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Shinza banshou discussion thread~Revival~

Ren1999 said:
i heard a rumor that yuri debubk cosmology shinza became L1C on fb, I was a bit surprised to hear that rumor even though I thought it was just a rumor
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Well whether it is true he did it or not, it has nothing to do with us here if he did not try to do so here.
Chasekilleen said:
I kind of forgot. Did Yuri even read K3?
I don't remember if he played it or not lol
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He never played it but I think like everyone else who did not play it, he read it here and there
 
Tarang123 said:
He said he did
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Tarang123 said:
He did play the game...sort of. More of, he found a playlist that had a majority of the game and basically finished it.
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I'm only asking because some of the parts he picked out in that "downgrade thread" were severely misinterpreted. I think he did admit that he misunderstood how it was written (which I appreciate his frankness/honesty).
But it just honestly doesn't make sense to me that he read it and misunderstood the main argument he was supporting.
 
Ultra_instinct_issei said:
read this bois
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As He is arguably one of the most knowledgeable on the series so yes I actually agree with most of what he said, removing the name calling obviously, but I can see where he is coming from which was why I actually advocated for deletion of the series. Like there were **** tons of things wrong with the verse. well here is his post
One thing he is wrong on tho is that we did not acknowledge avesta, like wtf? where did he see that.
literally all the supporters here that I know, not the power hungry ones as there indeed some, all of them acknowledges it which is why it is, delete the pages wait for Aditya to end and we can continue from there
They are too busy crying about Pantheon's cancellation to notice that the series continues and has moved onto greener pastures. I'd be damned if, what, 3 users there know Avesta even exists. That's the level of giving a shit and "accuracy" you should expect of them. But they care about more stuff than just "Lol this is broken" and "lol powerlevels", or at least that's what they say. My two cents: if you aren't keeping up with a series with readily available info in English, no matter how much you claim there is not (because some users, me in between them, make quite the effort so this is the case, despite said new content being behind a ******* paywall), and the most you do is spent your time in some wiki arguing powerlevels, upgrades and downgrades... call me crazy, but it sounds like you don't care about the series. That's the level of the "fanbase" there.

The only hot shit on that site is making gross misinterpretations of shit from KKK, obviously through the filter of Machine Translators (oh, but don't you dare call them out, they'll begin crying), trying to fit them into their shitty tiering system while also getting important lore related stuff massively wrong. And they'd do this either to wank or downplay stuff for whatever reasons each user has. Oh, and never forget the absolutely meme "1-A Mercurius laugh" or multiversal Briah Machina because of the aftereffects of Lui's death. Or Gigaversal+++ Longinus for Kemono-dono as an Apostle. Right now, there seems to be some absolute c**t in there who, on top of lying about certain users who regularly post in this forum, claims Singularity (absolute nothingness) has "realms" (whatever this is) within it and that Yakou's dimensional dislocations in KKK are some kind of cosmology size indicator for some reason.

The site itself is also, IMO, the most relevant cause of lots of powerlevel obsessed r**s flocking to this series in search of that and nothing more, while giving not a single **** about the story, and it's also the salt source of another handful who hate the series for nothing more than battleboard salt.
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Oh I think he misread Quasi in the singularity having realms, no one said they do, it was more like it may acts as layers, as it gets harder to go deeper and you need to guide your own soul to some higher existence before you keep drilling deeper. Something I agree with, but no one ever said singularity has realms.
The thing is that, trying to fit the singularity into our tiering systems will have it act as it as some layers, not saying it does literally but similar.

Another guy said this
This really isn't the place to discuss whatever Omega lul shit is happening on another website.
And after much laugh (we've seen that thread, ******* hilarious by the way), we elitists assh*les, couldn't care less about those twats and the shit they're swimming in (somehow being able to consume a media in an eastern language makes you an elitist).

Yes, Avesta of Black and White exists
Yes, it is important to the Shinza serie
No, you can't cherry pick and ignore it if you follow the serie
No, it isn't a spin-off like boruto or like some twat over there considering KKK like an arc from Naruto (laughed so hard)
If you want to ignore it, then ignore Paradise Lost, Kajiri Kamui Kagura and Aditya who is around the corner too
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Seriously who has been saying that avesta does not matter among you guys?
 
