Top 15 Strongest Non-Smurfs for Every Tier Continuation

[Livinmeme]

Uriel killed Uriel? Uriels own profile verbatim says mid godly so what's up with that?

I'll drop this because of obvious reasons but PLEASE someone fix Uriels profile. The formatting is unreadable, layers just outright aren't listed anywhere, and stuff like this seems to contradict itself. The profile seems completely unusable for anyone not familiar with the verse which kinda defeats the point of the profile .

I was referrring to Dark scheinder (which canonically beat Uriel ass...Twice)

 

[Arkenis]

You mean this one? I genuinely can't understand wtf is going on in it ngl. It doesn't say what gives how many layers of what resistance

Ahh yes

Magic: Obviously

that explains it.

 

[Phsccarvalho]

Mujins should be type 3 concept as well but idk how the types work on the wiki. Hence why I asked how Uriels CM works but didn't get an answer

If it is not type 1 then Mujin cannot resist.

The madness seems to be a result of Fear and Mujin has layered resistance to fear manip (my lazy ass just didn't make a blog for it yet).

Although idk how is madness manip is treated on the wiki, and GoH fear might count for madness hax as well, but I didn't have time for that yet.

It doesn't matter.

Resisting fear doesn't make you resist madness and neither does the opposite.

So no matter how many layers of fear resistance Mujin has, he will go crazy.

 

[DavidTPPM]

I was referrring to Dark scheinder (which canonically beat Uriel ass...Twice)

Yeah then he should be on the list instead of him…
Or as you said, just make it so the spot says Bastard characters in general so they're interchangeable

 

[DavidTPPM]

Resisting fear doesn't make you resist madness and neither does the opposite.

So no matter how many layers of fear resistance Mujin has, he will go crazy.

I genuinely don't understand how the wiki treats madness manip ngl. 99% of the time I see madness manip it just like the victim goes mad out of fear, but somehow they're treated as 2 completely separate things

 

[DaReaperMan]

I genuinely don't understand how the wiki treats madness manip ngl. 99% of the time I see madness manip it just like the victim goes mad out of fear, but somehow they're treated as 2 completely separate things

Here's the thing.

Sometimes it happens through plain mind Manipulation, sometimes it happens through fear, sometimes it's just "goes mad", etc etc etc.

Fear is NOT the only cause of madness in fiction and to say otherwise is plain foolish.

 

[Mizuki67]

Isn't the creator being in 2nd spot questionable

 

[Robo432343]

The profile seems completely unusable for anyone not familiar with the verse which kinda defeats the point of the profile .

bro im not familiar with the verse but i can understand the profiles just fine

also Mujin should at least be above asura and nipponverse characters

 

[deonment]

Doesn't that make him a smurf then ?

No

layers just outright aren't listed anywhere

Layers don't need to be listed, if people don't want to read thats on them

 

[Arkenis]

Are all these layers accepted?

 

[Robo432343]

Are all these layers accepted?

yes, on the hax layer thread

 

[DavidTPPM]

Here's the thing.

Sometimes it happens through plain mind Manipulation, sometimes it happens through fear, sometimes it's just "goes mad", etc etc etc.

Fear is NOT the only cause of madness in fiction and to say otherwise is plain foolish.

Yeah I understand. Obviously making someone go mad through something like mind hax or whatever is different from just being scary.

But like the justification on Uriels profile is literally "his fight induced terror" with a panel of someone being scared. Yet it's somehow madness manip and not fear manip. When terror is by definition extreme fear.

 

[DavidTPPM]

bro im not familiar with the verse but i can understand the profiles just fine

Suuure

also Mujin should at least be above asura and nipponverse characters

No idea about that. I didn't read through the profiles yet

Layers don't need to be listed, if people don't want to read thats on them

What? That's like saying "abilities and stats don't need to be listed, if people don't want to read the series that's on them"…
The point of a profile is for people to have an idea of what the characters can do without doing some hard-core extensive research.

