• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Status
Not open for further replies.
I'm still neutral about that, but leaning towards agreement with Arceus0x. I'm also neutral on the tier 3 feat. I agree that it's legit. I just don't know the most accurate way to calc it. The way it's shown makes it seem 3-B, but the 3-C calc seems to have a more solid foundation
 
Last edited:
i mean no matter what you try if your clone is incomplete then it's not gonna be as powerful as the real thing. He should upscale from that, at least to 4-A, likely 2-C.

Through what i am seeing We should just add "likely 2-C" to the currently existing keys and then change the lifting strength. The only ones who need high 6-A are the fodder.
 
@Eficiente

You still need to help out here. It is inconsiderate to not help us finish your own thread.
 
Well, we need some staff approval first.
 
Yeah, the only thing being contested is the 3-C calc to my knowledge. Everything else has been accepted and has gotten staff approval to my knowledge.
 
What about the 6-A key for Kirby? Everyone agrees that it's fine for the low tiers, but even DDM says that the knowledgeable people he's talked to off wiki don't agree with it ever being a thing for Kirby.
 
Okay. We can probably apply what they have accepted then.
 

How does this look? @DragonGamerZ913 @Peptocoptr27
 

How does this look? @DragonGamerZ913 @Peptocoptr27
Wait, why do Magolor first key get effected?

Also why 4A, likely 3C likely 2C? shouldn't be just 3C likely 2C. Two 'likely' looks weird, anx it will be more weird where it will be in so many other page
 
Wait, why do Magolor first key get effected?

Also why 4A, likely 3C likely 2C? shouldn't be just 3C likely 2C. Two 'likely' looks weird, anx it will be more weird where it will be in so many other page
every 4-A post Drawcia is effected by it, at least that is what i've seen is suggested.
Magolor also harmed Kirby and Kirby harmed Crowned Magolor and tanked attacks from him so Magolor downscales in base.

About 3-C, likely 2-C, this is up to debate between anyone else who's interested in the upgrade. I just added the new tier on top of it, added links and wording, changed LS.
 
Btw I added the calc to the manga pages (Marx calc) and i changed novel character to Massively FTL+ via the calc i made discussed above. Idk where Eficiente's calc fits in all of this but at this point im too afraid to ask.
 

How does this look? @DragonGamerZ913 @Peptocoptr27
There are a few minor issues here and there that would take a while to go over. My biggest one being what Lord_JJJ already brought up. Everything else can be patched up and polished later, but all in all, this looks alright. Sorry I can't provide a more in-depth anslysis. Kinda busy rn.
 
Wait, why do Magolor first key get effected?

Also why 4A, likely 3C likely 2C? shouldn't be just 3C likely 2C. Two 'likely' looks weird, anx it will be more weird where it will be in so many other page
It should be “At least 4-A, likely 3-C to 2-C”

I’ll help out with the formatting when I’m home
 
every 4-A post Drawcia is effected by it, at least that is what i've seen is suggested.
Magolor also harmed Kirby and Kirby harmed Crowned Magolor and tanked attacks from him so Magolor downscales in base.

About 3-C, likely 2-C, this is up to debate between anyone else who's interested in the upgrade. I just added the new tier on top of it, added links and wording, changed LS.
But Magolor wasn't scaled from either Drawcia or his crowned form feats, he was scaled from his own feat (and Return to Dream Land Magolor without the crown scaling to his crowned self will cause circular scaling)

Wasn't most people here agreed with 3-C and thd calc had get accepted? I do not see much of a reason to keep the 4A rating for post-star allies in that case, It be 4A likely 3C, Likely 2C will makes the profile somewhat messy for me
 
If Arceus does not know how to edit properly, it is likely better if somebody more experienced handles the editing.

I will unlock the Kirby profile page.
 
