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Steven Universe CRT Thing

Foxthefox1000 said:
As for the Corrupting Light, why not assume it was actual light just for the sake of getting a possible distance?
Click to expand...
Wouldn't the attack need to display certain properties for us to assume light speed? (Like reflecting off of certain surfaces)
 
I mean, from what we see, reaching the surface from just beyond the Moon in seconds is around the speed of light, if not a bit faster.
 
I mean, that's seems like it would be a problem, we're assuming a distance to get a speed to get the distance we originally assumed
 
Also, Yellow's Biological Manipulation is actually transmutation, cause you can't use biological Manipulation on Inorganic Beings
 
Hm, I was thinking we take the tine fron when the light reaches the Moon to when it envelopes the Earth, and get a speed from that. Then, using that speed, we can calculate how long the light took to reach the moon via frames and all and then come up with a distance based on that. It's a little roundabout but it's the best we can manage.
 
Foxthefox1000 said:
Lmao called it being 6-A.

I just had a feeling.

And yeah, the beam definitely came from beyond the Moon and that was a stupid assumption from the start even more so than assuming Homeworld (the only other place we have atm for where the Diamond's could logically be).
Click to expand...
it was never a stupid assumption, how so? there is no eveidence that suggests the blast came from homeworld, yeah, both sides of the argument aren't definitive, but give me one piece of definitive or even suggestive evidence that indicates they where on homeworld.

And don't call other opinions stupid, it is perfectly reasonable to me. Yeah this is annoying we cant find a conclusion, but im sorry, if there is no evidence and your basing it all solely on assumption then its not a very good approach.

I know I keep repeating this, but think about it, High 5-A diamonds because they were "Assumed" to be on homeworld, and we "assume" the blast travelled interstellar distances, and we "Assume" the brightness, while on top of that we "assume" the diamonds are confident enough to withstand the cluster, and we "assume" white hadn't left homeworld in eons even though calling 6000 years eons is acceptable, at this point it doesn't really seem worth it now. I know we all want tier 5, but we cant just force make a conclusion by going roundabout multiple times all based off assumption, yes the evidence it was close to earth is also an assumption, but I've referenced enough times by now the image of their hands, that is at least a piece of suggestive evidence that can reasonably be used.
 
CinnabarManx421 said:
I'd just like to clear this up, no Lapis is likely not Tier 5 at full strength. I need to remind everybody that her High 6-A feat is only 35 Petatons which is on the low end of High 6-A. The high end is 29 Exatons. An Exaton is 1,000 Petatons. So unless we wanna say she somehow gets more than 828x stronger for no reason then no she is not anywhere close to Tier 5.
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Saying her full strength is at least 828x greater than that feat is EXACTLY what I'm saying, come on. Did you not watch the same show as us? The feat was VERY casual for her, she maintained it for hours while still being able to focus on other stuff involving way more skill and concentration, and **her gem was cracked so she was slowly dying**, she just has a will-of-titanium (she resisted Blue's hax) so through sheer force of will she was able to keep her body from degrading (except blank eyes) the way Amethyst's did. But she was feeling the SAME effects as Amethyst did when she had a cracked gem, and do you remember how horrible that was? Amethyst was reduced from 7-A to being **useless** at that point, and was actually dying. The unfortunate thing is that we have no numbers to attach to:

1. How casual she was.

2. How much a cracked gemstone weakens a Gem.

But when you combine the two factors, yes she was probably weakened by a factor of over 1000x, we just have no way to prove it by this wiki's standards. Amethyst was weakened so much by her crack that she was she went from 7-A to negatively-useful, so a cracked gemstone probably weakens a gem by well over 100x to 1000x, and Lapis' feat seemed so casual as to be using less than 1/10th of her power at the time. She probably IS Tier 5 (she is literally why people have been saying S.U. is probably Tier 5 for so long and thus she is why we are desperate to find a Tier 5 feat), it's just that without actual numbers to attach to it from WoG or the series, we can't use vague upscaling. But don't you go disrespecting our adorkable traumatized water-witch and saying she isn't probably a moon-buster! LMAO just kidding/sarcastic, I'm not angry at you.

