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Tower of God General Discussion Thread Part 5

ElajRuengies said:
We do have that; everyone who is Island level is 2x as strong as everyone who is Likely Island level
Click to expand...
wait, the hell train KE has 15.8 gigatons, and as so, a ranker has scales to 1/3 of the feat(5.25 gigatons), while Bam and those that scale to him 2/3 of the calc(10.5 gigatons). but we have it on the profiles. What i want, is put a note on calculations section similar to
Note:

  • The Town level+'s likes Tsuna are from 20% of Large Town level calc (58 kilotons of TNT)
  • The Large Town level+'s like Gokudera are from 2x of Large Town level calc (590 Kilotons of TNT)
  • The Small City level's like Tsuna are upscaled from Large Town level+ value
  • The City level's like Byakuran are from 10x of Small City level value (10 Megatons of TNT). For Tsuna, it's come from 1.6x of previous values (16 Megaton of TNT)
  • The Mountain level's like Enma are form 7x of City level value (112 Megatons of TNT)
  • The Large Mountain level's like Daemon Spade are from 10x of Mountain level value (1.12 Gigantons of TNT)
  • The Island level's like Vindice are from are from 6x of Large Mountain level value (6.72 Gigantons of TNT)
  • The Large Country level's like Kawahira are come from 30x of Island level value (201.6 Gigantons of TNT)
Click to expand...
but with the 6C only, it helps to clear misunderstanding
 
Do you think Kallavan and possibly Baam should get Supernatural Willpower? The first is obviously due to the fact that Kallavan can continue fighting even after having the big hole through his torso and even so he didn't seem to be very affected even though he refused medical help in an attempt to chase Baam after he escaped form the Last Station and even then, he didn't seem to be at risk of dying, Kallavan seems to fit in the solid criteria to have this ability. And for Baam, is because normal people should die immediately from the shock after receiving the Power of Souls, but he was completely fine, but I'm not really sure about it, I want to ask you guys what do you think
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
Do you think Kallavan and possibly Baam should get Supernatural Willpower? The first is obviously due to the fact that Kallavan can continue fighting even after having the big hole through his torso and even so he didn't seem to be very affected even though he refused medical help in an attempt to chase Baam after he escaped form the Last Station and even then, he didn't seem to be at risk of dying, Kallavan seems to fit in the solid criteria to have this ability. And for Baam, is because normal people should die immediately from the shock after receiving the Power of Souls, but he was completely fine, but I'm not really sure about it, I want to ask you guys what do you think
Click to expand...
Supernatural Willpower is the ability to exceed one's own limits through sheer willpower to a degree extremely far beyond real human standards.
Click to expand...
For both cases, no, as Kallavan didn't do anything beyond what someone of his level could have been capable of (while the fighting with an arm blown off/massive hole is seen as impressive even to people in his league, it isn't seen as impossible/absurd), and Bam not being affected by the malice of the Souls isn't even remotely due to his own will, but the fact that his power at its core is an unflinching endless gluttony (according to the Blue Demon at least)

I think a better candidate would be Jinsung Ha given that he managed to use a remote Reverse Flow Control and stop Maschenny and Kallavan despite being "two seconds away from dying"
 
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i yet again ask about this.
ImNot4nUser said:
wait, the hell train KE has 15.8 gigatons, and as so, a ranker has scales to 1/3 of the feat(5.25 gigatons), while Bam and those that scale to him 2/3 of the calc(10.5 gigatons). but we have it on the profiles. What i want, is put a note on calculations section similar to
Click to expand...
 
ImNot4nUser said:
yeah. example;
  • 6C like Charlie scale to 1/3 of the Hell train feat (the amount of calc that scales to him, in this case 5.25 gigatons)
  • 6C like Baam scale to 2/3 of hell train feat(10.5 gigatons)
Click to expand...
I mean, I personally prefer the current key system used where different sub-tiers are denoted with a suffix attached, since it lets one know the values for the character without having to know the specific scaling, but I'll see what other people have to say
 
By the way, really until now since the Hand of Arlen calc, haven't we had any recent accepted calc to apply?

Also, Data Zahard shouldn't get Regeneration via Data Manipulation? Since as the ruler of the Hidden Floor, he can regenerate using the system of there in his favor
 
ImNot4nUser said:
eh, i dont since i believe it will cause confusion but its not that bad... and i didnt meant as in the profiles, but the calc section
Click to expand...
By the calc section do you mean in the afterward of the calc description in the calculations list, or in the calc scaling notes?
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
By the way, really until now since the Hand of Arlen calc, haven't we had any recent accepted calc to apply?
Click to expand...
Nope... It's been long enough that I can prolly ask calc group members about it again though
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
Also, Data Zahard shouldn't get Regeneration via Data Manipulation? Since as the ruler of the Hidden Floor, he can regenerate using the system of there in his favor
Click to expand...
No, because D. Zahard says that he specifically doesn't regenerate
"As the Ruler of this Data World, once my arm is destroyed, it does not regenerate."
Click to expand...
 
