Transformers General Discussion

[Primestar3]

The feat is still incredibly vague, and can't be used. And the feats in the game suggest these characters aren't beyond tier 8 unless you can find something that is higher than 8-B

True, it is vague. Though I think they could still be above 8-B based on visuals. I don't remember anything that would definitely put them at 8-B (excluding visuals) max. But again, the statement is kind of vague, I agree.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

I think bumblebee destroys an entire power plant at one point

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Ok so bee does throw entire power cells at barricade which causes pretty big explosions, I do recall them destroying some big buildings but I dunno if that is 8-B

 

[Primestar3]

I don't think they should have profiles, as they seem too contradictory to one another and are pretty vague, so nope

Damn, I found this podcast where John Barber straight up says if a toy bio doesn't condradict the comics, it counts.


Timestamp: 00:14:50

Would the mountain level feats count then? I mean, the only thing condradicting it is Tunguska, but not necessarily the Cybertron city level feats since we don't know the actual size of the Cybertronian cities. I am guessing by condradiction, he mostly means story-wise.

Arcee's Target toy bio includes Decepticons working in a star breaking weapon. This may be condradicted in the comics, not sure.

Charii system - Transformers Wiki

tfwiki.net

Then you have stuff like Bludgeon and Whirl being FTE.

Autobot Whirl (2009) - Autobot - www.tfu.info

www.tfu.info

Unfortunately, he says he didn't watch Cyber Missions.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Except, which toy bios doesn't contradict tho? The Ironhide is a no as starscream was harmed by the city thing and shockwave was placed in a coma by Tunguska.

I'm not sure if that means anything.

That's nowhere close to FTL. Moving faster than a human can see is subsonic. Their current ratings are supersonic+ already

 

[Primestar3]

Except, which toy bios doesn't contradict tho? The Ironhide is a no as starscream was harmed by the city thing and shockwave was placed in a coma by Tunguska.

I'm not sure if that means anything.

That's nowhere close to FTL. Moving faster than a human can see is subsonic. Their current ratings are supersonic+ already

Tunguska would condradict, but I think SS's city level feat doesn't necessarily condradict, since it is a Cybertronian city and the narration says the flame of the explosion was powerful enough to engulf the city, wouldn't that be above city level then? Not sure if that Ark feat I talked about before would affect things.

It would be star level presumably. Though I am unsure if that doesn't condradict the comics continuity.

FTE = Faster than eye. Not sure how the FTE thing was calced at subsonic, though wouldn't the fact that TFs are bigger than a human make a difference? As in, it would be harder to be FTE for a character much bigger than a human, I think. Not sure by how much.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

The ark has yet to be called and I still doubt it could be called, even then, I don't think the crash is city level. Also you haven't really posted anything that says the Ironhide thing is connected to the comics.

That doesn't scale to anyone

I thought you were reffering to FTL, oops. They're already subsonic tho. Also FTE doesn't necessarily mean the character has to be so fast that they're invisible, it could just mean they're so fast it's hard for the human eye to keep track of them.

 

[Primestar3]

The ark has yet to be called and I still doubt it could be called, even then, I don't think the crash is city level. Also you haven't really posted anything that says the Ironhide thing is connected to the comics.

That doesn't scale to anyone

I thought you were reffering to FTL, oops. They're already subsonic tho. Also FTE doesn't necessarily mean the character has to be so fast that they're invisible, it could just mean they're so fast it's hard for the human eye to keep track of them.

It would be connected if it's not an outlier. Depends on the Cybertronian city feats, I think. I do think Ark feat may not be city level based on visuals or whatever tho, considering that it seems that explosions on the Moon might be bigger than they would be on Earth, but IDK.

Also, even with Tunguska, Optimus punches scales above it since SW's exterior was largely undamaged by the impact, yet OP's knuckle punch went through hik in the movie.

Although I don't disagree the mountain level bios may not fit, it's just a possibility that they are not outliers.

I know the Arcee thing doesn't scale to anyone, but it would still count as a part of the verse (if it doesn't condradict).

