When Silent Protagonists duke it out

[TheGatememer]

The gap is probably not as large as it seems to be if argue that Ganondorf is reasonably more skilled than other characters Kohga, that are already superior to at least adequately-trained goons.

That's like, nothing compared to Byleth's skill though. We're talking like, Byleth skillscrews Shez, who skillscrews all the House leaders, who skill screws your average student, each of whom can casually take down strongholds filled with dozens, if not hundreds of kingdom soldiers, who are skilled to the point where southern kingdom soldiers seem unskilled in comparison, who are more skilled than, well, literal kingdom civilians. Oh yeah, and this all happened 6 months before the game even began.

So basically: Byleth > Shez > Three House Leaders > Playable Students > 12+/100+ Kingdom Soldiers > Kingdom Soldiers > Southern Kingdom Soldiers > Kingdom Civillians

See here for more info, if you want.

Also, Link has better access to potent status effects such as electrical stunning and completely freezing enemies in a shell of ice.

Byleth can also electrocute enemies, and freeze them in place, and also has plenty of other status effects, like Burning (which can affect characters that can traverse lava), and Spellbound, which makes Link move slower, have reduced defense/resistance, and be unable to guard against any attacks.

And there's some mitigation against the Luck items affecting dodge rate due to the previously mentioned homing arrows.

Which isn't anything Byleth hasn't dealt with before, given that your average archer can learn the combat art Tracking Shot.

You know damn well that's based on chance and at an absurd peak if we want to talk about stat caps, it's like 16%.

Yeah, hence why I said there is a chance they could be nullified.

and technically, its closer to 19% if we factor in Three Hopes, and that's excluding amps

Link's toolkit is incredibly flexible and can realistically change tactics if he needs too including falling back. And every time Byleth wants to recieve that information, they have to expend one of their limited Pulses to do so.

It's not like Byleth is gonna spam divine pulse everytime Link pulls up a new strat. There's nothing stopping Byleth from falling back either, and sniping Link from afar with their spells, or ranged attacks.

I'm pretty sure that couldn't count considering how that wold basically change Byleth's key.

Meh, at this stage, Sothis still hasn't regained her power, so it probably wouldn't change Byleth's tier. Either way, worst case scenario, it bloodlusts Byleth.

That's still an option that requires diverting attention and resources away from Link.

Like a second or two at most, but sure.

 

[Dust_Collector]

OK yeah so funny deconstruction still happens if it's blocked

 

[TheGatememer]

What's stopping Link from rapid firing like a dozen at once? Especially when he can do it in slow down? In fact can they even react to that while getting blitzed?

Passive probability manipulation + luck manipulation would make Byleth harder to hit, Link could be frozen in place or paralyzed, Low-Mid Regen + Healing could allow Byleth to just heal it off, Attack Negation could allow some of those hits to be negated, Miracle would prevent at least 1 fatal attack from killing Byleth, Awakening would prevent Byleth from dying from normal attacks period, Instinctive Action allows Byleth to sometimes automatically block attacks, Skill, and Byleth could arguably just stay out of range from Link's arrows since Byleth arguably has better range.

Danmaku levels of attacks aren't anything Byleth hasn't dealt with either, and Link can only rapidly fire a "dozen" at once with bows like the 5*Lynel bows, and he has to be in the air in order to activate Bullet Time. Though, I guess the Great Eagle Bow does exist.

Also, Byleth can do the same (yes I know its claude, but it's a generic animation that everyone can do)

 

[TheGatememer]

HOL UP

Cant Link also do dumb shit like AOE lightning cause Byleth to drop shit, and then just fuse his weapons to his own effectively stealing it?

Cool, Link just fused an inverted Str/Mag sword, now his attacks do jacksh against Byleth

 

[Chariot190]

Byleth can also electrocute enemies,

Yes, but to what extent? Not all of Link's stuff is made equal, like obviously faroosh shit > electric keese shit.

And it has been awhile, but has any of Byleth's attacks ever actually displayed things like muscle spasms?
I think Link also has elemental up+ buffs? Idk tho i never used

and freeze them in place,

As above.

and also has plenty of other status effects, like Burning (which can affect characters that can traverse lava),

Can heal that, Sidon's water shield, etc.
Also we talking magma or lava? Is it the javelin wasteland valley you talking about?

and Spellbound, which makes Link move slower,

Flurry, plus he has potions and stuff that triple his speed to offset.

have reduced defense/resistance,

As above.

and be unable to guard against any attacks.

Is that even true? Seems a tad NLF. Like most sure, but ANY attack? Even unconventional or hax?

Which isn't anything Byleth hasn't dealt with before, given that your average archer can learn the combat art Tracking Shot.

Having dealt with it, doesn't mean it isn't there, Link has that and literally a thousand extra things to work off it that said archers lacked. It isn't a comparable situation.

and technically, its closer to 19% if we factor in Three Hopes, and that's excluding amps

But are we? Actually what is even the canon relation between that and this specific Byleth key? Idk about you but I'd prefer to not veer far off and go "Technically in this OTHER game it can do this", if that isn't actually the case in the key of the game being used, just kinda comes off as contradictory as to what this specific key can actually do.

It's not like Byleth is gonna spam divine pulse everytime Link pulls up a new strat. There's nothing stopping Byleth from falling back either, and sniping Link from afar with their spells, or ranged attacks.

What about time stop/recalling, using a flurry dash to bridge the distance and stopping them, sniping them back with heat-seeking elemental stuff, hopping on one of the zonai schematics and flying after them, etc. Like Link has a LOT of options that makes disengaging him extremely difficult, and all but impossible if they ever enter CQC given Link has Blade Mode that he can proc if Byleth so much as swings a weapon and in lore, all it is, is Link focusing so maybe not even that

Link could be frozen in place or paralyzed,

He can actually shrug off his own shit i accidentally nuked myself with the dragon items testing if they affected Ganon, they only daze him for a moment and they're the best in the game. Think mashing actual helps against ice too, might be wrong tho
Lightning stuff is annoying tho, instant recall helps tho

Low-Mid Regen + Healing could allow Byleth to just heal it off,

By that same token, can't Link hold up to 99x fairy lads? If we counting healing that might make this match totally impossible to win.
Though that begs the question, how much healing shit can Byleth have at this point? FE3H works on a time limit, iirc you cant INFINITELY get money and max out your items by this point in the game, can you?

Attack Negation could allow some of those hits to be negated,

But what if Link uses multi shot? Negating one won't help against the other 4 at the same time, especially things wit lasting "hitboxes" (idk how to word this, but im sure ya know what I mean).

Miracle would prevent at least 1 fatal attack from killing Byleth

This is fair, but I also feel that doesn't exactly cover more abstract stuff like deconstruction or soul steal, or multi attack items.

Awakening would prevent Byleth from dying from normal attacks period,

Given TOTK's whole gimmick, I'm sure almost every attack Link does is gonna have SOME sort of extra effect cooked in.

Instinctive Action allows Byleth to sometimes automatically block attacks,

Still needs to be fast enough to actually block them tho, IA isn't a free "block anything", that's a NLF, it works against the quickest thing it's shown to, now speed is equal yes, but I don't think it ever blocked an attack that is like 100x quicker than Byleth? Or whatever amount his amp is, i just know it's some dumb number.

and Byleth could arguably just stay out of range from Link's arrows since Byleth arguably has better range.

Flurry dash, recall, idk man he has a LOT of options, bro can even just fly up on something and carpet bomb out of range if the range game is going to be played.

Danmaku levels of attacks aren't anything Byleth hasn't dealt with either, and Link can only rapidly fire a "dozen" at once with bows like the 5*Lynel bows, and he has to be in the air in order to activate Bullet Time. Though, I guess the Great Eagle Bow does exist.

Wdym? A dozen is less than 3 shots, if he bullet times (aka just back flip with a wing shield or whatever) he can get a fuckton off whenever, and if he fuses the arrows with say, dragon horns AOE, gems, ancient tech, homing elemental stuff like elemental keese items, confuse shrooms, etc, whatever, actually avoiding anything is going to be next to impossible given half these have decent AOE, especially as this would happen way quicker than Byleth could react. Hell, Link can fire multiple of these at once, not like he only needs to pick one type, bullet time lasts long enough he can do shit like AOE flash freeze, lighting, deconstruction, and confusion all in one jump.
If not longer if he has stam food.

Also, Byleth can do the same (yes I know its claude, but it's a generic animation that everyone can do)

Not quite the same, Link can do his while speed amping.

Cool, Link just fused an inverted Str/Mag sword, now his attacks do jacksh against Byleth

What? Why that particular weapon? Why not one of the numerous actual half-decent weapons Byleth would surely be using instead? I don't think any of Byleth's stuff resists fusionism? I could be wrong, but given you can even fuse the MS, ehhhh also this would still make Byleth down a weapon
Also tbf, Link has a huge ass inventory, he isnt coming up with just one weapon.


Tbh, the main problem I see is that Byleth really dont got a counter to Blade Mode, shit just kinda lets Link mog for free given how ridiculous an amp that is. Divine Pulse is a thing, but knowing Link is suddenly gonna rush you at 300x speed or whatever the hell it is or do a flip and carpet bomb you with deconstruction blitz, doesn't exactly mean you can avoid it much the same way you could know a bullet is coming and not be able to do anything.

 

[Chariot190]

Oh right, can't Link just stop time and then rewind Byleth's projectile or long-ranged attacks back at him?

 

[TheGatememer]

Yes, but to what extent? Not all of Link's stuff is made equal, like obviously faroosh shit > electric keese shit.

It works differently compared to Link's stuff, and basically acts like extra damage + harms his allies around him

And it has been awhile, but has any of Byleth's attacks ever actually displayed things like muscle spasms?

No, as far as I can remember

I think Link also has elemental up+ buffs? Idk tho i never used

That only increases his attack power in certain climates/weathers iirc.

As above.

It freezes the enemy, and the enemy remains frozen for like 10-20 seconds, even when hit a bunch of times, unlike the frozen status in ToTK/BotW.

Can heal that, Sidon's water shield, etc.
Also we talking magma or lava? Is it the javelin wasteland valley you talking about?

Yea, characters are unaffected by the volcanic temperatures of the Valley of Torment, and only take slight damage while traversing lava.

As above.

Link doesn't have anything to increase his Magic Resistance from food.

Is that even true? Seems a tad NLF. Like most sure, but ANY attack? Even unconventional or hax?

I mean, it works against death hax. I wouldn't say any attack, but I mean most attacks, especially from those in the same tier.

Having dealt with it, doesn't mean it isn't there, Link has that and literally a thousand extra things to work off it that said archers lacked. It isn't a comparable situation.

tbh, I could argue said archers are more skilled than Link in most areas.

