Second Coming if it was good (Broly vs. Krillin) (GRACE)

[Eden_Warlock99]

Despite his increase of power, Gohan can't take Broly down. As Broly pummels the beaten Gohan, the others have no choice but to agonisingly watch. But as all hope seems lost, an unlikely hero steps out of the shadows. Piccolo? No, Krillin!

• Both are High 3-A
• Second Coming LSSJ Broly is used
• Battle takes place near the Molten Lava of Natade Village
• Both in-character

__________VS___________

Broly:

Krillin: 8 (ShakeResounding, Gilad_Hyperstar, MintyBoi1, Nierre, GlaceonGamez471, Catbowtie, Pyro9278, TegamiBachi25)

Incon:

 

[Ednaxel2]

Gohan (Cell Games) ~ Super Perfect Cell << Weighted Pikkon ~ Olibu < Yamcha ~ Krillin

Gohan (Cell Games) < Gohan (Post-Timeskip Training) < Broly

Krillin seems to gap him more

 

[ShakeResounding]

Second Coming if it was good

Soul.

If what Ednaxel said is accurate, it seems that Krillin holds a significant AP advantage. While perhaps he'd be intimidated by the physical stature of Broly and the "Oh shit this is a Super Saiyan I'm fighting", I think Krillin likely takes this.

Due to having experience with what a Zenkai can do for Saiyans from the escapades Planet Namek, he likely realizes that a long confrontation is exactly what he doesn't want.

As such, I'm inclined to believe Krillin will use his superior tactics and thoughtfulness in order to make sure his Kienzan is a priority. With an AP advantage on top of that, it shouldn't be too unreasonable for him to do so.

Gonna hold my vote but I'm actually gambling on Krillin.

 

[Ednaxel2]

As such, I'm inclined to believe Krillin will use his superior tactics and thoughtfulness in order to make sure his Kienzan is a priority. With an AP advantage on top of that, it shouldn't be too unreasonable for him to do so.

Greater AP also leads to equally greater speed in Dragon Ball (outside of boosts that sacrifice speed/having great mass/size)

 

[ShakeResounding]

Seals the deal for me then. It seems that Krillin has both the strength and the speed to deal with Broly in a manner that won't allow for the LSS' Zenkai Boosts and growth to catch up.

Should be more than a fair match as well considering both are in-chatacter, meaning Krillin isn't even OOC by finishing the fight quickly against a being so monstrous in both attitude and in presence.

Voting Krillin via superior mindset/strategies, AP, Speed, and the techniques to deal with Broly before Zenkais or Accelerated Development.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

The fact Toei Krillin can match second coming Broly is hilarious, but honestly yeah I could definitely see Krillin winning here

We don't know how seriously Gohan was training in the 7 years after the Cell Games, but Krillin's scaling chain seems to be better, especially since Broly was overpowered and defeated by Gohan, Goten and Goku, so unless Goku is >>> Gohan too, Gohan probably is only a few times weaker than Broly at most

Not to mention Olibu and Pikkon's feats were 7 years before the Buu Saga and Krillin was matching him in the Buu Saga 7 years later

Gonna vote Krillin too

 

[LaserPrecision]

What exactly is the scaling-chain for Krillin in detail?

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

What exactly is the scaling-chain for Krillin in detail?

Krillin is about as powerful as Yamcha, who easily defeated Olibu. Olibu, in turn, was able to go toe-to-toe with a Weighted Pikkon, the same Pikkon who two-shotted SPC.
Plus, King Kai believed Krillin and Yamcha to be the only two left capable of taking on Buu, which might even place them above an Unweighted Pikkon, who's a strong as SSJ Otherworld Saga Goku.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Krillin FRA. Stats and combat skill/experience are too big of advantages to lose. And he’s got the Destructo Disc.

 

[Nierre]

#KrillinSweep fra

 

[AStrangeverse]

Krillin is about as powerful as Yamcha, who easily defeated Olibu. Olibu, in turn, was able to go toe-to-toe with a Weighted Pikkon, the same Pikkon who two-shotted SPC.
Plus, King Kai believed Krillin and Yamcha to be the only two left capable of taking on Buu, which might even place them above an Unweighted Pikkon, who's a strong as SSJ Otherworld Saga Goku.

that is crazy

 

[GlaceonGamez471]

Krillin FRA

 

[LaserPrecision]

Krillin is about as powerful as Yamcha, who easily defeated Olibu. Olibu, in turn, was able to go toe-to-toe with a Weighted Pikkon, the same Pikkon who two-shotted SPC.
Plus, King Kai believed Krillin and Yamcha to be the only two left capable of taking on Buu, which might even place them above an Unweighted Pikkon, who's a strong as SSJ Otherworld Saga Goku.

