Super Shenron: The Dragon Who 'Possibly' got buffed from an omniscient being.

[StrymULTRA]

The interview was stated many years ago, back in like 2018. I do not remember the exact source, but Super Shenron can grant wishes that even include the death of Zeno, the destruction of all existence, or even the death of Super Shenron himself.

DDM no offense but this sounds absurdly unprofessional. You're basically making an extraordinary claim like this, without backing with a source, let alone the extraordinary evidence needed.

 

[CelestialVortex01]

Regardless, Zuno's statement should be more than enough that he's atleast comparable to Zeno if not superior

 

[Huesito88]

DDM no offense but this sounds absurdly unprofessional. You're basically making an extraordinary claim like this, without backing with a source, let alone the extraordinary evidence needed.

DDM is only saying he recalls hearing of it not that he agrees because of it

 

[Sus]

if that statement exists it'd be crazy ngl

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I think it'd be better to find the source first before using it as a reason to vote IMO

I agree we should find and source it before taking any action; and given that's what the OP is proposing. It should be the OP's job to find the source. But I am allowed to simply state a vague memory. I do not have time to go over everything.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

@AizenBankai09 great job here, i definitely agree with that, Zeno can't handle reality manipulation.

 

[StrymULTRA]

if that statement exists it'd be crazy ngl

It's not the 1st time when fake interviews/guidebooks are made tbh

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I agree we should find and source it before taking any action; and given that's what the OP is proposing. It should be the OP's job to find the source. But I am allowed to simply state a vague memory. I do not have time to go over everything.

I have this guide that is licensed by Toei, saying that he can make any wish without any restrictions.

Abilities: He can fulfill any wish made of him in the ancient language of the gods, without any restrictions, except for the fact that only one wish can be made at a time.

 

[Eikichi_Sensei]

The other arguments were also used in that link such as:

"He has no limitation, yet it is said that no one can beat Zeno, aka Super Shenron would have a limitation, that being Zeno, aka his "no limitation" stated is invalid as he has a limitation"

"It is said that "no one can beat Zeno" " No one is above him" "No one can beat him no matter what"
but if Super shenron truly has "no limits" then he could easily just beat zeno by wishing "defeat Zeno in a fight" which by statements is not a possible thing"

"If you really want to use the "no limits" as an argument for him being low 1-C, you would have to remove the statements from zeno being the strongest and unbeatable, since one would contradict the other"

"Someone wishes to him "i wish you you to beat Zeno in a fight" either way, the statement of "doing anything" applies to super shenron, and the statement isn't "no one can threat Zeno" it is "no one can beat Zeno no matter what" so Super shenron doing anything would contradict that, as defeating Zeno is part of "anything"

 

[CelestialVortex01]

I agree we should find and source it before taking any action; and given that's what the OP is proposing. It should be the OP's job to find the source. But I am allowed to simply state a vague memory. I do not have time to go over everything.

Alright so the other statements aren't valid enough?

 

[Sus]

It's not the 1st time when fake interviews/guidebooks are made tbh

true, that's why i said if

 

[Killerdrone123]

Based on zuno statement who is a nigh omniscient being who said that ss can do anything not to mention the fact same thing was repeated by g.p and zeno(the guy who can actually erase 5d timelines)couldn't we give atleast a possible rating

 

[RoninSlayer200]

Based on zuno statement who is a nigh omniscient being who said that ss can do anything not to mention the fact same thing was repeated by g.p and zeno(the guy who can actually erase 5d timelines)couldn't we give atleast a possible rating

i think we need to find their statements for evidence

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I don't have a problem with scaling SS's wish granting ability to Zeno, but I don't think you can say for certain all applications of Zeno's erasure are 5D in potency and I don't think a 2-C feat makes SS low 1-C.

Pretty much my thoughts as well.

If the scan DDM is referencing can be found, then I can agree with a direct Low 1-C upgrade. Based on OP alone however, I can't agree.

Edit:

Based on zuno statement who is a nigh omniscient being who said that ss can do anything not to mention the fact same thing was repeated by g.p and zeno(the guy who can actually erase 5d timelines)couldn't we give atleast a possible rating

I completely forgot about zuno
A possible rating might be okay I suppose

 

[Sus]

i think we need to find their statements for evidence

their statements are in the OP

the statement we don't have is super shenron being > zeno

 

[RoninSlayer200]

their statements are in the OP

the statement we don't have is super shenron being > zeno

my bad i forgot OP put it on thread

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I have this guide that is licensed by Toei, saying that he can make any wish without any restrictions.