ElajRuengies said:
By the calc section do you mean in the afterward of the calc description in the calculations list, or in the calc scaling notes?
Click to expand...
clarify.png

oh wait, its there tf didnt knew forget about what i said
 
@ElajRuengies

You know that Line Webtoon is infamous because of its low quality of translation that confuse readers sometimes right?

If he doesn't regenerate because he is the Ruler of the Hidden Floor, that internal monologue would not make sense (what a surprise, Line Webtoon once again confusing his readers) and Data Zahard would not have been impressed with Baam's power, he even said that "This power ... even goes against the system here ...”, which strongly implies that he expected his arm to regenerate despite having been ripped off, the first part of the monologue is simply badly worded, because otherwise Bam's attack making it not do so wouldn't be “going against the system”, it wouldn't make sense with what Baam did and showed, if it weren't for that, Data Zahard simply should just be surprised by Baam's AP, and it wouldn't be necessary one or two entire panels explaining how special the power that Baam acquired and how surprised he was because of that negated his exclusive powers as the Ruler of the Hidden Floor
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
@ElajRuengies

You know that Line Webtoon is infamous because of its low quality of translation that confuse readers sometimes right?

If he doesn't regenerate because he is the Ruler of the Hidden Floor, that internal monologue would not make sense (what a surprise, Line Webtoon once again confusing his readers) and Data Zahard would not have been impressed with Baam's power, he even said that "This power ... even goes against the system here ...”, which strongly implies that he expected his arm to regenerate despite having been ripped off, the first part of the monologue is simply badly worded, because otherwise Bam's attack making it not do so wouldn't be “going against the system”, it wouldn't make sense with what Baam did and showed, if it weren't for that, Data Zahard simply should just be surprised by Baam's AP, and it wouldn't be necessary one or two entire panels explaining how special the power that Baam acquired and how surprised he was because of that negated his exclusive powers as the Ruler of the Hidden Floor
Click to expand...
Fair enough (and also true about the translation), although there might need to be a note explaining about that for people who might be confused

Side Note- I redid the Mr. Finger calc using a higher resolution and slightly different measurements; while the width and length got smaller, the depth got larger, and the current output is 4.14 Teratons, or Small Country level+ (4 Teratons and above), making 100% Urek 414 Teratons, aka Large Country level (High 6-B+ starts at 430 Teratons)
 
ElajRuengies said:
Fair enough (and also true about the translation), although there might need to be a note explaining about that for people who might be confused

Side Note- I redid the Mr. Finger calc using a higher resolution and slightly different measurements; while the width and length got smaller, the depth got larger, and the current output is 4.14 Teratons, or Small Country level+ (4 Teratons and above), making 100% Urek 414 Teratons, aka Large Country level (High 6-B+ starts at 430 Teratons)
Click to expand...
Yes, I agree with you, and if you can, can you add Data Manipulation and a note explaining it and Line Webtoon's translation in Zahard's profile? Since you can explain it better than me.

Glad that we will still continue at High 6-B+, despite the downgrade, the only characters who will scale Urek's finger calc are Urek himself, Family Heads and Zahard, right?
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
Yes, I agree with you, and if you can, can you add Data Manipulation and a note explaining it and Line Webtoon's translation in Zahard's profile? Since you can explain it better than me.
Click to expand...
Done
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
Glad that we will still continue at High 6-B+, despite the downgrade, the only characters who will scale Urek's finger calc are Urek himself, Family Heads and Zahard, right?
Click to expand...
Ah, no, it's just shy of High 6-B+ by about 16 Teratons, meaning it's just High 6-B
Also yes!
 
ImNot4nUser said:
when did this happened??
Click to expand...
You see this during Garam's flashback when she was talking about the fight between Enryu and the 43rd Administrator, when she stated how their battle destroyed all the buildings, seas and mountains of the floor.

In fact, looking closely, it was the blood of the Admnistrator that flooded the 43rd Floor, not his shinsoo
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
You see this during Garam's flashback when she was talking about the fight between Enryu and the 43rd Administrator, when she stated how their battle destroyed all the buildings, seas and mountains of the floor.

In fact, looking closely, it was the blood of the Admnistrator that flooded the 43rd Floor, not his shinsoo
Click to expand...
  1. I know
  2. I know, all the floor of death that we've seen is the admin corpse, like, everything, his blood is shinsu, he is big af. i thought you knew something that maybe i missed.
 