But Magolor wasn't scaled from either Drawcia or his crowned form feats, he was scaled from his own feat (and Return to Dream Land Magolor without the crown scaling to his crowned self will cause circular scaling)

Wasn't most people here agreed with 3-C and thd calc had get accepted? I do not see much of a reason to keep the 4A rating for post-star allies in that case, It be 4A likely 3C, Likely 2C will makes the profile somewhat messy for me
The calc was not fully accepted, only the calculation itself. The feat is under debate. Also it is likely that only Void termina would scale to it either way.

Magolor downscales from his crowned form. Heavily downscales, but still, downscales.
 
So i'd like to make a vote just to see if anyone disagrees.

Should we add the high 6-A tier to kirby or not?

i upgraded kirby but this is the question we need to make sense of
 
I got my netbook fixed so, don't edit the pages, I'll keep up with everything that I didn't on the last few days and then I'll do it myself.
 
I got my netbook fixed so, don't edit the pages, I'll keep up with everything that I didn't on the last few days and then I'll do it myself.
Thank you. I appreciate it. Feel free to do so.
 
Last edited:
Anyways Efi, the current deal is this.
We do not agree with the idea of the high 6-A key due to the point that i brought up a while ago to you:
Dark matter clone is an imperfect clone of Dark matter swordsman which is suggested even in the japanese text. We believe that the clone, due to being an actual boss and keeping up with Meta Knight for a while, should be below DMS and thus everyone should scale to
4-A, likely 2-C, not including the star allies key.
Either way it makes no sense that Kirby would have a jump from high 6-A to 4-A, likely 2-C. When it was 5-A it at least sounded reasonable but at this point it just makes no sense.
 
I don’t have issues with the math, but I’m still rather iffy on scaling it to physicals for reasons I have said in the blog. I didn’t say it here since it’s a staff thread. I’ll probably respond to the rebuttal later since I can’t atm.
I went over this earlier in the thread.
Now for the fodder

Low end enemies like Waddle dees would be

At most High 6-A, possibly 4-A, likely 3-C, likely 2-C

Mini-bosses would scale to

High 6-A, possibly 4-A, likely 3-C, likely 2-C

with the three latter tiers being based on their helper form. This would only scale to those who have helper forms though so no, the bosses without that do not scale.
That "At most" comes out of nowhere, the rest is a mess and not how we do things, it would be "possibly 4-A to 3-C to 2-C" if added as they all go under possibly and we don't use an "or". It would be better to just be a little more patient and wait to see if the 3-C calc gets to be solid, as that possibility makes everything look better and I believe it to be the correct take on the calc.
And any primary game final boss would scale to
At least High 6-A, likely higher

The reason why i want to add a likely higher is because kirby did the high 6-A feat in his fighting ability whilst he fought the final bosses mostly using some final ability like the star rod and the love love stick.
That's not good enough, the love love stick for instance Kirby could pull it out of nowhere to beat others like MK and DDD w/ it in the tetris game.
Magolor also harmed Kirby and Kirby harmed Crowned Magolor and tanked attacks from him so Magolor downscales in base.
No, Magolor did so after those events, after being very vaguely implied to have kept some of the crown's power, showing w/o it abilities he only had w/ it, after having lost to Landia w/o the crown even tho he could one-shot Landia w/ the crown. It's true that Magolor could harm Kirby in a race, but that's less worthy, and next thing we know they added in the ability to grow more powerful via positive things like friendship and team work, which Magolor felt into. Or in other words, "haha the Kirby character got stronger for pretty much no reason, what a silly verse", that does it too, Kirby one-shotting Bandana Dee isn't Kirby one-shoting a 2-C Bandana Dee.
how far is kirby into 2-C
15 or 16 universes.
I don't really have an opinion here, but some offsite folks whom I talked to appear to disagree with Kirby being weaker in his earlier appearances compared to the newer Kirby games. Though, they do agree with the Tier 2 upgrades from what I heard.
We do not agree with the idea of the high 6-A key due to the point that i brought up a while ago to you:
Dark matter clone is an imperfect clone of Dark matter swordsman which is suggested even in the japanese text. We believe that the clone, due to being an actual boss and keeping up with Meta Knight for a while, should be below DMS and thus everyone should scale to
4-A, likely 2-C, not including the star allies key.
Lots of things on why this is wrong.
Thinking it critically one concludes that Dark Matter Clone scales while Dark Matter doesn't, simple as that, with the clone scaling even having some small amount of generosity to it that a profile wouldn't reflect.
Either way it makes no sense that Kirby would have a jump from high 6-A to 4-A, likely 2-C. When it was 5-A it at least sounded reasonable but at this point it just makes no sense.
You hold Kirby under way higher standards of logic than what it actually operates by. Kirby is nonsense and for kids, even in other verses for kids maybe the gap jumped wouldn't have made sense as it takes itself more seriously but that's not the case here. The argument on itself is also just dogmatism and therefore not worth saying, as "the gap in power jumped is too high" only matters if you can prove it's something wrong that is happening, the gap being too high on itself isn't something wrong unless you want it to believe to be something wrong.
 