Foxthefox1000 said:
Hm, I was thinking we take the tine fron when the light reaches the Moon to when it envelopes the Earth, and get a speed from that. Then, using that speed, we can calculate how long the light took to reach the moon via frames and all and then come up with a distance based on that. It's a little roundabout but it's the best we can manage.
Click to expand...
This actually sounds like a reasonable idea to me? I'm not sure if I myself am qualified enough at calcs though (just having a Masters in Math doesn't mean I know how to do calcs on this site, I am still a n00b at those lol) to do this? BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE A REALLY GOOD IDEA, doesn't it guys? It seems like the only possible way we can get an estimate for the distance the beam traveled! What do the rest of you think?
 
It was a stupid assumption because I literally stated multiple times that the light didn't come from the Moon so I dunno where anyone got that it came from the Moon, especially in most clips of it that we see.

Okay, not stupid, but a misinformed and incorrect one.
 
Foxthefox1000 said:
It was a stupid assumption because I literally stated multiple times that the light didn't come from the Moon so I dunno where anyone got that it came from the Moon, especially in most clips of it that we see.

Okay, not stupid, but a misinformed and incorrect one.
Click to expand...
never said it came form the moon, and tell me how is it misinformed, how is the possibility of them being on homeworld at the time informed at all, there's no evidence, all you doing is desperately trying to get them to tier 5 by trying whatever means you can even if you base the reasoning and numbers off of unconfirmed assumptions, so tell me how is your proposal correct or in any way informed?
 
Foxthefox1000 said:
It was a stupid assumption because I literally stated multiple times that the light didn't come from the Moon so I dunno where anyone got that it came from the Moon, especially in most clips of it that we see.
Okay, not stupid, but a misinformed and incorrect one.
Click to expand...
I was basing the moon-distance-assumption on what others said and I thought based on the image used in the calcs where the beam APPEARS to be coming from between the Moon and the Earth, but again, since we now saw there is ANOTHER perspective-view of the beam, it now seems that the beam appearing to "overlap" the moon on the earth's side was just some kind of glare-effect, and it did indeed come from further than the Moon.

In the end, Moon-distance was at least a safer assumption than thinking it came all the way from a distant galaxy, LOL.

Soupywolf5 said:
With the new distance the calc goes from 6-A to Low-end High 6-A
Click to expand...
Wait really? How did you calc the new distance? Using the method I quoted in my post above, the one that Foxthefox1000 came up with? If so, can you walk us through EXACTLY how you calced the new distance and the result you got?

Also I can't believe I literally had to explain to someone why Lapis is probably almost DEFINITELY 5-C by vague upscaling but we just can't use that vague upscaling by this wiki's standards and that Lapis has literally always been the entire reason why we've suspected for a long time that the verse is Tier 5, especially when said person's profile seems to indicate they are as into the verse as I am if not moreso. Just saying, do they not get how casual she was and how much a crack weakens a Gem?
 
Foxthefox1000 said:
It was a stupid assumption because I literally stated multiple times that the light didn't come from the Moon so I dunno where anyone got that it came from the Moon, especially in most clips of it that we see.
Okay, not stupid, but a misinformed and incorrect one.
Click to expand...
I was basing the moon-distance-assumption on what others said and I thought based on the image used in the calcs where the beam APPEARS to be coming from between the Moon and the Earth, but again, since we now saw there is ANOTHER perspective-view of the beam, it now seems that the beam appearing to "overlap" the moon on the earth's side was just some kind of glare-effect, and it did indeed come from further than the Moon.

In the end, Moon-distance was at least a safer assumption than thinking it came all the way from a distant galaxy, LOL. As Nickobloke said we have a lot more reason than not to think they were somewhere close to the Earth-Moon-System, at least somewhere within Earth's Solar System, rather than light-years away from it.

Soupywolf5 said:
With the new distance the calc goes from 6-A to Low-end High 6-A
Click to expand...
Wait really? How did you calc the new distance? Using the method I quoted in my post above, the one that Foxthefox1000 came up with? If so, can you walk us through EXACTLY how you calced the new distance and the result you got?

Also I can't believe I literally had to explain to someone why Lapis is probably almost DEFINITELY 5-C by vague upscaling but we just can't use that vague upscaling by this wiki's standards and that Lapis has literally always been the entire reason why we've suspected for a long time that the verse is Tier 5, especially when said person's profile seems to indicate they are as into the verse as I am if not moreso. Just saying, do they not get how casual she was and how much a crack weakens a Gem?
 