I just forgot that blood and shinsoo of the Admnistrator are the same, and I caused this confusion by accident. But in general I just wanted to know if its possible calculate the flood that the Administrator's blood caused in the 43rd Floor
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
Also, is there any way to calculate that 43rd Administrator's death caused a flood of shinsoo in the whole floor?
Click to expand...
Uh, technically one could get a number out of it but it would require a some assumptions.
  1. That the Sea of Blood shown on the Admin's corpse covers the entire floor (this is to make getting volume and thus mass easier)
  2. That the Sea of Blood is as deep as some random real world sea chosen, probably the Mediterranean due to sheer size (see first brackets)
  3. That shinsu-blood-whatever as dense as actual blood.
Using KE, the average speed for flash-floods is 2.7 meters per second, although a different sources says flood water can get to speeds of 29.95 m/s (67 mph). Alternatively, one could use potential energy like in this calc.

KE 1: 7.4459568e+13 meters * 1500 meters * 1060kg/cubicm 0.5 * 2.7^2 = 103.139137 Gigatons
KE 2: 7.4459568e+13 meters * 1500 * 1060 * 0.5 * 29.95^2 = 12.69081807 Teratons
GPE 1: 7.4459568e+13 meters * 1500 * 1060 * 9.8m/s^2 * 1500 (height, in this case the sea's elevation above it's bottom) = 415.9520753 Teratons
GPE 2: 7.4459568e+13 meters * 1500 * 1060 * 9.8m/s^2 * 400,000 (height, the Admin bleeding/flooding from halfway up the Floor) = 110.9205534 Petatons

This all kind of assumes a bit, and gets either low values or in the last one's case- a seriously high value compared to the Admin's Floor Destruction calc

A more comparable output is how Enryu and the Administrator's clash destroyed all the buildings, seas, and mountains- taking that middle term and assuming the water got boiled away in their clash, a basic vaporization calc yields
  • 4390000 cubic kilometers (volume of the Mediterranean) *10^9 (cubic meters per km3) *10^6 (cubic centimeters per m3r) * 2575 (joules per cm3) = 2.7 Petatons
And both Enryu and the Admin get this since it happened more than once
 
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ElajRuengies said:
A more comparable output is how Enryu and the Administrator's clash destroyed all the buildings, seas, and mountains- taking that middle term and assuming the water got boiled away in their clash, a basic vaporization calc yields
  • 4390000 cubic kilometers (volume of the Mediterranean) *10^9 (cubic meters per km3) *10^6 (cubic centimeters per m3r) * 2575 (joules per cm3) = 2.7 Petatons
And both Enryu and the Admin get this since it happened more than once
Click to expand...

You shouldn't count the oceans in this calc? I remember that the Middle Area was big enough to contain an ocean within it and overall it is smaller in comparison to the Outer Towerm and the Inner Tower should likely count one too

You can see this statement in the chapter 56 of the Season 2
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
You shouldn't count the oceans in this calc? I remember that the Middle Area was big enough to contain an ocean within it and overall it is smaller in comparison to the Outer Towerm and the Inner Tower should likely count one too

You can see this statement in the chapter 56 of the Season 2
Click to expand...
Yeah but geography varies wildly between Floors, so it's unknown if the 43rd had an ocean/oceans. (Plus, Garam didn't say that oceans were destroyed, she said that seas were destroyed.)

With that being said, a "sea" can mean an ocean in casual speak, so for completion's sake, here's another vaporization calc using the smallest oceans, the Artic Ocean and Southern Ocean. (At ~1.5 and ~2 times the size of the US, it's plausible there can be oceans this size in a Floor. The Indian, Atlantic, and Pacific however, would take up almost all/more space than an entire Floor has)
  • Artic: 18750000 * 10^9 * 10^6 * 2575 = 12.3551 Petatons
  • Southern: 71800000 * 10^9 *10^6 * 2575 = 44.18857553 Petatons
(The Southern Ocean is much deeper on average than the Artic despite not being much bigger, hence the greater volume)
 
ElajRuengies said:
(Plus, Garam didn't say that oceans were destroyed, she said that seas were destroyed.)
Click to expand...
Look, I read the ToG translations that are translated directly from Korean to the language in my country of origin (and their translations are far, far better than LINE's overall), and the translation staff is fluent in the Korean language, so it is safe that I can confirm that during the speeches of Garam on the destructive battle between Enryu and the 43rd Administrator is actually like this: "During their clash, all the mountains, oceans and buildings of this floor were destroyed..." if translated from the language of my home country into the English
 
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Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
Look, I read the ToG translations that are translated directly from Korean to the language in my country of origin (and their translations are far, far better than LINE's overall), and the translation staff is fluent in the Korean language, so it is safe that I can confirm that during the speeches of Garam on the destructive battle between Enryu and the 43rd Administrator is actually like this: "During their clash, all the mountains, oceans and buildings of this floor were destroyed..." if translated from the language of my home country into the English
Click to expand...