Pretty much my thoughts as well.

If the scan DDM is referencing can be found, then I can agree with a direct Low 1-C upgrade. Based on OP alone however, I can't agree.

Edit:

I completely forgot about zuno
A possible rating might be okay I suppose

Here too, guide with Toei licensing.

 

[Sus]

i might be misremembering but didn't zeno kill zamasu who wished for immortality by SS?

it seems both zeno and SS can cancel out each other's abilities, not sure if it changes anything but i thought of bringing it up

 

[Eikichi_Sensei]

Here too, guide with Toei licensing.

I really wonder why they sometimes use Spanish scans, and not English or Japanese, because it seems like a special album for the Spanish part but not the main (Japanese) ones.

I am a Spanish speaker, that is called an Album, something to promote the series or for fans of the series, nothing official, it only has the authorization of the company to sell its products, that does not mean that Toei has ordered that it be done as an official part of the series, it is very common in this part of South America.

 

[Eseseso]

Neutral

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I really wonder why they sometimes use Spanish scans, and not English or Japanese, because it seems like a special album for the Spanish part but not the main (Japanese) ones.

I am a Spanish speaker, that is called an Album, something to promote the series or for fans of the series, nothing official, it only has the authorization of the company to sell its products, that does not mean that Toei has ordered that it be done as an official part of the series, it is very common in this part of South America.

We literally use Dragon Ball Spanish guide ( el mangá)



Furthermore, the company itself has a direct partnership with the company that provided the guide, it is secondary material anyway.

BIG BANG was born in 2008 in Santiago de Chile, dreaming of entertaining children, young people and adults, awakening their creative and social spirit. It is a creative and dynamic company, with a human, passionate team and a wealth of experience in its work. Recognized by licensees and prominent companies for being avant-garde in design and quality, focused on developing licenses through collectibles, albums, card games and promotional activities that are always back on trend and the simplest form of entertainment, in the territory of Chile and other countries in the region.

 

[CelestialVortex01]

Alright so I assume we can all agree that he can get a possibly low 1-C rating cause of Zuno's statements?

 

[ArcaneAbyss]

Alright so I assume we can all agree that he can get a possibly low 1-C rating cause of Zuno's statements?

And Zeno's

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I personally think Zuno should be a pretty reliable source to at least suggest a possibly Low 1-C rating. And of course, SS will be considered a glass cannon given the lack of notable durability feats.

 

[Eikichi_Sensei]

We literally use Dragon Ball Spanish guide ( el mangá)



Furthermore, the company itself has a direct partnership with the company that provided the guide, it is secondary material anyway.

That's not a guide, it's an album as a colleague said before in the demotion of Conceptual Manipulation to Grand Priest.

I even just found out that it was only distributed in Chile if I look at the comments on the video, not India, not Colombia, can you at least provide the "guide" in Japanese?

Being licensed by Toei doesn't mean that the same company has ordered it to be made, not to mention that they distribute it in a limited way and not worldwide. The guide they use must exist in Japan (place of origin) or they don't?

 

[CodeCCLL]

Now, let's get to the meat of this CRT. Zeno’s erasure of multiple universes wasn’t just your everyday wipe—this was 5D EE, the kind that messes with constructs on a whole other level. But guess who reversed that? Yep, Super Shenron. He restored those universes like it was just another Tuesday. The sheer fact that he could bring back something erased on a 5D scale screams Low 1-C potential.

When mathematical dimensions are erased, void remains, and the ability to erase higher mathematical dimensions does not erase the already dimensionless void at a deeper/unrestorable level.

Furthermore, erased standard space-time continums from the hypertimeline does not significantly affect the hypertimeline itself, nor does adding new space-time continums to the hypertimeline or restoring already erased space-time continums significantly affect the hypertimeline.

So this argument is complete nonsense.

 

[Sus]

i agree with a possibly/likely

but can we downgrade the current 2C value to 7 macrocosms instead of 18? him affecting all 18 at once excluding the hyper timeline is an oddly specific and baseless assumption

 

[CloverDragon03]

I can support a "possibly Low 1-C" via the statements

 

[CelestialVortex01]

When mathematical dimensions are erased, void remains, and the ability to erase higher mathematical dimensions does not erase the already dimensionless void at a deeper/unrestorable level.

