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Yu-Gi-Oh!: fixing Yubel Scaling + some additions

the type of tablet doesn't matter to my argument, well i guess it doesn't make sense for the tablet to be destroyed or something since they have been around for thousands of years so yeah i'll drop this point

literally false monsters do have emotions in duels and sometimes speak it doesn't necessarily mean that they're a diffrent version also there is no evidence that says DMG cannot talk in duels
1-?. but he doesn't really need only the disk other characters have shown that they don't necessarily need the disk
2-isn't finished how ?
3-just to clarfiy i'm not using my interpretation that diabound has resistance to sealing so yeah i am saying that even if diabound doesn't have resistance to sealing it still does not make any sense for him to be sealed
4-yea doesn't change much, there's no confirmation about that also sealing monsters has been a thing before egypt even existed
 
K, from now on I'll move the other point up (Just stating this to avoid confusion)

Hold on, I may have worded it wrong. I agree monsters can have emotions and talk, DMG does a lot actually. The issue is that DMG (Spirit World) is very different from DMG (DM) when they talk / act. For example, DMG (DM) rarely talks to Yugi and more often to the Dark Magician (LIke in BBT) whereas the Spirit World version talks excessively.

1- Who summoned another person's ka without the disk?
2- I'm arguing as the sealing is supposed to work for thousands of years but Diabound's didn't, that the sealing failed basically.
3- Oh. I guess this becomes more of a lore discussion then. I agree it doesn't make much sense too, outside the context of the debate, but then again Yugioh (anime) has quite a bit of plotholes so I usually don't worry about it much.
4- Uh, agree. However, Rome was several thousands of years after Egypt and Caesar never sealed them, he just liked the jewels to show his power.
 
DMG in the spirit world talks excessively because the spirit world is in danger normally she doesn't talk that much she also appears in atem's mind along with kuriboh so i find it really hard to believe that she originates from that said world

1-the one and only atem
2-i'm not sure if it works like that, if time was somehow related to the seal being successful or not and the seal failed because it is supposed to last for thousands of years then it would've curmbled by itself but we see that's not the case with diabound
3-so what's the conclusion on this point?
4-yeah i know but atlantis is wayy older
 
I know, but then she would be talking excessively during the entire arc as well. Especially in the Raphael fight given she alone would have proved his beliefs wrong.

1- When did that happen?
2- I guess? Although at this point we would just be debating technicalities.
3- Eh, we could just agree to disagree
4- Yeah, but what would matter is if Caesar could seal them and I don't think he was stated to have the Seal or a Milennium Item.
 
i mean she is just like always doesn't talk to other duelist except atem and DM so i'm not sure why she would go out of her way also her personalty is exactly the same as her spirit self she's always playing around teasing others etc , also if you really want to disprove DMG the card and the one in the duel spirit being different then you need to disprove the legendary dragons/knights whirch is basically impossible
1-when yugi was getting attacked by the spirits of kul elna and DM saved him
2-i'm not really sure if it's technicality since i don't remember time being established as a factor in sealing but eh
3-sure
4-well tablet of spirits existed in atlantis before the orchalcos came to and wayy before Milennium Items
 
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DMG (DM) doesn't talk to Yugi though, DMG (SW) does sure and not just Atem (Talks to Joey, Kaiba, and in GX the whole cast). Not sure you wanna bring up the Knights / Dragons, as they're pretty clearly affected by Yugi summoning them, unlike DMG.

1. Dark Magician wasn't summoned initially by Yugi though, he appeared on his own. He also managed to continue the fight with Bakura shortly after dying as Mahado.
2. Well it'd be a pretty split discussion on whether sealing counts as working if its failure is slightly delayed.
4. Yeah but neither is the time of Caesar / show Caesar with the ability to seal.
 
like i said in the rest of DM DMG doesn't need to talk because there was nothing like the spirit world being in danger and like i said when needed she does talk like when she talks with anzu in the virtual world, what do mean "affected by Yugi's summoning" because the dragons were almost always with DMG even in the end of the arc

1. and it's not really important to my point ? because your point is about how they need the disks to summon other KAs so the items would be used to summon their own KA if understand correctly but that's literally not true the millennium item are also used to summon other KAs , like when aknadin used his milennium eye
to summon humanoid giant and humanoid giant wasn't there when egypt was attacked so it kinda proves that the KAs they summoned to defend egypt wasn't their own
9fd9084f49c05d64c29f2e86e3602118.png
2906daa7e7d876a64cf74db72e6475c0.png
e13d3f43c56cc0daa5a4610f23622790.png

2. i'm not sure if it would be that split but i'll leave at that
4. neither did atlantis pre orichalcos and i mean nothing says that Caesar sealed Rianbow dragon himself ? also Caesar was very involved with Egypt iirc so it doesn't really contradict anything and it does make sense in world
 
Kinda goes against GX's portrayal of Spirit World Dark Magician Girl who goes as far as dueling for fun. Pretty sure when summoned they actively left the Spirit World, but I can check that later.

