Yhwach The Almighty vs Son Goku (Xeno)

[Ottavio_Merluzzo]

Incon FRA

 

[Arcker123]

I must have been reading the wrong chapters of bleach then cause I never saw him changing the future every time Ichigo decided to take one step forward or one step backward

I mean. He did do that though. He was rewriting the future every time Ichigo moved to trap him.

I was talking more about Yhwach’s deeper characte.

 

[Ss3micah]

So like can someone make a list of both characters wincon?

As far as I know…
Yhwach has none and Neither does Goku
Too many 3-D Hax that get nulled by Keysword and Fate Hax just traps Goku in a loop he can’t attack Yhwach and can’t summon people

My only other argument here is that with Stamina Hax, Goku just passive nulls Yhwach long enough to seal him or summon someone that resist Fate Hax

Otherwise if that fails then incon

 

[Hellscream]

It's not about yhwach changing every future, yhwach literally states, that anything he sees being used, he also understand, and anything he understands will become unable to affect him in any way. Which means, that if goku uses his summoning, it pretty much gets nullified as soon as it's used in any of the infinitev amount of futures that yhwach sees

But like i said, even if they were to seal him, yhwach can still see the effects of being "sealed" in the future, and negate it.

And i specifically stated that yhwach has 4-d power absorption multiple times.

 

[Ss3micah]

I mean. He did do that though. He was rewriting the future every time Ichigo moved to trap him.

Yeah but there difference here is that Yhwach KNOWS what ichigo is gonna do to trap him.
He doesn’t know what Goku is gonna do because again….. he can’t see the Acausal 4 summons. All Yhwach would see is Goku doing nth worth concern such as Standing Still or Posing like a Goof and your still saying that would be enough to convince Yhwach that Goku is trying to trap him and he needs to Rewrite the Future

I was talking more about Yhwach’s deeper characte.

Meh
In that context I guess

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

As far as I know…
Yhwach has none and Neither does Goku
Too many 3-D Hax that get nulled by Keysword and Fate Hax just traps Goku in a loop he can’t attack Yhwach and can’t summon people

My only other argument here is that with Stamina Hax, Goku just passive nulls Yhwach long enough to seal him or summon someone that resist Fate Hax

Otherwise if that fails then incon

So with DD would Goku have enough time to fuse with tokitoki? that should resolve the issue with fate hax no?

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

Also since it's Goku would he have Awakened Keysword? or just dormant since if I am correct only few characters have awakened one being trunks, demigra and chronoa if I am correct

 

[Ottavio_Merluzzo]

Also since it's Goku would he have Awakened Keysword? or just dormant since if I am correct only few characters have awarded one being trunks, demigra and chronoa if I am correct

He doesn't have the Awakened Keysword.

 

[Ss3micah]

It's not about yhwach changing every future, yhwach literally states, that anything he sees being used, he also understand, and anything he understands will become unable to affect him in any way.

Keysword resist layered 4-D Powernull so yeah he ain’t nulling anything

Which means, that if goku uses his summoning, it pretty much gets nullified as soon as it's used in any of the infinitev amount of futures that yhwach sees

Keysword grants resistances to its weilder so Goku also resists 4-D Powernull

But like i said, even if they were to seal him, yhwach can still see the effects of being "sealed" in the future, and negate it.

If he can’t null Goku he can’t stop summons

And i specifically stated that yhwach has 4-d power absorption multiple times.

4-D Power Absorption not physically
Not to mention Goku has DD which can Passive Null Yhwach since he doesn’t resist stamina Hax. Null him long enough to seal or summon

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

from what I know he can awaken it with summon but I am not sure how long does awakening the sword will take

 

[Ss3micah]

Also since it's Goku would he have Awakened Keysword? or just dormant since if I am correct only few characters have awakened one being trunks, demigra and chronoa if I am correct

If Goku had Awaken Keysword this would be an auto stomp

So with DD would Goku have enough time to fuse with tokitoki? that should resolve the issue with fate hax no?