First of all, dissing the verse you work on like that is awkward. Nonsense? For kids? Like it isn't 100% meant for adults but they work on the lore with actual intensions and actual ideas in mind. Saying that it's nonsense is even worse dogmatism.
 
First of all, dissing the verse you work on like that is awkward. Nonsense? For kids? Like it isn't 100% meant for adults but they work on the lore with actual intensions and actual ideas in mind. Saying that it's nonsense is even worse dogmatism.
Yeah, like what the ****?
 
Second of all, i ain't denying there's a gap in power between the series, but if there is one it ain't freaking infinity. I'd close my eyes on something like a high 6-A to 4-B tier or even 4-A, but you are suggesting that kirby jumped an infinity in power without any visible powerup. I get why DBS can get from 4-B to a 3-A/low 2-C cause they've actual special transformations and stuff, but kirby doesn't. He may grow due to friendship but not to that extent.

Also btw where the heck is it stated that Nova was summoned using 7 star roads? What?

Anyways lemme get to the next part.
Kirby did not stop the battle between the sun and the moon because Marx told him not to. Kirby is gullible, he is told that's the way and so he does it that way. There's also no indication that Kirby couldn't stop Nova in a different way, assuming he wasn't strong enough is not better than assuming that Kirby just saw the ship he used and used it to destroy the Nova without causing too much collateral damage. Otherwise we might as well argue that Kirby was too weak to just punch away Haltmann's ship. Kirby just does what's conventional to him, he always did.

But less about the unimportant part and more about the next point.

My next point is something we argued about a while ago.
Superstar Kirby should have the same AP as Superstar ultra Kirby. Kirby there killed Marx soul who absorbed all of Nova's power and became more powerful. He should scale to Nova.

Before your argument was that it shouldn't scale for being an extra story in a remake. My argument is that that is a load of barnicles because the events in the extra story about marx soul take place RIGHT after the events in Milky way wishes. This not a fight that happens in the main canon, but we see that it is a what if situation and we consider those good for scaling. I mean the entire Marvel What if series caused changes in the MCU scaling. It's a what if situation, shown later on that is considered viable for scaling.
We also have Final Fantasy with it's remakes that are considered canon over the original. Heck, even the remake of Mario and Luigi games are used over the originals. If Kirby SSU is a remake with more info and events then it should be taken over the original and placed in the same spot of the timeline as Kirby Super star which would make Kirby 4-A, likely 2-C.

Finally, on the Dark matter swordsman thing. The clone scales 100% to Mk, downscales, but still scales. He is a boss battle with decent hp. If he didn't scale he would be an enemy that MK one-shots just like any fodder. MK not being satisfied by DMC just means that the only person who can satisfy his bloodlust is someone like Galacta Knight.
The clone is incomplete, it is implied to not be the same as the original. There's no evidence to suggest that it is infinitely stronger for some reason. Previous clones made by Star Dream have already been shown to be inferior to the originals. This makes it not that different.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top