Furthermore, erased standard space-time continums from the hypertimeline does not significantly affect the hypertimeline itself, nor does adding new space-time continums to the hypertimeline or restoring already erased space-time continums significantly affect the hypertimeline.

So this argument is complete nonsense.

Yeah it was a pretty bad idea afterall

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

That's not a guide, it's an album as a colleague said before in the demotion of Conceptual Manipulation to Grand Priest.

I know it's not a guide, but it's still licensed by Toei, it even says so on the cover.

I even just found out that it was only distributed in Chile if I look at the comments on the video, not India, not Colombia, can you at least provide the "guide" in Japanese?

There is no Japanese version, as it is a Spanish album.

Being licensed by Toei doesn't mean that the same company has ordered it to be made, not to mention that they distribute it in a limited way and not worldwide. The guide they use must exist in Japan (place of origin) or they don't?

What is still secondary material to the original work, even if Toei itself didn't make it, is still official material that can be used, not least because it has a license seal (it doesn't contract the source material, it just complements the original work).

 

[BestMGQScalerEver]

I dont particularly mind using Zuno for a possibly.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

But yes, Zuno's statement is quite fragrant here and i agree with possibly (it's better than nothing)

 

[Quantu]

Possibly FRA.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I personally think Zuno should be a pretty reliable source to at least suggest a possibly Low 1-C rating. And of course, SS will be considered a glass cannon given the lack of notable durability feats.

That's fine with me

 

[CelestialVortex01]

I want to thank everybody who evaluated in this thread, and I'm deeply sorry if I've caused any confusion

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

1. "B-but Super Shenron only restored universes, not hypertimelines!"

True, but the level of erasure was still 5D. Zeno’s EE scales with his hypertimeline feat, meaning Super Shenron had to revert something on that level, even if it was just universes this time.

Are you saying that if Character A, someone who can erase a universe, chooses to erase a tree, and Character B restores said erased tree, then Character B can restore a universe? No. Sorry. That doesn't make sense.

Also, after the Tier System update. The difference between Low 1-C and tier 2 is not qualitative anymore. So hax isn't qualitatively different. You would have to prove that Super Shenron has Low 1-C range.

So, let’s talk about this gigantic, gold-plated dragon. Super Shenron is no ordinary dragon—this guy can grant "any" wish, no matter how wild.

This is really a case of whether this meets the NLF. You might as well argue that Super Shenron should be able to erase away the entire hypertimeline and zeno as well, since any wish can stand.

 

[CryoTheMayo]

A god with Low 1-C power believes Super Shenron can do 'anything'. Logically it would follow that the Low 1-C god is factoring in Low 1-C capabilities when he is saying that. So Super Shenron having Low 1-C hax makes sense to me.

 

[Ryzen7900X]

tbh just Zeno's statement alone is enough for SS to scale to low 1-C, at least possibly, so I agree as well

 

[Qawsedf234]

Now, let's get to the meat of this CRT. Zeno’s erasure of multiple universes wasn’t just your everyday wipe—this was 5D EE, the kind that messes with constructs on a whole other level. But guess who reversed that? Yep, Super Shenron. He restored those universes like it was just another Tuesday. The sheer fact that he could bring back something erased on a 5D scale screams Low 1-C potential.

I think you're confusing what was counted as a Hypertimeline for Dragon Ball Super. The totality of the timeline, as in every universe, the void inbetween and the greater axis separating the two is what makes something Low 1-C. Its why Zeno or anyone who can delete the entire cosmology would be 5D.

Restoring an erased universe is just a 4D feat as that's just a singular temporal axis. To be 5D Shenron would need to bring back something like Truck's erased timeline.

 

[CelestialVortex01]

I think you're confusing what was counted as a Hypertimeline for Dragon Ball Super. The totality of the timeline, as in every universe, the void inbetween and the greater axis separating the two is what makes something Low 1-C. Its why Zeno or anyone who can delete the entire cosmology would be 5D.

Restoring an erased universe is just a 4D feat as that's just a singular temporal axis. To be 5D Shenron would need to bring back something like Truck's erased timeline.

Oh well I thought erasing a universe on a 5th dimensional scale and SS restoring it would be 5D hax but oh well , thanks for clarifying though and do you agree with both Zeno and Zuno's statements?