Sure, he has bullet time, but what else?

But are we? Actually what is even the canon relation between that and this specific Byleth key? Idk about you but I'd prefer to not veer far off and go "Technically in this OTHER game it can do this", if that isn't actually the case in the key of the game being used, just kinda comes off as contradictory as to what this specific key can actually do.

I don't really understand your question; are you asking which is more "canon"? If that's what you're asking, both are equally canon, and there's no reason Byleth shouldn't have access to the same abilities they have in Three Hopes.

What about time stop/recalling,

Link doesn't have time stop, according to his profile. And I don't see what recalling would do here. But, Byleth has Time Stop, and while they can't move during it, they can still use it to think, and prepare for Link's attacks.

using a flurry dash to bridge the distance and stopping them,

Link can't flurry rush hundreds of meters, and he has to actually dodge an attack for it to work.

sniping them back with heat-seeking elemental stuff,

Which can easily be healed off, blocked, or dodged, especially from a distance. The only notable long range multi-shot bow Link has is the Great Eagle Bow.

hopping on one of the zonai schematics and flying after them, etc.

Then Byleth can also just fly away on a Pegasus/Wyvern, or shoot him down, since Link can't attack while controlling a steering stick.

Like Link has a LOT of options that makes disengaging him extremely difficult, and all but impossible if they ever enter CQC given Link has Blade Mode that he can proc if Byleth so much as swings a weapon and in lore, all it is, is Link focusing so maybe not even that

That is assuming Link actually dodges Byleth's attacks, and at the last moment. That's gonna be difficult when Byleth's melee weapons can hit opponents from tens of meters away (and I don't mean like vacuum slashes either, like straight up reach hax from minecraft type crap).

Also, if Link gets caught up in Byleth's Windsweep, which is basically a small tornado that sucks opponents in, his counterattacks will be nullified, so even if Link activates Flurry Rush, he's not gonna be able to attack Byleth back. And as long as Byleth keeps attacking Link (which they will, given they can dish out like over 100 attacks in seconds), well, this happens.

He can actually shrug off his own shit i accidentally nuked myself with the dragon items testing if they affected Ganon, they only daze him for a moment and they're the best in the game. Think mashing actual helps against ice too, might be wrong tho
Lightning stuff is annoying tho, instant recall helps tho

It still affects him, so really, not really that notable tbh.

By that same token, can't Link hold up to 99x fairy lads? If we counting healing that might make this match totally impossible to win.

if you glitch stuff, sure, but Link can only hold up to like, 4 fairies, since they stop spawning after a certain amount.

Though that begs the question, how much healing shit can Byleth have at this point? FE3H works on a time limit, iirc you cant INFINITELY get money and max out your items by this point in the game, can you?

Funny enough, Byleth doesn't really need healing items. They have the Combat Art Healing Focus, which heals Byleth 50% of their HP each time, and literally has no drawbacks besides not being as effective at healing as an Elixir. They also have Low-Mid Regen from several sources, like Blessed Weapons, and the skill Renewal.

But what if Link uses multi shot? Negating one won't help against the other 4 at the same time, especially things wit lasting "hitboxes" (idk how to word this, but im sure ya know what I mean).

lol

I gotta check later, but don't Multi-shot bows have some spread? So unless Link is like right up in Byleth's face, or uses Keese Eyes, they're unlike to all hit. And again, probability manip + supernatural luck would help on top of Byleth's dodging skills.

This is fair, but I also feel that doesn't exactly cover more abstract stuff like deconstruction or soul steal, or multi attack items.

Soul Steal wouldn't really impact Byleth in this fight, albeit not because of Miracle, since Byleth can survive without their soul.

Given TOTK's whole gimmick, I'm sure almost every attack Link does is gonna have SOME sort of extra effect cooked in.

Ye, but unless that gimmick is deconstruction, it's probably not gonna kill Byleth. And going by chapter 15 in Three Hopes, characters can canonically remain Awakened for at least several minutes at a time.

Still needs to be fast enough to actually block them tho, IA isn't a free "block anything", that's a NLF, it works against the quickest thing it's shown to, now speed is equal yes, but I don't think it ever blocked an attack that is like 100x quicker than Byleth? Or whatever amount his amp is, i just know it's some dumb number.

It works against enemies that can move FTE in comparison to Byleth, like users of Astra, which is a pretty crazy speed amp. Oh yeah, and Byleth can also use Astra as well, and can additionally move way faster with certain attacks.

Flurry dash, recall, idk man he has a LOT of options, bro can even just fly up on something and carpet bomb out of range if the range game is going to be played.

Again, Flurry Rush won't allow Link to instantly travel hundreds of meters, and I don't see what recall would do, aside from recalling a single one of Byleth's projectiles, which they can spam.

Byleth can also fly, via Wyverns / Pegasi, and they have much greater mobility than Zonai vehicles.

Wdym? A dozen is less than 3 shots, if he bullet times (aka just back flip with a wing shield or whatever) he can get a fuckton off whenever,

Wingshields only make Link last for like a second in the air, only enough for him to shoot once or maybe twice while in Bullet Time.

and if he fuses the arrows with say, dragon horns AOE, gems, ancient tech, homing elemental stuff like elemental keese items, confuse shrooms, etc, whatever, actually avoiding anything is going to be next to impossible given half these have decent AOE, especially as this would happen way quicker than Byleth could react. Hell, Link can fire multiple of these at once, not like he only needs to pick one type, bullet time lasts long enough he can do shit like AOE flash freeze, lighting, deconstruction, and confusion all in one jump.
If not longer if he has stam food.

All that just for Byleth to tank all of it sans deconstruction with Miracle/Awakening, and instantly heal it off with regen + healing

Wouldn't Link need a bit of prep to actually fuse stuff like wings/bombs to his shields and stuff anyhow? And the Bombs are only one-time use, so unless Link gets lucky enough to fuse a bunch of bomb shields or whatever, he's going to constantly have to re-fuse his mobility shields.

Not quite the same, Link can do his while speed amping.

I was more referring to the danmaku levels of arrows, but fair.

What? Why that particular weapon? Why not one of the numerous actual half-decent weapons Byleth would surely be using instead? I don't think any of Byleth's stuff resists fusionism? I could be wrong, but given you can even fuse the MS, ehhhh also this would still make Byleth down a weapon
Also tbf, Link has a huge ass inventory, he isnt coming up with just one weapon.

I was sorta joking, but it's not a bad weapon per-say, since Byleth is actually proficient in magic, so his AP wouldn't be affected.

Tbh, the main problem I see is that Byleth really dont got a counter to Blade Mode, shit just kinda lets Link mog for free given how ridiculous an amp that is. Divine Pulse is a thing, but knowing Link is suddenly gonna rush you at 300x speed or whatever the hell it is or do a flip and carpet bomb you with deconstruction blitz, doesn't exactly mean you can avoid it much the same way you could know a bullet is coming and not be able to do anything.

Byleth could just hit Link once with Windsweep, which is made much easier by the fact that it sucks in surrounding enemies, and Link would just be completely unable to counterattack as long as Byleth keeps continuously attacking him, like this, and at that point it's basically gg. Alternatively, Byleth can just freeze, or paralyze Link with Ice Attacks, and Dark Magic respectively before hitting Link with Windsweep if for whatever reason they have trouble hitting Link.

So Link rushing in with melee is, to put it lightly, a bad idea (which iirc, is also the most in-character thing for Link to do).

So really, Link's best bet is to make a bombshield or something to go into the air, and try to Bullet Time bombard Byleth with deconstruction arrows, and try to repeat that 10 more times. But even then, that's easier said than done due to Byleth's passive probability / luck hax, and the fact that Byleth can just fly out of range, or erect stone pillars to hide behind, etc, before Link can even pull that off, which Byleth will become more effective at doing with each Divine Pulse cause they would know Link's exact moves.

Oh right, can't Link just stop time and then rewind Byleth's projectile or long-ranged attacks back at him?

Like one of Byleth's dozens of projectiles, but yea. Also, Time Stop isn't on Link's profile.

 

[Blunt_Claw]

But, Byleth has Time Stop, and while they can't move during it, they can still use it to think, and prepare for Link's attacks.

Link has the same thing while preparing to use recall.

 

[TheGatememer]

Link has the same thing while preparing to use recall.

Not on his profile, as far as I can see.

 

[Dust_Collector]

Cracker you will pay for this I gave you the scan for time stop, the heavens will shake from my wrath for this folly

Yeah recall works as time stop as well (While it's not on his profile it is in Ganondorfs resistances so that counts as something ig)

 

[TheGatememer]

Cracker you will pay for this I gave you the scan for time stop, the heavens will shake from my wrath for this folly

Yeah recall works as time stop as well (While it's not on his profile it is in Ganondorfs resistances so that counts as something ig)

Not on his profile so cant be used :troll face:

 

[Blunt_Claw]

Key: Base (Academy Arc) | Base (Three Hopes: War Arc)

What does "Three Hopes: War Arc" key refer to specifically?
Is it a seperate key for Three Hopes or is it like a mid-game key?

We are using the "Academy Arc" key for this thread btw.

 

[TheGatememer]

What does "Three Hopes: War Arc" key refer to specifically?
Is it a seperate key for Three Hopes or is it like a mid-game key?

We are using the "Academy Arc" key for this thread btw.

Separate key for Three Hopes. Basically, Byleth, but 2 years older than the Academy Arc version.

 

[Blunt_Claw]

Separate key for Three Hopes. Basically, Byleth, but 2 years older than the Academy Arc version.

Then why does the academy arc key seem to have stuff from three hopes?

 

[TheGatememer]

Then why does the academy arc key seem to have stuff from three hopes?

Because Byleth had it from the beginning, even prior to the war arc.

 

[Chariot190]

It works differently compared to Link's stuff, and basically acts like extra damage + harms his allies around him

Then why even bring it up if it doesn't grant him res? If FE lightning magic dont do that, that won't exactly help if Link carpet bombs with Farosh horns then.

No, as far as I can remember

Then why does it matter?

That only increases his attack power in certain climates/weathers iirc.

Nah not weather bonus, the other shit.

It freezes the enemy, and the enemy remains frozen even when hit a bunch of times, unlike the frozen status in ToTK/BotW.

That doesn't matter at all though? What's important is how cold it is. Though funny you mention that, I'm pretty sure the frozen status in TOTK is permanent untill hit, for anyone that ISNT Link, like freeze a Moblin for example, pretty sure they stay frozen forever. That just means Link is hitting them so goddamn hard it breaks the ice, not that the ice has some arbitrary time limit, which given smashing a frozen enemy does 2x damage, along with the evident length, probably the case.

