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Son Goku vs Simon the Digger

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FluffyCreatureZ said:
The blast itself is universal AP but the energy in it is tiny since it barely effects goku's reserves. So 1 type is him constantly getting stronger and the other is him getting stronger via will power I see. I wanna know the potency of the passive one, the second one I don't see coming into play since the fight ends immediately after goku lands an attack so simon doesn't have time to get motivated lol. Also Goku is like far FAR stronger than simon like far far stronger, like if you want a number, then if we substitute SSG for SSJ then at SSB goku would be at least 350 times stronger low balling (it's logically much bigger but I am multiplier stacking but what I am saying is still true it's just a visual representation). So that evolution needs to be very potent to both catch up to goku's dummy high AP gap and his own reactive evolution.
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The passive one isn’t too bad, the willpower based RE is the real problem, because his will is immense, just by being a spiral being. Lordgenome even said the spiral instinct is to reach the heavens, and the Anti-Spiral says spiral beings find beauty in struggling to the end. So the more powerful an opponent is, Simon would off the bat increase his willpower greatly, because he’d have to fight harder. And now you’re just throwing around random multipliers that aren’t said anywhere, or are inconsistent. Sure, in his own verse, he’d stomp himself after every transformation, but against verse foreign characters, the stomps wouldn’t be enough to say it is, because their verses don’t work the same
FluffyCreatureZ said:
Simon cannot survive violent fragmentation and that's what happens when DB characters don't suppress destructive capacity when using physicals you can see this happening in the final attack that goku did against moro.
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Where does it say he can’t?
FluffyCreatureZ said:
Goku can move sextillions of light years in seconds, and fight starts at 4km, speed equalized. Goku has no issue crossing the distance, and since simon starts with hand to hand then goku can just take advantage of that to attack him.
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Cant fool me with that “likely”, plus speed is equal. SGGL’s attack speed is 3.2320924e71c
FluffyCreatureZ said:
WTF just because the size of the energy is 4-B doesn't mean the energy it self is 4-B quantity... bruh the energy is 3-A.
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There’s a calc that puts the SGGL’s spiral power which was likened to a Galaxy being born, at 4-A. So clearly SGGL outputs more power than the energy source
 
BluudyManikin777 said:
The passive one isn’t too bad, the willpower based RE is the real problem, because his will is immense, just by being a spiral being. Lordgenome even said the spiral instinct is to reach the heavens, and the Anti-Spiral says spiral beings find beauty in struggling to the end. So the more powerful an opponent is, Simon would off the bat increase his willpower greatly, because he’d have to fight harder. And now you’re just throwing around random multipliers that aren’t said anywhere, or are inconsistent. Sure, in his own verse, he’d stomp himself after every transformation, but against verse foreign characters, the stomps wouldn’t be enough to say it is, because their verses don’t work the same
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I don't believe simon has enough time to significantly amp himself with will power, even if he can turn a stomp around I still doubt it can close the gap of goku's AP and if he even has enough time to amp himself because of the AP gap.
And I already clarified that I am technically multiplier stacking but still low balling at the same time, I am literally visualizing how huge each one of his amps are. The nature of his forms is that each one is far stronger than the other, more than enough to conclude that goku can more than one shot even if you say different verses, it doesn't work that argument because that's literally how huge goku's amps are, SSG by itself is far stronger than SSJ 50x. Simon < SSJ goku (7x stronger) < SSJ2 < SSJ3 <<< SSG < SSB.
BluudyManikin777 said:
Where does it say he can’t?
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His regen (low-mid) isn't strong enough to heal him from being blown to pieces which is what happens if goku punches him.
BluudyManikin777 said:
Cant fool me with that “likely”, plus speed is equal. SGGL’s attack speed is 3.2320924e71c
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What are you talking about? Goku is literally in the sextillions while massively low balling and speed is equalized to the slower character.
BluudyManikin777 said:
There’s a calc that puts the SGGL’s spiral power which was likened to a Galaxy being born, at 4-A. So clearly SGGL outputs more power than the energy source
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This is the calc for the universal SGGL. It claims the total energy is at universe level so I am going of what it says, although pretty sure this is a different feat from the one you're mentioning. About what you're saying, that's not how it works, you can't break the law of conservation of energy like that, the amount of energy the SGGL gained is the same amount that was absorbed since energy cannot be created or destroyed. It can't be both, either SGGL is 4-A or the energy he absorbed is 3-A.
 
Goku should also have indomitable will as a Saiyan, but Simon has the strongest willpower in fiction (aside 1-A ppl like Lucifer from DC) that gap is nothing. So if he doesn't get one shotted right away then theres a chance he'll catch up pretty quickly, who the hell you think he is?
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
I don't believe simon has enough time to significantly amp himself with will power, even if he can turn a stomp around I still doubt it can close the gap of goku's AP and if he even has enough time to amp himself because of the AP gap.
And I already clarified that I am technically multiplier stacking but still low balling at the same time, I am literally visualizing how huge each one of his amps are. The nature of his forms is that each one is far stronger than the other, more than enough to conclude that goku can more than one shot even if you say different verses, it doesn't work that argument because that's literally how huge goku's amps are, SSG by itself is far stronger than SSJ 50x. Simon < SSJ goku (7x stronger) < SSJ2 < SSJ3 <<< SSG < SSB.
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Even though there’s a huge scaling chain, it isn’t enough evidence to say he stomps, at best this just shows that he is far superior to an unknown extent
FluffyCreatureZ said:
What are you talking about? Goku is literally in the sextillions while massively low balling and speed is equalized to the slower character.
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The Sextillion thing isn’t until beginning of ToP SSJBKKx20 Goku. We aren’t even using that version, that’s not even a lowball for this version. And I know speed is equal, what about it?
FluffyCreatureZ said:
This is the calc for the universal SGGL. It claims the total energy is at universe level so I am going of what it says, although pretty sure this is a different feat from the one you're mentioning. About what you're saying, that's not how it works, you can't break the law of conservation of energy like that, the amount of energy the SGGL gained is the same amount that was absorbed since energy cannot be created or destroyed. It can't be both, either SGGL is 4-A or the energy he absorbed is 3-A
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These characters move faster than light which is already impossible, I don’t see why the energy source can’t be a lower tier than what a character can output. Fiction doesn’t have to always be realistic
 
