• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Removing CM1 from Aeons (Honkai: Star Rail)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Super_Nova said:
That’s for concepts (singular), Imaginary Energy is a quantity of a certain substance. Please do read what the other parts of that description says; you can’t prove something with a half-assed defintion
Click to expand...
But you didn't address anything about Imaginary governs all the three structures in Honkaiverse which is the Sea of Quanta, the Imaginary Tree and the Imaginary Space.

The only stuff you've addressed, is the universal concepts in the Imaginary category and it's all

Imaginary Space... The Overseer said this is the origin of the universe and where all laws intertwine. This is the other side of the world, built upon rules above rules.
Click to expand...

...the terra incognita where laws governing the universe and the ultimate truth of life came into being... the Imaginary Tree.
Click to expand...

In the distant past, there existed an Aeon. With one flick of the wrist, THEY crafted the laws of the cosmos. THEIR followers formed the Beyond the Sky Choir, spreading solemn and reverent hymns throughout the universe.
Click to expand...

"Stars trace your fingers' and command all living's law and authority... Sweet dreams nowadays have manifested, and the gazillions of old laws have all faded away."
Click to expand...
 
Voidnether said:
But you didn't address anything about Imaginary governs all the three structures in Honkaiverse which is the Sea of Quanta, the Imaginary Tree and the Imaginary Space.

The only stuff you've addressed, is the universal concepts in the Imaginary category and it's all
Click to expand...
Imaginary Energy is everywhere in the cosmology yea. I’ve never disagreed with this in the whole thread. I even said it had “universal range” in my summary lol.

My whole point is that just this proves nothing about CM1.
 
Super_Nova said:
Imaginary Energy is everywhere in the cosmology yea. I’ve never disagreed with this in the whole thread. I even said it had “universal range” in my summary lol.

My whole point is that just this proves nothing about CM1.
Click to expand...
Wouldn't Vietthai think the otherwise though..
 
Voidnether said:
Wouldn't Vietthai think the otherwise though..
Click to expand...
Can nobody in this wiki track anything for the sake of their life.

Imaginary Energy is the primordial substance that permeates from the Trunk and manifests all corporeal things, i.e Real Space. It makes zero sense for it to not be universal.

I disagree with Genshin for a completely different reason lol. Nothing to do with it’s range
 
then why is Imaginary, that like all 3 of us agreed upon, shapes everything within hoyo cosmology, including concepts IT SoQ etc... cm3, if cm3 is literally just this
Concepts that don't meet the same standards as Type 1 or Type 2, such as personal concepts that continue to govern the object in question, merely on a more specific scale, or concepts whose nature is not elaborated upon.
Click to expand...
like whenever i read this crt i feel like if downgrade passes its more leaning to CM2 bcs of this:
Such concepts are abstract and govern all reality within their area of influence. These concepts shape everything, and changing them would either require the alteration of every object of the concept or, if manipulated directly, change all objects of the concept alongside the concept itself. These concepts, however, exist simultaneously with and are bound by the object of the concept. In this way, an abstract dependent concept can be destroyed by destroying all objects of the concept, restored by re-making an object of a previously existent concept, or changed by changing all objects of the concept across reality. This, however, does not qualify for this form of conceptual manipulation, and is rather treated as a by-product of another action akin to a "domino effect"
Click to expand...
 
Vietthai96 said:
Universal mean the whole of something, the leyline being conceptual and affect the entirety of Genshin world make it Universal within Genshin world.
Click to expand...
The issue with leylines being CM2 is that it isn’t one singular (non-composite) leyline that governs the whole of Genshin’s world, but rather a sum total of all leylines are what govern the entire thing, which is an issue since concepts are meant to be non-composite; composite is what information type 2 is, but not concepts.
PedjaTarzan said:
If imaginary grounding all existence across Imaginary Space-->Tree--->Sea of Quanta is not enough for literally this quote of CM1 then might as well completely remove this requirement for cm1, literaly.
Click to expand...
The issue is that imaginary is not said to be the concept of reality itself for that to matter or govern them in a way that matters. For example, I have one characters who’s got a whatness that defines him as a great demon lord, giving him his quality as a great demon lord. But the thing in question is also said to rule over everything. Despite ruling all things, that will still make it a Type 3 concept, since it is not the concept of everything, but the concept of “great demon lord,” not the concept that makes everything what it is.
 