Yea, characters are unaffected by the volcanic temperatures of the Valley of Torment, and only take slight damage while traversing lava.

That's what I figured, that really isn't enough, volcanic temps is insane, but TOTK Link chugs a potion or slaps on flame breaker, and suddenly heat that causes instant immolation and disintegration of non-metal weapons does absolutely nothing as seen in Death Mountain. That is WELL beyond standard volcanic temps, and Link, too, can walk across molten slag just fine, which is what I think you're referring to, in the Valley post-javelin. Of course he can't jump in a pool of liquid magma, but neither can they.

Anyway, yeah Link can just heal this or have Sidon protect him.

Link doesn't have anything to increase his Magic Resistance from food.

No, but he can amp his durability to everything including magic (as seen against the multiple enemies that use magic when a def buff is up), temp and elemental attacks too, and more.
He doesn't have anything that specifically amps magic res, true, but what he does have is flat-out better and encompasses that anyway.

I mean, it works against death hax. I wouldn't say any attack, but I mean most attacks, especially from those in the same tier.

Then it works against death hax, but does it work on say, mind manip? Kinda taking an inch from a mile here, and the tier don't matter if we're talking about hax, kinda what makes it hax. Not withstanding Link has the advantage there if we wanna go that route.

tbh, I could argue said archers are more skilled than Link in most areas.

I sincerely hope you don't.

Sure, he has bullet time, but what else?

The like 1000 different items, hax, like 15+ different amps, hundreds of weapons, thousands of demon parts and most items that have various effects, 4 allies that cant be killed and help him at all times, and a whole slew of other shit, ATOP huge blitz? Idk why you even asked this.

I don't really understand your question; are you asking which is more "canon"? If that's what you're asking, both are equally canon, and there's no reason Byleth shouldn't have access to the same abilities they have in Three Hopes.

Wrong answer. Why? That isn't what the profile covers, nor the key that we are using. Sure, both might be canon, but so is Age of Calamity, we don't extrapolate shit from that for the **** of it tho...

If something in the actual game, which is being used in this match, differs from that, why in the bloody hell are you taking what it's like in a spin off game instead of how it's actually portrayed in this key?

Link doesn't have time stop, according to his profile. And I don't see what recalling would do here. But, Byleth has Time Stop, and while they can't move during it, they can still use it to think, and prepare for Link's attacks.

EXACTLY like Link
Let's not pretend recall doesn't stop time dude.

if you glitch stuff, sure, but Link can only hold up to like, 4 fairies, since they stop spawning after a certain amount.

Actually? If so aight, but is that actually true? I thought a few places alone had more than 4 at a time like that one sky isle with the pool, and that they respawned each blood moon. I could be wrong, I didn't exactly attempt to farm the things, but are you for sure?
Link would still have like hundreds of healing items tho anyway, and like 100 potions, full heals, buffs, and so on.

It still affects him, so really, not really that notable tbh.

This might be a fair thought in a vacuum, but the freezing is permanent for example, if done on say, anything not named Ganon give or take.
Freeze a moblin and bam, they're frozen forever (i think? idk it's an insanely long time at the very least, I think it's permanent until Link strikes them so hard they metaphorically explode, at least a minute or so tho if not), which is to say, no, it only affecting Link for about 1/~~~~ of the time is insanely notable, he has a solid res.

Link can't flurry rush hundreds of meters, and he has to actually dodge an attack for it to work.

Uh, are you confusing gameplay with lore here? All Flurry Rush is, is Link focusing.

And actually im not sure? I think it simply depends when you proc it, at the very least i've seen it rush down like 70 goddamn meters before. I mean it's obviously hard as shit from a distance, but stuff like Gleeok's, Lynels and so on have some wacky AOE.

And besides, if you're taking Warriors stuff as evidence, I don't think I need to say Flurry Rush in AOC actually CAN do that.

Which can easily be healed off, blocked, or dodged, especially from a distance. The only notable long range multi-shot bow Link has is the Great Eagle Bow.

What? Deconstruction Arrows cant be healed. Gloom shit, cant be healed (like actually kind of a huge plot point), damage stuff and elemental stuff can, but like, being flash frozen and then promptly electrocuted isn't something Byleth is walking off (electrocuting a frozen enemy does extra extra damage btw), especially given Byleth is quite a bit weaker than Link, god forbid Link amps his stats.

Then Byleth can also just fly away on a Pegasus/Wyvern, or shoot him down, since Link can't attack while controlling a steering stick.

Uh, what? What Class is Byleth here? I hope to God you aren't using a composite, that isn't allowed.

That is assuming Link actually dodges Byleth's attacks, and at the last moment.

What? Not even, Link can initiate that shit like a solid 5 feet away, and not even last second, timing is exceptionally generous, and again, in canon all it is, is Link "focusing", you're confusing gameplay and the actual mechanics behind it.

And also yeah he can because the moment he begins the slow down happens.

That's gonna be difficult when Byleth's melee weapons can hit opponents from tens of meters away (and I don't mean like vacuum slashes either, like straight up reach hax from minecraft type crap).

VERY BAD idea, that means Link can dodge from a distance, something that is way less difficult as more distance = more time to react, and then he just rushes Byleth over those tens of meters.

Also, if Link gets caught up in Byleth's Windsweep, which is basically a small tornado that sucks opponents in, his counterattacks will be nullified,

Then he uses recall.

so even if Link activates Flurry Rush, he's not gonna be able to attack Byleth back.

Recall, or the fact he's like 100x quicker in flurry and absolutely nothing Bylet has is gonna tag him.

And as long as Byleth keeps attacking Link (which they will, given they can dish out like over 100 attacks in seconds), well, this happens.

All I'm seeing is free recall, Link just blocks with say a shroom shield and causes Byleth to be hit with mind hax, or Link procs flurry and does the same thing back.

I gotta check later, but don't Multi-shot bows have some spread? So unless Link is like right up in Byleth's face, or uses Keese Eyes, they're unlike to all hit. And again, probability manip + supernatural luck would help on top of Byleth's dodging skills.

I have said NUMEROUS times now, Link can slap AOE stuff onto them, and it isn't even small, it's like 20m per shot, Byleth legit getting carpet bombed by giant AOE attacks he can't react to. The spread is a good thing, he ain't dodging shit.

Have you SEEN the AOE on like a Dragon Arrow? That shit wacky.

And prob+luck doesn't exactly stop the impossible, this aint TTGL, if Link shoots and turns like 100m into a frozen wasteland, 100x quicker than Byleth can act, luck aint exactly stopping that.

Ye, but unless that gimmick is deconstruction, it's probably not gonna kill Byleth. And going by chapter 15 in Three Hopes, characters can canonically remain Awakened for at least several minutes at a time.

Or gloom, or just the fact Link is multiple times stronger, can amp himself further to either cripple or off set Byleth's debuffs.

And again with Three Hopes, are we not using the 3H Academy key????

It works against enemies that can move FTE in comparison to Byleth, like users of Astra, which is a pretty crazy speed amp.

Not explicit enough, that is just FTE. But how much is it actually? Link's we can actually tell given we see it from his POV, that's just vague, could be way less.

Also I REALLY dont like how 90% of Byleth's answers involve low percentile procs, that shit aint reliable.

Oh yeah, and Byleth can also use Astra as well, and can additionally move way faster with certain attacks.

As above, nice, a speed boost, how much though? im gonna need some sort of number otherwise I'm just assuming baseline FTE difference.

Also wtf why is every clip you sending 3H

Again, Flurry Rush won't allow Link to instantly travel hundreds of meters, and I don't see what recall would do, aside from recalling a single one of Byleth's projectiles, which they can spam.

Why not exactly? We know for a fact it lets him rush, it just depends when he procs it and how far away the enemy is.
Yeah, and send that projectile right back to him to get hit by.

Link can also just Recall, rewind, stop, repeat, causing them to drop, given Recall stops time when he uses it, no real threat here.

Byleth can also fly, via Wyverns / Pegasi, and they have much greater mobility than Zonai vehicles.

Again, why the hell are we assuming he has that? Byleth CANT have that atop some of the other shit mentioned, that's compositing.

Wingshields only make Link last for like a second in the air, only enough for him to shoot once or maybe twice while in Bullet Time.

Which he can do literally whenever. Being able to instantly proc like a 100x speed buff and spam deconstruction, gloom, whatever, kind of a crippling issue.

All that just for Byleth to tank all of it sans deconstruction with Miracle/Awakening, and instantly heal it off with regen + healing

I think you're grossly downplaying how big he stat gap is, especially if Link buffs, even if Byleth debuffs, some of Link's shit can like two shot himself as it is and his own buffs mitigate whatever Byleth can do. Byleth isn't just walking this off, and does it matter? Stupid speed buff into deconstruction danmaku is still that, Byleth can't counter that.

Wouldn't Link need a bit of prep to actually fuse stuff like wings/bombs to his shields and stuff anyhow? And the Bombs are only one-time use, so unless Link gets lucky enough to fuse a bunch of bomb shields or whatever, he's going to constantly have to re-fuse his mobility shields.

He can do it literally mid flip? He's packing all the tools, he can make shit on the fly. And honestly, I'd agree with you, but given you're given Byleth a ******* pegasus, probably due to how OP says "all equipment", I'm going to in turn say no, Link should have everything flatout.

I was sorta joking, but it's not a bad weapon per-say, since Byleth is actually proficient in magic, so his AP wouldn't be affected.

Well no, but Byleth would actually use decent shit instead most likely, no reason Lnk can't abuse fusionism, it's ACTUALLY his main thing.

Byleth could just hit Link once with Windsweep,

Dodge, proc Flurry and dodge, bomb jump and into flurry and dodge.

which is made much easier by the fact that it sucks in surrounding enemies,

What is Byleth's LS again?

and Link would just be completely unable to counterattack as long as Byleth keeps continuously attacking him,

Or whip out one of his dozen shields that would flash freeze, electrocute, cause mass confusion, etc and block.

like this, and at that point it's basically gg.

As above.

Alternatively, Byleth can just freeze, or paralyze Link with Ice Attacks,

What? Dodge, again, also he can shrug off Flash Freezing just fine.

and Dark Magic respectively before hitting Link with Windsweep if for whatever reason they have trouble hitting Link.

And he does this before Link does a cool back flip and bombards him with deconstruction, muscle spams, mind hax shrooms and more why?

So Link rushing in with melee is, to put it lightly, a bad idea (which iirc, is also the most in-character thing for Link to do).

Link rushing in against a dude he's like 3x stronger than, can speed blitz, and has actual instant kill hax is a bad idea? Idk man, I strongly disagree, literally think if Byleth goes into CQC, tey just straight up die, especially when 90% of their hax is percentage based.