Honestly, I'm not 100% sure if Krillin would out scale Broly then. Does the Kamehameha in the Toei continuity get the same upgrades that got applied to canon (Kamehameha upscaling greatly from physicals)?

If so, Broly effortlessly tanked a fully charged Kamehameha from SSJ Goku with literally zero damage. Just walked through it like it was air. With Kamehameha's being able to vaporize people superior to the user. Which is much greater than two-shotting SPC (As Kamehameha can destroy/vaporize through gap larger than that). And to his credit, while I won't say this will make some absurd difference, Broly was able to easily weave/evade attacks from Piccolo and Goku simultaneously (While not even looking at Goku)

I feel that's more notable skill-wise tho.

And that was a weaker Broly too. The one being used is a stronger one from the second coming. The one who required a fully charged Super Kamehameha from THREE people (SSJ Gohan, Goten, and Goku) to overpower him. 2 wasn't enough, despite a Kamehameha being a very generous buff from physicals. And even then, the Kamehameha didn't kill him. The collision with the Sun did.

So it should be like: SSJ Goku <<< Kamehameha < Broly <<< Family Kamehameha >~ Broly (Second Coming)

I think that's significant enough scaling that got kinda overlooked.

 

[Flashlight237]

Honestly, I'm not 100% sure if Krillin would out scale Broly then. Does the Kamehameha in the Toei continuity get the same upgrades that got applied to canon (Kamehameha upscaling greatly from physicals)?

If so, Broly effortlessly tanked a fully charged Kamehameha from SSJ Goku with literally zero damage. Just walked through it like it was air. With Kamehameha's being able to vaporize people superior to the user. Which is much greater than two-shotting SPC (As Kamehameha can destroy/vaporize through gap larger than that). And to his credit, while I won't say this will make some absurd difference, Broly was able to easily weave/evade attacks from Piccolo and Goku simultaneously (While not even looking at Goku)

I feel that's more notable skill-wise tho.

And that was a weaker Broly too. The one being used is a stronger one from the second coming. The one who required a fully charged Super Kamehameha from THREE people (SSJ Gohan, Goten, and Goku) to overpower him. 2 wasn't enough, despite a Kamehameha being a very generous buff from physicals. And even then, the Kamehameha didn't kill him. The collision with the Sun did.

So it should be like: SSJ Goku <<< Kamehameha < Broly <<< Family Kamehameha >~ Broly (Second Coming)

I think that's significant enough scaling that got kinda overlooked.

That's part of the equation. The other part is, well, didn't Broly also fight World Tournament-arc characters in the second movie he appeared in as opposed to Android-arc characters?

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

If so, Broly effortlessly tanked a fully charged Kamehameha from SSJ Goku with literally zero damage. Just walked through it like it was air. With Kamehameha's being able to vaporize people superior to the user. Which is much greater than two-shotting SPC (As Kamehameha can destroy/vaporize through gap larger than that).

Not sure about this, a fully charged Kamehameha did obliterate Perfect Cell's torso (Not completely either, as his nucleus survived), but that was when he was suppressed and SPC is about as powerful as the initial SSJ2 Gohan that completely eclipsed that Cell's true power and was toying with him.

The other part is, well, didn't Broly also fight World Tournament-arc characters in the second movie he appeared in as opposed to Android-arc characters?

Around that time, ye. The Gohan that Broly fought also kept training, so he's "considerably stronger" than his Cell Games counterpart.

 

[LaserPrecision]

That's part of the equation. The other part is, well, didn't Broly also fight World Tournament-arc characters in the second movie he appeared in as opposed to Android-arc characters?

Are you asking if it takes place earlier in the timeline, or if Broly fought fodder characters. If you mean the former, no. Considering there was Boo Saga Gohan in the movie (And Goten and Trunks).

If you mean the ladder, yes. There were fodder characters Broly dispatched in that movie. But that wasn't the main focus. The Family Kamehameha was.

 

[LaserPrecision]

Not sure about this, a fully charged Kamehameha did obliterate Perfect Cell's torso (Not completely either, as his nucleus survived), but that was when he was suppressed and SPC is about as powerful as the initial SSJ2 Gohan that completely eclipsed that Cell's true power and was toying with him.

It obliterates his torso, just didn't have the juice (or perhaps the precision) to destroy his nucleus. It is true he was holding back, but doesn't the CRT for the Kamehameha have it literally overcoming gaps larger than that?

The Kamehameha that obliterated Cell did nothing to a weaker Broly. And a stronger Broly tanked a fully charged Kamehameha from a stronger Gohan, Goten, and Goku simultaneously.