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technically
Ren and Reinhard are sons of Mercurius and Ren loves Rea who is great-granddaughter of Reinhard. So, in a indirect way he love his great-granddaughter.
Magsarion is son of Mitra's avatar. Indirectly Mitra is mother of Magsarion.
In a way, Marie is indirectly mother of Ren, Reinhard and Machina.
 
Ultra_instinct_issei said:
read this bois
Click to expand...
There was no one here who ignored Avesta. We were only waiting for Avesta to be finished and perhaps translated into English. We could not use Avesta's contents for scaling cosmology before it was finished. Personally, I was so interested in Avesta that I read the summary of almost half of the story and I am still waiting for the light novel or visual novel (which is going to be published in the future) to be translated into English. Also, no one had ignored Paradise Lost, We were looking for important scans from Paradise Lost.
 
Ultra_instinct_issei said:
read this bois
Click to expand...
Also wtf bruh? First of all, someone who is focused on powerscaling a verse can be a fan of it, many times we only powerscale the verses we love. Secondly, you can be a fan because of the power level of a verse, everyone becomes a fan of something for a reason, one of those reasons can be the power level, there is nothing wrong with such a thing; also the power level is part of the story, so you are actually a fan of the story. Thirdly, not everyone has the time, money and motivation to learn Japanese, which is one of the most difficult languages in the world, just to read a series; Not learning Japanese doesn't mean you're not a Masadaverse fan. I personally have no motivation to learn Japanese other than reading Masadaverse, I still have to spend years to learn it?!
 
Infera28 said:
Also wtf bruh? First of all, someone who is focused on powerscaling a verse can be a fan of it, many times we only powerscale the verses we love. Secondly, you can be a fan because of the power level of a verse, everyone becomes a fan of something for a reason, one of those reasons can be the power level, there is nothing wrong with such a thing; also the power level is part of the story, so you are actually a fan of the story. Thirdly, not everyone has the time, money and motivation to learn Japanese, which is one of the most difficult languages in the world, just to read a series; Not learning Japanese doesn't mean you're not a Masadaverse fan. I personally have no motivation to learn Japanese other than reading Masadaverse, I still have to spend years to learn it?!
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I think the point they're making is that there's a gross misinterpretation of the story because of the obsession with scaling the verse. I myself have seen people do things like this. That being said, I do think they're going too far with the whole Japanese thing or even the fact that the site never used Avesta.
 
If there is anyone or people who are interested in getting Avesta and Aditya, please can you signify.
The plan is to get them and then find a Translator also and get them to translate the work for us.
Thanks.
 
I'm planning to read K3 and Paradise Lost once i finished with Demonbane's RT. After that, i will gather materials to write Shinza's cosmology with the help from my friends. Let see what i can do.
 
Mugen_no_Setsuna said:
I'm planning to read K3 and Paradise Lost once i finished with Demonbane's RT. After that, i will gather materials to write Shinza's cosmology with the help from my friends. Let see what i can do.
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You don't have to worry about shinza's cosmology. It is done already.
But as a forum we need a version somewhere for us alone.
do you speak japanese?
 
Pain_to12 said:
If there is anyone or people who are interested in getting Avesta and Aditya, please can you signify.
The plan is to get them and then find a Translator also and get them to translate the work for us.
Thanks.
Click to expand...
I've read a few chapters of Aditya (like 5 or something), and I've read Avesta once (don't ask me how cause I honestly can't remember), and I've been trying to re-read most of it.

As well as that, Aditya's apparently been put on hold, just to give some more info.
 
Pain_to12 said:
You don't have to worry about shinza's cosmology. It is done already.
But as a forum we need a version somewhere for us alone.
do you speak japanese?
Click to expand...
While my Japanese is not as "pros" as Chase, yet, i still can understand them. Which is why i can re-translate the feats of Demonbane. Though Masada will be a bit challenging since his writing is on high level and far more complex that Haganeya's. Currently im learning both Japanese and Chinese, with the later is to improve my Kanji.
Can i see your cosmology blog?
 