The layers should be at least easy to find and understand. They're often times even more important than stats which are on the profiles.

 

[Arkenis]

But like the justification on Uriels profile is literally "his fight induced terror" with a panel of someone being scared. Yet it's somehow madness manip and not fear manip. When terror is by definition extreme fear.

No you're definitely ignoring the rest that's said.

"An incommensurable rage and sadness. The terror has taken over everyone and everything. The balance has disappeared"

The rage and sadness are unable to be measured by regular standards, so its already something beyond basic rage and sadness. It's then spreading all over the Earth, causing the balance of it to disappear. I don't know anything about Bastard!! but that don't sound like regular fear manip lol

 

[Rakih_Elyan]

Cui Heng should share the same spot as Gu Taxian in 2-A and be the sole being in the 1st of 2-B due to his TD type 2 and NEP type 2 and his 8 layers of Hax in his 2-B keys.

BUMPING

 

[Arkenis]

BUMPING

Just had a stroke soon as I read "TD type 2 and NEP type 2" then you stacked on 8 layers.

 

[Rakih_Elyan]

Just had a stroke soon as I read "TD type 2 and NEP type 2" then you stacked on 8 layers.

His layers is on invul and shit lol, not his TD and NEP.

 

[DavidTPPM]

No you're definitely ignoring the rest that's said.

"An incommensurable rage and sadness. The terror has taken over everyone and everything. The balance has disappeared"

The rage and sadness are unable to be measured by regular standards, so its already something beyond basic rage and sadness. It's then spreading all over the Earth, causing the balance of it to disappear. I don't know anything about Bastard!! but that don't sound like regular fear manip lol

Yeah so their fight made people afraid, angry, and sad. That doesn't even sound like hax.

If I were to hijack a plane and were to fly it into a kindergarten I'm pretty sure the passengers would also feel rage, sadness, and fear. Doesn't give me some special "madness manipulation"

 

[Robo432343]

madness hax is too controversial to be a wincon rn

Uriel still has a bunch of other layered and conceptual hax that he can use to stomp

 

[DavidTPPM]

madness hax is too controversial to be a wincon rn

Uriel still has a bunch of other layered and conceptual hax that he can use to stomp

Yeah, at this point I'm just ranting about the existence of madness manip in general

 

[Robo432343]

Chen Qi shouldn't be number 1 for 3-A anymore
the person who created Chen Qi's profile said he's fine with Lindon and Satan being above Chen Qi because the verses hax has not been evaluated yet so they layer stomp
it should be:
1. Wei Shi Lindon
2. Satan
3. Chen Qi

 

[Deceived3596]

I have a question. He's right under 6. Shadow Man/JJK (Gojo, Sukuna)

I'm looking at his profile and it seems he stomps all of them, would it be fine to put him above them?

Sure. I don't have any complaints about him being higher on the list.

 

[Mizuki67]

the likes of kamen rider, should be a a worthy victim of chloe, so....that's basically relates to the other characters of this verse that is on her level, like ramiris, rimuru etc

 

[LazerDim8000]

Tensei Slime characters shouldn't be that high for 2c. DMC top tiers like mundus, vergil, and dante have nine layers of passive madness hax, and characters from anima gate characters(not just mundus) have 16 layers of hax and tied with touhou characters.

 

[Mizuki67]

Tensei Slime characters shouldn't be that high for 2c. DMC top tiers like mundus, vergil, and dante have nine layers of passive madness hax, and characters from anima gate characters(not just mundus) have 16 layers of hax and tied with touhou characters.

They still dont have 2-A range so sorry

 

[Mizuki67]

also slime have passive 6 layers of CM1 so cry

 

[LazerDim8000]

also slime have passive 6 layers of CM1 so cry

That was most definitely not accepted I know of only 1-2

 

[LazerDim8000]

They still dont have 2-A range so sorry

That 2a range is specifically for their immortality, which is practically useless when characters from DMC are passively inducing madness upon them, a notable win con that would likely lead to them committing suicide. As for characters from anima gate, magic for beings who are gnosis 35 and above is 10-16 layers, so even basic death hax generated by a gnosis 35 would screw them over.

