Should hakai from dragon ball be used in vs matches?

[Twisted_Little_Raven]

This is the most flawed existence erasure attack I have ever seen tbh. It's been proven to not work on people on at least the same level. Belmod isn't erasing jiren or macarita, he simply can't. Hakai energy can be withstood and overpowered.

So if hakai only works on something with less energy than the attack, why should it even be used?That goes for any attack. If I'm a 6-A and a 6-B fired a blast at me, his attack is getting flat out overpowered by mine. The only difference I'm seeing.. is that when you are killed by hakai you go bye bye, so I guess it works for people with annoying regen , but still same strength at least and it's useless

. Frieza somehow withstood it twice.. hakai feels so selective in what it wants to destroy too. It destroyed a rock coming at toppo but why not the ground beneath him? I mean he is surrounded in hakai energy so in reality he should have eliminated himself. The only use I see for hakai.. opponent is weaker than hakai user and opponent has really good regen. I don't see any other good scenario

 

[Twisted_Little_Raven]

On my phone but for some reason it doesn't show all of my words. Weird

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Pretty sure that's just resistance, not "Hakai doesn't work on stronger people".

Also it doesn't matter if it has limited use, it won't go anywhere.

 

[Theglassman12]

It's still just hax. The fact that other resisted it means that they are resistant to the ability. That's how it's been for like A LOT of characters in this wiki.

 

[Therefir]

Dragon Ball has always worked like that, if the opponent is stronger than you then he resist your hax.

It is obvious that Toppo can control his hakai aura or that all who tried to attack him would have been erased.

 

[Twisted_Little_Raven]

hmm

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

The only use I see for hakai.. opponent is weaker than hakai user and opponent has really good regen. I don't see any other good scenario

Killing incorporeal enemies, destroying souls, stuff like that.

 

[Twisted_Little_Raven]

That too

 

[Theglassman12]

That too

So how does that mitigate how useful the Hakai is?

 

[Twisted_Little_Raven]

Barely

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

I mean, nevermind the fact that the ability to harm non-corporeals can make the difference between a stomp and a win.

 

[Twisted_Little_Raven]

What about a 2-C vs Beerus that isn't non-corporeal?

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Said 2-C one shots him.

 

[Twisted_Little_Raven]

Yes, but is the 2-C tanking the hakai? Honestly hakai has nlf potential but Ima leave it at that.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Every Durability Negation attack has NLF potential. There comes a time when people should have common sense to realize that if Beerus tries to hakai a 2-A, he's gonna get killed beforehand.

 

[Akreious]

The ability to overpower hax via sheer power is an aspect of the verse itself; not a weakness of the verse's haxes. I think that's what people needs to get. In Dragon Ball, you're able to overpower any hax as long as you're superior in power (Vegeta Versus Toppo Hakais, Goku Versus Hit, Shenron being unable to do anything against people stronger than his creator, etc). There's simply a TON of evidence that characters in this verse naturally just gain resistances the more power they have. The only other way to explain this phenomenon is if ALL hax in Dragon Ball only work on weaker enemies, which is frankly ridiculous on all accounts.

 

[Grimreaperofjustice]

Ok TOPPO used "Hakai energy" two diffrent things because even Frieza managed to manifiest "Hakai Energy" honestly IMO someone should highlight/ make a thread to get Destuction energy and destruction two seperate things as you could tell Beerus' Hakai is MUCH,... MUCH more diffrent from Toppo and Frieza Hakai energy is intended for "weaker same level opponents" as hakai is Im erasing you, your body, and soul... One is just an OP ki blast while the other is an hax Erasure do you get my point?

 

[Grimreaperofjustice]

Also Frieza was never on the level of a hakaishin so him manifiesting and blocking that energy should stand out in the diffrences

 

[Grimreaperofjustice]

Heres my thing Zeno charges his "squish" for stronger opponents or harder things and IMO I know this might sound like wank but given a properly charged hakai from him depending if your in the 2 teir or not I think you need to be above 1-c in order to survive it so honestly with a charge hakai I think Zeno is 2-A but as for Beerus I think his Hakai cap. is either 2-C or loweerrrrrrrr end of 2-B nothing more

 

[Son_Gandhi]

Remember toppo wasn't allowed to kill in the tournament so his hakai may have been more effective without restrictions. Beerus has clearly mastered his hakai power but as of right now it's limits are unclear.

