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Spatial dimensions are mathematicsSeeing something as illusion isn't mathematics?
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Spatial dimensions are mathematicsSeeing something as illusion isn't mathematics?
Then that would stay as is. But Gates would be upgraded if i understand the new tiering system correctly.Spatial dimensions are mathematics
My attention just to the lack ofBecause it's not a null set.
The vacuaa at the very least should be upgraded imoThen that would stay as is. But Gates would be upgraded if i understand the new tiering system correctly.
That would make even Umr At Tawil and other Ancient Ones tier 0.The vacuaa at the very least should be upgraded imo
Now all makes sense
Tier 01-A wukong.
A monkey king solo all of your verse.
Yeah methinks Angled Space would be a chain of R>F since Space & Time are just illusions and nonexistent actually as they are imperfect manifestations of Angled Space.It does however, have infinite hierarchy of spatial dimensions, higher one views the lower one as infinitesimal in comparison and then it has infinite gates the higher views the lower one as illusion or "imperfection" or even as Shadow.
I don't think that's what Ultima is proposing.1-A Gandalf... neat.
Correct.Like i say i dont think R>F is equal to nonexistence. Dream even if it just illusion it still exist, in thought or mental meaning. Nonexistence in other hand is literally not exist even in thought or mind, you cannot even think about that
I mean what is nonexistence??? Is it black, a darkness??? Then it not nonexistence at all
So the "atribute" of nonexistence is not equal to the atribute of fiction. Like from the very fundamental atribute of existence not equal to the atribute of reality
The thread in simple terms:Bruh i dont know where you got 2D is not lacking of volume, 2D is 2D because it have no volume, the volume is 0
Even DT say 4D is strecth in 5D space, but the volume is still 0, and cannot be tiered
In fact, the R>F relationship that Ultima wants to make works like "real-unreal" or "something-nothing".Like i say i dont think R>F is equal to nonexistence. Dream even if it just illusion it still exist, in thought or mental meaning. Nonexistence in other hand is literally not exist even in thought or mind, you cannot even think about that
I mean what is nonexistence??? Is it black, a darkness??? Then it not nonexistence at all
So the "atribute" of nonexistence is not equal to the atribute of fiction. Like from the very fundamental atribute of existence not equal to the atribute of reality
Making our own world example, 2-D space should exist as a fundamental part of reality, we just can't perceive it. It is more extreme, but you can compare this situation to how we see time always going forward because of our perception of entropy in the visible world, but in microscopic physics time actually has a neutral direction.The thread in simple terms:
Ideal scenarios of R>F where there are no anti-feats and there is an unquestionable Reality to Fiction transcendence are effectively a higher tier than any dimensional stacking.
This is factual because a lesser dimension only has the value of zero in a higher dimensional space, while a fiction would have a value of zero in every possible space and level of reality.
Therefore if you can see dimensional space as fiction you effectively are seeing any structure that follows dimensional guidelines, no matter how many values are there, as fake and equal to 0 in your reality.
While this may be true, it should be limited only by the space and dimensionality available in your verse. If the existence of at most the 5th dimension is shown in the verse, the "quality of all dimensions" mentioned in that verse is only the part up to the 5th dimension, because besides the physical 5th dimension, there are even higher theoretical dimensions that you think of. The beings that we can imagine and model are still within the boundaries of the 5th dimension.Ideal scenarios of R>F where there are no anti-feats and there is an unquestionable Reality to Fiction transcendence are effectively a higher tier than any dimensional stacking.
This is factual because a lesser dimension only has the value of zero in a higher dimensional space, while a fiction would have a value of zero in every possible space and level of reality.
Therefore if you can see dimensional space as fiction you effectively are seeing any structure that follows dimensional guidelines, no matter how many values are there, as fake and equal to 0 in your reality.
Then i dont think "R>F" is good word for that. Seeing as dream is R>F by it meaning, but yeah not nonexistence. I just think we can create some superiority criteria beyond "R>F" for something that literally perceive the whole world as nonexistence to it existenceIn fact, the R>F relationship that Ultima wants to make works like "real-unreal" or "something-nothing".
According to current R>F standards, many characters only get from "seeing books or dream" nonsense, but, according to this, may change and many characters may lose their R>F.
0 is same value in every dimensional space. So there are no lower D is only have 0 in higher dimension and fiction is 0 in every possible dimensionThe thread in simple terms:
Ideal scenarios of R>F where there are no anti-feats and there is an unquestionable Reality to Fiction transcendence are effectively a higher tier than any dimensional stacking.
This is factual because a lesser dimension only has the value of zero in a higher dimensional space, while a fiction would have a value of zero in every possible space and level of reality.
Therefore if you can see dimensional space as fiction you effectively are seeing any structure that follows dimensional guidelines, no matter how many values are there, as fake and equal to 0 in your reality.
When one thinks of infinity does that mean they have filled up infinite space with their thoughts?And in fact fiction is not 0 value, it not nothing. It still have value in mind or thought, it not nonexistence
That's an interesting observation! For me, that would depend on how the evaluated work treats its higher dimensions. If they function under similar principles, following the standard 4-D model of Space-Time (ergo, we are informed about them being infinitely higher spaces but otherwise following similar rules in a higher layer of space) then I think R>F transcendence is superior, no matter how many layers are stacked.While this may be true, it should be limited only by the space and dimensionality available in your verse. If the existence of at most the 5th dimension is shown in the verse, the "quality of all dimensions" mentioned in that verse is only the part up to the 5th dimension, because besides the physical 5th dimension, there are even higher theoretical dimensions that you think of. The beings that we can imagine and model are still within the boundaries of the 5th dimension.
