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Slight Percy Jackson stat adjustments.

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VersusJunkie54

VersusJunkie54

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It has been awhile since I've read the first Percy Jackson trilogy. So please correct me if I am wrong. I feel I'm bound to be. But I feel like this feat was taken out of context.

From what I remember, "Holding up the Heavens" was more of a feat of willpower than raw strength. Then there's also a matter of consistentcy. This is Percy's only 6-C feat, and it damn near broke him. It is also worth noting that Percy was incapacitated for some time when he survived the eruption of Mt St Helens. Yes, he did get stronger since then. But in this context, 7-B, to 6-C is a pretty big gap. Especially since the former nearly killed him. I find it unlikley he would've gotten that much stronger.

The profile also assumes that he would've been this strong through all of the books, and arcs. Beginning of series Percy being 6-C seems..... wrong to me.

So yeah, I have my doubts on this feat. But if someone can explain in detail why it is this way, I'll accept it. However, if it really is out of context, then downgrades may be in order.

Edit: Ignore all this. No downgrades are happening.
 
Well, there aren't that many good feats in Percy Jackson, so trying to create keys for him would go nowhere.


You should probably bring scans of it being based on the will to lift. And, Percy getting incaped by a volcanic explosion is probably just another case of "Writers don't do math". Even if Percy was struggling to lift it, he should be getting stronger overtime as you said.
 
@Versus

He also went toe-to-toe with the Titans and Giants, who should be able to replicate similar feats.
 
I'll have to find said scan when I get my hands on a book again.

But "Lifting The Heavens" sounds like a Hyperbole to me. It could either be interpreted as lifting the atomsphere, or the entire universe. The former, a bit questionable, the latter utterly ridiculous of course.

If it really was the weight of the atmosphere, shouldn't the ground under Percy's feet, along with othe others fractured and cracked under said weight? The fact that there seemed to be no enviormental effects from that kind of mass over a small area raises a lot of questions.

Again, forgive me if I'm wrong. It's been years since I've read PJO
 
@Versus

Okay stop.

You're arguing from incredulity. Atlas had that same weight for thousands of years and the mountain didn't crumble. Hercules did the same thing.

Further more it's corroborated by other demigod feats like Jason wrecking Mount Othrys in his battle with Krios and Nico collapsing a mountain fortress with his powers. Not to mention the many times they end up fighting the Giants, who were explicitly born to kill the Gods.
 
Okay, no need to be rude dude..... Cut me some slack, I already said I haven't read the books in quite some time.
 
@Versus

I'm sorry if I came across as rude, but argument from incredulity is literally the weakest kind of argument.
 
Yeah no. The lifting feat for Percy doesn't work, b/c he's not tanking the entirety of the weight (see here: https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1559922#63 for where we modified the lifting rules to account for human physiology) but Annabeth did have the sky literally drop on her (she didn't have time to brace and the sky is in motion) when she was lifting the sky, so he scales to her and the verse remains 6-C.

@Kepekley - Actually I did a calc for the Hazel island feat (assuming vaporization) and Spino did it too (assuming melting) to both get a value of 7-A so its still not 6-C. So pretty much the only feat we have that has 6-C is Annabeth surviving the sky dropping on her.
 
@XING

Again, no.

Greek Mythology =/= real world atmosphere. The sky is akin to a giant globe he has to carry, so he's lifting the entire sky by himself.

That's like saying that Superman's planet pushing feats aren't legitimate since his arms don't wrap around the entire planet.
 
No I get that which is why I said Annabeth speciffically works and he scales from her.

Percy's lift can't be used to get AP or durability b/c you generally can't get AP or durability based on lifting feats, due to the time involved in the lift. Like I stated, unlike a punch or a kick or any sort of attack, a lift is a slow sustained motion which allows for many more muscles fibers to be recruited into the movement, more easily (it's a bit like how if you hold your finger back with your other hand you can build up a lot more force with a flick from close distance than if you didn't and just tried to accelerate from a standing start), Lifting/pushing mvoements also allow the body's tendons to help out by storing the energy, then releasing it in a sudden burst, acting like a spring. If we use real world ratios, when the world's heaviest deadlift is compared to the world's most powerful punch, the deadlift has nearly 5 times more energy,

And you can't scale from his durability either b/c the sky wasn't in motion and he had time to apply an opposing force against the weight, which means he's only tanking a fraction of it (again the amount of energy involved in a deadlift if used in an actual attack would kill/severely damage most humans). Annabeth on the otherhand had the sky drop on her with no time to brace, so he scales from her, and 6-C remains.
 