 

[Belyompusct]

lolnecro.

 

[Son_Gandhi]

Nani

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

This necro tho...

 

[AKM sama]

Every hax has limits. You can't assume a hax will work on everyone when the opponent is out of your paygrade and the user has no feat of successfully haxing anyone on that level.

That said, DB has time and again shown that more ki = more hax resistance. DB characters who have higher ki can overpower certain hax. It doesn't mean that hakai doesn't have existence erasure or it's not a hax. I agree with Akreious.

EDIT: Didn't realize it was a necro lol

 

[Grimreaperofjustice]

true XD

 

[Neo_hakkaishin]

v

 

[Neo_hakkaishin]

Look the friend up is right when he said
One is just an OP ki blast (with the characteristic of erasing opponents of existence if the user kills the opponent using that energy) while the other is a hax, so much so that the shidora, already used both versions, one he gave to the and the other he used to erase a city, and in the scene, you do not see a sphere of energy, heading to the city, so they should not be the same technique


little curiosity, if you fuse all the characters of draon ball canon and not canon with zeno, we have practically an omnipotent being

because zeno has all the power, but not the knowledge to use them, zuno knows everything but does not have the strength or power to use them, there are hundreds of ubiquitous characters and almost this in dragon baal (counting canon and canon), there are, however it does not look like it, several hax in dragon ball, and a practically omnipotent being by granting wishes

fusing all the characters of dragon bal would have a being at least almost omnipotent

 

[Assaltwaffle]

@Neo

I can agree that is two separate applications of the same energy.

I don't know why you included the second part, but no, a "composite dragon ball super" character would not be omnipotent. It would be 2-C with a limited amount of hax. AKA it would be beaten by a fair number of 2-Cs and most 2-Bs and higher.

 

[Son_Gandhi]

If 2 zeno's fused and then grand priest fused with all angels and then fused with that fused zeno then fused with goku and Vegeta that would be at least 2-A.

 

[Akreious]

How would fusing a bunch of 2'Cs create a 2-A?

 

[Son_Gandhi]

The rise in power would be exponential, like considering we haven't even seen zeno's limits, the potential power and abilities that fused being would have could be huge

 

[Akreious]

2-A is infinite. Even exponential powers by Googols and quindecillions per micro nanoseconds wouldn't be 2-A.

 

[Son_Gandhi]

Couldn't zeno be 2-A but we have just not seen it displayed, I mean its very unclear the true limits of zeno's power. How would a being who is not 2-A actually become a 2-A?

 

[Akreious]

Just because we haven't seen the limit of someone's powers doesn't mean they have infinite. Or does Saitama get 3-A now because "he never tried"?


In order for a being that's not 2-A to become 2-A, they literally need to be infinitely more powerful than they were before. Fanfics usually do this via Kaioken x Infinity (Dun ask me how).

 

[Son_Gandhi]

Fair enough I see what you're saying. the fusion I came up with was purely hypothetical based on how fusion has been displayed and the power of those involved, couldn't it be possible for the fusion to be exponentially infinite though? If not then 2-B? Saitama could be that powerful, hopefully we will see a lot more of what he is truly capable of in season 2, mayve even pushed to his limits.

 

[Akreious]

2-B is a definite possibility if we take "Fusions are exponential".

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Just saying that we have literally just past a rule saying that just because you are infinitely stronger as a Low 2-C or 2-C, that does not grant you 2-A.

 

[Grimreaperofjustice]

^ The only reason Zeno is 2-B - 2-A is statements... '

Like I said cap for Beerus/ GoD's is 2-C

Don't make it seem like I said "its because he is infinatley stronger"

 

[InfiniteBlack123]

So what about characters from the Xenoverse and the world of the Heros.


Souldn't they be 2-A since they can effect a world with and Infinite amount of timelines. Xenoverse's recent dlc confirms the existence of Infinite History and timelines.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Infinite History=/=Infinite Timelines