Rule Violations Reports - 62

[Buttersamuri]

If you want me to stop asking him to check out threads, fine. I'll stop asking him. But he isn't a sock, he just doesn't use wiki much since he doesn't really know how to or has many reasons to come on it. I just ask him to vote on threads. Here's this to show you too. he is a guy who hosts a show that we make.

 

[Moritzva]

I know only one person on this entire wiki who uses the word "hacks" instead of "hax".

 

[The_Wright_Way]

We've already discussed how easily Discord conversations are to fake, so I'm hesitant to take thst as evidence.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

We've established that it's easy to fake a Discord conversation. I don't really know if this scenario has a 100% effective method of telling but I must say it is odd that there are handfuls of users who talk in the same way as Butters and only vote on threads Butters is in, in favor of the character Butters has already voted for, exclusively.

 

[Buttersamuri]

Question: Are Ce and Metal ever seen on any threads that Butters isn't? Because if not, that's some pretty damning evidence.

Again. That's because I Ask him to vote on my threads. He doesn't typically do wiki himself. That's why he doesn't go on other threads really

 

[Listentomyrhytm]

Kinda suspicious that all messages are from today.

 

[ElixirBlue]

That Discord conversation about Princess Elise would be before Jacky's report, if the time stamps are right.

Her wiki page can stay, tho

Or Butter's like talking to himself.

 

[Buttersamuri]

That's because the fight was literally down today. Check the timing of the messages and thread making

 

[I'm_Blue_daba_dee_daba_die]

seems a bit more suspicious. But I will try and check

 

[Agnaa]

Well, from this video that Butters linked, there seems to pretty obviously be two separate people, Butters and Caleb.

Considering they're working together here to make vs-debating related videos on verses they liked, I wouldn't be surprised if they went to the same threads and had somewhat similar opinions, despite being separate people.

So, I don't think this is a sock situation.

 

[Nemo212]

I'm going to be frank, I watched a bit of your show, and it sounds like you putting on a nasally voice. That's not convincing to me either.

 

[Jackythejack]

Ce has been on, like, every thread butters has been on. Metal? Don't think so didn't bother looking but yeah just about every thread Ce has been on, Butters has been on

 

[Moritzva]

Even if they aren't socks, their reasonings and voting habits are absolutely not ******* okay.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Yeah, that video alone, now that I've clicked on it, pretty conclusively proves that they're not socks.

 

[Agnaa]

@Nemo I seriously doubt that Butters faked having a friend a year and a half ago so that he could create a sock 6 months ago to vote on threads he likes.

Even if they aren't socks, their reasonings and voting habits are absolutely not ******* okay.

Why?

 

[Nemo212]

We don't have a rule against brigading. We should have something preventing people from calling up all their buddies to 7-0 a thread whenever they feel like it.

 

[Jackythejack]

Metal or Ce? Or both?

 

[Moritzva]

Bringing on your friends to mindlessly FRA your threads isn't any better

^

 

[Agnaa]

^

From just the screenshots in this thread (I haven't taken the time to look at the threads themselves) it doesn't seem like it's always mindless FRAing. You yourself posted a screenshot of them both typing out full-length arguments for why a character wins. And we're not going to ban people for FRAing occasionally.

 

[Nemo212]

@Agnaa It seems like a parody/knockoff of Death Battle, yes? There's two guys on that show. If you're going to imitate them, you need two people. It sounds to me like a voice.

But it's not proof, yeah. It's circumstantial at best.

Regardless, what the hell do we do about brigading?

 

[Moritzva]

When an OP calls upon a friend, in which they use incredibly similar reasonings to their threads, voting for the same characters 100% of the time, I am inclined to call bullshit.

 

[Nemo212]

Actually, hold on a second.

That show's only an alibi for one of the people suspected of being a sock.

What about the one that's not Caleb? He's not in the clear.

 

[Jackythejack]

I feel like people are ignoring my point with Ce. Sure, metalthegear might have an excuse but there's two users who I reported, and I doubt this friend has two different accounts, and butters never mentioned them or even tried to address them

 

[Agnaa]

@Nemo Their two mics have completely different background noises. Unless Butters got two mics or went into different rooms to record those different voices. I'm inclined to just believe that people his age sound roughly similar.

@Moritzva idk if we have a rule about that yet, so a thread should probably be created to make one.

@Nemo Jacky You're right on that count. Butters could still be in the wrong, we'd just have to remember not to ban "Caleb"'s account (and remember to check for any suspicious activity from it in the future).