We have been told the Diamond Corruption Attack 3 Times.

Lapis - She was in the mirror. It's not that her view is wrong but probably not the best since she was trapped inside the mirror.

Nephrite - She was on Earth but when she was explaining it she broke down from the tramua thus her viewpoint isn't very clear.

Garnet - She was right next to Rose & Pearl and described great detail. In fact the show even pans out and shows where Yellow Blue and White's distance was to Earth and it shows right between the Earth and the Moon.

I think the last option is the best conclusion on how close the Diamonds were to Earth
 
Pepper14832 I agree

let me just put this out there, if the blast came from homeworld, the amount of energy you would need for light that bright to travel that distance while still maintaining its integrity of energy would probably be in the Steller range.
 
Nickobloke said:
Pepper14832 I agree
let me just put this out there, if the blast came from homeworld, the amount of energy you would need for light that bright to travel that distance while still maintaining its integrity of energy would probably be in the Steller range.
Click to expand...
Well the light definitely had **Diamond-Gem-Magic** keeping its integrity though. Keep in mind the beam was **white** in color, not a single-wavelength laser, so even if it WAS coming from as close as say, even just 10% of the distance from the Earth to the Moon, if the beam had the actual properties of normal white-light it should have spread out and attenuated so much as to become way more inconsequential than what we saw by the time it reached earth. As evidence for the whole "Gem Magic" holding-its-integrity thing, well, we know the beam was somehow a carrier for the Diamonds' corruption-hax, so yeah, it wasn't just "normal light" or anything. So assuming the beam couldn't hold its integrity over literally **any** distance may itself be a faulty assumption because "magic." Edit: Even with the best mono-wavelength lasers humanity can produce, a red or blue light laser fired at the moon with something like an initial beam-width of a few inches or feet ends up spreading out to like 6.5 KILOMETERS in width by the time it reaches the moon, true story.

So what are everyone's thoughts on my last post, SPECIFICALLY OP (Soupywolf5), could you tell us how you calced the new distance from that other viewpoint, and what result you got?
 
Let's assume it did come from homeworld.

Even with SOL speed travelling the universe takes time. I am not sure how far Earth is from Homeworld in terms of light years but didn't it take a solid Earth day for them to travel in ruby's ship to homeworld? That's even IF the ship is going NEAR SOL or FTL

So it wouldn't make sense for all Homeworld Gems on Earth not being able to evacuate in time when it seems they were all notifed and the attack would take nearly an entire Earth day to get there.
 
Well the light definitely had **Diamond-Gem-Magic** keeping its integrity though. Keep in mind the beam was **white** in color, not a single-wavelength laser, so even if it WAS coming from as close as say, even just 10% of the distance from the Earth to the Moon, if the beam had all the properties of normal white-light it should have spread out and attenuated so much as to become completely inconsequential by the time it reached earth. As evidence for the whole "Gem Magic" holding-its-integrity thing, well, we know the beam was somehow a carrier for the Diamonds' corruption-hax, so yeah, it wasn't just "normal light" or anything. So assuming the beam couldn't hold its integrity over literally **any** distance may itself be a faulty assumption because "magic."

So what are everyone's thoughts on my last post, SPECIFICALLY OP (Soupywolf5), could you tell us how you calced the new distance from that other viewpoint, and what result you got?

look dude at this point we are just going back and forward and making little progress, if we could get a mods thoughts on the matter that would help a lot, but theres really not much to continue discussing now without bringing up the same issues again and again.
 
