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SHION vs YHWACH REMATCH

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Arkenis said:
I just wanna see the evidence for souls in Slime having info 2,
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Click here, even Rimuru WN and LN have HGR because information was accepted as a fundamental aspect and in that same scan it says that the soul is information, in a while Shion will receive type 2 information manipulation for being able to affect the soul too, we will just ask you to close this while the profile remains out of date
 
Worthless said:
Can you elaborate?
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It's straightforward, I don't need to elaborate. If your unable to understand that there's not much I can do for you.
Worthless said:
W/e you says that's how they were written if they are unaffected by it because they exist outside of it then so be it like wtf other verse causality got to do with theirs
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They don't exist outside of the laws of cause and effect, type 4 Acausality works on basing themselves on a different system of cause and effect. They are not immune, they're resistant as per the literal wiki page.
Worthless said:
Lol look at altair, anos and akato sai profiles.
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Both of them have higher D hax and work on different systems. Akato is literally tier 1, he exists outside of cause and effect due to him being outerversal and transcending it.
Worthless said:
God stop with this 3D level acausality and so what if one can manipulate infinite time no matter how many ***** one can manipulate if someone doesn't have it to manipulate to begin with then it's irrelevant.
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No I won't stop with this "3-D Acausality shit." because you fail to understand the basic principles of how Acausality works. Yhwach doesn't even manipulate time so you literally have zero idea what your talking about as per usual Worthless. Her system of causality is only 3-D, Yhwach's Fate hax works on a 4-D level. Acausality on a 3-D level isn't saving her.
Worthless said:
Your argument is basically like this "I can manipulate the soul of someone who doesn't have a soul" "I can manipulate someone concept who doesn't have a concept" lmao
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You are single handily the user who lacks the most amount of reading comprehension on the wiki. This is very different than what I'm saying, she has type 4 Acausality. She isn't immune to causality or fate hax, especially ones that work on an Infinitely higher level than the system of cause and effect that her verse works on.



So again don't @ me with your shit arguments if you yourself have little to no idea on what your even arguing.
 
Peak said:
I understand what you mean and what I am trying to tell you is that the fundamental aspect of bleach is not information, I'm not denying that it has a fundamental aspect, but as long as Yhwatch can't affect type 2 information (slime's fundamental aspect) Shion can't be killed, because she can exist as a soul which is composed of type 2 information, this is how type 2 information manipulation works
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Dude you just don't get what is information type 2. It doesn't have to be fundamental aspects of the verse. It can be fundamental aspects of somethings made up of information. You are only considering based on Tensura having information type 2 because the verse completely made up of it. That's not the case for others.

Conceptual Manipulation is treated as more potent than information in many verses and you don't need information manipulation if you have Conceptual manipulation which can encompass information manipulation.

Again information type 2 isn't given to only verses which has complete verse based on information. Only some aspects which governs the reality is enough. What you are trying to say is solely based on Tensura which is not the case for other verses.
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
Dude you just don't get what is information type 2. It doesn't have to be fundamental aspects of the verse. It can be fundamental aspects of somethings made up of information. You are only considering based on Tensura having information type 2 because the verse completely made up of it. That's not the case for others.
Click to expand...
Fundamental: These characters can manipulate information, which serves as fundamental building block of reality
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if the information is not fundamental, then it is not type 2 information
EldemadeDityjon said:
Conceptual Manipulation is treated as more potent than information in many verses and you don't need information manipulation if you have Conceptual manipulation which can encompass information manipulation.
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As you said yourself, if in verse the concept is considerad superior to information then yes, but this is not something applied by default, you need to prove that it works like that in verse, if so, characters with conceptual manipulation should acquire type 2 information manipulation, and before you say that in bleach this is treated this way, there is nothing proving that the information composes the reality of something in bleach, and again, if you do, do a CRT about it and i will accept that concept>type 2 information in bleach, what i showed was accepted in verse and what you are showing me was not accepted, simple
EldemadeDityjon said:
Again information type 2 isn't given to only verses which has complete verse based on information. Only some aspects which governs the reality is enough. What you are trying to say is solely based on Tensura which is not the case for other verses.
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Yes, I have no problems with that so I agree, now I need you to show me the information in bleach being the fundamental aspect of reality, i.e. it must be shown the character rewriting/destroying something in reality using the information and that would be type 2 information and it must be linked to the profile, and before you say about Ichibe, I don't see type 2 manipulation of information on his profile so I won't take him seriously until I have him
 