 

[Buttersamuri]

Metal is TGD. Same situation. But to a far lesser degree. He doesn't like the wiki a lot. So I rarely bother him about it. a vs friend agai.

And as well. For Caleb. he literally has his own account as well to proof it.

As well as him having another gaming channel


If that doesn't convince you, then I don't know what would. Caleb is an entirely separate person from me.

 

[Schnee_One]

Even if they aren't socks, their reasonings and voting habits are absolutely not ******* okay.

I see no reason why voting habits are rule violation worthy

Very annoying? Sure, rule violation worthy is a massive stretch.

 

[Nemo212]

We don't have any proof that Metal is TGD except your word. Certainly doesn't say on his channel. Given that you're the one on trial here, it's not quite reliable.

Although, TGD has an email on his description. Surely someone neutral can email him to give a statement?

 

[Jackythejack]

So Caleb is ce? I'm confused on who's who here

 

[Buttersamuri]

I can also say that a good chunk of people do it. Asking someone who knows the character and will likely support them in a vote. I've gotten asked to vote on threads, and others have done it.

 

[Agnaa]

For Metal, the Buggler page was made by him, and then later edited by himself and Butter in quick succession (4 minutes apart).

Did Butter really make this page on an alt 9 months ago, edit it on that alt 5 days later, then log onto his main to edit it further 4 minutes later, then log onto his alt to edit it more 14 hours later?

Again, all of this was 9 months ago before there was any suspicion. This behaviour doesn't really seem indicative of a sock account.

 

[Buttersamuri]

So Caleb is ce? I'm confused on who's who here

Caleb is CC

Metal is The Great demon

 

[Nemo212]

Well, here's something to bring up.

Ce, Metal, and Butter haven't ever commented on each other's message walls. We know that Ce and Butter aren't the same guy, we still don't know about Metal. There's the possibility that they communicate over Discord or something else, not the wiki. Butter mentioned both of them don't like using the wiki, so that's a possibility. Release of chat logs dating back from then might prove Butter innocent.

Key word: dating back. Not from today. If they're socks, I don't think Butter would have thought back far enough to fake DMs from six months ago to now. If they're not, well, that would reveal itself, no?

 

[InfiniteSped]

Just talking through Discord is pretty normal.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

@Nemo Believe the main point now is deciding whether or not dragging people from bascally off-site to come vote on your threads, is okay.

 

[I'm_Blue_daba_dee_daba_die]

Pretty sure it wasn't a rule and was never said to be banned.

Anyway. This seems like a dislikable thing, but this is at worst, reportable

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I don't really consider myself invested in getting Butters banned, but I will put this out here- just because we don't have a rule against this (yet) doesn't mean we cannot take action. It being legal doesn't inherently make it right. I know Agnaa is digging through the threads at the moment to try to weigh in himself.

 

[I'm_Blue_daba_dee_daba_die]

Pretty sure there is something in the Constitution that describes what are you saying. I think it's called a Ex Post Facto law

I don't think the wiki should be enforcing Post Facto Laws where we punish people for stuff when it was accepted as legal

 

[Agnaa]

I wanted to find out if these friends of Butters just post the same arguments, so I started going through threads. Some just had all three of them FRAing for stuff from earlier in the thread, but I soon found this match where Butters and Ce both posted their arguments for Mr. Bean beating Composite Human. Here's a summary:

• Butters: Mr Bean isn't stupid
  • Mr Bean wouldn't mess around
  • Mr Bean would set up a trap
  • Mr Bean's supernatural luck will save him (giving himself good luck and his opponent bad luck)
  • Mr Bean only needs one strike to win
• Ce: Mr Bean's supernatural luck gives him an edge (giving himself good luck and his opponent bad luck)
  • Humans can't handle luck as tough as Bean's
  • Mr Bean just needs one strike to win, which is plausible with luck
  • Some of CH's tech won't work
  • Passive luck may just jam CH's gun

Ce brought up arguments which Butters didn't (tech manip), and Butters brought up arguments that Ce didn't (setting up traps, intelligence, combat mindset).

To me this screams "two people with mostly similar opinions posting their own thoughts". The only part here that could have a reasonable rule written about it is repeatedly asking friends to comment on threads. But do we actually want to make a rule about this?

 

[I'm_Blue_daba_dee_daba_die]

Pretty sure many people are invited into VS Threads by others. If we make that rule then it would be hard to distinguish FRA training and people just wanting input on VS Threads

 

[Nemo212]

I suppose we could have something against making invitations biased. (I.e. can you come agree with me on this thread?)