Nickobloke said:
look dude at this point we are just going back and forward and making little progress, if we could get a mods thoughts on the matter that would help a lot, but theres really not much to continue discussing now without bringing up the same issues again and again.
Click to expand...
Yup you're right! At this point I just want the OP to tell us how he did the distance-calc he is saying he did from the image of the other vantage-point, other than that I feel like yeah, we can stop for now except for the following:

We can keep the TIERING the same as now (meaning as you said Nickobloke WE CAN STOP DEBATING THE BEAM-FEAT in our clearly futile desperation to get Tier 5, lol), while we will have to add the new Pink Form and Monster keys for Steven, with Monster obviously being At Least High 6-A Likely Far Higher, and while debating if my proposal for Pink Form Steven ("Varies, From At Least High 7-A to At Least High 6-A Likely Far Higher depending on emotional state and shapeshifting") is okay or not with people based on the fact that Monster Steven really wasn't "corrupted" at all, he was just the actual full potential of Pink Form with size-shifting and passionate emotions (if he really was corrupted then he couldn't have gone back to normal with just a hug, he would have needed the Diamonds' healing-powers, so yeah he really was just shape-shifting based on his subconscious perception of hiimself and got that powerful, meaning that Pink Form can indeed surpass White). At least those are my own thoughts/opinions, how about you Nickobloke? I mean they didn't need the Diamond-auras to heal him, so he wasn't really Corrupted, just shapeshifting. . .right?

But yeah we can basically stop until some Mods/Admins come to approve our edits already in the OP, other than asking the OP about his distance-calc and figuring out what we wanna do with Pink Form Steven.
 
Well admittedly, it's a pretty rough calc, so, I used the speed obtained from measuring the time it took to reach the Earth from the Moon (The calc I showed before, which got the beam's speed to be 1.198 C), and used the provided timeframe for the whole beam (Someone above said 18 seconds so that's what I used) and got a distance of 6,464,890,000 Meters, and then I replaced the length of the beam in the recalc with this value (Everything else about the calc seemed to be agreed with, it seemed like the distance was the only thing people had problems with) so the formula was: 2(2.19562392e+14) + 4(15424458.76091969 * 6464890000) = 3.9930884e+17 M^2 for the beam's surface area multiplying by the previously calculated brightness (190120000 Joules/M^2) and you get 7.5916597e+25 Joules, or roughly 18.14 Petatons of TNT (Even lower than Lapis' feat) if I've done anything wrong here please let me know
 
Goodyfresh said:
Also I can't believe I literally had to explain to someone why Lapis is probably almost DEFINITELY 5-C by vague upscaling but we just can't use that vague upscaling by this wiki's standards and that Lapis has literally always been the entire reason why we've suspected for a long time that the verse is Tier 5, especially when said person's profile seems to indicate they are as into the verse as I am if not moreso. Just saying, do they not get how casual she was and how much a crack weakens a Gem?
Click to expand...
TBH that's part of the reason why I make these


I don't actually know the reason :/
 
Yeah okay let's just drop the whole attempt to find a Tier 5 feat then LOL, it's a lost cause guys! Oh well.

Soooo back to Pink Form Steven, what does everyone think about my idea for rating him in my above post? Again, Monster Steven was not actually CORRUPTED. In fact, should Monster Steven even get a separate key; shouldn't he just be considered the high-end of Pink Form Steven? If Steven was actually corrupted, he would have needed the Diamond Healing Auras (INCLUDING SOME OF HIS OWN FROM A BOTTLE) to fix the corruption. But apparently all he needed was EMOTIONAL SUPPORT. Therefore he was not corrupted. Monster Steve WAS Pink Steven, just the FULL-POTENTIAL of Pink Steven with passionate emotions and shape-shifting. As some of us speculated, Pink's power/potential was dependent on her emotions, and she is kinda like the Hulk in that if she gets more emotional she can get stronger. We should also give Pink Form Steven some kinda rage/emotion-power in his power-list.

I propose that Monster Steven not even be a separate key and we just note in his profile that it is the high-end of Pink Steven, and that we rate Pink Steven "Varies, From At Least High 7-A to At Least High 6-A Likely Far Higher, dependent on emotional-state and shapeshifting." The At Least High 7-A of course comes from how hard and easily he stomped Jasper while still human-sized but with his "true power." And it doesn't matter if the "official" name for his Monster form is "Corrupted" Steven, he was NOT corrupted, just shape-shifting because his physical form is dependent on his perception of himself, and at the time he thought "I am a monster." So what we saw is just his actual full power, raw and uncut, when emotional enough.

I feel like this is really the last thing we need to go over as far as edits and additions to the OP go, then we can ask Mods/Admins to approve edits.
 
to be honest im not really sure if he was corrupted or not, I mean, the other diamonds where sharing a body of water with him when he was turned back to normal which is how corruption was healed before, but It might have just been him shapeshifting with full potential pink diamond powers while having a mental breakdown.


and soupy that wanked profile what the hell, can I see your others.
 
