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Tier 1 Review Thread

The justifications seem fine, if basic.
 
Supreme Chaos' justification is High 2-A, not Low 1-C.

@Ovens Sorry this is late.

  • Phoenix: Existing beyond a basic High 1-B structure isn't 1-A. Make it more clear that it's metaphysical transcendence.
  • Luxzes and Mako seem fine.
 
@Promestein the infinity map seems 5 dimensional to me why wont Supreme Chaos be 6 dimensional since he is from an even higher dimension?

I wont argue if the stats really aren't justified but I have went over the justification a couple of times already and can't see any problem.
 
Infinite universes are 2-A. Infinite sets of infinite universes is still 2-A, just a higher degree of 2-A. Transcending them is High 2-A.
 
Here's a description for the most powerful character in the verse

"He is beyond what even we (boundary gods) dare imagine, the Grand Design is everything we know but, it isn't everything there is. beyond the Grand Design lies a higher level of existence, and beyond that, yet another. There comes a point when such a hierarchy must come to a conclusion, but when do we reach this point? when the laws of science say so'?, when the laws of logic says so? or, when even the philosophers dont dare to dream about it! there must be a limit. But, the structure created by the True God doesn't concern itself with such restrictions, it keeps going till infinity. Even if our power was multiplied by infinity, we wont even reach the next level of existence, for our abilitiy to influence that plane is non existent to begin with, we will never have a place there. The scariest thing, this structure is, but a mere part of his existence."

Will he qualify for tier 1? if so which level of tier 1?
 
Well, it depends how big the Grand Design is.

@Laciel The explanation for him and Mania should be more complex and clearly metaphysical in nature than just "beyond dimensions."
 
The Grand Design is just three realms in the same level of existence as the Infinity Map, I dont get why it's magnitude is relevant since it's on the lower rungs of the dimensional hierarchy.

Another problem i have with the infinity map being 2-A is that i have found articles about Dimensional theory and according to it, the space that contains all universes with different starting points lies in a higher dimensional plane than the space that contains all universes with the same starting point.
 
Promestein said:
@Laciel The explanation for him and Mania should be more complex and clearly metaphysical in nature than just "beyond dimensions."
Click to expand...
I've changed Mania's explanation to 'simultaneously embodies and transcends his World Fruit, which are established to have infinite higher levels of existence'

Mattias's justification is that the nature of his existence lets him comprehend the nature of higher levels of existence and dimensional transcendence existences, and then he developed magic that allowed him to affect these things, and his feat is that he defeated Mania in the Dreamlands.
 
@Andytrenom Well, the Grand Design is 2-A, then, and this transcending figure would be At least Low 1-C.

@Laciel Okay.

@Seed I don't think a Tier 0 can give up their powers.
 
@Prom. I heavily respect your opinions Prom, especially regarding this type of conversation. My only question is why can't they ? It would be one thing if their powers were given to another without consent, which would deny their Omnipotence in the first place, but this is instance is not that way at all. Thank you for responding.
 
@Ovens TPoL is fine.

@Seed Omnipotence paradox. I don't have the best grasp on metaphysics or transduality but Tier 0's don't start or stop being Tier 0, they're always Tier 0
 
sorry for entering your conversation, but yes and no? Saying that it can't denies their Omnipotence. but even if a Tier 0 were to give their power it would still be tier 0. reason i that a tier 0 will aways be allowed to do whatever it desires. for example since it transcendes logic, you really can't say. remeber being Tier 0 means you can do whatever you want without being limited to logic, probability, destiny, etc.... he can be a non Tier 0 while being a Tier 0. because....... Logic? Again sorry for entering this conversation.
 
You're either Tier 0 forever and ever beyond our understanding of time and the word forever or you're not Tier 0

A Tier 0 "giving power" to a lesser being is basically just assimilating them into a transcendent, eldritch being beyond all logic.
 
if a tier zero can defie all logic then shouldnt they be able to defied logic that stops them from giving there power to others?
 
Here is the problem Tier 0's have. They are never logical in the first place .They are beyond all possible limitations. Saying she cannot do so because of her being an tier 0 does not make any sense. An assumption that Hitomi was never Omnipotent based on such small evidence is not wise in any way. The giving away of an Omnipotent's/Tier 0's power to an lesser being has never happened in any offical continuity . All of this statements are based off of general opinions, based on theorys such as Omnipotence Paradox, as is my own. I fail to see exactly how this contradicts Hitomi being an tier 0 anyways . An true contradiction of beign an true tier 0 is if she destroyed her own powers, which heavily contradicts her powers. Using Darkmon's same satement, i can say that due to tier 0's being able to defy all logic, they can give away their powers willingly. There is no reason whatsoever why they can or cannot, otherwise your giving them an limitation they do not have. However, i shall rest, and completely take out that bit about HItomi doing that, if it makes you all better. Sorry about that little rant.
 
@Seed

A Tier 0 cannot give away their powers, and cannot make someone else Tier 0.If Character X is truely Tier 0, and they give away their powers to character Y, the moment they desire it, they can immediately regain said powers, and Character Y can do nothing to stop them, which is a limitation, and Character Y was never Tier 0. And if Character Y can stop them from regaining their powers, then Character X was never Tier 0 to begin with
 
Put it another way. Can Hitomi immediately regain their power and Crying Child cannot stop her? If so, Hitomi is the true Tier 0, and Crying Child is not. If Hitomi cannot immediately regain her power, she never was a Tier 0 to begin with, and seeing as the Crying Child has her power, its still questionable whether Crying Child is Tier 0.

If you want the Crying Child to be your Tier 0, just find some other way to make them that. Maybe they had a self-imposed mental block and Hitomi was just pretending/incorrectly believed herself to be the Tier 0. But Tier 0s making other people into Tier 0s does not make sense
 
Okay. Okay. I'll stop, okay ? It is not in my best interest to stir this up any further. Anyways, I can easily retcon things so that Hitomi was never an tier 0 in the first place, just an incredibly powerful High 1-A , and T.C.C to be the original Tier 0 of both Wonderlands & Worlds' Beyond. In fact, i will just do that. It is easier on my end, and can be explained easier than this. I'l ex[lain that she boasted about her powers to protect the true tier 0, or something along thoses lines. I'll change each of the Unknowns to High 1-A , to gauge her power better.
 
Fusing into one entity is about the only way someone could "become" a Tier 0, but even then they would be merging into an already existing entity, and its debatable as to whether they would keep their own mind, especially if the T-0 is also omniscient or omnipresent
 
I am thinking of using a cosmology based off of the Umineko verse. In my verse, existence will comprise of an infinite number of existential levels and each existential level would contain 4 higher dimensional planes, Supreme Chaos would be 8 dimensional for being the strongest entity in the second existential level, alongside Supreme Order and Fable Man. Would this work?
 
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