Grabbing_dragon said:
The issue with leylines being CM2 is that it isn’t one singular (non-composite) leyline that governs the whole of Genshin’s world, but rather a sum total of all leylines are what govern the entire thing, which is an issue since concepts are meant to be non-composite; composite is what information type 2 is, but not concepts.

The issue is that imaginary is not said to be the concept of reality itself for that to matter or govern them in a way that matters. For example, I have one characters who’s got a whatness that defines him as a great demon lord, giving him his quality as a great demon lord. But the thing in question is also said to rule over everything. Despite ruling all things, that will still make it a Type 3 concept, since it is not the concept of everything, but the concept of “great demon lord,” not the concept that makes everything what it is.
Click to expand...
The Imaginary predates, creates and shapes up all of creation itself; it is a primordial concept that constitutes of the reality-transcending conceptual domain that are built above layers of rules, the origin of all law and order, incarnation of truth itself -- the Imaginary Tree.

The Imaginary Tree governs absolutely everything, ranging from mere individual objects, such as Sirin's subspace lances, and all the way up to the Imaginary Space, the conceptual domain that shapes up utterly everything across the Honkai metaverse.
Click to expand...
Brother...
 
Grabbing_dragon said:
The issue with leylines being CM2 is that it isn’t one singular (non-composite) leyline that governs the whole of Genshin’s world, but rather a sum total of all leylines are what govern the entire thing, which is an issue since concepts are meant to be non-composite; composite is what information type 2 is, but not concepts.

The issue is that imaginary is not said to be the concept of reality itself for that to matter or govern them in a way that matters. For example, I have one characters who’s got a whatness that defines him as a great demon lord, giving him his quality as a great demon lord. But the thing in question is also said to rule over everything. Despite ruling all things, that will still make it a Type 3 concept, since it is not the concept of everything, but the concept of “great demon lord,” not the concept that makes everything what it is.
Click to expand...
Bro, they didn’t tier this with the acknowledgment that the definition stated in the CM page was the actual definition lel.
 
PedjaTarzan said:
Brother...
Click to expand...
Is there a scan with a direct statement saying it is the "concept of everything" for that to matter, or that it is what makes everything "what it is"? All I see is that it has control over everything and a vague mention of concept that can be taken as an idea.
Super_Nova said:
Bro, they didn’t tier this with the acknowledgment that the definition stated in the CM page was the actual definition lel.
Click to expand...
So true.
 
Grabbing_dragon said:
Is there a scan with a direct statement saying it is the "concept of everything" for that to matter, or that it is what makes everything "what it is"? All I see is that it has control over everything and a vague mention of concept that can be taken as an idea.

So true.
Click to expand...
How are Paths an idea when they shape up reality itself? HSR revolves around the Aeons and their Paths, Path is literally a powersource too on top of that
 
Voidnether said:
Genshin is millions of times worse when you include the worldbuilding and how they're not meant to be interpreted as that
Click to expand...
I don't know why this is linked to leylines, aren't their justifications completely different?

Every object has a concept, and that concept supports the object. So my question is, what does the path concept support? Furthermore, path energy should be distinct from philosophical concepts. As explained previously, paths emerge from these concepts. Aeons don't form concepts, but rather operate under their auspices. Forming a path can also mean forming path energy. This energy is bestowed upon humans so they can harness the power of the path. So, paths aren't conceptual, but rather physical energy that humans gain from the aeons after following their respective paths.

This is why I agree with CRT, because I don't see a fundamental concept in paths.
 
Furina003 said:
I don't know why this is linked to leylines, aren't their justifications completely different?

