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In the game right after that, he's stated to go faster than he's ever been before and somehow percieves instant teleportation in real time, percieving Shadow's travel from point A to point B during it.
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Sonic General Discussion Zone Act 1: New Frontiers
- Thread starter Maverick_Zero_X
- Start date
MysticMania
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I also feel Archie may have somewhat more of a temper than Game, maybe.
Ghengiroo115
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The one part I really don’t get is why that statement is used to justify baseline Supers > Storybook forms. Like, those forms didn’t even exist yet and nobody in-universe knew they existed (hell I’m pretty sure even now Sonic is the only one in the main universe that knows about them).
I keep forgetting that statement exists. Something good is that if baseline Supers get downgraded and if (when) 6-D gets rejected, I think we can still use this to justify Perfect Chaos and Metal Overlord upscaling above Phantom King. That would keep the Low 2-C scaling the characters currently have from the former which would be nice to have (don’t think it’s necessary especially since 2-C is on the table now, but it’s still useful to have).
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What are opinions on that outer Archie sonic thread?
Ghengiroo115
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Question, if baseline Classic/Adventure Supers are > Darkspine Sonic then shouldn’t modern base characters have Immeasurable Lifting Strength? Eggman mechs like the Super Egg Robot have LS scaling to Super Sonic. Tbh idk if there’s actually any instance of LS scaling to Eggman mechs (or Infinite) in the modern era, but at least those would have Immeasurable LS right?
Not that any of this matters in the hopeful instance that baseline Supers get downgraded, but worst-case scenario there might be an LS upgrade if it stays.
Not that any of this matters in the hopeful instance that baseline Supers get downgraded, but worst-case scenario there might be an LS upgrade if it stays.
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I feel like the super forms can just upscale from the Paradox Prism themselves. Worst case scenario we can just use linear scaling chain of Classic Super<Adventure Super<Modern Super and scale everyone from Phantom King's low 2-C feat.
ShakeResounding
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Yeah upscaling from Darkspine is meh to me nowadays, Phantom King is a much more reliable place to upscale.
Sonic Question Time: This one will be a bit different. I've been floating around the idea of making a "Super Form"/"Super State" page as of recently. What are your opinions regarding that, folks? Would that make things too complicated for no payoff?
Sonic Question Time: This one will be a bit different. I've been floating around the idea of making a "Super Form"/"Super State" page as of recently. What are your opinions regarding that, folks? Would that make things too complicated for no payoff?
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Personally? Not sure. On one end, the Super forms do give a decent ability overlap, like, it’s undeniable that there are passive abilities you get just by being Super, like Acausality, but there’s differences between even the Super forms of the 3 Sonic’s (meaning it wouldn’t be totally effective regardless). Not to mention while the abilities themselves are significant, the actual quantity is pretty low. Honestly leaning more no than yes, but I’m frankly not sure if that’s the better move more than it is the more convenient move.
ShakeResounding
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Eh, yeah I was running into some issues regarding how relevant it would actually be. I suppose there might not be a reason to make it
Ghengiroo115
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Now that I think about it I think upscaling from Darkspine actually causes circular scaling issues as well, since it goes Darkspine < Super Egg Robot < Egg Wyvern < Darkspine. I think we’d have to axe Low 2-C ‘06 if we kept Darkspine upscaling.
Personally I don’t really like making the Phantom King the baseline for Super forms, since I’m not aware of any evidence that it’s their weakest usage of the Emeralds. If there’s anything I’m missing though then I might change my mind.
Idk if it would be all that useful tbh
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If anything it makes more sense to be a higher level, given Eggman said it made the Master Emerald redundant.
Ghengiroo115
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Tbf it was modern Eggman who said that, but yeah that is a thing terrifyingly enough.
Ghengiroo115
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Btw how does the wiki handle modern Eggman seemingly not remembering the events of Mania? Wasn’t him finding the Phantom Ruby in the Forces prequel comic his first encounter with it?
ShakeResounding
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From what I gather, we just ignore it. Same could be said for Sonic himself during Forces, as he was trying to stall Infinite for Tails to get a read on him.
In fairness, when has the Master Emerald ever even been relevant power-wise? It's essentially ALWAYS for some form of vying control over the Chaos Emeralds to my recollection
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Characters have utilized the master emerald for power amps throughout the franchise, plus it’s basically a big chaos emerald that can enhance other chaos emeralds into stronger forms. So it has merit as a powerful energy source.
