Two dark characters fight each other

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Also, im honestly finding the "Speed is equal so I can dodge" argument to be rather silly.

If speed is equalized, you cant just assume the opponent can easily dodge attacks when the attacks would also be exactly as likely to hit the opponent since speed is equalized.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I can just show this.

Has no problem phasing through stuff.

That doesn't disprove my point. He moves. And doesn't use any other moves. Can't say the same for Darkrai, because both Darkrai and many other Pokemon have shown the ability to attack while intangible.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I got from the now blocked clip from this thread, the dammaku didn't appear hard to dodge to someone that can spam teleportation, and Shadow does dodge alot of attacks Cal, Sans isn't even that good

Then show me a fight against an equal where he canonically goes without getting hit. Not random GUN soldiers, someone on his level.

 

[Theuser789]

Darkrai's is as strong as a gun soldier compared to Shadow in this fight

And the clip that Shadow showed shows Shadow attacking while phasing, that's the entire deal of that move, Shadow hides in distorded space then comes back hitting a opponent, he can do the same to Darkrai, imediately attacking him after coming back

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I mean, it's not like Shadow's millions of times faster than a GUN soldier and is the same speed as Darkrai here.

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

@Cal Darkrai being able to go intangible won't do anything. Shadow has non-physical interaction for being able to hit ghosts.

You also tell him to show Shadow fighting against an equal but Darkrai isn't equal to Shadow, he's weaker.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

You know what? You're right. Darkrai acknowledges that he's weaker than Shaodw then and plays it safe and thought based haxes like he did Palkia then.

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

How would Darkrai know that Shadow is stronger than him?

 

[Theuser789]

Teleporting has nothing to do with speed Cal, Shadow being faster than Gun soldiers doesn't matter in relation to his teleport

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Yes it does. Reactions are a thing. With Shadow's speed, he can easily just dodge bullets like they're nothing, let alone with teleportation.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

How would Darkrai know that Shadow is stronger than him?

Same reason you're comparing Darkrai to a GUN Soldier.

 

[Theuser789]

Except that Shadow didn't just use teleportation to just dodge bullets, otherwise he wouldn't even need it

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

@Cal Darkrai being able to go intangible won't do anything. Shadow has non-physical interaction for being able to hit ghosts.

Useless. All Pokemon in the verse in general have NPI and they cant touch Darkrai when he's intangible. So you'll need more than NPI to counter this.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Then once again, show me Shadow fighting an equal where he hasn't been touched once.

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

I wasn't the one who made the GUN soldier comparison.

Darkrai hasn't shown any info analysis; extrasensory perception, or whatever that would allow him to tell how strong his opponent is. He'd probably think Shadow was just some other random Pokemon. Everyone knows who Palkia is and what he can do, so that would pretty much be prior knowledge.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

How would Darkrai know that Shadow is stronger than him?

This is the same guy who sensed Two Beings fighting in a place between their dimensions, two beings who are unfathomably stronger than Darkrai.

Darkrai doing the same here against Shadow wouldnt be a surprise.

 

[Theuser789]

Shadow doesn't need to not be thouches once, he just needs to avoid a Dammaku which he can in various manners

 

[Theuser789]

I mean, Darkrai should now who they are, thus knowing how strong they are, the same can't be said for him knowing Shadow's power

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Final time, show me Shadow fighting against an equal ithout being touched once, otherwise your claim that he can just lolavoid everything, let alone danmaku, is baseless. Once again, Shadow doesn't have Ultra Instinct.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

>Darkrai should know who they are

Based on literally what?

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

@Cal Dude, if the range of the danmaku is only citywide then Shadow can easily get away from it.

Also why do you keep comparing teleportation to Ultra Instinct? Teleporting is a superior method of dodging to begin with.

 

[Theuser789]

They being famous mythological criatures? There are books in Pokemon telling the myths if the creation trio

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

They being famous mythological criatures? There are books in Pokemon telling the myths if the creation trio

Doesnt mean random wild pokemon know about them....Darkrai doesnt exactly go to Canalave Library.