1. In the flashback you presented, everyone has their og Kas though. Also, Aknadin has a disk on his left arm when he summons humanoid giant. (5:50-6:10, you can see it when he jumps)
4. Irl Caesar spent 9 months there, Yugioh Caesar traveled the rest of the Old World instead from what I can tell. Also this would during the days of Ptolmey Egypt, long after the Milennium Items and Kas had been lost to time.
 
no it does not because she was always cheeky even in DM and i'm pretty sure that it wasn't ever established that she hates duels or something like that in DM
1-the disk is not open (not used) when he summoned humanoid giant which proves my point
971bad5b0d6be1d92be09fa33f45bf89.png
9c9560af45ebd6bca950b0af10bdcac5.png
479cddec9e99023954fdd73a96bd5c88.png

4.yes he gathered the gems from around the world there's nothing that says that he did not stay in egypt for 9 months , they're not really lost to time because shadi is experimenting on other people by using the millennium items to judge if they're worthy also nothing says that cesar sealed the crystal beasts by himself no matter how you slice it there's nothing contradictory here
 
No I meant she talks a lot in GX, whereas DMG (DM) may be cheeky but can't talk to yugi nearly as much
1. That looks rather open to me, usually only the tip sticks out, no?
4. First of all, we shouldn't be assuming IRL Ceasar's journey was the same, especially considering he never traveled the world ofc. Secondly I brought it up because there is no other point in time (if we want to use Caesar's IRL journey to Egypt) for this to happen. Before Egypt, he was in Gaul then in a civil war and afterwards in Italia til his assassination before he left for Parthia.

Lost in time to the common people.
 
she has physical form for that day of course she's gonna talk ,also you keep saying she can't talk when i'm pretty sure she doesn't try to unless evidence are given
1.yeah when characters use the disk the tip comes out in here it's not it's closed
4. well it could be a hyperbole and he didn't really travel through the entire world but yeah i get it so are we gonna use his IRL journey or not ? , well shadi could fill all of these just fine even without being a parana because it's anime

even if it's lost in time to common people it's not really impossible for him to just find the tablet or shadi somehow
 
I mean, if one DMG talks a lot in both her appearances (Spirit World & GX) and the other talks, well never in the entirety of the series, (DM) it becomes kinda apparent they're different: she doesn't necessarily can't talk. It's mostly just pointing out the differences between the two.
1. I think that's just the angle, if you look at 8:30 - 8:40 you can see it's open. Albeit it's a quick scene.
4. (Combining these last two) Idk if we use Caesar's IRL journey. Like I said, doesn't really fit. Not to mention it'd be kinda weird for him to meet Shadi and it never be brought up or just randomly get a tablet to bring back to Rome.
 
my guy you're literally ingoring the context of said scenes and i talked alot about how yugi refers to DMG (DM) as the same DMG he made promise with and how him referring to a diffrent DMG wouldn't make any sense narratively
1. still closed
f1f71e7ddb77b8a84bf7e703f5613758.png

4. im fine with either , like i said shadi could fit it all of it together , not really ? because of characters in ygo have shit randomly happen to them in yugioh for example pegasus he's literally the exact same as caesar's traveling through the world but for different reasons and then he met shadi
 
I wouldn't be using a narrative argument considering, again, how often DMG (DM) talking would have changed everything. Nevermind completely changing Raphael's mind- she could have told Yugi not to use the seal of Orichalchos for example. Having them be the same completely destroys the narrative logic there. But I don't mention that considering how season 4 isn't really narratively consistent.
1. That doesn't look closed but it is pretty blurred. Though the line art also depicts it as open.
4. That's not the weird part about it, the weird part is that it'd never be mentioned. And even this response, at best, is just as assuming to fit it in for your point.
 
in that duel atem's pride was on the line it was mentioned mutliple it so it would've hurt atem's pride alot if she were to help him , even if you ingore the pride part DMG was sealed when atem activated the seal of Orichalchos

1. even with the blurriness it still looks closed i can ask a couple of guys here to give thier opinion if you want. broken link
4.i have a rebuttal but first and foremost i want to be clear about this
so i want to know what you want from debating about this point do you want us to disregard the rainbow dragon&Caesar stuff stuff because of this or what ?
 
Raphael knowing the truth isn't reliant on hurting Atem's pride, or really any of the villains learning they were the baddies all along. DMG stopping him from activating the seal in the first place sounds rather important here, even more so than his pride.

