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Regarding Base Goku's speed during Namek saga...

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Davy0 said:
The multiplier rule doesn't count. Do you know how many series use multipliers for such an effect? The calculations would crap on everything, unless you want that to happen, I suggest you just back away from the notion very slowly.
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Multiplier count. Example: kaioken is admitted by everybody as a multiplier of all stats. Why would it be different with SSJ forms?
 
OK. So how about we take every single series and give this Multiplier effect a try with them, let's say we do this for Bleach, every bankai should give a person 5 to ten times their usual power level, even though every ability is different based on the users own uniqueness.

And then let's go to a series that relies on transformations akin to DB what happens then. What happens when said abilities subvert what characters are truly capable of doing. Then you have a massive problem on your hands. Do you not? Feats and word of god are one thing, but multipliers are known to be wrong in terms of feats and multipliers becoming outliers.
 
Davy0 said:
OK. So how about we take every single series and give this Multiplier effect a try with them, let's say we do this for Bleach, every bankai should give a person 5 to ten times their usual power level, even though every ability is different based on the users own uniqueness.
And then let's go to a series that relies on transformations akin to DB what happens then. What happens when said abilities subvert what characters are truly capable of doing. Then you have a massive problem on your hands. Do you not? Feats and word of god are one thing, but multipliers are known to be wrong in terms of feats and multipliers becoming outliers.
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It's different with db because precise numbers are given (example: kaioken 2 = twice faster, kaioken 3 = 3 time faster. Kaioken 20 = 20 time faster, SSJ 1 = 50 time faster etc ...)
 
Jeune fou said:
Davy0 said:
OK. So how about we take every single series and give this Multiplier effect a try with them, let's say we do this for Bleach, every bankai should give a person 5 to ten times their usual power level, even though every ability is different based on the users own uniqueness.
And then let's go to a series that relies on transformations akin to DB what happens then. What happens when said abilities subvert what characters are truly capable of doing. Then you have a massive problem on your hands. Do you not? Feats and word of god are one thing, but multipliers are known to be wrong in terms of feats and multipliers becoming outliers.
Click to expand...
It's different with db because precise numbers are given (example: kaioken 2 = twice faster, kaioken 3 = 3 time faster. Kaioken 20 = 20 time faster, SSJ 1 = 50 time faster etc ...)
Click to expand...
I agree with Jeune fou. The whole multiplier thing works differently in Dragon Ball than in other series. And not using multipliers for other series, in my opinion, does not justify not using them for DB. Nor does using multipliers for DB justify using them in other series.
 
The only reason why the Kaioken Multiplier is accepted is because it's specifically stated to increase all of a person's stats by the multiplier. SSJ multiples aren't stated to be like that. And I've explained this multiple times already so don't start bringing it up again.

The Blog post will be done in a few minutes...
 
So if Saiyan Saga Goku is Sub Relativistic+ (7% SoL) and kaioken x2 would be Relativistic (14% SoL). Would that mean Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga is also going to be Relativistic as he managed to keep up with Goku whilst he was using kaoiken.
 
I am sorry, and you can go ahead and disregard this comment if the blog post is already almost done, but I am fairly certain the SSJ multiplier does affect all stats due to the fact that it multiplies ki output, which does directly translate to all stats, including strength, durability, attack potency, and even speed.
 
The Correctionist said:
I am sorry, and you can go ahead and disregard this comment if the blog post is already almost done, but I am fairly certain the SSJ multiplier does affect all stats due to the fact that it multiplies ki output, which does directly translate to all stats, including strength, durability, attack potency, and even speed.
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It probably does to be honest but it's not very specific especially when it comes to speed and only says the transformation increases the user's power by 50. But it doesn't really matter anyway since SSJ Goku and Frieza are likely FTL+.
 
The Correctionist said:
I am sorry, and you can go ahead and disregard this comment if the blog post is already almost done, but I am fairly certain the SSJ multiplier does affect all stats due to the fact that it multiplies ki output, which does directly translate to all stats, including strength, durability, attack potency, and even speed.
Click to expand...
Unless there's an official statement that it increases all stats it ain't gonna be applicable sorry. But hey they're still likely gonna receive a 40X increase but don't be hopeful just yet...
 
SchutzenDunkelZiel1217 said:
Unless there's an official statement that it increases all stats it ain't gonna be applicable sorry. But hey they're still likely gonna receive a 40X increase but don't be hopeful just yet...
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Yeah... I doubt we'd ever get something like an actual quote confirming it... I am fairly certain that is how it works, but I understand no quote = not acceptable.
 
Oblivion00 said:
The Correctionist said:
I am sorry, and you can go ahead and disregard this comment if the blog post is already almost done, but I am fairly certain the SSJ multiplier does affect all stats due to the fact that it multiplies ki output, which does directly translate to all stats, including strength, durability, attack potency, and even speed.
Click to expand...
It probably does to be honest but it's not very specific especially when it comes to speed and only says the transformation increases the user's power by 50. But it doesn't really matter anyway since SSJ Goku and Frieza are likely FTL+.
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True but the Zenkai boost does the same it only increases power yet it's proven that it also affects the speed.
 
Ah everyone's being too hopeful. Well on the Blog Post it technically supports a 28X FTL SSJ Goku and 100% Frieza but there's still needs to be a community decision for that so I'd suggest you fight hard to get it accepted...
 
SchutzenDunkelZiel1217 said:
Ah everyone's being too hopeful. Well on the Blog Post it technically supports a 28X FTL SSJ Goku and 100% Frieza but there's still needs to be a community decision for that so I'd suggest you fight hard to get it accepted...
Click to expand...
How far are you into the blog?
 
It's technically done but I'm trying the do the finishing touches to make it appear shorter. I kinda went overboard and typed over 1200 words for it...
 
My personal opinion on this will be using something that most likely wasn't used so far in this blog(I didn't bother browsing every single response, so I may be wrong), but we already have a speed feat for Goku AND Piccolo for that matter back in Dragon Ball. Goku and Piccolo for the first time in the manga, during the tournament, reached a speed where the NORMAL HUMAN eye can't follow them. We know that normal humans can see supersonic objects(granted, it's most often a blur, but the important thing here is that they saw SOMETHING). Hence, Goku and Piccolo are supersonic back in Dragon Ball. Then, all you really need to apply are the power boosts Goku received between the end of Dragon Ball, and onto the Namek Saga. I'm not able to bring a precise answer, but I believe this is a more solid base to start from than most of the arguments I've seen until now.
 
So due to my current situation and the problems with the device I am using at the moment, can someone briefly summarize whether or not the speed will be upgraded, and if so, to what levels?
 
Sheoth said:
So due to my current situation and the problems with the device I am using at the moment, can someone briefly summarize whether or not the speed will be upgraded, and if so, to what levels?
Click to expand...
I believe its being accepted, when the upgrades take place idk.

we got a calc that is accepted to that Namek SSJ Goku is 28X FTL, KaiokenX20 14XFTL KaiokenX10 7XFTL

if you mean how do other characters scale off this im not sure
 
Since Dragon Ball Kai is a valid canon source now... Why not try and scale the timeframes off those scenes? Could that be useful?
 
Unless Sonic gets all his feats, even the ones considered "Outliers" he's losing against him. Full Powered Super Saiyan Form is comparable to Cell who has the ability to potentially destroy stars, same as Freeza if not moreso.
 
I already gave him my input about the Multiplier thing, I don't trust multipliers because they don't usually break-even with feats.
 
I was talking with Sheoth. He asked about the conclusions of this thread.
 
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