It says the human eye can't see the fight, not can't track it, so, probably the former, I think.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Anyone who scales above shockwave is straight up 7-B. Anyone around the level of shockwave or lower is At most 7-B.anyone significantly below shockwave is Low 7-B+.

Could you provide a scan?

Other than being star level, it doesn't have anything other info about it, so it can't have a profile. We don't even know it's name.

I don't they're moving so fast humans can't see them. It could just need their combat and reaction.

 

[Drite77]

BTW. why 7-B for extended Bayverse?

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Starscream survived a cybertronian city exploding and shockwave crashing on earth caused the Tunguska event, which caused 15 megatons of TNT iirc, he got knocked out from it tho

 

[Drite77]

I think that I already said that the first could be not 7-B depending on how far Starscream was from the explosion

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

The ship crashing caused the explosion, and starscream was inside the ship went that happened

 

[Drite77]

Being inside the ship is not the same as being at the epicenter of the explosion though

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Well that's a big yikes.

 

[Primestar3]

Being inside the ship is not the same as being at the epicenter of the explosion though

Apparently, this is a shot of Trypticon (doesn't seem to be its full size, it is the capital metropol of Cybertron, so presumably bigger than a human city):
Image

And the narration says the "burning sky engulfs the city"
Image

If the fireball alone is big enough to engulf the city, then wouldn't the explosion be above city level?

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

His point isn't that the explosion wasn't city level, his point is that the starscream has to be at the epicenter of the explosion to be city level.

For instance, the refinery explosion. Scorponok was literally holding the bomb in his hands. And he survived no problem.

 

[Primestar3]

Starscream survived a cybertronian city exploding and shockwave crashing on earth caused the Tunguska event, which caused 15 megatons of TNT iirc, he got knocked out from it tho

In regards to explosion size, if this is Tunguska:
Image

Then isn't the SS explosion bigger than Tunguska if the fireball engulfed the city?
Image

 

[Drite77]

Apparently, this is a shot of Trypticon (doesn't seem to be its full size, it is the capital metropol of Cybertron, so presumably bigger than a human city):
Image

And the narration says the "burning sky engulfs the city"
Image

If the fireball alone is big enough to engulf the city, then wouldn't the explosion be above city level?

I don't know how those scans answer the fact that Starscream wasn't at the center of the explosion

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

In regards to explosion size, if this is Tunguska:
Image

Then isn't the SS explosion bigger than Tunguska if the fireball engulfed the city?
Image

It's not the fact that the explosion destroyed the city, that is a definite yes. The point is that if starscream was not at the center of the explosion, then he's lower than city level

 

[Primestar3]

His point isn't that the explosion wasn't city level, his point is that the starscream has to be at the epicenter of the explosion to be city level.

For instance, the refinery explosion. Scorponok was literally holding the bomb in his hands. And he survived no problem.

I wasn't arguing against that. What I mean is that:

Inverse Square Law

Wikipedia describes Inverse Square Law as this: In physics, an inverse-square law is any physical law stating that a specified physical quantity or intensity is inversely proportional to the square of the distance from the source of that physical quantity. A simplified formula for this is area...

vsbattles.fandom.com

If this page is correct and that a person 30 meters away from a 7 kiloton nuke gets building level durability, then SS who was close to the an explosion the fireball of which engulfs a city would still get something. Not sure how much. Also, the Trypticon ship itself doesn't look that large in comparison to SS, so SS was still relatively close to the epicenter.

@Drite77

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Hm, considering I am pretty mediocre at maths I can't input on that

 

[Drite77]

Well, that is a difference of about 16630.2385251

Also one thing, Starscream is way bigger than a normal human, so the further he is from an explosion, it would yeild way less than if he was a human

 

[Primestar3]

@Drite77 @Emirp sumitpo

Hmm, how big is this city just from this image?

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Isn't that iacon and not trypticon?

 

[Primestar3]

Isn't that iacon and not trypticon?

Apparently, it's Trypticon since Ironhide just drew to Megatron's home soon after the scene here which is in Trypticon. TFWiki thinks so too, though they can make mistakes.