1. Sure. The link works for me, but I could look for a replacement if no one can see it.
4. Ye, as Rainbow Dragon being trapped in the tablet kinda relies on Caesar being able to seal the Rainbow Dragon somehow, despite not knowing of Kas or having the items
 
to atem it was and that's the most important thing it was a duel about his ideals , even so if you ignore the ideals/pride concept the reason atem even activated the seal in the first place was because of dark magician the dragon knight being sealed

1- you could just link me the website or not the full pic, like this
4. but the Caesar&Rainbow Dragon stuff don't contradict anything or is it impossible to exist in verse and i could make as many bullshit as possible and it would still fit within the yugioh setting the reason i absolutely refused using diabound being sealed is because it does both of these
 
Which would all not matter if she just talked to Raphael beforehand.

1. Is this better?
4. To be fair here, you did just earlier reject the Diabound example because we don't know the full backstory behind it, so using Rainbow Dragon would be contradictory.
 
that's again ignoring the theme of the duel and what not and also ignoring how duel spirits mostly work timeus doesn't randomly decide to help yugi in a duel and doesn't randomly do stuff to dartz in a duel just because dartz sealed him a long time ago
1. yeah i see that but it's concept art .. the disk is not active in the show itself
4. we argued about this for almost 3 pages you know that's not the only reason i rejected the Diabound example
 
also here is a better pic of the disk being open and closed and to me it's clear that it's closed
61bcbcd547553be506e0992864e70fe7.png
f1f71e7ddb77b8a84bf7e703f5613758.png
 
All that means is that the theme of the duel has DMG (DM) and DMG (SW) seperate. But Spirit World DMG is clearly not bound by that, even if we ignore regular DMG has talked (In BBT) so there is no real excuse.
1. Would be weird to include it as line art but not use it- although the example itself is hard to accept considering Aknadin at this point isn't even a regular Ba user- if he still has Ba after becoming undead.
4. But it was the only reason that actually stuck.
 
not really because said theme addresses them as the same character so if you're accepting themes and narritve as an argument then you pretty much concede on DMG being the same person as the one in the spirit world , again you're acting as if DMG doesn't talk in DM like ever when that's not the case
1. i mean there's alot of stuff yugioh drops later on like kaiba being the final bad guy after zorc's defeat misawa's fire dragon the light of destruction storyline and so on so it's really that weird , Ba is the energy of your soul/willpower just because you become an undead doesn't mean that you're souless/have no will also aknadin has one of the strongest wills due to how bad he wants his son to be the pharaoh
4. literally the conclusion of that debate is "yeah it doesn't make sense" and i could do the whole debate again
 
I brought up the theme because that's the current argument- and no, it would mean they're separate. Point to me where DMG (DM) talked as if she was DMG (SW). I already brought DMG (DM) in BBT talking as a counterpoint as she was in the middle of a duel at the time, meaning there was no excuse for the Raphael fight.
1. Fair, although like I said, Aknadin is definitely not a regular Ba user at the least after being resurrected, especially now that he wields a portion of Zorc's power.
4. Sure you can, but then the same applies for the Rainbow Dragon. You can't use one and not the other while giving the same reason to not use one.
 
ok then explain how they're separate , in BBT DMG says that the monster they're against seems strong but DM assures her and says that with their power and master (yugi) victory is assured so DM is basically telling her to trust thier power and their master which doesn't contradict anything that i've said she doesn't just talk to yugi or paradox randomly
1. i know he isn't a regular Ba user because of him having zorc's powers but that's not the point because when he summoned humanoid giant he didn't use zorc's powers he used the eye
9fd9084f49c05d64c29f2e86e3602118.png

4.dude they're not the same thing because like i said Caesar having rainbow dragon's tablet doesnt contradict anything or is it impossible to exist in verse meanwhile diabound being sealed does
 
I mentioned it since BBT proves DMG can talk in the middle of a duel, which if she was the same as the Spirit World DMG, would result in her entirely disproving the villains. Also feels like the GX example keeps getting ignored when DMG (SW) summons DMG (DM)...
1. Let me explain, the Ka reflects the Ba, so having a different Ba / infused with someone else's power would therefore change the ka at least slightly.
4. Neither does Diabound's origin, its just not explained thoroughly.
 
i never said she can't talk in middle of a duel i said that she doesn't talk to her master nor her master's opponent because of reasons above, what's wrong with that ?
1. that's true but that only applies when a Ka gets born it refelcts the user's Ba and will so while his soul got fused with zorc his will is still the same and it doesn't make sense for his Ka to trun out like that given that again his will is still the same and given that humanoid giant doesn't look anyway near close to the Kas being summoned when egypt was attacked
4. diabound's origin was explained he's born from the haterd of the people that got killed in kul elna him getting sealed on the other hand is not explained what's so ever
 
Yeah zexal and above ***** the continuity real hard
Also Didn't i already agree?
Anyways just in case i Agree
 
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