Yup
A passive null that can definitely keep Yhwach incapacitated long enough for Sealing or Summoning to happen

 

[ArmBill]

Yhwach Is more raw, so he wins.

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

Goku appreciate Ywhach's mustache while Ywhach is ****** confused on how Base Goku's hair looks the exact same from front and side

 

[Deceived3596]

This thread's a certified bruh moment.

Yhwach's absorption is objectively 4-D, he absorbed Soul King's Fate Manipulation, which is 4-D and he absorbed Mimihagi's precognition resistance, which is 4-D. The reason why Weaken Soul King doesn't have it in his tabber is because his profile is straight ass right now.

Yhwach in-character does spam the **** out of his Almighty, he literally did it against Ichigo multiple times.

I'm leaning towards Yhwach as i see him absorbing Goku before Goku seals him away because of The Almighty's Fate Manipulation constantly changing the future events which might occur, allowing him to chose a future which Goku doesn't use sealing in it or doesn't summon his goobers, and him deciding to chose a future which he's absorbing Goku, regardless of the range disparity between each other, similar how he made his attack hit Ichigo despite the fact it was blocked by Orihime's Shun Shun Rikka.

 

[Ss3micah]

This thread's a certified bruh moment.

Certified? Nahhhhhh
Why haven’t reached THAT level yet

Yhwach's absorption is objectively 4-D, he absorbed Soul King's Fate Manipulation, which is 4-D and he absorbed Mimihagi's precognition resistance, which is 4-D. The reason why Weaken Soul King doesn't have it in his tabber is because his profile is straight ass right now.

Again, don’t blame me for going by the profile lol. That’s what it’s expected that we are supposed to do. And again I thought we were talking about PHYSICAL absorption. If it’s power absorption then yeah I agree he can absorb 4-D Hax. I thought what was being argued was that his physical absorption was 4-D that being capable of absorption of 4-D structures and stuff

Not like it matters cause Goku does resist 4-D absorption anyways

Yhwach in-character does spam the **** out of his Almighty, he literally did it against Ichigo multiple times.

Then summoning won’t happen easily then nor will sealing unless Goku incaps Yhwach with passive Stamina Hax and SEI that Nulls Yhwach long enough to get sealing or summoning off

I'm leaning towards Yhwach as i see him absorbing Goku

Goku resists 4-D absorption so nope

before Goku seals him away because of The Almighty's Fate Manipulation constantly changing the future events which might occur, allowing him to chose a future which Goku doesn't use sealing

Sealing can happen if Goku passive nulls Yhwach with DD leaving him powernulled long enough to summon or seal

in it or doesn't summon his goobers, and him deciding to chose a future which he's absorbing Goku,

Goku resist 4-D absorption

 

[Ss3micah]

btw isnt absorption Contact Based?
Regardless Goku having Keysword both amps his already innate 4-D resistance since the keysword has its own unique 4-D absorption resistance plus Goku can just powernull absorption with Keysword

 

[Deceived3596]

Again, don’t blame me for going by the profile lol. That’s what it’s expected that we are supposed to do. And again I thought we were talking about PHYSICAL absorption. If it’s power absorption then yeah I agree he can absorb 4-D Hax. I thought what was being argued was that his physical absorption was 4-D that being capable of absorption of 4-D structures and stuff

Not like it matters cause Goku does resist 4-D absorption anyways

If he's capable of absorbing 4-D abilities his absorption would be 4-D, he just doesn't have the range to absorb 4-D sized objects and beings.

Evidence?

Then summoning won’t happen easily then nor will sealing unless Goku incaps Yhwach with passive Stamina Hax and SEI that Nulls Yhwach long enough to get sealing or summoning off

Yhwach would just continuously absorb Reishi around him to regain his lost Stamina or could indirectly negate the drain with The Vanishing Point, also idk what "SEI" is, can you explain that a little more in-depth?

I currently don't see how either would stop Yhwach from Fate Manipulating Goku into oblivion tbh.

 

[Ss3micah]

Evidence?

