Some speed calcs.

[TheMightyRegulator]

"Second: This was actually explained by LazyWaka I think. While the perspective does indeed seem weird, the calc. is based on the fact that Toneri went from the full moon, into the Earth's shadow and into the light again while crossing across the center of the planet. That naturally means that he crossed the diameter."
if i understand you correctly, then he crossed much more 12000 kilometer, as the distance between the earth and the moon also counts in that explanation, which will result in an FTL beaten-up toneri, which is an outlire if i ever saw one.

"Third: The timeframe is honestly the biggest concern but I will repeat my standpoint on the issue. We have no good reason to assume that time was distorted. If we were to assume so despite the lack of evidence then any animated series would be incapable of getting feats related to timeframes. Besides, couldn't this qualify as an assumed timeframe (which is fine on this site)"

dragon ball super had a speed feat using natural phenomena's attributes to determine a timeframe, that substantially different to the cinematic time...so there are other ways, there are other methods you can use before relaying on the movie clock which almost always misrepresent the timeframe of the events for the sake audience enjoyment.

The distance between the Earth and the Moon is probably negligible as Toneri was moving the Moon for several days.

What methods can be employed to separate real time from cinematic time? (Just for curiosity's sake, if you don't mind me asking)

 

[DontTalk]

In this case a timeframe that was stated to be ten minutes was 4 minutes in the movie, which is why I would doubt the timeframe.

Let me argue further: If we assume the movie timeframe is depicted in real time we can also simply scale Narutos speed from Naruto jumping off the moo. He jumped past hinatas height in 7 frames. So assuming hinata is 1.8m tall and that the movie is running at 30 fps we get 1.8m/(7 f / 30 fps) = 7.7 m/s. Now was that this slow? Probably not, but it shows that if we use the timeframe as truth simple scaling of speed shows that the value doesn´t fit, so we get a contradiction through the assumption that the timeframe is correct, which implies that the timeframe is incorrect.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

In this case a timeframe that was stated to be ten minutes was 4 minutes in the movie, which is why I would doubt the timeframe.
Let me argue further: If we assume the movie timeframe is depicted in real time we can also simply scale Narutos speed from Naruto jumping off the moo. He jumped past hinatas height in 7 frames. So assuming hinata is 1.8m tall and that the movie is running at 30 fps we get 1.8m/(7 f / 30 fps) = 7.7 m/s. Now was that this slow? Probably not, but it shows that if we use the timeframe as truth simple scaling of speed shows that the value doesn´t fit, so we get a contradiction through the assumption that the timeframe is correct, which implies that the timeframe is incorrect.

So...any reason we can't use the value you discovered to convert the cinematic time to real time? Something that took 10 minutes in cinema took 4 minutes in real life. This would imply the cinematic time is 2.5x slower. Multiply this to the 4 seconds, use the stated distance, Mach 9800, sub-relativistic Naruto.

Boom. Problem solved.

 

[DontTalk]

That would assume that all actions in that time were slowed down equally, which isn´t clear. It is not like all actions in that time were slowed down and some amount of time can happen in cuts, like we also have them in this scene. Lastly it doesn´t solve the fact that naruto jumping off the moon still contradicts the speed given.

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

Some angsizing would be needed and a more secure timeframe but Naruto jumping off the moon shouldn't be an issue since he did so in base form and needed chakra mode to cross said distance to reach Toneri as shown afterwards.

 

[FinalBattleX01]

Yeah but here's the thing, you are using one instance to argue a different one. With that logic then a single instance of slow mo or a timeframe discrepancy in a series would invalidate everything else. Just because something happened in instance A doesn't mean it happened in instance B. Like Antvasima said, we have to look at this from a case-by-case basis.

Assuming I understand your argument, its possible he was that slow seeing as he was doing a simple jump in base form. Its obvious that the feat we are arguing was done through his cloak (seeing as he was cloaked once he reached Toneri) as opposed to the speed he demonstrated in his initial jump so I don't see how there would be a speed discrepancy.

Besides, as I have stated in the past, how is this any different than assuming a timeframe? Except in this instance we actually have a reason to use said timeframe.

 

[DontTalk]

"how is this any different than assuming a timeframe?"

If we assume timeframes we use hard low ends. What you ask for isn´t a low end.

"you are using one instance to argue a different one"

The instance we talk about is during the timeframe I mentioned. So I am using a general one to argue a more specific one, that belongs to the generalization.

"Its obvious that the feat we are arguing was done through his cloak (seeing as he was cloaked once he reached Toneri)"

Naruto has a flight jutsu that lets him get faster in mid air? That is news to me. Also if he changed into cloak form off screen as you suggest, doesn´t that also demonstrate how some things that happened weren´t shown?

 

[DontTalk]

I will have to continue the discussion tomorrow, as I have to sleep now. I think its best if I lock the thread until then, else I will have 20 replies which will make discussing in an ordered manner hard.

(if someone of the staff wants to say something to it now they of course can unlock the thread).

 

[DontTalk]

I did stuff.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you

 

[DontTalk]

Well, now we just have to wait what the rest thinks about it.

 

[Zerzavyx98]

mach 7,000 is looking "okay."

To many it might not seem reasonable but so didn't the other sub-rel passed calcs..

 

[Illuminati478]

i still don't believe the timeframe, from the same reason as before, but since its ceiling calc for this feat, i can believe it to be true...as a ceiling that is, not the actual value.

 

[Gomuguns]

..

 

[Gomuguns]

so ?