Every object has a concept, and that concept supports the object. So my question is, what does the path concept support? Furthermore, path energy should be distinct from philosophical concepts. As explained previously, paths emerge from these concepts. Aeons don't form concepts, but rather operate under their auspices. Forming a path can also mean forming path energy. This energy is bestowed upon humans so they can harness the power of the path. So, paths aren't conceptual, but rather physical energy that humans gain from the aeons after following their respective paths.

This is why I agree with CRT, because I don't see a fundamental concept in paths.
Click to expand...
Path concept is the Imaginary concept itself, the Imaginary shapes and makes up everything across all the three realms in Honkaiverse

Path energy is the philosophical concepts themselves, path is the philosophical concepts composed of imaginary energy

Paths don't emerge from those concepts, when they're composed of the concept itself

Paths are created when an entity ascends into Aeonhood, so obviously Aeons create concepts here, absolutely no reason for them to operate under that. You can't form something that already exist, Paths are just congregations of Imaginary Energy together created when someone ascends into Aeonhood and creates said Path. When you harness the power of a Path, you harness the imaginary energy within and a simple form of manipulating the imaginary energy already meant you're manipulating the conceptual forms of it

I stated multiple times it's metaphysical, it won't even make sense for them to be physical

If you even understand what you're talking about, harnessing the authority of the shades wouldn't mean they're conceptual using your logic
 
Furina003 said:
I don't know why this is linked to leylines, aren't their justifications completely different?

Every object has a concept, and that concept supports the object. So my question is, what does the path concept support? Furthermore, path energy should be distinct from philosophical concepts. As explained previously, paths emerge from these concepts. Aeons don't form concepts, but rather operate under their auspices. Forming a path can also mean forming path energy. This energy is bestowed upon humans so they can harness the power of the path. So, paths aren't conceptual, but rather physical energy that humans gain from the aeons after following their respective paths.

This is why I agree with CRT, because I don't see a fundamental concept in paths.
Click to expand...
Mavuika harnessed the Authority of Death bestowed by Ronova, since Mavuika is able to use the energy, Authority of Death isn't conceptual in nature. Do you even understand how stupid that sounds
 
Voidnether said:
Path concept is the Imaginary concept itself, the Imaginary shapes and makes up everything across all the three realms in Honkaiverse

Path energy is the philosophical concepts themselves, path is the philosophical concepts composed of imaginary energy
Click to expand...
As I said before, every object has a concept. For example, if a character is able to manipulate time, will they automatically gain the concept of manipulation, since time is a concept? Obviously not. Time is a concept, but when a character manipulates time, it doesn't automatically gain the concept of manipulation without further explanation. Because what is being manipulated is the object of time itself, not the concept of time. Just like if someone destroys a mountain, does that mean they destroy the concept of the mountain? Isn't that clear?

So, the concept of the path is a philosophical concept that exists in the universe. From this concept, aeons are born, which walk under the auspices of their respective path concepts.

Aeons don't use the concept of the path, but rather the energy path. As Welt explained, aeons use the energy of the path, not the philosophical concept itself.
Voidnether said:
Paths are created when an entity ascends into Aeonhood, so obviously Aeons create concepts here, absolutely no reason for them to operate under that. You can't form something that already exist, Paths are just congregations of Imaginary Energy together created when someone ascends into Aeonhood and creates said Path. When you harness the power of a Path, you harness the imaginary energy within and a simple form of manipulating the imaginary energy already meant you're manipulating the conceptual forms of it
Click to expand...
do you have a scene where aeons created the philosophical concept of the universe?
Voidnether said:
I stated multiple times it's metaphysical, it won't even make sense for them to be physical

If you even understand what you're talking about, harnessing the authority of the shades wouldn't mean they're conceptual using your logic
Click to expand...
it has nothing to do with shades, so yeah? that's how it is
Voidnether said:
Mavuika harnessed the Authority of Death bestowed by Ronova, since Mavuika is able to use the energy, Authority of Death isn't conceptual in nature. Do you even understand how stupid that sounds
Click to expand...
Mavuika does not gain the authority of death, but the energy of the authority of death which increases her raw power in the use of phlogiston
 
Furina003 said:
As I said before, every object has a concept. For example, if a character is able to manipulate time, will they automatically gain the concept of manipulation, since time is a concept? Obviously not. Time is a concept, but when a character manipulates time, it doesn't automatically gain the concept of manipulation without further explanation. Because what is being manipulated is the object of time itself, not the concept of time. Just like if someone destroys a mountain, does that mean they destroy the concept of the mountain? Isn't that clear?