Tarang123 said:
I've read a few chapters of Aditya (like 5 or something), and I've read Avesta once (don't ask me how cause I honestly can't remember), and I've been trying to re-read most of it.

As well as that, Aditya's apparently been put on hold, just to give some more info.
Click to expand...
Me too I have read some chapters of avesta.
I want us to buy both works and also pay for a translator to translate it or at least pay for a high powered MTL.
So that's why I am posting it here, so we can come up with a way to share the total cost.
Tarang123 said:
Have a blog for the cosmology?
Click to expand...
Separated currently for DI and KKK, PL is still in the works
Mugen_no_Setsuna said:
While my Japanese is not as "pros" as Chase, yet, i still can understand them. Which is why i can re-translate the feats of Demonbane. Though Masada will be a bit challenging since his writing is on high level and far more complex that Haganeya's. Currently im learning both Japanese and Chinese, with the later is to improve my Kanji.
Click to expand...
That's okay, the only masada writing that is hard are the chantings, so unless you are planning on translating them, you should be fine.
Mugen_no_Setsuna said:
Can i see your cosmology blog?
Click to expand...
Sure, when I am done with PL, I will send it
 
Mugen_no_Setsuna said:
While my Japanese is not as "pros" as Chase, yet, i still can understand them. Which is why i can re-translate the feats of Demonbane. Though Masada will be a bit challenging since his writing is on high level and far more complex that Haganeya's. Currently im learning both Japanese and Chinese, with the later is to improve my Kanji.
Can i see your cosmology blog?
Click to expand...
You're giving me too much credit. I've lost my mojo lately because of work and tertiary study. You probably have already surpassed me a long time ago 😔😔
 
I can't quite find the page, but I found something on atwiki that was quite interesting. Essentially, there's a particular paragraph about pseudo-gods that mentions that even when turning off their taikyoku, they keep a part of that power in their durability, but to a far lower degree. They exist in a different phase of physics and that stuff, but that difference is completely different when they actually use their taikyoku, in which they're completely and utterly invincible and impossible to harm unless you can reach that same level. Of course, if you've read the series, you'd know that the series says something similar, or at least implies it, but it was interesting to read anyway. I still need to find the page, though.
 
Tarang123 said:
I can't quite find the page, but I found something on atwiki that was quite interesting. Essentially, there's a particular paragraph about pseudo-gods that mentions that even when turning off their taikyoku, they keep a part of that power in their durability, but to a far lower degree. They exist in a different phase of physics and that stuff, but that difference is completely different when they actually use their taikyoku, in which they're completely and utterly invincible and impossible to harm unless you can reach that same level. Of course, if you've read the series, you'd know that the series says something similar, or at least implies it, but it was interesting to read anyway. I still need to find the page, though.
Click to expand...
That is really good, that means the EE would get an higher AP rating for fighting the Tenmas
 
Chasekilleen said:
Kek, that higher physical phase is at the start between Tousei and Akuro/Morei. It's uhh nothing new tbh lol.
Click to expand...
The point I made was that it was assumed for a while that the Tenmas have the same durability even without their taikyoku, hence why they had High 1A/1A durability even disregarding their taikyoku, and it was one of the main arguments made against the 1A nature of the gods.

So I would say it's technically something new as it would contradict the previously assumed information
 
　瞬間、だらりと腕を下げた悪路の首に、宗次郎の斬気が真っ芯で命中した。
At that moment, Sojirou's zanki hit Akuro's neck with a straight center hit.

「効かんよ。(穢土)われらの(太極)ことわりを舐めるな」
"A useless move. Do not look down on our (Edo) law (Taikyoku)."

「―――――ッ」
"-----."

　なのに無傷。まったく無傷。薄皮一枚切り裂けない。それは紫織の拳を受け止めたときと同様で、頑強さと言うより別位相の物理を目にしたかのようだった。
And yet unharmed. Completely unharmed. Not even a thin layer of skin was torn off. It was the same as when he received Shiori's fist, and it was as if I had witnessed another phase of physics rather than robustness.