 

[Drite77]

@Drite77 @Emirp sumitpo

Hmm, how big is this city just from this image?

Can't really say from that image

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

I guess we still have the shockwave thing, even if that one is a bit iffy

 

[Primestar3]

I guess we still have the shockwave thing, even if that one is a bit iffy

True. Still I'm hoping the SS thing is still impressive. I'm thinking the explosion might be city+ if the fireball alone engulfed it. The shockwave would be much bigger. And that scan I posted above seems to suggest that Trypticon is a fully fledged metropol. I don't have pixel calcing software, so can't calc it myself. Still, SS seemed to be a few dozen meters away from the epicenter. IDK how impressive it is exactly.

There is also this from Defiance:
Metrotitan city gets damaged by an alien attack, which makes the power lines volatile. Optimus places some charges, which detonates and then "brings the city on top of" SS, Barricade, Crankcase and Brawl.
Image 1
Image 2
Image 3

(I skipped some scans of OP and SS fighting).

In panel 4, the charges go off with a "fwoosh", and then the next panel, there is a single big "boom", so maybe the city destruction wasn't a chain reaction, but a singular explosion? It happens right next to the Decepticons present.

Thoughts?

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

There's nothing saying the entire city was destroyed tho, and due to the way the explosion is drawn, it would be hard to calc it.

 

[Primestar3]

There's nothing saying the entire city was destroyed tho, and due to the way the explosion is drawn, it would be hard to calc it.

Hmm, but Optimus does say the city is unstable, and also, that the charges would bring the city down on top of the Decepticons.

Considering that it seems the whole city was unstable (the panels showing the city showed it completely damaged), I think likely the whole city was gone after the charges (considering Optimus's quote).

 

[Primestar3]

There's nothing saying the entire city was destroyed tho, and due to the way the explosion is drawn, it would be hard to calc it.

Another city shot showing the city completely damaged:
Image

 

[Drite77]

Hmm, but Optimus does say the city is unstable, and also, that the charges would bring the city down on top of the Decepticons.

Considering that it seems the whole city was unstable (the panels showing the city showed it completely damaged), I think likely the whole city was gone after the charges (considering Optimus's quote).

The way it is drawn doesn't look that the City was destroyed completely

 

[Primestar3]

The way it is drawn doesn't look that the City was destroyed completely

I'm going by Optimus's quote that says the city itself is unstable power line-wise (the entire city is also seems to be drawn damaged) and that the charges would bring the city down on top of the Decepticons. The implication seems to be that the whole city is destroyed in the explosion.

The art itself is unclear, but it doesn't really show much of the explosion.

Though it could have been only a portion of the city like you two say.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

At best, it could be "Possibly 7-B" But it's still pretty iffy as the art doesn't really show that. And there aren't really anything to say the city was destroyed.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Movie Optimus vs aligned optimus: go check it out

Bumping this here

 

[Primestar3]

And there aren't really anything to say the city was destroyed.

Well, as I said, I think Optimus saying "the city is unstable", the art showing the city indeed seemigly being completely damaged, and Optimus saying the charges would bring the city down seem to imply the whole city was destroyed.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

That's why I said it's a possibly feat. The art doesn't show it, there's no statement that it happened, but the city being stable shows it could've happened, therefore: "Possibly 7-B"

 

[Drite77]

I'm going by Optimus's quote that says the city itself is unstable power line-wise (the entire city is also seems to be drawn damaged) and that the charges would bring the city down on top of the Decepticons. The implication seems to be that the whole city is destroyed in the explosion.

The art itself is unclear, but it doesn't really show much of the explosion.

Though it could have been only a portion of the city like you two say.

That is... far from destroyed. Unstable power line-wise has nothing to do with the city being destroyed, the charges would bring the city down on top of the Decepticons also is far from destroyed, like, a city can be Unstable power line-wise without it having a single city block destroyed, hell, my city is normally unstanble power line-wise

 

[Shadyboi0]

By pure size alone what would be the AP of someone who is 350m?