So, the concept of the path is a philosophical concept that exists in the universe. From this concept, aeons are born, which walk under the auspices of their respective path concepts.

Aeons don't use the concept of the path, but rather the energy path. As Welt explained, aeons use the energy of the path, not the philosophical concept itself.

do you have a scene where aeons created the philosophical concept of the universe?

it has nothing to do with shades, so yeah? that's how it is

Mavuika does not gain the authority of death, but the energy of the authority of death which increases her raw power in the use of phlogiston
Click to expand...
Imaginary as an object itself is conceptual, this is how its even established and accepted to be a type 1 concept — Paths are created by the Aeons, not the otherwise, even Super_Nova who doesn't even play the game would know that Paths are created by the Aeons. When an entity ascends into Aeonhood, they created said Path. Nous as an entity already existed way before the Path of Erudition came into existence, when Nous ascended into Aeonhood, the Path of Erudition is created.

Said energy of the authority of death is conceptual, isn't this what Sahl is trying to do in his newest CRT? I mean it doesn't really matter when there's obviously a difference with Honkai in which if someone is able to manipulate the Imaginary, that's just conceptual manipulation
 
Grabbing_dragon said:
Is there a scan with a direct statement saying it is the "concept of everything" for that to matter, or that it is what makes everything "what it is"? All I see is that it has control over everything and a vague mention of concept that can be taken as an idea.
Click to expand...
I really dont understand your question when i actually quoted even from the page itself that due to Imaginary everything else in the universe exists exactly because its the primordial concept and that it grounds everything including all Paths which are also conceptual in nature.
So from the hoyo cosmo page these two are closest i could get (the scans are below the text but the way they are put in is so ass..)
 
Super_Nova said:
Bet

Click to expand...

Unfortunately, you scored lower than me, so I disagree with the CRT

image.png
 
Voidnether said:
Said energy of the authority of death is conceptual, isn't this what Sahl is trying to do in his newest CRT? I mean it doesn't really matter when there's obviously a difference with Honkai in which if someone is able to manipulate the Imaginary, that's just conceptual manipulation
Click to expand...
never mind, this isn't CRT Genshin, bro.
I won't discuss it further 😁
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
E0S1 Saber
RMC
E0S0 Robin
E0S1 (Acheron LC) Dan Heng

E1S1 Phainon
E0S1 (Bronya LC) Sunday
E4S1 (Bronya LC) Bronya
Tingyun

E0S1 Castorice
E2S1 Cyrene
E0S1 Evernight
E0S1 Hyacine


Where did i whale bro 😭
Click to expand...
These are all 3.X teams lmao. The last one is even 10 cost. You’re either Aventurine or you broke the bank, I don’t believe it
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Voidnether
  • Locked
Honkai: Star Rail — Regarding the Aeons
Replies
24
Views
3K
TWILIGHT-OP
TWILIGHT-OP
SuperNova55555
  • Locked
Bro, who keeps giving Honkai dudes these hax
3 4 5
Replies
193
Views
13K
SuperNova55555
SuperNova55555
Mbpoops
  • Locked
quick irontomb removal
Replies
8
Views
1K
Mbpoops
Mbpoops
Mbpoops
quick Imaginary energy crt
Replies
30
Views
2K
Mbpoops
Mbpoops
SuperNova55555
  • Locked
On Aeonic Scaling (Honkai)
5 6 7
Replies
263
Views
14K
Reiner04
Reiner04
Back
Top