So really, Link's best bet is to make a bombshield or something to go into the air, and try to Bullet Time bombard Byleth with deconstruction arrows, and try to repeat that 10 more times.

Unironically could, Byleth can' exactly prevent that from afar, Link slapping a bomb on a shield, or hell just using an eagle shield once, automatically gives him a free pass to deconstruction via blitz.

But even then, that's easier said than done due to Byleth's passive probability / luck hax,

Really feeling like this is being wanked here ngl

and the fact that Byleth can just fly out of range,

Except he's getting blitzed if Link does that.

or erect stone pillars to hide behind, etc,

Except he's getting blitzed if Link does that, also multi-shot bow, one of te 5 will just eat the pillar, the rest will be unphased.

before Link can even pull that off, which Byleth will become more effective at doing with each Divine Pulse cause they would know Link's exact moves.

Which moves, he has THOUSANDS of things, like I can not stress this enough, Link has more than 10 ways to kill Byleth, and a million ways to go about it, not that he needs to as he has flurry. But blud legit has THOUSANDS of items, yes, most dont do much, but a good chunk are outright crippling.

Like one of Byleth's dozens of projectiles, but yea. Also, Time Stop isn't on Link's profile.

And Byleth now has to deal with whatever they shot coming back at them, and lad, me and you both know what recall does

Because Byleth had it from the beginning, even prior to the war arc.

So? To the same degree? Given how you yourself even pointed out 3H has differing percentiles for ability activations, that's kind of a tremendous red flag that shit shouldn't just be slapped on.

Anyway yeah, I'm still not seeing anything that actually stops Link from flurry blitz, best was Astra, but that's way more vague and we don't even know if it's comparable, hell it could be BETTER for all we know, but it's simply not clear enough, additionally, as seen with Ganon, both Link and Ganon can flurry the others flurry, which tbh I'd also wager would aid against windsweep and astra anyway, assuming Link's LS doesnt do that for him for the former. Add onto most of Byleth's stuff being percentage-based, while Link doesn't have to deal with that, 3x stronger, and the fact this is a 5v1, idk man.

ALSO, what class is being used, because unless it's Wyvern or Pegasus Knight, why would Byleth have those?

Edit: For freeze stuff it's half a minute according to a lad I got to check, and those mfs like Class 100 to M, and as shown with that one boko near the funny Ganon flashback tear shrine (there's one who is frozen in ice, ACTUAL perm, and if unthawed, is completely fine), they can shrug off being frozen indefinitely, so Link being able to smash out in moments, is still pretty absurd when his ice stuff can either 1. Straight up kill these dudes occasionally despite the enemy's cold res 2. They can shrug off what is probably months of having been frozen and be unphased 3. Have stupid af LS that should enable them to just smash out.
And yet Link can escape over like 10x quicker than them.

 

[Blunt_Claw]

What is Byleth's LS again?

Byleth's LS is Class K while Link's is Class M.

 

[Chariot190]

Byleth's LS is Class K while Link's is Class M.

Yeah might be an issue, i don't think Link is getting hit by any sort of succ, given he's like 2k tons, after waking up, from being crippled, while naked, with a stick.

 

[TheGatememer]

I’ll respond to all that in a bit, but just had a really funny thought. Since Byleth has passive speed amps to combat speed, and Link’s combat speed only increases during Flurry Rush/Bullet Time, if either of the two ever get near each other, Byleth’s Thief skill could allow them to just yoink a bunch of Link’s items, including Fairies and the Ancient Blades

 

[Chariot190]

Link has ways to buff his speed, such as potions, food, and armor via movement, and hell just some of his weapons. He also has huge def buffs atop his 3x def advantage, atk buffs over his 3x ap advantage, and so on.

Also, again, Flurry is JUST Link "focusing", in gameplay it's enabled via timing a dodge, or, literally just falling, but it's the same technique. The fact he can proc it by being in the air at all should be enough indication that "dodging", probably isn't an actual requirement in canon. We see it in AoC, we see it even in game, we see it in others like Ganon, etc. It really isn't hard to trigger, if at all. ALSO, the fact they're "passive" speed buffs might be an issue, that would just make them standard combat speed and thus equalized, you might wanna reword that mate.

I'd also like to point out, no, Thief is again another percentile-based skill (I think?), not reliable, and Link is packing like 5k items, actually taking something of value as opposed to say, one of his 999x apples ain't exactly worth mentioning. Link also resists most of his stuff too so shrug. AND, stealing a fairy won't do anything, idk if the lore changed, but back in classic like OOT, MM, WW, and so on, a fairy heals Link because they aid the Goddess's chosen hero and are generally kind, if Link is fighting a dude to the death and they steal one, they aren't going to help the dude trying to kill the weider of the Hero's Spirit.

And besides, speed is the least of Byleth's problems, the fact 90% of Byleth's options are just sub 20% luck-based skills, in contrast to Link who doesn't need a "well MAYBE it'd work" to do stuff, is very, very, concerning. Like yeah sure 20% of the time something could work, that still means the other like 80% they die. None of this is even remotely consistent. And as the matches page states, we go with what's more likely.

And finally, is it even possible for Byleth to have all these skills? What I mean is, yes they CAN have these skills, but all at once? FE3H works on a timer, is it possible to get Byleth to each Class, take the skills, then class change, and gather ALL these skills before time skip even doing the optimal peak farming methods? Obviously, you could get a chunk, but I legit don't think all at once is possible, you might have to pick and choose? I could be wrong on that but.... Link at the very least doesn't exactly have such a caveat, he can, at this point in the game, have 99x Dinraal Horns if he wanted for example.

 

[Blunt_Claw]

Yeah I don't see Byleth winning this when Link can get 100 times faster by doing this

 

[TheGatememer]

Link has ways to buff his speed, such as potions, food, and armor via movement, and hell just some of his weapons. He also has huge def buffs atop his 3x def advantage, atk buffs over his 3x ap advantage, and so on.

Those buffs don’t stack though. And I’m talking about combat speed, not movement speed. His speed buffs only boost his movement speed. And also, Byleth has a MS advantage by default

And Byleth can pretty easily proc crits, which triple their damage, given their Crapton of crit boosting skills, combined with their danmaku levels of ranged, and melee attacks, and the fact that they have guaranteed crits if they dodge one of Link’s attacks. It also helps that Byleth scales above several stomps/one shots above their value.

Also, again, Flurry is JUST Link "focusing", in gameplay it's enabled via timing a dodge, or, literally just falling, but it's the same technique. The fact he can proc it by being in the air at all should be enough indication that "dodging", probably isn't an actual requirement in canon.
We see it in AoC, we see it even in game, we see it in others like Ganon, etc. It really isn't hard to trigger, if at all.

Just because he can, doesn’t mean he will. We only see Link enter his focused state when dodging right before a melee attack lands, or if he draws a bow in the air. We’ve never seen him enter flurry rush outside of those two conditions, so even if he could, it’s probably hella out of character for him to do so. (Hell, he didn’t do it to save Zelda from Astor, or the King Rhoam Bosoheromous Hyrule or whatever the **** his name is from Guardians) So that shouldn’t be assumed for this match.

Ganon also only uses flurry rush when dodging Link’s attacks, and hell, he never even attacks during that state.

ALSO, the fact they're "passive" speed buffs might be an issue, that would just make them standard combat speed and thus equalized, you might wanna reword that mate.

Actually, the speed equalization rules don’t say anything about passive speed amps being equalized, just that they get affected by the same modifier. Byleth still has speed amping stuff on top of that anyways.

I'd also like to point out, no, Thief is again another percentile-based skill (I think?),

Nah, you’re thinking about the thief staff, the steal skill is different, since it always works as long as user speed > for speed.

not reliable, and Link is packing like 5k items, actually taking something of value as opposed to say, one of his 999x apples ain't exactly worth mentioning.

Byleth can steal whatever non-weapon items they want (not limited to just 1, can steal as many as they’d like), which also includes stuff like shields, food, and rings in addition to his other consumables. So there goes his Bullet time, amps, and Sages

Link also resists most of his stuff too so shrug.

Doesn’t resist stuff like being frozen, or deconstruction tho, (even though he should imo since enemies hitting him with the Ancient Blade does nothing)

AND, stealing a fairy won't do anything, idk if the lore changed, but back in classic like OOT, MM, WW, and so on, a fairy heals Link because they aid the Goddess's chosen hero and are generally kind, if Link is fighting a dude to the death and they steal one, they aren't going to help the dude trying to kill the weider of the Hero's Spirit.

That’s assuming that it’s still the case in TotK, and if nothing else, it denies Link of using some of his options.

And besides, speed is the least of Byleth's problems, the fact 90% of Byleth's options are just sub 20% luck-based skills,

They aren’t? That’s a huge exaggeration. The only things that I can think of that are luck based is the attack negation, which Byleth doesn’t even really need. There’s also death manipulation, but Link probably resists that anyways. Like 90% of Byleth’s kit is either guaranteed to work, or has a ridiculously high chance of procing (like crits) that they might as well be guaranteed to work.

in contrast to Link who doesn't need a "well MAYBE it'd work" to do stuff, is very, very, concerning. Like yeah sure 20% of the time something could work, that still means the other like 80% they die. None of this is even remotely consistent. And as the matches page states, we go with what's more likely.

See above.

And finally, is it even possible for Byleth to have all these skills? What I mean is, yes they CAN have these skills, but all at once? FE3H works on a timer, is it possible to get Byleth to each Class, take the skills, then class change, and gather ALL these skills before time skip even doing the optimal peak farming methods? Obviously, you could get a chunk, but I legit don't think all at once is possible, you might have to pick and choose? I could be wrong on that but.... Link at the very least doesn't exactly have such a caveat, he can, at this point in the game, have 99x Dinraal Horns if he wanted for example.

Yes, it’s just very unoptimal in a normal playthrough.

 

[TheGatememer]

And still working on the response to your other thing, may take a little while cause of classes later today

 

[Chariot190]

Those buffs don’t stack though.

What, yes they do? there's a cap (like 3 levels each buff), but they DO stack. Unless I'm actually insane, why can't Link eat a 3x atk buff, and a 3x def buff, and a 3x elemental buff, and also a 3x stealth buff because that's also a thing.

And I’m talking about combat speed, not movement speed.

And im talking about BOTH.

His speed buffs only boost his movement speed.

Flurry. Literally just using a quicker weapon.

Link has ways to buff combat, movement, and movement again.

And also, Byleth has a MS advantage by default

And now he dont
Also flurry effects movement speed

And Byleth can pretty easily proc crits, which triple their damage,

Amazing, he can now actually harm Link. Unless Link roids out, puts on good armor, and so on.