Wait...Steven isn't 5-C anymore. Why?

Since Steven is half human, could De-Corruption work in a different way for him by bringing out his human side?

Just a theory.
 
Nickobloke said:
the other diamonds where sharing a body of water with him when he was turned back to normal which is how corruption was healed before, but It might have just been him shapeshifting with full potential pink diamond powers while having a mental breakdown.
Click to expand...
He wasn't corrupted as they didn't use their auras to heal him, we literally SEE the colors of diamond-auras when they first release them, and we did not see that at all. If they were using their auras to heal him, Rebecca would have clearly shown that. He was literally healed by just **emotional support**, Rebecca made it absolutely clear that it was **being hugged and kissed** that brought him back. He started to come back and regain his senses before the Diamonds hugged him, just from Garnet and Lapis. And it wasn't the Diamonds who ultimately made him come back, it was Connie who was the final push. Further evidence he was not corrupted: When Connie kissed him and he cried, his tears had aura, **and he ocean-water turned pink from it.** We did NOT see the water change color at all, nor the release of any aura-light, from the other Diamonds. He came back literally from an actual normal hug and kiss.

This all absolutely, positively has support from how we know his powers work. His physical form is dependent on his perception of himself, we've known that since So Many Birthdays in Season 1 and saw it again in Fragmented. Notice he became a monster as soon as he said "I'm a monster." That's it guys, it's literally just shapeshifting and emotions. This confirms that Pink was basically a Gem version of The Hulk, lmao no wonder her "tantrums" worried the other Diamonds so much and they resorted to emotional abuse and manipulation to control her, ya know? Also as far as we know, CORRUPTING a gem is an ability wielded by multiple Diamonds together, and we have no precedent in the series for someone being able to corrupt themselves all on their own, but we have TONS of precedent for Steven's physical form changing based on his perception of himself. Therefore based on all the evidence evidence we have, the only logical Conclusion I feel we can reach is that Monster Steven is not "corrupted," he was just the absolute high-end of Pink Form when driven to grow to extreme size by strong emotions.

Sorry for the wall of text agai but just wanted to clarify the reasoning, it really is all based purely on logic from solid evidence! I have to go to bed now guys, but will be back tomorrow to see what people think (and will drop it if the **majority** disagree even if I further make my case). I hope this was helpful :)

And yeah Soupy's wanked profiles are amazing lol.
 
5-C really isn't that out of the question, and I was the main voice against the tier 5 upgrades, I mean, if steven and the diamonds where made 5-C, it would be acceptable, we just lack the numbers to prove it without assumptions.
 
Could Lapis be boosted by taking on two other Lapises, who are confirmed terraformers, and overpowering them both?
 
Sorvoe551 said:
Could Lapis be boosted by taking on two other Lapises, who are confirmed terraformers, and overpowering them both?
Click to expand...
Hmm, actually that maybe something, but I think the only reason she overpowered them was because she was more experienced and had way more practice in certain abilities, the two lapis' even said that she was teaching them new things.
 
Looking over the fight again, I noticed two things that affect my thoughts on it.

1. Lapis "teaching them new things" seemed to be more a lesson in technique instead of power. Nice and Mean Lapis (yes, those are their names given by the fandom) responded to her water hands and chains like "Oh cool, never thought of shaping water that way" and instantly pulling off her moves with the power of two.

2. Recapping the last half of the fight for context: Nice & Mean threw a water sawblade at her. Lapis stopped it then dispersed it, shocking them both. She them summoned a tidal wave that neither of the two dodged before forming Gundam Aqua and preparing to stab them with a water spear. If Steven wasn't their to remind her of her "humanity," Lapis would have shattered both of them. Once she powers down, Nice & Mean are like "Holy shit, you're super strong! We'll do whatever you say."

While we already know that our Lapis is considered an exceptional version of her Gem type, the back half of the fight specifically tells me that her strength is so far above terraformers that it leaves them in a state of awe and terror. While it seems that any Lapis is capable of using the techniques we've seen because of a high skill with shaping water, Lapis' raw power seems to be leagues above her "sisters"
 
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