lucario, Dreamy Bowser, and Count Bleck.

The biggest thing I mentioned in the above paragraph is that this was "my main problem", so in my personal experience, they have been the most troublesome, and in the experience of you, 1-A matches have been most troublesome. To some, DC VS DB matches have been most troublesome, and to others, matches involving SCP characters such as 871 or 628 have been most troublesome.

I don't think just opinions should be enough to ban matches, but like Assalt said, statistics.

The recent problems with 1-A threads we've been having are just outdated profiles.
 
I wasn't suggesting banning them outright. But address certain problems with it. Case in point, why are they added to pages? Like High 1-As and 0s they shouldn't even have an "Other" section.
 
Sera Loveheart said:
And in Tier 2 threads, usually it comes down to a matter of abiltities. In 1-A matches it's always "who is above more 1-As" which is relative depending on the mechanics of the verse.
Click to expand...


That's because in most cases there's no other way to determine who's stronger. But we can at least compare verse mechanics if they are made clear.
 
Michael VS Yatou is extremely outdated, and I don't know why the Presence VS Umr at-Tawil was added. There isn't a rule against adding them, it's just that they're usually just not good matches or even close, so they just shouldn't be added.

But like I said, the recent problem is that we're debating with characters who don't have their power properly defined on their pages due to being outdated. This is the case for all Umineko profiles and Masadaverse 1-A characters.
 
As someone who used to be vulnerable to this, I can definitely agree.

There are several misconceptions about 1-A characters and 1-A in general, like holy ****.

As far as I'm concerned, there are 1-A characters who are still tied to some sort of physicality (such as mass, mathematics, etc.), and other 1-A characters who aren't, yet either way they can be called "baseline 1-A".

Also, in the context of Masadaverse, I don't even know where "10 Taikyoku = 1 degree of infinity" came from.
 
It's from the Reinhard vs Bernkastel thread. And it's headcanon.
 
Pretty sure it was around from before then, but I never questioned it until a few days ago.

Now I'm looking for any justification for it.
 
It's false.

1 difference in Taikyoku means everything.

1 vs. 2.

2 no sells everything from 1.
 
Something can be a stomp or no sell without a different of infinity between them.

Which is why I require citation saying that there is a difference of infinity and not just "this guy has more taikyokyu therefore he wins no matter what", which is not necessarily an infinite gap

I don't care whether it's 10 taikyoku making it a stomp or 1, the point is that it needs proof that the difference is infinite.
 
There is no quote that says that, period

It just higher taikyoku = lower one being practically nonexistent and irrelevant to higher god
 
I think you need to analyze the ability of Shiori and her interaction with those with higher taykyoku.
 
From what I vaguely remember, we had a discussion about this previously, and ended up with the result that people can engage in 1-A threads for fun, but are not allowed to add the results to any character pages, as it is extremely hard to properly compare such characters.
 
@Ant

Thank you for clarifying. Because on Tenma Yato's page his "victory" against Michael was added and Presence VS Umr at-Tawil was also added for some reason.
 
People argued at that "do not expect" part of the rule meant that matches could still be added, they just shouldn't be expected to.

If we want, we can reword that to make it a flat out "no 1-A matches will be added on profiles"
 
@Monarch Laciel

I think that we should reword that part so it is not misunderstood, yes.
 
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