We haven't even delved into Link's ARMORS yet btw, blud could slap on the BDSM fish suit and just slap Farosh items on all his stuff so every time he blocks, a giant 20m-esque AOE lightning dome is triggered and fries Byleth and makes them drop everything and stuns them.
As one of many things he could do.

given their Crapton of crit boosting skills,

Still chance based. The fact almost EVERYTHING you've brought up, in the end, is entirely percentile, aka, not guaranteed, is very problematic.

combined with their danmaku levels of ranged,

Recall, blitz, Link has the same but way worse given, ya know, deconstruction.

and melee attacks, and the fact that they have guaranteed crits if they dodge one of Link’s attacks.

Bruh, if Link DODGES, they die. Flurry 100% proc, Byleth then gets slammed by like a dozen hits above their paygrade, almost 100% chaining hax and what not given Link can swap weapons mid-rush.

It also helps that Byleth scales above several stomps/one shots above their value.

And so does Link? The AP value comes from Colgera, the "first" dungeon boss in the intended order. His key is after he's done everything, but dont got the MS. Which is to say he's quite a bit above Colgera at that point, how much? Idk, but given he starts off with a 3x advantage over Byleth's calc, I'm going to say Byleth aint bridging that gap. Well, unless you have a statement or multiplier, if so then aight.

Just because he can, doesn’t mean he will.

And he will? What sort of question is that, we know from talks with burdfucker and the diary Link can whips that shit IC.

We only see Link enter his focused state when dodging right before a melee attack lands, or if he draws a bow in the air.

AOC, also blocking too actually, initiates slow down. Like bro, it is JUST him focusing.
Him dodging, in air, etc is just moments of when he does displayed within gameplay but it isn't like he can't elsewhere in canon.

We’ve never seen him enter flurry rush outside of those two conditions,

Blocking, backfliping, side stepping, AOC.

so even if he could, it’s probably hella out of character for him to do so.

Literally not but you do you ig.
No offense, but, you realize absolutely everything you've mentioned, Byleth has never been shown to do outside of gameplay, if you wanna talk IC, even if not intentionally, 95% of Byleth's tech is OOC. Not really a tree you wanna bark up.

Like, take a look at what Byleth does in cutscenes, or is stated to actually do, kind of lukewarm.

(Hell, he didn’t do it to save Zelda from Astor, or the King Rhoam Bosoheromous Hyrule or whatever the **** his name is from Guardians) So that shouldn’t be assumed for this match.

He did use it to save Zelda though?

Ganon also only uses flurry rush when dodging Link’s attacks, and hell, he never even attacks during that state.

Yes he does? Ganon can immediately attack Link mid-slow down, forcing Link to inturn down his flurry, mid flurry?

Actually, the speed equalization rules don’t say anything about passive speed amps being equalized, just that they get affected by the same modifier. Byleth still has speed amping stuff on top of that anyways.

You don't seem to understand, I'm calling out you and the profile out here, not speed-equal rules. if they're PASSIVE speed amps, aka, always up, that becomes his inherent speed, like by default. Like I feel I shouldn't have to explain if someone say, is always 25% quicker passively, that isn't exactly an amp, that's just how fast tey are now.

Nah, you’re thinking about the thief staff, the steal skill is different, since it always works as long as user speed > for speed.

k fair, except Link with flurry like 100x Byleth so...
And still kind of useless, like what, he wanna take the risk to steal an apple?

Byleth can steal whatever non-weapon items they want (not limited to just 1, can steal as many as they’d like), which also includes stuff like shields, food, and rings in addition to his other consumables.

Since actually ******* when?
I hope to God you aren't about to argue Byleth can suddenly steal 5k items at once lmao.
All against a dude who can and will blitz them if they get to close.

And, again, since when could you pick what to steal? Last I checked it proc'd, and it just drew from their equipment.

So there goes his Bullet time, amps, and Sages

What? Literally none of that affects bullet time, it's an ability tied to his own innate self, he can proc it while naked and with zero weapons even, hell Link could literally beat the shit out of Byleth with his bare hands if needed.
Amps, tied to armor, and foods, and Byleth ain't stealing all that shit let's not pretend.
And the Sage stuff is a magical orb thingy, I don't even think it qualifies as a corporal item and more just something innate. But, even then? So? What's that gonna do? Now the sage spirits can teleport to Byleth instead of Link and mog him regardless of distance, I don't think Byleth would WANT to steal them even if he could, it isn't like stealing it is putting them on his side, nor would it even stop them from attacking or defending Link, I legit dont know what this would accomplish besides waste time he could be doing actually doing something noteworthy.

Which, by the way, you realize you're arguing Byleth pulls this off while fighting 4 dudes (Again, this IS a 5v1, one can make shields to protect Link, one is strong af, one has giant AOE, one ranged, and then Link himself, and they all attack and defend at the same time, and all are above Byleth in stats), all next to Link and can teleport back to his ass o help him, all of which are above Byleth in stats, and one of which even has diet bullet time too. If Byleth so much as attempts to engage CQC, he gets mogged by like 5 dudes above him, one of which is even above Link in pure power at this stage.

Doesn’t resist stuff like being frozen, or deconstruction tho, (even though he should imo since enemies hitting him with the Ancient Blade does nothing)

Except he actually kind of does, as mentioned,
" For freeze stuff it's half a minute according to a lad I got to check, and those mfs like Class 100 to M, and as shown with that one boko near the funny Ganon flashback tear shrine (there's one who is frozen in ice, ACTUAL perm, and if unthawed, is completely fine), they can shrug off being frozen indefinitely, so Link being able to smash out in moments, is still pretty absurd when his ice stuff can either 1. Straight up kill these dudes occasionally despite the enemy's cold res 2. They can shrug off what is probably months of having been frozen and be unphased 3. Have stupid af LS that should enable them to just smash out.
And yet Link can escape over like 10x quicker than them."

Freezing that has such a strong potency, it can kill or freeze solid dudes who already have decent freeze res, affects Link for like actually half a second. I could be wrong, but I don't think Byleth has any sort of potency scaling going on?

And honestly, I didn't know the latter, I was going to say fair, but pointing ou he actually does res that shit is just shooting yourself in the foot, I'm not going to pretend he doesn't if he actually does.

That’s assuming that it’s still the case in TotK, and if nothing else, it denies Link of using some of his options.

Yeah why wouldnt it be? It isn't like they changed? Faes didn't suddenly become animalistic assholes, they ARE, in fact, sentient. And if te established reason for why they heal them was the aforementioned, and they still do that, why would we assume it changed? Like honestly, do we need to be told the MS hurts bad stuff every time? Kind of just something we know as it's been established.

They aren’t? That’s a huge exaggeration. The only things that I can think of that are luck based is the attack negation, which Byleth doesn’t even really need. There’s also death manipulation,

Bro, a HUGE chunk of skills involve luck, they aren't guaranteed, well I mean some yeah, but even those tend to be situational.

The fact attack neg is one the luck based ones is also kind of bad, idk about you but I don't exactly feel like voting for a thing that works only 15% of the time as a valid option.

but Link probably resists that anyways.

Gloom do be a thing yeah, the way hearts work his death res is actually kinda wacky, shit is like Dark Soul stats meters, more he has, longer he can res.

Like 90% of Byleth’s kit is either guaranteed to work, or has a ridiculously high chance of procing (like crits) that they might as well be guaranteed to work.

High chance isn't guaranteed, let's not pretend it isn't, and even something like 49% chance, still means over half the time it fails and Byleth gets rolled.
also fun fact, TOTK has crits too

See above.

See above 2.

Yes, it’s just very unoptimal in a normal playthrough.

Proof?
We're talking like 100 skills, can you even GET the ******* items to class change that many times within that timeframe to move between each class (Or des 3h use stas to change, i forget, well either that's still a limit on classes)? And if so, why are we assuming if Byeth wastes all his money and time on that shit, he's gonna have all these other items, weapons, and whatnot that also cost resources? Like, that is one of the game's gimmicks, time/resource management.

Like my man, I am 99% sure this is bordering on composite, this shit just isn't possible to happen all at once pre time skip.

I want to know, for a fact, what is actually possible pre-time skip. And from there, what we're giving him because I know damn well all of it is impossible, shit be acting like Venom Snake walking up with his whole army, despite the fact he literally can't at any point, bro has to pick and choose.

 

[Chariot190]

Question, can Byleth even use Divine Pulse after being deconstructed?

 

[CrackerVolley]

It's kinda hard to tell tbh. From cutscenes, it seems like they can Pulse from mortal peril if they recognize they're going to die (e.g. almost getting killed by Kostas), while Pulse also sorta happens automatically when their lifebar hits zero in gameplay, but not before saying a sentence or two.

 

[Chariot190]

I haven't played 3H since it came out and i only used it once, on the group battle exam map or whatever, with the hill so im not 100% sure on how it's portrayed.

But, if the only times he uses it, that being before death or whenever he ***** up a "turn", or after HP hits 0 (yet evidently still not dead given dudes can have whole-ass monologues after HP hits 0), that implies, at least to me, when he uses it, he has to actually be alive still, sure he can do it when literally dying, such as HP hitting 0, but do we not have an instance of him using it WHILE dead?

If not, is this even a thing worth arguing? Link has a few instant kill options, if Link gets off an Ancient Arrow for example and instantly kills Byleth because that shit IS instant, enemies mid-attack freeze and disintegrate, shit looks funny when used on a Lynel mid-charge that kinda just skips the whole "kill him 10 times" thing.

 

[Chariot190]

Redownloaded it to test some shit, food buffs dont stack, but item + food buffs do (like you can have 3x def from food, but 3x atk from items and it'll work, also armor buffs can be mix and matched).

Shields kinda broken, like slap a gleeok horn onto the shield, and whenever Link deflects, the foe gets electrocuted, frozen, or immolated, this also applies to mud buds or whatever else Link decides to slap on a shield. Aka, actually attacking Link in CQC is kinda dumb, any blocked attack can be crippling, if not lethal, have hax like mind hax, and he doesn't even need to block directly, just swinging the shield when it has say, a gleeok horn causes a whiffed effect.
Link ALSO has healing weapons via Light Dragon stuff just like Byleth,.
Link can create updrafts at any time via a ruby rod or flame stuff too. Link can also, in an odd cracked kind of way, teleport, fall back, and prep, and go back. Now why do I say this? Purah Pad lets him teleport to any shrine or designated place, now of course, Link might be able to **** off but that's self BFR if he can't come back, fortunately, Link can set a warp point (up to 3), wherever he wants to, Link just slaps a point down and then ***** off, that way he can come back, and yes, I DID check. This has an interdimensional range, you can teleport off alt dimensions such as the Rauru shrines, which is to say Link CAN **** off to Hyrule, and still come back to SBA.
Ancient Blades can be used on normal weapons too, which still instant kill i also got a clip of Link face tanking one so we can slap that on the profile

Also tbh, kind of missed the forest for the trees, but he doesnt EVEN need to attach this shit for it to work, yeeting a dragon horn for example, still does a huge **** off AOE, he desnt even need to slap it on a weapon or bow, this goes for all his shit.



