Regarding Flashes durability

[Confluctor]

Why does their durability is being scaled to their AP? This is literally no indication that their ap = durability when channeling the entirety of speed force. Or when moving at exactly light speed. Just because their 4B versions do, doesn't mean this does too because most of it is done via hax or through chain reaction (destroying universe, for example)

If anyone's got any headcanon reason, they should probably be added to their profiles.


Tl;Dr, right now, Flash files assumes their durability scales to their AP at tier 2 and above without proper feats or reasons to back it up.

 

[Confluctor]

Actually, turning this into a CRT. This is a pretty serious issue with Flashes files in general and as such, should be fixed.

@Antvasima @LordTracer @Amelia_Lonelyheart @Maverick_Zero_X @Emirp sumitpo @Firestorm808 @Qawsedf234 @Transcending @Oliver_de_jesus

Your help would be appreciated with this

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Is this with all Flashes in general? Like the post crisis and post Flashpoint?

 

[Confluctor]

Yes. Except for pre crisis

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Tbh I'm not as knowledgeable with the post crisis as I am with the post flashpoint. But wouldn't the post flashpoint feat fall under environmental destruction?

And off topic but unless I'm tripping, I don't remember it being stated than Wally and Barry were absorbing the entire speed force when they were racing together, as I can't find that statement anywhere

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Though if there it is all done under hax or chain reaction, then removing to tier 2 to physicals is probably fine

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

yes, i agree, even if it's not hax, this is a momentary amp that doesn't keep Flashes durability at that point for a very long time (not counting the time when it is perceived by flash)

 

[Antvasima]

I agree with Confluctor about that, as far as I am aware, the Flash characters are consistently portrayed as having far lower durabilities than their attack potencies, even though it doesn't technically make any sense, given that they usually attack by punching others.

@Qawsedf234 @SuperAPM @Firestorm808 @EmperorRorepme @LuciferDC099 @Ehnkr2beboh @Deagonx @Elizio33 @LordTracer @Planck69 @MarvelFanatic119 @catzlaflame @Armorchompy @Kulf_Boba @LephyrTheRevanchist @The_Impress

Your help would be appreciated here.

 

[Confluctor]

But wouldn't the post flashpoint feat fall under environmental destruction

Exactly what my issue here is.

For post crisis, one of their value comes from harming Superboy prime, who 1, is inconsistent af, and 2, iirc some form of hax was used.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Agreed

 

[Confluctor]

And off topic but unless I'm tripping, I don't remember it being stated than Wally and Barry were absorbing the entire speed force when they were racing together, as I can't find that statement anywhere

It never was. I think I might take the steps and downgrade their ap too one of these days

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you for helping out, Confluctor.

 

[LordTracer]

Actually, turning this into a CRT. This is a pretty serious issue with Flashes files in general and as such, should be fixed.

@Antvasima @LordTracer @Amelia_Lonelyheart @Maverick_Zero_X @Emirp sumitpo @Firestorm808 @Qawsedf234 @Transcending @Oliver_de_jesus

Your help would be appreciated with this

I agree with Confluctor about that, as far as I am aware, the Flash characters are consistently portrayed as having far lower durabilities than their attack potencies, even though it doesn't technically make any sense, given that they usually attack by punching others.

@Qawsedf234 @SuperAPM @Firestorm808 @EmperorRorepme @LuciferDC099 @Ehnkr2beboh @Deagonx @Elizio33 @LordTracer @Planck69 @MarvelFanatic119 @catzlaflame @Armorchompy @Kulf_Boba @LephyrTheRevanchist @The_Impress

Your help would be appreciated here.

My apologies, but I can’t really help out here. Flash is one of the things that completely fall outside of my expertise.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. No problem. Thanks anyway.

 

[Jibz]

Makes sense

 

[Firestorm808]

I'll do some more research on the matter.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

It never was. I think I might take the steps and downgrade their ap too one of these days

If you're referring to 4-B AP I'mma have to fold ya >:[

 

[Chariot190]

Wouldn't third law force the durability to match the AP by virtue of not dying by doing the move? I get where it's coming from tbh.

But If it's a momentary amp only just go "[basic tier], up to [tier] with thing".