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The idea is that Classic Super Sonic is weaker than Adventure Super Sonic and so forth. So we would use more linear scaling.
ShakeResounding
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Oh yeah, Hyper Jobber, nearly forgot the Master Emerald did that
Ghengiroo115
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I don’t really understand. Do you mean baseline Adventure era Super Sonic would upscale from all of Classic Super Sonic’s feats? Or am I wildly misreading?
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Yes, that. Since Gens seems to be showing Modern Base>Adventure Super, Super Sonic probably grows in power in each era.
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Super Sonic is a transformation, the characters growing in power does not mean that the super form grows in power.
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He already does in Frontiers. Level 1 Super Sonic is weaker then level 99.
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That’s actually what happens in Frontiers, as base Sonic grows SS grows proportionally to mimic it.
Ninja’d
Ghengiroo115
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While Super Sonic does get stronger over time, I’m not sure why we’d scale lower tier Adventure/Modern Supers above higher tier Classic/Adventure Supers. Since you have the whole varies rating and all I’m not sure why we’d assume something like that. Also wouldn’t that put everything above Classic Super’s 1-C rating, or would we change it to where only Gens/Forces Classic Sonic can output that level of power?
Personally I still think it makes more sense to just have the baseline be the multiplier for the Emeralds combined.
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i thought it was the fact that Sonic grows in power and Super Sonic just amps Sonic current power
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are people just ignoring that Metal Sonic in mania adventures can have a super glow thing and is not a super form?.
again, the ''baseline''of a super form is the super power (the one's that tails, amy and knuckles have in superstars)and the real super form is the one where you are glowing gold or you transform, it is not that hard.
again, the ''baseline''of a super form is the super power (the one's that tails, amy and knuckles have in superstars)and the real super form is the one where you are glowing gold or you transform, it is not that hard.
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Wholeheartedly agree with it.
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I already explained in the private convo why that doesn't work, but I won't reopen that can of worms until we get there.
Discuss that with Omega. He's currently working on a Chaos Energy page for the game verse, which I think covers about the same ground.
Timeline split after Generations, hence why Classic Sonic is reffered to as "that Sonic from another dimension" in Forces. Don't care what anyone says. Even Sega. It's the most logical explanation.
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I LOVE infinite upscaling Sonic via time loops
Ghengiroo115
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Jokes aside, yeah it probably should just be a timeline split (unless they royally overcomplicate things by referencing the Hard Boiled Heavies in a later story or something).
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NO is not, Sonic cannot remember things from ''other dimension''he does not have cosmic awareness, literraly it is more consistent for it to be the past rather than another dimension.
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there is no timeline split, it is the same timeline
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where is the proof for that?it was never stated that Eggman does not remember those events, also time travel does not work like that.
for the time travel to work, the Ruby most go from the future to the past, but the ruby went to the future, Eggman would obviosly not remember that because the effect didn't work.
i mean, why do you think Silver travels to the past to change the past and save his future?it is a simply time travel mechanic
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I mean, the Timeline split was retconned, so I figured we just assumed those inconsistencies had been buffered out.
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Yeah. I know. It's just stupid as hell and results in more inconsistancies than if it wasn't retconned. That's why I said I don't care what Sega says.
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The idea is that being with Modern amped his super form, yes. We know Super Sonic can share his own energy with others in Heroes or 06.
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Yes, but when that happened in Heroes or ‘06, Sonic very clearly transformed first, and then gave his energy to the others. Here, they transform at the same time. Idk.
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Tailstube
Tailstube 5 is based on remembering Mighty, Ray & Fang, and Amy mentions Trip in the end
Still, I hate that! The timeline split was what made the most sense
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Ghengiroo115
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I assumed only Mania would be split off and Superstars would still be main timeline, but if they reference Mighty and Ray’s Mania appearances in Tailstube then yeah that complicates things.
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Huh. Yeah, TailsTube DOES fudge that and make it so it's back to one whole timeline again. Funny, that.
The true answer is Eggman has Dementia.
The true answer is Eggman has Dementia.
Ghengiroo115
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Brain damage from blasting off like Team Rocket so often, I reckon.
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