Peak said:
if the information is not fundamental, then it is not type 2 information
Click to expand...
You still don't understand what written in their. You don't need whole verse made up of information to get information Manipulation
Peak said:
As you said yourself, if in verse the concept is considerad superior to information then yes, but this is not something applied by default, you need to prove that it works like that in verse, if so, characters with conceptual manipulation should acquire type 2 information manipulation, and before you say that in bleach this is treated this way, there is nothing proving that the information composes the reality of something in bleach, and again, if you do, do a CRT about it and i will accept that concept>type 2 information in bleach, what i showed was accepted in verse and what you are showing me was not accepted, simple
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Dude 💀 read this again you are not getting the point
Arkenis said:
Yeah to add to what @EldemadeDityjon stated

Names are by themselves fundamental information to characters in Bleach, changing this changes them and what they are. Yhwach can resist such hax through the almighty so interacting via the almighty with info 2 is definitely in Yhwach’s capabilities
Click to expand...
Peak said:
Yes, I have no problems with that so I agree, now I need you to show me the information in bleach being the fundamental aspect of reality, i.e. it must be shown the character rewriting/destroying something in reality using the information and that would be type 2 information and it must be linked to the profile, and before you say about Ichibe, I don't see type 2 manipulation of information on his profile so I won't take him seriously until I have him
Click to expand...
Names are literally information 🗿
Feel free to read it when you are free
en.wikipedia.org

Information - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org


Same goes for Shion then i won't take her having information type 2 based soul.
 
LordGinSama said:
It's straightforward, I don't need to elaborate. If your unable to understand that there's not much I can do for you.
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Just explain what higher dimensional causality is and it's connection with the lower one then i will be content
LordGinSama said:
They don't exist outside of the laws of cause and effect, type 4 Acausality works on basing themselves on a different system of cause and effect. They are not immune, they're resistant as per the literal wiki page.
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Yeah, no, you are contradicting what the novel said , it said they exist outside of it [1] and not different
LordGinSama said:
Both of them have higher D hax and work on different systems. Akato is literally tier 1, he exists outside of cause and effect due to him being outerversal and transcending it.
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Hell are you even talking about? What higher dimensionsal hax got to do with their type 4/Acausality hm?

And that's not what I'm talking about I'm talking about his 2-C form and not his 1-A form
LordGinSama said:
No I won't stop with this "3-D Acausality shit." because you fail to understand the basic principles of how Acausality works. Yhwach doesn't even manipulate time so you literally have zero idea what your talking about as per usual Worthless. Her system of causality is only 3-D, Yhwach's Fate hax works on a 4-D level. Acausality on a 3-D level isn't saving her.
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If he doesn't manipulate the time then how tf his hax is 4D then? Now that I focus on this, manipulating an infinite possibilities is not equal to manipulating a higher dimensionsal fate it's just like how a 2-A characters can't ascend to low 1-C by just merely destroying or manipulating an infinite universes but if so then explain?

And just stop with this 3D shit Acausality cause this doesn't literally make any sense considering some of them are f outside of even time dimension
LordGinSama said:
You are single handily the user who lacks the most amount of reading comprehension on the wiki. This is very different than what I'm saying, she has type 4 Acausality. She isn't immune to causality or fate hax, especially ones that work on an Infinitely higher level than the system of cause and effect that her verse works on.
Click to expand...
And i keep saying she is outside of it and not different so basically your argument is same to the examples I've given and how many times do i have to say that no matter how many possibilities or higher level it is you can't manipulate someone who doesn't have it to begin with
LordGinSama said:
So again don't @ me with your shit arguments if you yourself have little to no idea on what your even arguing.
Click to expand...
You are not the one to talk like yuck i didn't open this site to argue with anybody I'm here to check my thread, i just happened i see this 3D or whatever it is through link in tensei discussion if not for you acting like we've debate before i won't even bother replying to you so don't act like I'm enjoying this

Anyway i would just use your ***** to debunk your own argument in case you don't know each universe in tensei had its own law and causality [2] each verse system work differently than the others, so even if you say it's different instead of outside the outcome is still the same considering he doesn't have a feat that suggest he could manipulate a causality different to what he has shown to manipulate or a causality similar to theirs US users.
 
I don't even need to reply to that trash ass argument. 3-D Acausality is a literal thing that's already accepted, it's based upon dimensionality to quite frankly I don't give a flying **** what you say or think Worthless. Make a CRT if you think 3-D resistances covers 4-D hax or if you think Type 4 Acausality makes you immune to any form of cause and effect.
 