Just saying, I’m not even trying to say one wins, because I’m on both of their sides, but some people just make the opponent look like a pushover, when they clearly aren’t. Simon isn’t, and Goku isn’t, it’s a good fight, and no stomping will happen here
 
BluudyManikin777 said:
Even though there’s a huge scaling chain, it isn’t enough evidence to say he stomps, at best this just shows that he is far superior to an unknown extent
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I say it's more than enough but he doesn't stomp, it's just the gap is huge from base to blue it's far far more than 50x, it's just way more than enough to one shot easily.
BluudyManikin777 said:
The Sextillion thing isn’t until beginning of ToP SSJBKKx20 Goku. We aren’t even using that version, that’s not even a lowball for this version. And I know speed is equal, what about it?
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I forgot sorry, but still it's massively low balling since it's only SSJ goku that's 9.8 quadrillion C and not taking into account the gap between SSJ and blue. Anyway this is kind of irrelevant since speed is equal but my point is that goku has no trouble reaching simon and can take advantage of him going for hand to hand to get a one punch in.
BluudyManikin777 said:
These characters move faster than light which is already impossible, I don’t see why the energy source can’t be a lower tier than what a character can output. Fiction doesn’t have to always be realistic
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Then prove he actually absorbed an amount of energy that equals 4-A then magnified it and became 3-A and not that he absorbed a 3-A energy or a if he isn't 4-A and not 3-A. Because I feel a huge amount of cap coming from your claim here. You say it was calculated to be 4-A, well that calculation can be wrong and pretty unnecessary since they'd already know he became 3-A. The most logical conclusion I can come up with is that the energy he absorbed isn't 4-A but actually 3-A since there's nothing on the profile about getting more than he absorbed.
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
I say it's more than enough but he doesn't stomp, it's just the gap is huge from base to blue it's far far more than 50x, it's just way more than enough to one shot easily.
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Stomp or one shot, it’s not enough proof for any of those
FluffyCreatureZ said:
Then prove he actually absorbed an amount of energy that equals 4-A then magnified it and became 3-A and not that he absorbed a 3-A energy or a if he isn't 4-A and not 3-A. Because I feel a huge amount of cap coming from your claim here. You say it was calculated to be 4-A, well that calculation can be wrong and pretty unnecessary since they'd already know he became 3-A. The most logical conclusion I can come up with is that the energy he absorbed isn't 4-A but actually 3-A since there's nothing on the profile about getting more than he absorbed.
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If the mass of the ultra-dense space was 3-A, SGGL (before absorbing it) would’ve been crushed immediately
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
Send me the calculation ok.
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Here

and SGGL shouldn’t output power at this level, because Lordgenome said in humanoid mode, it’s supposed to have power that rivals the micro cosmos. And before SGGL was SGGL, it was Cathedral Lazengann, Lordgenome used to pilot this gunman thousands of years ago, and is the 2nd most knowledgeable character in TTGL (Messenger Nia probably knows more, but ehh)
 
Um tf, I am so lost, I didn't watch this show so I know jack shit, the calculation you sent me is the amount of energy that SGGL can output which has nothing to do with the absorbing thing, but I found the absorbing calc I think this is it at least, and the result is a few kilo foe, so how does this prove that he is universal or that he can make more power than he absorbed or whatever? WTF I am so lost like did he become universal after absorbing this 4-A thing??? AHHHHH
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
Um tf, I am so lost, I didn't watch this show so I know jack shit, the calculation you sent me is the amount of energy that SGGL can output which has nothing to do with the absorbing thing, but I found the absorbing calc I think this is it at least, and the result is a few kilo foe, so how does this prove that he is universal or that he can make more power than he absorbed or whatever? WTF I am so lost like did he become universal after absorbing this 4-A thing??? AHHHHH
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Yes, SGGL became 3-A after absorbing the ultra-dense space that was being converted into energy. Although, fra, I believe Goku could still win if he landed enough hits, but it’s not a stomp or one-shot, he’s just vastly superior

edit: one ki blast and its over for Goku
 
Well I think that only happened once and the SGGL doesn't actually have that ability, although it doesn't make much of a difference since goku won't be using blasts once he figure how they can be absorbed and he'd punch gg, I am still voting goku.
 
No I mean the the absorb then amplify thing, it only happened once I'm sure, but absorption by itself still exist it's just not useful against goku (it is but not when all goku needs is to punch).
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
NOOOO you misunderstand I mean absorbing an amount of energy and then getting more energy than they actually absorbed.
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It happened in episode 17. He absorbed a Low 6-B’s energy, and went from Low 6-B to 6-A. That’s for another time though, the profiles still aren’t up to date, and are in dire need of new calcs
 
Okay, what am I missing about Goku that makes him even stand a chance against Simon? A Complex Multiversal Character, with a far great array of Hax than Goku could ever dream of dealing with?
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
It's in his optional equipment. Simon is using SGGL
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Ah, well, I don’t know then.
This depends if you accept Low-Multi Goku, which I think VsB has as Likely, or something like.

If it’s not accepted as Low-Multi, then I presume SGGL could win, mainly due to Hax, similar AP/Dura, though I don’t quite know how comparable he is in speed, both have MFTL, but Goku’s is high up there.
 
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