After double checking (the syllable blocks used could mean either sea or ocean(s), and "sea" itself can refer to the oceans so fair enough), it looks like don't have any reason to doubt you, in which case either of the ocean boiler outputs works for me (although in a blog proper I'll probably have to also account for the buildings and mountains being destroyed, despite that being negligible)

This also means that even Low-End 1% Enryu is more than twice as powerful as Partial Release Khel Hellam
 
Will you use oceans boiling output or an ocean boiling output? Since just one area of the Tower (Middle Area) is big enough to contain an ocean within it and very likely the Inner Tower and Outer Tower should have one too

Also, the Administrators and Enryu will scale to the total output or half of it? Since their battle caused it
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
Will you use oceans boiling output or an ocean boiling output? Since just one area of the Tower (Middle Area) is big enough to contain an ocean within it

Also, the Administrators and Enryu will scale to the total output or half of it?
Click to expand...
Honestly it almost doesn't matter; even using a singular low-end (boiling one Artic Ocean) and dividing it in two, Enryu and the Admin will still be Multi-Continent level (6.1775 Petatons each).

With that being said, since two beings battled I'll divide the result in half, while having different ends for 1 Ocean or 2 Oceans. I'll also use the Southern Ocean because the Artic Ocean is incredibly shallow on average (The Southern Ocean is 4-5 kilometers deep on average, which is normal for an ocean, while the Artic Ocean is only 900 meters deep on average, which is shallower than the Mediterranean)
 
Yes, I know that the result would be High 6-A regardless of whether it was one, two or three oceans used in the calc. But I just want to be as consistent as possible in relation to the calcs and what was said by Garam in the story

Ok

It's kinda sad that only two characters (who only fight off-screen 90% of the time) who will be the only ones who will scale to this, although that may change in the future if Enryu faces the Family Heads and an combined attack of three or four of them match Enryu's power
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
Yes, I know that the result would be High 6-A regardless of whether it was one, two or three oceans used in the calc. But I just want to be as consistent as possible in relation to the calcs and what was said by Garam in the story

Ok

It's kinda sad that only two characters (who only fight off-screen 90% of the time) who will be the only ones who will scale to this, although that may change in the future if Enryu faces the Family Heads and an combined attack of three or four of them match Enryu's power
Click to expand...
Honestly, I can see the Top Tiers being upgraded in the future given how the current 100% Urek w/ Shinsoo output is really just 100% of that specific jab, and named techniques are way stronger than normal attacks.

Eurasia Blossom's ability to "instantly kill 99% of the population by just accelerating the Shinsoo around." lines up almost perfectly with the [20 psi of Overpressure/99% fatality] rule for explosion calcs, meaning, if population means population of a Floor, she could scale to the current Admin calc.

Of course, only the future will tell how this will go
 
I mean, I can see and likely agree with the Family Heads, Zahard and Urek scaling to the calc of Administrators destroying a floor.

Since the calc is something that Administrators could easily and do not demonstrate their true power and the fact the Eurasia Blossom's overall backstory was not retconned like Yama's, and her capacities as a Wave Controller do not appear to be exaggerated or very out of the standard compared to the other blogs of her Family Heads peers. Besides that Urek's finger attack was very casual, it wasn't even a normal blow
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
It looks good for me at least. In your opinion, what End should be used? Since I am not a specialist at calculations
Click to expand...
Probably not the High End given how that would make ~88.5% of the 43rd Floor's area water, which is a bit much (although it's not impossible). Either the Mid or Low End looks fine to me.
Since the calc is something that Administrators could easily and do not demonstrate their true power and the fact the Eurasia Blossom's overall backstory was not retconned like Yama's, and her capacities as a Wave Controller do not appear to be exaggerated or very out of the standard compared to the other blogs of her Family Heads peers. Besides that Urek's finger attack was very casual, it wasn't even a normal blow
Click to expand...
The only problem I can see with it is that the [99% fatality shinsoo control thing] comes from a character profile that is 10 years old. While this in-it-of-itself is not a problem, the thing is that Urek's Lightspeed attack was rejected for that same reason, so accepting Eurasia's ability but rejecting Urek's despite coming from the same dated source looks like cherry picking.
 
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