Worthless said:
Just explain what higher dimensional causality is and it's connection with the lower one then i will be content.
Click to expand...
I've explained it, you're just a stubborn clown who refuses to understand shit that's simple to understand out of sheer ignorance, so I'll entertain your dumbass arguments by backhanding you with my ring hand.
Worthless said:
Yeah, no, you are contradicting what the novel said , it said they exist outside of it [1] and not different.
Click to expand...
Which is irrelevant, the profiles don't state that they exist outside the laws of cause and effect outside of their own verse. Now I suppose she can resist the Thought Robot's plot Manipulation based on her being Acausal? "Hmmm."
Worthless said:
Hell are you even talking about? What higher dimensionsal hax got to do with their type 4/Acausality hm?
Click to expand...
There's a difference of infinity between the two, "hmm"
Worthless said:
And that's not what I'm talking about I'm talking about his 2-C form and not his 1-A form
Click to expand...
Again that's irrelevant.
Worthless said:
If he doesn't manipulate the time then how tf his hax is 4D then?
Click to expand...
time isnt required to be higher D? Oh wait i forgot, i'm dealing with you who can overwrite the system that the staff created despite being a literal nobody blue name.
Worthless said:
Now that I focus on this, manipulating an infinite possibilities is not equal to manipulating a higher dimensionsal fate it's just like how a 2-A characters can't ascend to low 1-C by just merely destroying or manipulating an infinite universes but if so then explain?
Click to expand...
💀 bro you just proved my point. These are actual ******* braindead argument that a donkey could debunk. Different levels of infinity exist, 2-A is 4-D, Low 1-C is 5-D.


I.E a gap of infinity.
Worthless said:
And just stop with this 3D shit Acausality cause this doesn't literally make any sense considering some of them are f outside of even time dimension.
Click to expand...
No I will not stop with this "3-D Acausality." because it's a literal ******* thing you goober. Don't sit here and condescend to me, acting as if you know what your talking about despite being wrong.
Worthless said:
And i keep saying she is outside of it and not different so basically your argument is same to the examples I've given and how many times do i have to say that no matter how many possibilities or higher level it is you can't manipulate someone who doesn't have it to begin with.
Click to expand...
Again type 4 isn't Immunity to changes to cause and effect. If you think she can negate changes to cause and effect from a 1-A character I'd suggest finding out if you were dropped on the head as a kid
Worthless said:
You are not the one to talk like yuck i didn't open this site to argue with anybody I'm here to check my thread, i just happened i see this 3D or whatever it is through link in tensei discussion if not for you acting like we've debate before i won't even bother replying to you so don't act like I'm enjoying this.
Click to expand...
Because you get slapped around every time we've debated.
Worthless said:
Anyway i would just use your ***** to debunk your own argument in case you don't know each universe in tensei had its own law and causality [2] each verse system work differently than the others, so even if you say it's different instead of outside the outcome is still the same considering he doesn't have a feat that suggest he could manipulate a causality different to what he has shown to manipulate or a causality similar to theirs US users.
Click to expand...
Again, that's irrelevant unless the cosmology is 4-D which isn't noted in her profile. Your literally making shit up and intentionally twisting my words to fit your narrative.



Now do me a solid and hold that fat ass L.
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
You still don't understand what written in their. You don't need whole verse made up of information to get information Manipulation
Click to expand...
yes, i already said i accept this, it is not necessary for you to restate this
EldemadeDityjon said:
Names are literally information 🗿
Feel free to read it when you are free
Click to expand...
I already said that I won't accept this kind of argument while manipulation of information type 2 is not on Ichibei's or Yhwatch's profile, if they can handle type 2 information then this must be linked to the profile
EldemadeDityjon said:
Same goes for Shion then i won't take her having information type 2 based soul
Click to expand...
I'm also sure I already said that we are updating Shion and that's why this topic should be closed, don't ignore what I say forcing your words, even the update CRT has already been created, although it's an upgrade for them to have type 2 information manipulation and the soul being information as a fundamental aspect has already been accepted, so it's really useless here, as long as Yhwatch doesn't have type 2 information manipulation in the profile, it can't kill Shion
 
Purgy said:
Also, even if Yhwach didn't neg up to Mid-Godly, 99% of his abilities damage and destroy the soul, so her Low-Godly is about as useless as not even having regeneration in the first place against Yhwach
Click to expand...
Yhwach cant erase shion souls which based on IM2
 
Peak said:
I don't think it's necessary to think about it too much, this match is bothering for an incon, Shion can't affect NEP1 and Yhwatch can't affect type 2 info, that's the current status of the match
Click to expand...
Yhwach nep1 is limited which not hes real pysicalogy.. uf u pook up in hes profile hes nep1 is based on skill..
 