@XING

Saying that the sky wasn't in motion is basically ignoring the text itself. Percy outright tells Artemis, "give me the sky", and she drops it on his shoulders after he gets under it so she can fight Atlas.

He takes the full weight of the sky, which seriously has me wondering if you read The Titan's Curse or not.
 
Even ignoring that, he still matched the Giants in hand-to-hand combat and bludgeoned Polybotes to death with Terminus' head.
 
@RR

Let's do some potential energy math.

Mass of the atmosphere: 5.15×10^18 kg.

Gravitational acceleration: 9.8 m/s^2

Height of an average 14 year old: 1.562 m.

5.15×10^18 kg * 9.8 m/s^2 * 1.562 m = 7.883414 × 10^19 Joules.

Island level

RR, do your homework before making statements like those.
 
Yes exactly just use the justification for Annabeth.

Also, no the book says ""I took out Riptide and slashed through her chains. Then I stepped nxt to her and braced myself on one knee - holding up my hands - and touched the could, heavy clouds. For a moment, Artemis and I bore the weight together." It did not drop on him.

Still you're right he should scale from beating up the giants, Jason destroying Mt. Orthys in his battle with Krios, and Annabeth having the sky drop on her. Basically, just change the justification and we're good.
 
So if a canonicly weaker Demigod like Annabeth was able to brace the weight of the atmosphere falling on her. Wouldn't that increase Percy's AP since as a member of the Big Three, he's the strongest breed of Demigod?
 
Not always, Hazel was killed by a weaker 7A explosion, so it proves that is doesn't necessarily mean they're stronger.

However, you are right as they are generally stronger so maybe put in at least 6-C instead?
 
@Versus and XING

Pretty much. It's more of a case of Riordan not knowing the math behind the feats he's writing than anything else.

All of the Seven were also able to take on the Giants in hand-to-hand combat as well, holding their own until the Gods arrived.
 
@Spino

"Hazel and Nico don't seem that strong"

Um... Hazel put a Giant to sleep all on her own when they're only supposed to be able to be put down by a God and Demigod working together.

Nico escaped Tartarus by himself when Percy couldn't and stomped a legion of Roman demigods and frequently strikes terror into both Jason and Percy.

Are you sure we're talking about the same characters?
 
@Spino

Nico can pulverize Gaea's Earthborn with ease while sickly and still recovering from his trip to Tartarus and Hazel is comparable to him.

Again, still not sure what you're taking about.

All of the Big Three's children scale period.
 
@Spino

Hazel fought the giants in close combat. We don't know which giants, but we know she did as a member of The Seven.

Nico is just as strong as her if not stronger.
 
@Spino

And it doesn't change the fact that Annabeth battled Enceladus, who is definitely not one of the weaker giants. Enceladus also fight Jason, who is also one of the Big Three.

Saying that Hazel and Nico don't scale to blatant Big Three demigod feats is like saying that Percy and Jason don't scale.
 
Reppuzan said:
@RR

Let's do some potential energy math.

Mass of the atmosphere: 5.15×10^18 kg.

Gravitational acceleration: 9.8 m/s^2

Height of an average 14 year old: 1.562 m.

5.15×10^18 kg * 9.8 m/s^2 * 1.562 m = 7.883414 × 10^19 Joules.

Island level

RR, do your homework before making statements like those.
Click to expand...
blogs.britannica.com/2012/01/how-much-does-earth-atmosphere-weigh/
 
@RR

"The total mean mass of the atmosphere is 5.1480×10^18 kg with an annual range due to water vapor of 1.2 or 1.5×10^15 kg, depending on whether surface pressure or water vapor data are used; somewhat smaller than the previous estimate. The mean mass of water vapor is estimated as 1.27×10^16 kg and the dry air mass as 5.1352 ±0.0003×10^18 kg." - American National Center for Atmospheric Research
 
And it doesn't change the fact that Annabeth battled Enceladus, who is definitely not one of the weaker giants

Uh...Enceladus was stated multiple times to be one of the weakest Giants.
 
@Kep

Then thank you for correcting me.

Still, even if Enceladus is one of the weakest giants, he still fought Jason.
 
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