This argument would be reasonable if this was a trainer instead, but thats obviously not the case.

Besides, Dialga and Palkia are mainly known for being rulers of time and space. Not exactly a well-detailed internary on their strength.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Cal Dude, if the range of the danmaku is only citywide then Shadow can easily get away from it.

Also why do you keep comparing teleportation to Ultra Instinct? Teleporting is a superior method of dodging to begin with.

Shadow isn't some coward who runs from a confrontation. Heck if anything Darkrai's more likely to hide and snipe given he canonically is stated to play things safe.

Because as everyone seems to be conveniently forgetting, reactions exist. Heck, even in the case of DB, why would UI be a big deal if Instantaneous Movement is a thing.

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

@Kukui Seeing as how Dialga and Palkia fighting literally shatters space-time, I would imagine it would be easy to sense that. What would Shadow be doing before fighting Darkrai?

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

@Cal That isn't running from a confrontation, that's just having the common sense to not let your opponent's attacks hit you. Shadow isn't going to stand there and let himself get hit.

Teleportation is instantaneous, and Jiren was still able to hit Goku in UI.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

@Kukui Seeing as how Dialga and Palkia fighting literally shatters space-time, I would imagine it would be easy to sense that. What would Shadow be doing before fighting Darkrai?

Well you'd imagine wrong since Darkrai was the only one in the entire movie who sensed it was Dialga and Palkia fighting from the very beginning of their encounter, despite never encountering them before. Not even an experienced scientist who studies space-time distortions knew it was the work of Dialga and Palkia until half-way into the movie.

This was even pointed out. He even went as far as to put Ash in a nightmare to warn him that Dialga and Palkia would be coming to Alamos Town to fight there.

 

[Theuser789]

There's nothing in Darkrai's profiles indicating that he has some power of sensing how strong someone is

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

That should honestly be added since he clearly did that against Dialga and Palkia and arguing he'd know about them just because they're legendaries when wild mon dont...exactly go to a library to do research, is flat out ridiculous.

I'll take this to a CRT.

 

[Theuser789]

Darkrai is not a regular wild pokemon though, so he could now about the mythological criatures, he could even heard someone talking about them for example

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Uh, no he didnt. Where did you get that idea from?

 

[Theuser789]

He knowing the strengh of famous mythological pokemon but nothing else? I am pretty sure that I already awnsered this question, do a CTR if you believe otherwise

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Cal That isn't running from a confrontation, that's just having the common sense to not let your opponent's attacks hit you. Shadow isn't going to stand there and let himself get hit.

Teleportation is instantaneous, and Jiren was still able to hit Goku in UI.

Except Shadow would approach. That's his character. Heck, strategic retreat would probably be detrimental if anything as it gives the insanely opportunistic Darkrai the chance to launch a sneak attack.

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

Not necessarily. He has ranged options of attacking like his Chaos Spear so he doesn't have to get close to Darkrai. In fact he didn't approach Solaris at all for example.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Chaos Spear is within Dark Void range and it's not Danmaku. Unlike Shadow, all Darkrai has to do is move a bit rather than constantly dodge.

 

[Stalker_Maggot]

Darkrai fra

 

[Theuser789]

Not really, Shadow's range is more than city

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

Super Shadow can fire several Chaos Lances at once with the Spear of Light, which are enhanced Chaos Spears that home in on the target.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Shadow. Which he needs to charge. Which gets him roofied by Darkrai.

@User. And Darkrai's range is more than city, but that doesn't stop Darkrai from using citywide range. Just because Shadow's Chaos powers can reach certain lengths doesn't mean it's usable like that. Otherwise Goku can snipe from the other side of the universe.

 

[Theuser789]

Let me count the votes

Shadow(9): ShadowWarrior1999, AboogieYesSir, VioletVoid100, modermmyrmidon, Spinoirr, theuser789, Godhand1999, Hiryu-Z, Marverick Zero X

Darkrai (3): The real cal howard, EmperorDoom25, Stalker Maggot

It's grace for Shadow for now