Edit: Ya can slap a AB onto a shield, which enables Link to deflect which dazes a foe for a moment (Class M vs Class K btw, Byleth is vulnerable to this), and then immediately obliterate the foe with the ancient shield while they're in recoil.

 

[Chariot190]

Before I delete this shit because I actually need space, is there ANYTHING you lads want me to get clips of
Because like, I'll do it, but I ain't redownloading it twice

 

[Blunt_Claw]

Before I delete this shit because I actually need space, is there ANYTHING you lads want me to get clips of
Because like, I'll do it, but I ain't redownloading it twice

I need a clip of the sage avatars jumping something so that everyone can understand what a 5v1 does to a mofo.

 

[TheGatememer]

Taking a whole lot longer than I thought tbh, heres what I've written so far.

Then why even bring it up if it doesn't grant him res? If FE lightning magic dont do that, that won't exactly help if Link carpet bombs with Farosh horns then.

Then why does it matter?

Figured it couldn't hurt to bring up.

Nah not weather bonus, the other shit.

Sorry, don't remember any of that tbh.

That doesn't matter at all though? What's important is how cold it is. Though funny you mention that, I'm pretty sure the frozen status in TOTK is permanent untill hit, for anyone that ISNT Link, like freeze a Moblin for example, pretty sure they stay frozen forever. That just means Link is hitting them so goddamn hard it breaks the ice, not that the ice has some arbitrary time limit, which given smashing a frozen enemy does 2x damage, along with the evident length, probably the case.

I was explaining the mechanisms on how the status effect works, since it's different from ToTK. Unlike in ToTK, where the ice breaks after a single hit (even from a ******* bee iirc), you can use the frozen status effect in FE to rack up damage all while the enemy can't do anything.

That's what I figured, that really isn't enough, volcanic temps is insane, but TOTK Link chugs a potion or slaps on flame breaker, and suddenly heat that causes instant immolation and disintegration of non-metal weapons does absolutely nothing as seen in Death Mountain. That is WELL beyond standard volcanic temps, and Link, too, can walk across molten slag just fine, which is what I think you're referring to, in the Valley post-javelin. Of course he can't jump in a pool of liquid magma, but neither can they.

Instant immolation, yes, disintegration, no, wooden stuff can last a bit before being reduced to ash. Eh, I don't know if I'd call it well beyond standard volcanic temps, since wood instantly catches fire at like 370 C / 700 F. I'm pretty sure Link instantly gets set on fire without the potion/flame breaker stuff, and iirc, you still get set on fire if you stand on those little lavaspots you sometimes find in death mountain, even with flamebreaker gear.

Anyway, yeah Link can just heal this or have Sidon protect him.

True, he could probably extinguish it if he does get set on fire. Though, it would still damage his wooden gear, if he has any equipped at that specific moment.

No, but he can amp his durability to everything including magic (as seen against the multiple enemies that use magic when a def buff is up), temp and elemental attacks too, and more.
He doesn't have anything that specifically amps magic res, true, but what he does have is flat-out better and encompasses that anyway.

**** I really need to get that dura-negging FE Magic crt done

That's fair then

Then it works against death hax, but does it work on say, mind manip? Kinda taking an inch from a mile here, and the tier don't matter if we're talking about hax, kinda what makes it hax. Not withstanding Link has the advantage there if we wanna go that route.

Wait shit I thought you were referring to Immortality Type 2 nvm. Basically, how it works is that it deals the same damage to Link regardless of whether or not he's blocking any attacks.

I sincerely hope you don't.

The like 1000 different items, hax, like 15+ different amps, hundreds of weapons, thousands of demon parts and most items that have various effects, 4 allies that cant be killed and help him at all times, and a whole slew of other shit, ATOP huge blitz? Idk why you even asked this.

I'm talking about pure combat skill, not equipment and/or abilities; everything you just listed would be the latter.

Wrong answer. Why? That isn't what the profile covers, nor the key that we are using. Sure, both might be canon, but so is Age of Calamity, we don't extrapolate shit from that for the **** of it tho...

If something in the actual game, which is being used in this match, differs from that, why in the bloody hell are you taking what it's like in a spin off game instead of how it's actually portrayed in this key?

Dude, both portrayals are equally valid, regardless of whether or not we're using Three Houses/Hopes keys; so Houses Byleth has the same abilities/techniques as Hopes Byleth, and vice versa. They aren't just gonna forget the moves they used literally like a few months prior. If you don't like that, then make a CRT.

EXACTLY like Link
Let's not pretend recall doesn't stop time dude.

Not on his profile, no use in this match :trell:

Dunno why it's not on his profile tbh, must've been missed.

Actually? If so aight, but is that actually true? I thought a few places alone had more than 4 at a time like that one sky isle with the pool, and that they respawned each blood moon. I could be wrong, I didn't exactly attempt to farm the things, but are you for sure?
Link would still have like hundreds of healing items tho anyway, and like 100 potions, full heals, buffs, and so on.

Yea, I know that they stopped spawning after a certain amount, and you had to use them up in order for the fairies to spawn again. It was the same in BOTW.

This might be a fair thought in a vacuum, but the freezing is permanent for example, if done on say, anything not named Ganon give or take.
Freeze a moblin and bam, they're frozen forever (i think? idk it's an insanely long time at the very least, I think it's permanent until Link strikes them so hard they metaphorically explode, at least a minute or so tho if not), which is to say, no, it only affecting Link for about 1/~~~~ of the time is insanely notable, he has a solid res.

I think it just lasts for a long time, but might be thinking of BotW, idk if the mechanics changed. Either way, Link can still be frozen.

Similar to Link, Byleth can also break out of the frozen status in like a second or two, when it freezes enemies for quite a bit.

Uh, are you confusing gameplay with lore here? All Flurry Rush is, is Link focusing.

It's specified that Link sometimes feels time slow down whenever focusing (ie, when performing Flurry Rushes/Bullet Time), it's not just activated at will.

And actually im not sure? I think it simply depends when you proc it, at the very least i've seen it rush down like 70 goddamn meters before. I mean it's obviously hard as shit from a distance, but stuff like Gleeok's, Lynels and so on have some wacky AOE.

The max i've seen him rush down outside of glitches is like, maybe tens of meters.

And besides, if you're taking Warriors stuff as evidence, I don't think I need to say Flurry Rush in AOC actually CAN do that.

Don't remember that ever happening in AoC, do you have a scan?

What? Deconstruction Arrows cant be healed. Gloom shit, cant be healed (like actually kind of a huge plot point), damage stuff and elemental stuff can, but like, being flash frozen and then promptly electrocuted isn't something Byleth is walking off (electrocuting a frozen enemy does extra extra damage btw),

You were referring to "heat seaking" stuff, so I naturally assumed you meant elemental keese eyeballs, and not the Ancient arrows. And Link doesn't have ranged Gloom stuff I think? Unless the Demon King bow inflicts gloom, which I don't think it does.

especially given Byleth is quite a bit weaker than Link, god forbid Link amps his stats.

Scaling chains exist. Byleth stomps Shez, who stomps nearly every student in Three Houses + Dimitri/Edelgard/Claude, Dimitri is far stronger than Claude, who can easily one-shot two soldiers who scale to 15.64 Kilotons.

So basically: >>> (For One-shots), >> (For Stomps), > (For Stronger)

Byleth >> Shez >> Dimitri > Claude >>> Soldiers = 15.64 Kilotons.

This isn't even factoring in stuff like crits, awakening, combat arts, skills, etc. Crits do 3x damage, which can be activated pretty easily thanks to crit boosting stuff, or by Byleth performing a perfect dodge, and getting guaranteed crits for several seconds. Awakening is strong enough to make characters instantly break stuff like weapons, and forcefields, when they previously couldn't.

Uh, what? What Class is Byleth here? I hope to God you aren't using a composite, that isn't allowed.

The OP specified that Optional Equipment was allowed, so Byleth has them here.

What? Not even, Link can initiate that shit like a solid 5 feet away, and not even last second, timing is exceptionally generous, and again, in canon all it is, is Link "focusing", you're confusing gameplay and the actual mechanics behind it.

And also yeah he can because the moment he begins the slow down happens.

Fair enough on the first point, for the second point, there's some issues. As I said previously, it isn't just activated whenever he focuses, it only happens sometimes when Link focuses, which is consistent with the fact that he only activates it after dodging/drawing a bow midair; Otherwise Link would just always be in a Flurry Rushed state during combat if all it required was him "focusing".

Even under the assumption that he only needs to "focus", there's still the issue that he's never been shown using it outside of dodging/drawing a bow, so it would be out of character. I guess there is also parrying, but he doesn't follow up with attacks during that.

VERY BAD idea, that means Link can dodge from a distance, something that is way less difficult as more distance = more time to react, and then he just rushes Byleth over those tens of meters.

Link doesn't have prior knowledge, so he wouldn't know think to dodge someone swinging their melee from like 10 meters away would actually hit him, until he's already been hit with it (plus, I'd imagine it would be much harder to dodge something you can't even see). And the more distance = more time to react would only apply to Byleth's vacuum slashes, and not their actual melee swings, which aren't projectiles.

Then he uses recall.

Doubt he can recall it, when he can't even recall vacuum slashes iirc.

Recall, or the fact he's like 100x quicker in flurry and absolutely nothing Bylet has is gonna tag him.

Looked it up, and its actually a 19x amp

See above. Yea, he can still activate flurry rush against Byleth's normal attacks; he just can't attack Byleth back, and his flurry rush is just gonna end, before Byleth inevitably follows up with other attacks. That is assuming Link can even dodge in the first place, cause of the massive skill gap, on top of probability hax + supernatural luck.

All I'm seeing is free recall, Link just blocks with say a shroom shield and causes Byleth to be hit with mind hax, or Link procs flurry and does the same thing back.

See above. Mind hax does nothing here, since Muddle Buds only cause enemies to indiscriminately attack anyone. Byleth has no allies, so they aren't impacted, like at all.

I have said NUMEROUS times now, Link can slap AOE stuff onto them, and it isn't even small, it's like 20m per shot, Byleth legit getting carpet bombed by giant AOE attacks he can't react to. The spread is a good thing, he ain't dodging shit. Have you SEEN the AOE on like a Dragon Arrow? That shit wacky.