I'd say that warrants pretty massive upscaling.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

It is true he was holding back, but doesn't the CRT for the Kamehameha have it literally overcoming gaps larger than that?

Thing is we don't really know how much Cell was holding back, and the bigger Kamehameha showings come from the DBS Manga, so they wouldn't even apply to the Anime.
SPC has crazy showings of his own too, literally disposing of Piccolo and the other Z-Fighers with his aura alone during his beam struggle with Gohan.

And a stronger Broly tanked a fully charged Kamehameha from a stronger Gohan, Goten, and Goku simultaneously.

I mean, while Gohan, Goten, and Goku certainly struggled to push Broly's Gigantic Meteor back, with Trunks even having to intervene and stop Broly from amplifying it further, the Family Kamehameha still ultimately overpowered that Gigantic Meteor, destroyed his barrier, and sent him flying toward the sun, so I wouldn't exactly say he tanked it, lol.

 

[Huesito88]

I mean, while Gohan, Goten, and Goku certainly struggled to push Broly's Gigantic Meteor back, with Trunks even having to intervene and stop Broly from amplifying it further, the Family Kamehameha still ultimately overpowered that Gigantic Meteor, destroyed his barrier, and sent him flying toward the sun, so I wouldn't exactly say he tanked it, lol.

Wasn't it the sun that actually done in Broly?

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Wasn't it the sun that actually done in Broly?

 

[Huesito88]

The Toei Sun, the true God Tier Glass Canon of GT

 

[LaserPrecision]

I mean, while Gohan, Goten, and Goku certainly struggled to push Broly's Gigantic Meteor back, with Trunks even having to intervene and stop Broly from amplifying it further, the Family Kamehameha still ultimately overpowered that Gigantic Meteor, destroyed his barrier, and sent him flying toward the sun, so I wouldn't exactly say he tanked it, lol.

I say tanked because the Kamehameha didn't see to do any visible damage. It was being launched into the Sun that seemed to do him in. I'd say Broly scaling to the Family Kamehameha is fine imo.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

One way to argue that Second Coming Broly surpasses Krillin in terms of AP is by interpreting Gohan’s "He's as bad a monster as ever!" to mean that Second Coming SSJ Broly is as strong as M10 LSSJ Broly. Since base Gohan was able to somewhat hold his own against that version of Broly, we could estimate that Second Coming LSSJ Broly is approximately x100 stronger than his M10 counterpart.

We can also use Krillin's upscaling from an Unweighted Pikkon to place him about x50 stronger than SPC, and while I do believe M10 Broly is stronger than Perfect Cell, given Goku's warning to Gohan to flee from him in M10, SPC has far more going for him for me to place him below M10 Broly.

So Krillin ends up being approximately ~2 times weaker than Broly, maybe less considering the fact that the Pikkon Krillin scales to has been training for seven years.

 

[Huesito88]

I say tanked because the Kamehameha didn't see to do any visible damage. It was being launched into the Sun that seemed to do him in. I'd say Broly scaling to the Family Kamehameha is fine imo.

Then we can downgrade Broly to lower than Small Building level Durability and Krillin still one shots

 

[LaserPrecision]

Then we can downgrade Broly to lower than Small Building level Durability and Krillin still one shots

Wall level. Goku and Trunks get hurt when he slams them through the wall of buildings.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Didn't Broly go to hell and get stomped by Goku and Pikkon jumping him?

 

[CBslayeR]

Didn't Broly go to hell and get stomped by Goku and Pikkon jumping him?

Offscreen post movie 10 so we don't know how much stronger Goku and Pikkon are, they both train a lot

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Offscreen post movie 10 so we don't know how much stronger Goku and Pikkon are, they both train a lot

Krillin would still upscale this given the whole "Him and Yamcha are the only other possible fighters that could remotely stand a chance against Buu" thing. We even scale them above Pikkon verbatim on his profile.

 

[Catbowtie]

Solar Flare + Kienzan Ggs. Krillin FRA

 

[Huesito88]

Wall level. Goku and Trunks get hurt when he slams them through the wall of buildings.

And Gohan thought the Lava would've killed Broly

 

[Pyro9278]

Krillin FRA

 

[TegamiBachi25]

Lol, this is all possible because of Toei scaling. I'm dying laughing over here XD

Krillin FRA

 

[TegamiBachi25]

Honestly, I'm not 100% sure if Krillin would out scale Broly then. Does the Kamehameha in the Toei continuity get the same upgrades that got applied to canon (Kamehameha upscaling greatly from physicals)?

It should. Toei Z anime includes everything from the original manga plus their own OC content that was approved by Toriyama.

I cannot access Youtube at the moment to find a video of this because I'm on a cruise with a shit wifi but everything from manga should apply to anime.