This is why we have a profile that’s ACCURATE and point people towards lol
Goku has resistance to Dark Factor which includes 4-D absorption

Yhwach would just continuously absorb Reishi around him to regain his lost Stamina or could indirectly negate the drain with The Vanishing Point, also idk what "SEI" is, can you explain that a little more in-depth?

DD and Goku’s long list of other stamina Hax constantly re-affects those with more than bare minimum stamina. So if Yhwach tries to regain more stamina it’ll instantly be set back to Bare Minimum over and over again

SEI means Status Effect Inducement
Once the target reaches a stamina level of Zero. They are locked in a state where they can’t perform any actions and all their abilities and locked from activation. Goku’s stamina Hax are passive and DD alone drops the opponent’s stamina literally 1 point away from Zero and even the most basic stamina Hax can drain 10% of stamina with Goku literally having dozens of stamina Hax passives all of which can take 10% to 90% of stamina passively and all of them acting on Yhwach all at once. No amount of Reishi absorption will stop DD from resetting his stamina back to 1 point from zero if it ever becomes at least 2 points above Zero and the other stamina Hax makes it worse

I currently don't see how either would stop Yhwach from Fate Manipulating Goku into oblivion tbh.

Cause DD and SEI powernulls him. He can’t activate Fate Hax because it’s activation is locked due to SEI and once Goku goes for sealing or summon any Acausal 4 beings it’s over

I mean Silver Arrow vibes be like stating that Yhwach can be locked out of using Almighty even if only for a moment that’s more than enough for goku

 

[LordGinSama]

Why you always cry when i see you

Ironic.

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

This thread's a certified bruh moment.

Yhwach's absorption is objectively 4-D, he absorbed Soul King's Fate Manipulation, which is 4-D and he absorbed Mimihagi's precognition resistance, which is 4-D. The reason why Weaken Soul King doesn't have it in his tabber is because his profile is straight ass right now.

Yhwach in-character does spam the **** out of his Almighty, he literally did it against Ichigo multiple times.

I'm leaning towards Yhwach as i see him absorbing Goku before Goku seals him away because of The Almighty's Fate Manipulation constantly changing the future events which might occur, allowing him to chose a future which Goku doesn't use sealing in it or doesn't summon his goobers, and him deciding to chose a future which he's absorbing Goku, regardless of the range disparity between each other, similar how he made his attack hit Ichigo despite the fact it was blocked by Orihime's Shun Shun Rikka.

Aren't time patrolers immune to changes in time

 

[Ss3micah]

Aren't time patrolers immune to changes in time

Acausal 1 yup
But that’s stop fate Hax I believe

 

[Ottavio_Merluzzo]

Aren't time patrolers immune to changes in time

Aca1 doesn't protect you from Fate Manipulation.

 

[theultimate5105]

What stops Goku from traveling to the past and killing Yhwach before he even had the Almighty

 

[Ss3micah]

What stops Goku from traveling to the past and killing Yhwach before he even had the Almighty

That’s actually a good question…

Yhwach doesn’t have Acausal 1 and can’t see into the past with Precog

All he would see with Precog is Goku instantly vanishing (since Time Travel happens instantly) and that’s it
Fate Hax can’t affect the Past either obviously

He could literally go back in time and kill Yhwach before attaining Almighty as both Fate and Yhwach are still subjected to Causality and Time Paradoxes

Even if Yhwach likes spamming Fate Hax there is no way he’s rewriting the future constantly every single millisecond and that’s all Goku needs to time travel

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

Keysword isn't a standard equipment on goku profile.

NLF


Goku has immeasurable speed so that's a massive advantage and Keysword is No factor here as it's not a standard gear equipment and OP never said Goku has Keysword.

Speed was equalized bro

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

imagine putting a low 2-C with environmental destruction to fight a 2-A+

Yhwach is soloed via the presence of xeno, nothing that Yhwach has affects Goku xeno, blitz after blitz, even before Yhwach activates the almighty he is dead

What's the use of changing all possible futures and they're all dead?