　喩えるなら、絵の中でどれだけ猛火を描写しようと、それが現実の人間を燃やせるわけがないのと同じ。
To use a metaphor, no matter how fierce a fire is depicted in a painting, it cannot burn a real person.

　立っている場所がそもそも違うという断絶感。
A sense of disconnection, of being in a different place to begin with.

　そして、絵に現実は害せなくても、現実が絵を破壊することは容易に出来る。
And even if the picture cannot harm reality, reality can easily destroy the picture.

　高次元から低次元への攻撃は、赤子の手を捻るよりも通しやすい。
An attack from a higher dimension to a lower dimension is easier to carry through than twisting a baby's hand.
Click to expand...
That's not what you think it is. Akuro literally points out they are protected by Edo's Taikyoku. Edo is the territory of Yato's Law of Time Stop and the Tenmas have higher degrees of his divine protection on them always. The Tenmas are literally a part of Yato and without the Time Armor protection they would get erased by Hajun's law. There is not a moment when their Time Armor protection is removed except for when Rindou uses her Tenma Fukumetsu on them. The Time Armor is called by other names such as Mugen Kannazuki and Edo Taikyoku that is repeated a lot in the vn. The parenthesis in the raw text I put there is to show which characters are in furigana. By the way, this entire passage is speaking in figurative language due to 喩えるなら with the first kanji character literally being metaphor. You can put these raw text in Jisho or other japanese dictionaries and you'll get the same results.
 
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Legacy30 said:
That's not what you think it is. Akuro literally points out they are protected by Edo's Taikyoku. Edo is the territory of Yato's Law of Time Stop and the Tenmas have higher degrees of his divine protection on them always. The Tenmas are literally a part of Yato and without the Time Armor protection they would get erased by Hajun's law. There is not a moment when their Time Armor protection is removed except for when Rindou uses her Tenma Fukumetsu on them. The Time Armor is called by another name which is Mugen Kannazuki that is repeated a lot in the vn. The parenthesis in the raw text I put there is to show which characters are in furigana. By the way, this entire passage is speaking in figurative language due to 喩えるなら with the first kanji character literally being metaphor. You can put these raw text in jpdb or other japanese dictionaries and you'll get the same results.
Click to expand...
The part that's referenced isn't specific for the Tenma themselves, it's for all pseudo-gods. Beings who can manage their taikyoku (turn it on and off). But even when turning it off, they still keep a little extra something.

自身の太極を「閉じる」ことができる（本物の神格は自身の流出を止められない）。所謂任意で発動する必殺技のような扱いが可能。ただし閉じたからといってただの人に戻るわけでもなく、太極に比べれば低位階に落ちるもののその身の硬さは頑強さというより別位相の物理を体現していると言われる程。例えるならば絵の中でどれだけ力を振るおうと、それを読む現実の人間に影響を及ぼせるわけもないとのと同じ理屈。逆に現実で絵を破くことなど造作もない。しかしこれでも前記の通り、多少特殊な人の身でも相性が合えば跳ね返せる低位階の業である。本来の力を揮えば絶対法則、神格同士でしか通じなくなる。ちなみに母禮は無形とはいえ曲がりなりにも太極の夜行の力をその炎で消滅させているので、閉じている状態であろうと太極に分類される状態。

Basically, the basic context being:
-pseudo gods can "close" their taiji
-Even when closing it, they don't return to just being regular human beings, however.
-While the level they reach is lower than taikyoku, it's a level of another phase in physics rather than robustness (basically verbatim what the Soujirou vs Akuro section says.
-Because it's a lower level thing, of course, it can be deflected and affected based on compatability.
-This does not apply to Taikyoku which can only be affected by other beings of taikyoku.


The tenma have this, along with their time armor, which protects them to a much higher degree.


As for it being figurative, the only figurative part was the very first sentence, where he says in your translation: To use a metaphor, no matter how fierce a fire is depicted in a painting, it cannot burn a real person.

Everything else feeds into the information already given above like the sense of disconnection (adding onto the whole phase in physics thing, and of course the whole thing with reality being able to destroy the picture even if the picture cannot destroy reality). I don't think it's really fair to write off the entire thing as figurative language when it's clearly implied that only that specific example given is figurative.
 
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