Sure, but Byleth can tank it via Miracle, Awakening, Regen, etc. Worst case scenario, Byleth rewinds time.

And prob+luck doesn't exactly stop the impossible, this aint TTGL, if Link shoots and turns like 100m into a frozen wasteland, 100x quicker than Byleth can act, luck aint exactly stopping that.

again, 19x amp

Then Byleth just breaks out if they're hit by it, or instantly gets purified by standing in a purification area they can make.

Or gloom, or just the fact Link is multiple times stronger, can amp himself further to either cripple or off set Byleth's debuffs.

Scaling chains exist. Byleth stomps Shez, who stomps nearly every student in Three Houses + Dimitri/Edelgard/Claude, Dimitri is far stronger than Claude, who can easily one-shot two soldiers who scale to 15.64 Kilotons.

So basically: >>> (For One-shots), >> (For Stomps), > (For Stronger)

Byleth >> Shez >> Dimitri > Claude >>> Soldiers = 15.64 Kilotons.

This isn't even factoring in stuff like crits, awakening, combat arts, skills, etc. Crits do 3x damage, which can be activated pretty easily thanks to crit boosting stuff, or by Byleth performing a perfect dodge, and getting guaranteed crits for several seconds. Awakening is strong enough to make characters instantly break stuff like weapons, and forcefields, when they previously couldn't.

And again with Three Hopes, are we not using the 3H Academy key????

Literally in Byleth's Academy key:

At least 7-C, At most High 6-A with the Sword of the Creator, higher with Awakening

Not explicit enough, that is just FTE. But how much is it actually? Link's we can actually tell given we see it from his POV, that's just vague, could be way less.

Need to calc it tbh

Also I REALLY dont like how 90% of Byleth's answers involve low percentile procs, that shit aint reliable.

I already explained to you how most of Byleth's valid options don't depend on low proc chances dude. Like the only thing that is low proc is the attack negation, and they don't even need it.

As above, nice, a speed boost, how much though? im gonna need some sort of number otherwise I'm just assuming baseline FTE difference.

actually, what even is baseline FTE anyways

Also wtf why is every clip you sending 3H

Cause it's accepted on Byleth's profile. Also, see what I said earlier about Three Houses/Hopes.

Why not exactly? We know for a fact it lets him rush, it just depends when he procs it and how far away the enemy is.

Ain't that a NLF? We can't just assume he can dash whatever distance he wants, when in most cases, the most he dashes is like 10 meters, maybe a bit more.

Yeah, and send that projectile right back to him to get hit by.

Link can also just Recall, rewind, stop, repeat, causing them to drop, given Recall stops time when he uses it, no real threat here.

Link can only recall one projectile at a time. Causing it to drop is just gonna cause the spell to explode. And can he even recall stuff like lightning, or fireballs? Cause I know you can't recall Lynel fireballs.

Again, why the hell are we assuming he has that? Byleth CANT have that atop some of the other shit mentioned, that's compositing.

Like I said, OP allowed Optional Equipment. Wyverns/Pegasi are optional equipment for Byleth, so they have it.

 

[CrackerVolley]

Not on his profile, no use in this match :trell:

Dunno why it's not on his profile tbh, must've been missed.

Ngl, I'm not actually sure if it counted as Time Stop, so I just got cold feet and never added it. Sorry.

 

[TheGatememer]

Ngl, I'm not actually sure if it counted as Time Stop, so I just got cold feet and never added it. Sorry.

not forgiven, you are sentenced to water temple

 

[CrackerVolley]

Which one?

 

[TheGatememer]

Which one?

that one

 

[CrackerVolley]

 

[CrackerVolley]

You want me to add it to Link's profile now?

 

[TheGatememer]

You want me to add it to Link's profile now?

I'd make a crt for it just in case

 

[CrackerVolley]

Here u go

 

[Chariot190]

Figured it couldn't hurt to bring up.

Aight.

I was explaining the mechanisms on how the status effect works, since it's different from ToTK. Unlike in ToTK, where the ice breaks after a single hit (even from a ******* bee iirc), you can use the frozen status effect in FE to rack up damage all while the enemy can't do anything.

But that doesn't matter? At all. Ice status in TOTK has a damage multiplier, just because it doesn't break in FE doesnt mean it's better, honestly, I'd sooner say they're just to weak to shatter it.

As established, like three times, even the mooks in TOTK have inane ice res, yet they can be frozen, Link, is like 15x better res from them.
Class K to M enemies, that can shrug off being flash frozen for months, unphased, can be frozen and even killed by it (And yes, LS definitely plays a part, given Link is cognizant instantly and can act right away, he just has to like, shimmy out of it).
And Link can even freeze dudes in like 1000c temps.
Like it goes on, it's kind of wacky.

Also, also, I just checked, even Link's worst ice items can instantly cool down lava into solid rock, so yeah nah his ice is COLD, can turn liquid lava into solid cooled rock while in a place that's like 1000c and people ******* eat this fruit HOW

And, tbf, zelda bees wild, golden bee my mvp.

Instant immolation,

Yes. aka, far beyond valley.

yes, disintegration, no, wooden stuff can last a bit before being reduced to ash.

What like ten seconds? That's pretty instant. In a normal volcanic region that would take like an hour, and not even to the same degree, I just watched a boko shield turn to a puff of smoke bro...

Eh, I don't know if I'd call it well beyond standard volcanic temps,

But it is? like 2-3x. Might even be higher given how quick it happens, but Im still talking with Dale about temp shift calcs.

since wood instantly catches fire at like 370 C / 700 F.

Not the way it does in TOTK where it catches ablaze on contact with the air and then turns to smoke like a few seconds later.

I'm pretty sure Link instantly gets set on fire without the potion/flame breaker stuff, and iirc, you still get set on fire if you stand on those little lavaspots you sometimes find in death mountain, even with flamebreaker gear.

Yes, and that's INSANE. That is far beyond Valley of Torment it isn't even funny, that place is just molten slag, probably a few hundred degrees, but people aren't catching fire on contact with the air, wood doesnt turn to smoke and poof away in like 15 seconds, etc.

True, he could probably extinguish it if he does get set on fire. Though, it would still damage his wooden gear, if he has any equipped at that specific moment.

I mean, why wouldn't he have it up to begin? That's Sidon's main gimmick, he's going to slap a bubble shield on Link immediately, and then do so again whenever it breaks.
Again, it's a 5v1.

And yeah true, but all the wooden weapons suck except korok stuff ass so shrug. Except a few like Demon Bow, that doesnt burn, I just checked so that's actually cool.

Wait shit I thought you were referring to Immortality Type 2 nvm. Basically, how it works is that it deals the same damage to Link regardless of whether or not he's blocking any attacks.

???
I'm sorry, idk what youre talking about.

I'm talking about pure combat skill, not equipment and/or abilities; everything you just listed would be the latter.

Please, 80% of the "skill" stomps in 3H are actually just AP stomps. I'm not going to say they aint skilled because, goddamn they are, but be real here.

Dude, both portrayals are equally valid, regardless of whether or not we're using Three Houses/Hopes keys; so Houses Byleth has the same abilities/techniques as Hopes Byleth, and vice versa. They aren't just gonna forget the moves they used literally like a few months prior. If you don't like that, then make a CRT.

That's just cherry picking
"hey, in the game we using it's like this, but another game has better number so let's use that instead".

And we're using the 3H key actually, 3H2 is a diff key so...

I mean my issue isn't them having it, it's the fact shit evidently doesnt work the same. I could make a CRT? Tbh this seems kind of loose. It's like with Pokemon, everyone used to be like "oh dark void is a spawn move, so it cant be dodged", while using anime Darkrai whose dark void is a projectile, like bruh, if we using 3Houses, I dont mind using FEW stuff, but can we at least treat it AS it is in 3H
Also you did mention IC stuff below with Link, but it goes both ways, if Byleth doesn't use this extra stuff in 3H, but does in FEW, why would it be assumed IC for a 3 key?

Yea, I know that they stopped spawning after a certain amount, and you had to use them up in order for the fairies to spawn again. It was the same in BOTW.

Ill check ig. But 4 revives regardless of what happens is insane, these lil mfs even work against death hax thanks flat and sharp
And, unlike Byleth, these are automatic and happen even after death.

I think it just lasts for a long time, but might be thinking of BotW, idk if the mechanics changed. Either way, Link can still be frozen.

Similar to Link, Byleth can also break out of the frozen status in like a second or two, when it freezes enemies for quite a bit.

I checked, see bottom of post.
Yeah but, again, these lil fellas HAVE stupid af cold res, a basic RED boko can shrug off being frozen for months, or however long Colgera was a thing. AND they're all Class K~ as well.
Yet at worst, they flash frozen for a solid half minute, and it's so cold it kills them, and Link can freeze IN death mountain, aka, the place that takes not even 15 seconds to vaporize wood, causes instant immolation, and so on. And yes, Byleth CAN freeze shit in the valley too, but as mentioned, I'm pretty sure the air within death Mountain alone is like 2-3x the valley.

Not on his profile, no use in this match :trell:

Dunno why it's not on his profile tbh, must've been missed.

I mean I get that, but we both know he has it. A lot of shit was missed tbh tbf i missed it too, some of this shit i never thought to do so im not blaming anyone

It's specified that Link sometimes feels time slow down whenever focusing (ie, when performing Flurry Rushes/Bullet Time), it's not just activated at will.

Bro, it is quite literally just proc'd by him focusing. He can focus at will. We see him do it, like in TOTK, he can proc that shit mid-air, whenever he attempts a dodge (aka, even just him moving), on deflect, etc. And I think Ravali has this too? Or maybe it was Teba idk.

And we see dudes like Ganon, same tech, react to a flurry and initiate their own.

You're conflating gameplay mechanics with lore, because yeah no shit going bullet time whenever would be game breaking (and the fact you can anyway with a shield flip IS game breaking, bros at the big N did not think that through), shit's still loose af tho.

The max i've seen him rush down outside of glitches is like, maybe tens of meters.

Honestly just depends when the hurt box is dodged and where the enemy is. I've seen bro dash like 50m against a Lynel charge due to fucky timing and the Lynel having already moved.

My point is, this affects movement, he can rush down as long as it's up. And it lasts AWHILE.

Don't remember that ever happening in AoC, do you have a scan?

Not on me, I'm not exactly the AoC or even the TOTK/BOTW dude, but I can probably look later for clips.

You were referring to "heat seaking" stuff, so I naturally assumed you meant elemental keese eyeballs, and not the Ancient arrows. And Link doesn't have ranged Gloom stuff I think? Unless the Demon King bow inflicts gloom, which I don't think it does.

Well for those yeah, but 5x heat seeking elemental attacks, that Link can swap between instantly is kinda of bullshit.