 

[Mizuki67]

That 2a range is specifically for their immortality, which is practically useless when characters from DMC are passively inducing madness upon them, a notable win con that would likely lead to them committing suicide. As for characters from anima gate, magic for beings who are gnosis 35 and above is 10-16 layers, so even basic death hax generated by a gnosis 35 would screw them over.

Open a vsthread, let's play. I don't talk too much

 

[LazerDim8000]

Nah It'll be redundant on my end to make a stomp match. Besides, this match was made not too long ago. https://vsbattles.com/threads/baal-vs-rimuru.164957/

 

[Deceived3596]

Prime Soul King for a free spot in Low 2-C. I believe he can be higher on the list, but I don't feel like debating about it right now. I'm not entirely sure about 3-B and 3-A though as I don't know if Soul King's Almighty is still considered as 4-D or not. I know its range was downgraded, but I'm not sure if its dimensionality was downgraded alongside it.

Brethren Moons for a free spot in 5-C. I think they should be capable of defeating Doom with their abilities, but like before, I don't feel like having that debate right now.

 

[Mizuki67]

Nah It'll be redundant on my end to make a stomp match. Besides, this match was made not too long ago. https://vsbattles.com/threads/baal-vs-rimuru.164957/

Then don't bother me if you cant make a thread, cope with the L you get

 

[Mizuki67]

@Arkenis they should be removed from 7, don't think its a good idea for a verse to appear twice in the list

 

[Arkenis]

@Arkenis they should be removed from 7, don't think its a good idea for a verse to appear twice in the list

Who? And do they appear in the same tier?

 

[Mizuki67]

Who? And do they appear in the same tier?

Yes they appear in 2-C, 4 and 7 (correct one is 4)
also we should remove that Li quey Chinese guy from the list, he have no supporters plus he have justified abilities, this is just a suggestion @Rakih_Elyan is an expert in this, lets know what you think

 

[LazerDim8000]

Then don't bother me if you cant make a thread, cope with the L you get

I mean you’re free to make one but I’ve already explained how it’s gonna go.

 

[Mizuki67]

I mean you’re free to make one but I’ve already explained how it’s gonna go.

I am not the one who have a problem with our placing so i am not obligated to create a thread, YOU ARE, if you have issues with a verse placing then YOU should solve the problem

 

[LazerDim8000]

In the strongest characters thread, anima characters are tied with touhou characters at number 5, dmc guys have multiple layers of passive madness hax accepted as of recently that would hinder any kind of action of their opponent 2a immortality or not . You’re arguing something that’s pretty clear.

 

[deonment]

What? That's like saying "abilities and stats don't need to be listed, if people don't want to read the series that's on them"…
The point of a profile is for people to have an idea of what the characters can do without doing some hard-core extensive research.

The layers should be at least easy to find and understand. They're often times even more important than stats which are on the profiles.

No, what, layers are something external to the indexing of a profile, sure you can choose to include it, but there is no need to, and no it is no way comparable to not listing justifications or stats, layers are external to the justifications and only come up in matches, we index first, debate second

And they are, most profiles will just include them in their justifications or on a verse page but will never explicitly say it because that shit breaks the flow of reading, so once again, if people don't want to read, that's on them

 

[Flashlight237]

GOnna toss in Maple for 9-A (maybe 8-A): https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Maple_(BOFURI)

Her defenses are perhaps the most broken for her tier. Prior to Devour being limited to 10 uses a day, the technique can be used to absorb literally anything that comes her way. Physical attacks, magic, projectiles, anything that hits her wouldn't do jack to her. This isn't even mentioning all of Maple's other abilities.