Yhwach is the most overrated character, 4D absorption via absorbing an immobile fetus lol

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Not ready for deployment yet

Saturno do Omega would make a good fight with Seu Madruga

 

[Deceived3596]

imagine putting a low 2-C with environmental destruction to fight a 2-A+

Yhwach is soloed via the presence of xeno, nothing that Yhwach has affects Goku xeno, blitz after blitz, even before Yhwach activates the almighty he is dead

What's the use of changing all possible futures and they're all dead?

Yhwach is the most overrated character, 4D absorption via absorbing an immobile fetus lol

 

[Hellscream]

Keysword resist layered 4-D Powernull so yeah he ain’t nulling anything

Keysword grants resistances to its weilder so Goku also resists 4-D Powernull

If he can’t null Goku he can’t stop summons

4-D Power Absorption not physically
Not to mention Goku has DD which can Passive Null Yhwach since he doesn’t resist stamina Hax. Null him long enough to seal or summon

Prove that their powernull is on yhwach's level, which i very highly doubt.

 

[Hellscream]

Actually, i just noticed that most of the keyswords resistances, and powers are only used against dark ki, something exclusive to the demon race in DBH?

So how exactly is any of that relevant to yhwach's hax?

 

[Ss3micah]

Prove that their powernull is on yhwach's level, which i very highly doubt.

Goku can use both DD power lock and Keysword powernull, both of which can work against 4-D Higher Dimensional Existence Beings with Layered 4-D Resistance to Powernull

Yhwach is still ultimately a 3-D being with a 3-D resistance to Power Null and his greatest feats of using Almighty to Powernull characters were against 3-D characters who dont even resist powernull and those that do definitely dont have it to a 4-D level

NowI must ask you...
One what grounds can you claim

#1: That Yhwach's power null works against goku when goku has the Dark Factor Resistance and Keysword amped resistance both of which resist layered 4-D power null.
#2: That he can resist goku's powernull when Yhwach has no resistance feats to 4-D powernull

 

[YungManzi]

Prove that their powernull is on yhwach's level, which i very highly doubt.

Yhwach's Pnull is baseline, so if they're indeed layered and 4-D then that pnull is >>Yhwach's. Which is kind of a moot point since, Yhwach has no resistance to the almighty anyway.

 

[Hellscream]

With what i've seen most of these powernulls, come from dark ki/ factor, which the keysword counteracts, as it was pretty much created to defeat them.
Yet again, don't see how this applies to yhwach.

 

[Ss3micah]

With what i've seen most of these powernulls, come from dark ki/ factor, which the keysword counteracts, as it was pretty much created to defeat them.
Yet again, don't see how this applies to yhwach.

Let me ask you a question then

The DF has its own 4-D layered powernull which Goku resist and the Keysword further amps thats resistance with its own resistance.... Then why do you think Yhwach's powernull which is baseline 4-D would work against Goku who already has layers of resistance to 4-D powernull?

And why do you say Keysword's powernull would not work against Yhwach when his greatest powernull resistance feat is 3-D and the powernull of the keysword operates on layered 4-D?

 

[Hellscream]

Wait, is this the powernull of the keysword / DF?

 

[Ss3micah]

Wait, is this the powernull of the keysword / DF?

Ohhh joy so now its gonna turn into THAT kinda debate....
DF

 

[Ss3micah]

Let me ask you a question then

The DF has its own 4-D layered powernull which Goku resist and the Keysword further amps thats resistance with its own resistance.... Then why do you think Yhwach's powernull which is baseline 4-D would work against Goku who already has layers of resistance to 4-D powernull?

And why do you say Keysword's powernull would not work against Yhwach when his greatest powernull resistance feat is 3-D and the powernull of the keysword operates on layered 4-D?

Wait, is this the powernull of the keysword / DF?

Also I would like an answer to my question sirrr

 

[TheGunsFinalWrath]

Yhwach has access to Sternritter correct?

 

[Ss3micah]

Yhwach has access to Sternritter correct?

Yup

 

[TheGunsFinalWrath]

Yup

Ok, that's what confuses me. He has never used these in the story before, no? So like, what's the point of giving him a access to these, if he has never used them in story before?