Demon King Bow don't (i had one on me), but that bow does have stat amp, I would not be surprised if it just kills Byleth on impact if Link is at full HP.

And gloom, a lot of random Items have gloom covered on it, I should probably actually check what tho, s yeah tat one's on me, but regardless, any gloom would be crippling to Byleth, even just being within a few feet of that shit.

Scaling chains exist. Byleth stomps Shez, who stomps nearly every student in Three Houses + Dimitri/Edelgard/Claude, Dimitri is far stronger than Claude, who can easily one-shot two soldiers who scale to 15.64 Kilotons.

So basically: >>> (For One-shots), >> (For Stomps), > (For Stronger)

Byleth >> Shez >> Dimitri > Claude >>> Soldiers = 15.64 Kilotons.

Yes, and as with every match ever, or even indexing (far higher plat...), upscaling is just that, upscaling, it means he shit stomps 15kt dudes, but that doesn't mean he aint getting folded by say, a 70kt dude even if his scaling was twice that.

Upscaling doesn't magically close big ass calc gaps. Link is INHERENTLY 3x Byleth's calced value, Link, too, scales above his value by quite a bit. Shit evens out, blame wiki standards if you want but it is what it is, for the same reason 10 stomps wouldnt bridge a 10x calc diff, same shit here. Especially as stomps can vary between verses, it's unquantifiable without extra info. If you have a stated multiplier or have something like DBZ where face tanking or one shotting is a confirmed 2x gap, that would work tho.

This isn't even factoring in stuff like crits, awakening, combat arts, skills, etc. Crits do 3x damage, which can be activated pretty easily thanks to crit boosting stuff, or by Byleth performing a perfect dodge, and getting guaranteed crits for several seconds. Awakening is strong enough to make characters instantly break stuff like weapons, and forcefields, when they previously couldn't.

Yes, now factor in Link's armors that buff his def, his def buffs, and all that other shit. I stand by what I said, Byleth is pretty outmatched in raw stats, they have ways to bridge gaps, but kinda useless if the foe can mitigate that gap and put it right back where it was before, WITHOUT relying on luck btw.

The OP specified that Optional Equipment was allowed, so Byleth has them here.

So a comp match? And you're talking to the dude who made the Baoh profile, optional equipment still has to be hypothetically POSSIBLE.

I can make a CRT ig if you're going to pull the "the profile says-" tech.

Fair enough on the first point, for the second point, there's some issues. As I said previously, it isn't just activated whenever he focuses, it only happens sometimes when Link focuses,

Dude, actual semantics. The "sometimes", is, evidently in combat, and not when Link is focusing on what to have for dinner or some shit. The "sometimes" isn't saying "oh it's when he focuses, BUT ONLY IN THESE HYPER SPECIFIC SITUATIONS", obviously he needs to focus hard enough

which is consistent with the fact that he only activates it after dodging/drawing a bow midair; Otherwise Link would just always be in a Flurry Rushed state during combat if all it required was him "focusing".

The fact he can initiate bullet time mid air (and then uncock his bow and just float there without having an arrow drawn, nice try on that one), and dodging, aka "focusing on an enemy's attacks", mid-combat, and initiating it off any manner of movement.

And honestly, you just named off the two actual combat scenarios Link finds himself in. I mean look at Ganon, when Link and Ganon throw hands, they do shit like furry mid flurry, attack back, and then flurry that flurry back. This shit ain't as complex as you're implying.

Even under the assumption that he only needs to "focus", there's still the issue that he's never been shown using it outside of dodging/drawing a bow, so it would be out of character. I guess there is also parrying, but he doesn't follow up with attacks during that.

Literally every time he perfectly blocks something for starters, which still lets him swap items and weapons at blitz level speeds.
And what? Dude, we have CURRENTLY described like 80% of all combat for him, where he uses it, the **** do ya mean that shit out of character?

Link doesn't have prior knowledge, so he wouldn't know think to dodge someone swinging their melee from like 10 meters away would actually hit him,

Why not? Half the enemies he fights can do that? phantom ganons, ganon, yiga elites, etc. There's actually a LOT of dudes that have shit like that. And if Link sees blud begin swinging from like 20m away, well he's not a dumbass, obviously he's swinging for good reason.

until he's already been hit with it (plus, I'd imagine it would be much harder to dodge something you can't even see). And the more distance = more time to react would only apply to Byleth's vacuum slashes, and not their actual melee swings, which aren't projectiles.

Link has enhanced senses and time stop.

That applies to EVERY ranged attack because combat speed is equal, they have to cover more distance, meaning he can dodge and even react with far, far, less issue. Unless you mean in direct CQC, then yeah but, same? Byleth dies if they go CQC tho. Like bro, Link can slap Deconstruction everything, hell he dont even need to, the item itself on contact kills enemies, i dropped one, attached to nothing, at a boko and bro vanished.

Doubt he can recall it, when he can't even recall vacuum slashes iirc.

Ill check what he can recall ig.

Looked it up, and its actually a 19x amp

Thought it was 33x. Also bro 7x is a blitz

See above. Yea, he can still activate flurry rush against Byleth's normal attacks; he just can't attack Byleth back, and his flurry rush is just gonna end,

He can tho? He does that against Ganon. Ganon will literally flurry him back, attack Link, Link can dodge mid-flurry against Ganon's, and continue attacking back.

before Byleth inevitably follows up with other attacks.

And then flurry again, you know there's no cooldown right? Hell, if ya time it right ya can frame trap **** frame traps, light mashing assholes, you know who you are.

That is assuming Link can even dodge in the first place, cause of the massive skill gap, on top of probability hax + supernatural luck.

Im not saying they aren't skilled, but you realize he can initiate a dodge from like 5 feet away, and bullet time will initiate BEFORE the dodge is even done right? Byleth so much as moves his arm within a 5ft radius of Link, and Link can bullet time, rush him down, and kill him.
And the probability hax is far less imposing than you imply especially because Link has supernatural luck too, inherently, but that's ACTUALLY not on the profiles so ehhh, i wont chase that here

Then Byleth just breaks out if they're hit by it, or instantly gets purified by standing in a purification area they can make.

What? Byleth is only Class K, it takes even Link a second to break out, and his ass is Class M, and it takes Moblins like 30 seconds and they Class K, AND have cold res. And if Link hits Byleth to break him free, bro is probably dying because that's a 6x AP dif due to ice modifier, like 12x if Link has ATK buff, and like 24x if he uses a lightning weapon.

See above. Mind hax does nothing here, since Muddle Buds only cause enemies to indiscriminately attack anyone. Byleth has no allies, so they aren't impacted, like at all.

Not actually true, I just gathered clips of those, when proc'd, the enemy will stop and be confused for like a solid 5 seconds first before resuming attack, they also lose track of you when afflicted and have to agro again. That shit causes mass confusion and disorientation, it isn't simply a "kill friend" switch. And they also stop when they regain senses too btw.

Sure, but Byleth can tank it via Miracle, Awakening, Regen, etc.

Regen isn't infallible, can be overcome due to healing cap, and aint doing anything if he's crippled or one shot in one go.
Awakening is just a stat buff, doesn't save him.
Miracle actually works (on some stuff, like it aint stopping ancient tech), but, not that good if ya know, Link attacks twice. Which last i checked, kills ya in game if a foe procs miracle, and then just hits ya again.

Worst case scenario, Byleth rewinds time.

Not if blud is dead, deconstructed, mind haxed, and so on.

Literally in Byleth's Academy key:

Is that not the green haired form?

Need to calc it tbh

Probably Link needs stuff too tho tbh, I'd bet like 15$ his flurry can hit 9c based off mirror light

actually, what even is baseline FTE anyways

Faster than eye.

Cause it's accepted on Byleth's profile. Also, see what I said earlier about Three Houses/Hopes.

I mean if you're gonna hold me at gunpoint.

Ain't that a NLF? We can't just assume he can dash whatever distance he wants, when in most cases, the most he dashes is like 10 meters, maybe a bit more.

No? We know he can dash, we see him do large gaps, and there's no reason he can't.
Logically speaking, how far he can dash, is simply tied to how long a flurry lasts, at that point just some basic math. If for example, he does like 20m in 1/5th his flurry, and the total length is 5x that, then by proxy, 100m should be possible.

What WOULD be a nlf is if i said flurry can last forever, and as such, can dash however far he wants by proxy, no, how far is still limited by length.

Link can only recall one projectile at a time. Causing it to drop is just gonna cause the spell to explode. And can he even recall stuff like lightning, or fireballs? Cause I know you can't recall Lynel fireballs.

I will check. And yeah? Exactly, if the spell drops and explodes, it wont hit him? And given he stops time when he does this, he can just neg all Byleth's long range attacks, they'll just drop and not him as he goes one by one, negging them. Link can manually stop recall btw, so he can just recall, stop, disable it, then go to next one.

From my testing tho, the attacks seem to need to be corporal, at least mostly? It's kinda all over.

Like I said, OP allowed Optional Equipment. Wyverns/Pegasi are optional equipment for Byleth, so they have it.

I would prefer we use common decency, while that is true, comps are NOT allowed either, wiki rules, this match can't even be added if we go that route, this would just be F&G.

Again, I'm not seeing how Byleth doesn't get mogged by 5 dudes at once, all stronger and unkillable, ALSO, I've been testing stuff, but Link can recall his own shit, like what's stopping Link from yeeting something, letting Byleth dodge, and then recalling his own item to pincer Byleth between that and like 5x bullet time deconstruction carpet bombing + huge AOE waves of frost, flame and lightning, making him unable to dodge? Or even just a forced compromise, what's stopping Link from doing a massive stun AOE, frying both of themselves, and deleting Byleth on recovery given Link recovers 4x quicker on stun compared, hell Link can just make it an ultimatum to where if Byleth hits, him, he procs an electric like like stone or something that explodes the moment Byleth hits the shield or Link DROPS IT, and hits them both, but as mentioned Link is quicker on recovery and just deletes his ass (except actually, i tested this on multiple foes, by the time Link is undazzled and attacking, the foe is still fried for a solid 4-5 seconds. He might not even too, given electric res armor too but i dont have his full fish suit so i cant check...). Or hell, light manip, Link has stuff that blinds and stuns foes in a huge vicinity (Link is unphased), etc.

Link has so many ways to just kinda mog Byleth and lead into a free kill, and then slap on speed buffs, a bunch of other buffs, his own revive bullshit, and just random hax like demon king weapons, allies and zonai stuff, etc. Not to say Byleth also dont have buffs, but when half are lucked based, and he's already fighting an uphill battle, ehhh.

Also I still wanna know if it's possible for Byleth to even HAVE everything in one run pre-time skip, like most of it yeah, but all of it?