If it's ED, well yeah **** it ig. It'd be ED only.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

Wouldn't third law force the durability to match the AP by virtue of not dying by doing the move? I get where it's coming from tbh.

But If it's a momentary amp only just go "[basic tier], up to [tier] with thing".

If it's ED, well yeah **** it ig. It'd be ED only.

Speed force allows the flash to give the middle finger to physics so the 3rd law won't apply.

 

[Saksham_Gopal]

Flashes are not always as durable as their AP. Their durability is determined by the amount of speedforce they channel, which is why, recently, Barry was severely beaten by Daxamites, but in the next issue, he one-shots several of them, drawing blood. So his attack potency is greater in this case than his durability was in the previous issue. This should make sense because Barry mentioned in Rebirth issue 2 that his muscles feed on speed force, so he should be able to control the amount of speed force he channels into them and I am saying this because it would also make sense for how he in the past got brutally injured many times from people like Girder (a character below Superman level threat) to the point his ribs were cracked. I also recall one time Wally mentioning the same that how speedforce automatically adjusted his body durability to withstand a punch from Mongul. Imo, Flashes should have unknown durability which I always thought.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Don't their durability vary like their AP does? It's better to just stick to the varies rating.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Don't their durability vary like their AP does? It's better to just stick to the varies rating.

Agreed

 

[Firestorm808]

Varies should suffice.

 

[Confluctor]

The issue is not varies - which should have always been there, not sure why it wasn't, but the issue is their durability scaling to to their AP at tier 2 and above. That needs to be fixed.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

The issue is not varies - which should have always been there, not sure why it wasn't, but the issue is their durability scaling to to their AP at tier 2 and above. That needs to be fixed.

He already does actually. But yeah, let's stick to the topic at hand

 

[Antvasima]

The issue is not varies - which should have always been there, not sure why it wasn't, but the issue is their durability scaling to to their AP at tier 2 and above. That needs to be fixed.

Okay. I apologise for derailing then.

What do the rest of you think about this?

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Bump.

Rebirth Hunter Zolomon with the Speed, Strength and Sage Forces would be downgraded. I suggest something along the likes of "Far higher with Speed, Strength and Sage Forces"

His profile is wack considering that version of Hunter scales to At least 2-C, possibly Low 1-C but he's listed as just 2-C. That and his 4-B feat is when he had the Speed, Strength and Sage forces

 

[Confluctor]

the Still Force could briefly halt Mister Mxyzptlk's powers

This bit needs changing too. That's just hax.

And tbf their 2c is absolutely worthless since the feat they are scaling to is actually low 1c at the very very least.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

And tbf their low 2c

Low 2-C feat? You mean 2-C?

 

[Confluctor]

Yes, 2c. Idk why I wrote low with it

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

So you're suggesting straight up Low 1-C? Based

 

[Confluctor]

Aye

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Pog

 

[Antvasima]

Rebirth Hunter Zolomon with the Speed, Strength and Sage Forces would be downgraded. I suggest something along the likes of "Far higher with Speed, Strength and Sage Forces"

His profile is wack considering that version of Hunter scales to At least 2-C, possibly Low 1-C but he's listed as just 2-C. That and his 4-B feat is when he had the Speed, Strength and Sage forces

tbf their 2c is absolutely worthless since the feat they are scaling to is actually low 1c at the very very least.

Can you explain exactly what needs to be done here and why please?

 

[Confluctor]

Right now, for this thread, we are waiting for firestorm to comment I think. He said he will look at some stuff (?)

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. No problem.

@Firestorm808

Have you had the time to proceed with your work here?

 

[KingTempest]

Maybe the speed force amplifies their durability to be able to withstand those forces?

 

[Antvasima]

It could technically also simply completely break the laws of physics in this area as well as others.

 

[Confluctor]

Maybe the speed force amplifies their durability to be able to withstand those forces?

Two things, there is no backing for something like that - at least for anything tier 4 and above. And secondly, most of their tier 2 feats are done via hax or environmental destruction.

 

[Firestorm808]

Since we have no verification at this time, I'm fine with some tiers having unknown durability since 3rd law may not apply.