rainheart said:
Yhwach nep1 is limited which not hes real pysicalogy.. uf u pook up in hes profile hes nep1 is based on skill..
Click to expand...
oh so Shion can affect him? Anyway, let's close this and when we update Shion's profile we can create this again
 
Peak said:
oh so Shion can affect him? Anyway, let's close this and when we update Shion's profile we can create this again
Click to expand...
Yeah she cann its should be a wincon for her..
Reason?
Nep1 yhwach are based on skill.
The Vanishing Point - Enhanced Invisibility, Nonexistent Physiology (Nature: Type 1 - Aspect: Type 1),..
SHION Ultimate skill susanoo would stomp..
Yhwach cant kill shion LGR which based on IM2..
Resistence for Almighty(stop with so called 4D Acca4 thing)
And Next up Diablo LN vs Yhwach🥱
 
I stand by my point that Shion's profile should be updated anyway, when it's updated I'll come back here or if it's closed we create another topic vs
 
Purgy said:
Why are you bumping immediately after posting?

Yhwach negs currently, he doesn't even need anything more than The Almighty to do it
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Ur ignoring IM2 and acca4..
And dont say like 4D fate manip can bypass acca4 cuz like i sayd there is nothing as 4D acca4 (and even so im pretty sure acca4 has resistence to TS and all TS are 4D)..
 
rainheart said:
Ur ignoring IM2 and acca4..
And dont say like 4D fate manip can bypass acca4 cuz like i sayd there is nothing as 4D acca4 (and even so im pretty sure acca4 has resistence to TS and all TS are 4D)..
Click to expand...
I am ignoring IM2 until it's written on Shion's profile yes

And apparently Acausality is based on dimensions now so her Acausality Type 4 is irrelevant to 4-D fate hax
 
rainheart said:
And btw im pretty sure "The Almighty"
Is just 4D based on range.
( (4D - Multiversal+ - The Almighty allows Yhwach to see everything clearly from the present into the distant future [33])
Not does it means can affect 4D being and it has no feats affecting 4D being..
So it wouldnt be a problem..
Click to expand...
So disingenuous lol
Precognition and Fate Manipulation (4D - Multiversal+ - The Almighty allows Yhwach to see everything clearly from the present into the distant future [33]. Yhwach can see events in the near future, such as seeing the resurrection of Ichibē Hyōsube [34]. The Almighty was also used to foresee events several millions of years into the future, such as perceiving the death of the Soul King [35]. Yhwach can see all possible futures like grains of sand on a beach. The true power of The Almighty is to “transform the future itself.” Yhwach is capable of changing and influencing all of the futures that he sees. The Almighty allows Yhwach to cut down any fate his opponent may make for themselves [36]. Yhwach can destroy something in all possible futures with The Almighty [37]. The number of futures that Yhwach can manipulate [38] are repeatedly stated to be infinite [39]. With The Almighty, Yhwach can set traps and attack his opponent instantly through rewriting and attacking through the future [40]. Yhwach’s attacks through the future cannot be sensed as well [41]. If his attacks were to be blocked, he can rewrite the future to make his attack successful [42]. Yhwach can defend himself from attacks by destroying the attack through the future [43])
Click to expand...
4-D Potency, make a CRT if you believe otherwise
 
Purgy said:
So disingenuous lol

Precognition and Fate Manipulation (4D - Multiversal+ - The Almighty allows Yhwach to see everything clearly from the present into the distant future [33]. Yhwach can see events in the near future, such as seeing the resurrection of Ichibē Hyōsube [34]. The Almighty was also used to foresee events several millions of years into the future, such as perceiving the death of the Soul King [35]. Yhwach can see all possible futures like grains of sand on a beach. The true power of The Almighty is to “transform the future itself.” Yhwach is capable of changing and influencing all of the futures that he sees. The Almighty allows Yhwach to cut down any fate his opponent may make for themselves [36]. Yhwach can destroy something in all possible futures with The Almighty [37]. The number of futures that Yhwach can manipulate [38] are repeatedly stated to be infinite [39].
Click to expand...
Just like i have sayd thats just the Range(4D range) and has no feats like affecting 4D being..
 
rainheart said:
Im not saying shion is 4D.. im just sayin Almighty are just 4D based on range.. so still.. get neg by acca4
Click to expand...
What is listed is it's potency, I was part of the CRT that got it accepted lol...

Again, make a CRT to remove it, but a warning, you'll 100% be clowned by people who actually know what they're talking about so I'd advise against it
 
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