You are modeling with dimensions, so even if it is a higher dimension that you can imagine, 1000D, you will actually still imagine and model it within the dimensionality that cosmology limits you, that is, within the boundaries of the 5th dimension.
To give an example, we humans can only model 4-dimensional or higher-dimensional cubes in the 3rd dimension, within the boundaries of the 3rd dimension.
Even though we say "there are higher dimensions" and model them, they still cannot go beyond the 3rd dimension, there is always the same thing within the all concepts of dimensions
In short, we cannot go beyond the dimension shown in the verse. If we do this, we will have made NLF.
What do you even mean???When one thinks of infinity does that mean they have filled up infinite space with their thoughts?
Fiction is something that our brain tricks us into thinking is there but when you think about it, it's not. The brain is piecing together a variety of real information to make up something that does not exist. A comic page is in reality paint, words and paper not actual characters seen inside. From a 3-D model, 2-D space would only have a value of zero in Height/Depth. Fiction would have a value of zero in all three aspects of length, width and height/depth.0 is same value in every dimensional space. So there are no lower D is only have 0 in higher dimension and fiction is 0 in every possible dimension
And in fact fiction is not 0 value, it not nothing. It still have value in mind or thought, it not nonexistence
For example, you imagined yourself eating pineapple on pizza. Does that mean you ate pineapple on pizza?What do you even mean???
Is infinity is not exist???
Which then creates a paradox.A fiction meanwhile, no matter its complexity, does not exist no matter the level of reality that we try and look at. It is a fabrication and no matter how elaborate a fabrication is made it remains a fabrication in all layers of reality.
Noosphere uses a lot of mathematical concepts, but i'm not sure how that's going to be impacted because they aren't physical in the first place.i wonder what SCP will be downgraded to
As Ultimate explained in the thread, dimensional quality is valid to any number of dimensions, because dimensions can be generalized as such and their quality doesn't change with a higher number of dimensions (It's just a 90º degree rotation of the same dimension in a way that is perpendicular to the other dimensions, it's not something of different quality as the basic nature remains the same, all n-dimensions are the same 1-dimensional lines).While this may be true, it should be limited only by the space and dimensionality available in your verse. If the existence of at most the 5th dimension is shown in the verse, the "quality of all dimensions" mentioned in that verse is only the part up to the 5th dimension, because besides the physical 5th dimension, there are even higher theoretical dimensions that you think of. The beings that we can imagine and model are still within the boundaries of the 5th dimension.
In short, we cannot go beyond the dimension shown in the verse. If we do this, we will have made NLF. That's why " being beyond the all concepts of dimensions" is just give you +1
It would be real to us from a dimensional perspective, but to these presumed characters of a higher state of being, it would relegate the structure of dimensional space to the ranks of fiction. I don't think there is a paradox, simply a scenario where all values of dimensions are made irrelevant. The tiering comes from the observers being powerful enough to treat something that under real world principles should be a scale in the way that we with the same real world scale treat actual fiction.Which then creates a paradox.
The fabrication doesn’t exist, isn’t real, has a value of nothing, but it is still tiered. And the Real layer’s tier is dependent on the tier of the fabrication.
This new proposed system requires us to view the lower layers as nothing but at the same time having a value that can be tiered.
Math characters crying right now
But to do this is to go beyond the dimensions that the verse shows us. This is where I disagreed with Ultima because the dimensions that the verse shows us are what we actually have and here we can call "the quality of dimensions", because in the verse, the existence of other dimensions (higher dimensions) has never been shown to us and it would be very unhealthy to "assume" that they exist when their existence is not known. .As Ultimate explained in the thread, dimensional quality is valid to any number of dimensions, because dimensions can be generalized as such and their quality doesn't change with a higher number of dimensions (It's just a 90º degree rotation of the same dimension in a way that is perpendicular to the other dimensions, it's not something of different quality as the basic nature remains the same, all n-dimensions are the same 1-dimensional lines).
If you are above all dimensions in a 4-dimensional setting, stating that it exists limited to a possible 5th dimension implies it's not beyond dimensions as a quality. It's like saying that something is beyond age, but just adding one year to the oldest thing in the universe, is just giving it age, not something that is really beyond age.
Basically, solving qualitative superiority using quantitative superiority is not using the quality, just assuming that the quantitative is a valid interpretation to it. And of course, there are a lot of universes that do this kind of thing (Like how many times something that is 5th-dimensional is stated to be beyond time and space in stuff like Marvel and DC), but just because franchises often do this kind of correlation doesn't mean that our systems need to just follow what they do. Instead they should be open to both verses that generalize the two as equal and also those that don't. All that the changes Ultima wants to make is accepting the logic of the difference between qualitative and quantitative and allowing franchises that do the correct approach a ranting that better fits their universes.
Ahhhh man, Low 1-C upgrade attempts came to my mind due to R>F and other reasons.Shinra solos math fodders
That's me in a nutshell.
LotR is 5-D due to qualitative superiority over the main universe.I don't think that's what Ultima is proposing.
LOTR stays unimpacted by this.
I know.LotR is 5-D due to qualitative superiority over the main universe.
Pretty sure it would qualify for 1-A due to R>FI know.