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He has enough feats that i think he should be upgraded from solar system. I lnow alot of people call them outliers but universal seems reasonable.
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Should superman be upgraded to universal?
- Thread starter Masterchaotic
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Which superman?
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Elaborate.
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If you're talking about Post-Crisis Superman, he will not be upgraded to universal. Much of them are either not universal, are non-canon, or are strait up massive outliers. Pre-Crisis on the other hand is already universal.
Also, could you please up categories in your threads so that it's easier to find them next time?
Also, could you please up categories in your threads so that it's easier to find them next time?
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- Thread starter
- #6
Post crisis superman has shown more universal feats though and with how many there are how can they be outliers?
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The number of feats isn't really the relevant part, but just the fact that it would be contradictory is the importance. Superman actually has a ton of Tier 5 and 4 feats that are consistent. And the best Superman feat that's actually legit is only like 4-A, but there's only one and it required excessive amounts of prep time he doesn't normally have in order to perform.
As for Superman's two supposed universal feats, the Book of Infinite pages is not quantifiable. He never lifted it, and the combined strength of him and Shazam was not enough. Also, I don't think the book of infinite pages actually has infinite mass, it's just the title of the book from what I heard. Same with the Spectre lifting feat, the Spectre doesn't have infinite mass, her has interchangeable mass. And when Superman and Spectre tried lifting them, they both failed and it was Green Lantern who showcased being stronger than both of them combined at this point. And also, Superman and Zod shaking the phantom zone could be universal, but it's a statement and not a feat and too vague to consider.
As for Superman's two supposed universal feats, the Book of Infinite pages is not quantifiable. He never lifted it, and the combined strength of him and Shazam was not enough. Also, I don't think the book of infinite pages actually has infinite mass, it's just the title of the book from what I heard. Same with the Spectre lifting feat, the Spectre doesn't have infinite mass, her has interchangeable mass. And when Superman and Spectre tried lifting them, they both failed and it was Green Lantern who showcased being stronger than both of them combined at this point. And also, Superman and Zod shaking the phantom zone could be universal, but it's a statement and not a feat and too vague to consider.
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Superman and zod shaking the phantom zone wasnt just a statement we saw it happen. He also shattered a psychic reality made by dominus and he shattered reality to punch death. I'd say it should atleast be looked into.
Also was imperiax dropped a few teirs? I remember him being stronger.
Also was imperiax dropped a few teirs? I remember him being stronger.
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I know they shook the phantom zone, but "going to destroy it" was just a statement. Either way, Phantom Zone feats aren't really consistent as even Batman level characters have been shown to break out of it before. It seems to be easily triggered by chain reactions iirc. Not to mention, Superman consistently gets knocked out by Supernovas and other events and characters who peak out at stellar levels. And even the official DC Comics said "Post-Crisis Superman's strength is no where near universal; there always be weights he can't lift, enemies he can't outrun and can be defeated through overpowering" or something along those lines.
Finally, there's the fact that the Infinite Mass Punch is specifically calculated to be 619 Kilofoe and that's Superman's absolute most powerful attack. An attack so strong, it makes Superman faint.
Finally, there's the fact that the Infinite Mass Punch is specifically calculated to be 619 Kilofoe and that's Superman's absolute most powerful attack. An attack so strong, it makes Superman faint.
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Do you have a scan of this statement by DC comics?
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Well im newer to the site and given debates iv had with superman fans in the past iv been told superman is 11D because supposedly a universe is 11D in DC based on the imperiax scan. And while i dont bielive that superman does have universal feats.AKM sama said:
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Well, I know Cartoon Fight club isn't reliable, but this specific scan is. pause video at the 15:11 mark 100% official source from DC Comics literally confirming that anything higher than 3-A should be impossible for Superman.
And we've already been over this countless times about the rest. And why he won't ever be any higher than 4-B. But yeah, it's true that there are countless Superman wankers out there. But there should be a discussion rule or something regarding Post-Crisis Superman and perhaps a detailed blog addressing every point if possible at this point. Surprised there wasn't a discussion rule already.
And we've already been over this countless times about the rest. And why he won't ever be any higher than 4-B. But yeah, it's true that there are countless Superman wankers out there. But there should be a discussion rule or something regarding Post-Crisis Superman and perhaps a detailed blog addressing every point if possible at this point. Surprised there wasn't a discussion rule already.
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The phantom zone thing isn't super usable. In context the zone was tied with Superman's and Zod's life force or something. So the more damage they took the more damage the realm took
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Really?
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Yeah. I'll get the scans and post it when I have the time
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So in other words, shaking the Phantom zone is a chain reaction that isn't applicable to the tiers of Superman or Zod.
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Yeah. The most it proves is that Zod can hurt Superman and Superman can hurt Zod
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Is that from the newer story arc in rebirth. Because i remember them shaking the phantom zone in that one when fighting rogol zaar.Qawsedf234 said:
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I mean I have something that could upgrade Superman but it's just to a higher degree of Solar System level (Megafoe range)
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No. Thats from the For Tomorrow arc back in 2005Masterchaotic said:
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He read to the end but he used some weird computer to do so iirc
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How does her saying "Shook out solar system" translate to galaxy level range? Does the comic state they were at the opposite side of the galaxy or something
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"Shook a galaxy"
The scan explicitly states solar system.
The scan explicitly states solar system.
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Damn misread it lol (I'll check out the comic to see more context tho)
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Assuming they're talking about the Darkseid vs Superman fight in Superman/Batman then it was not at the edge. It happened near the Sun after Superman got a minor solar amp
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Rocked means "slightly shaking"
This feat has been calculated at 5-A before, I think.
This feat has been calculated at 5-A before, I think.
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I could try writing the discussion rule, but the blog would probably take a lot more time. Though, I could ask them for help yes. Probably something like this. Additionally, AssaltWaffle I know had plans to reword all the franchise specific rules into a blog post list. I'm open for improvement, but a rough draft for the discussion rule would look a little something like this.
- Please refrain from upgrading Superman (Post-Crisis) to anything beyond 4-B. We have had countless discussions for years on the issue. The conclusion is that there are far too many outliers, canonicity issues, and lack of legitimacy for any feat beyond that.
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Yes, although it may be better to link to the blog in a footnotes section for the Superman (Post-Crisis) page itself.
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