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REDUX ~ Son Goku vs Ness

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TheJ-ManRequiem said:
Tyranitar should stomp Charizard, what the hell . The gap between kefla and Goku was big, just couldt hit him , she could of killed him in one attack .
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Doesn't that go against what you were saying?

Anyway, how about the fact that middle form Pokemon are Sub-Rel at .034c, yet 100% Zygarde is in the same tier? See how our scaling rules go?
 
Well cal if ya are talking about speed itd be over 1.2x ovo .

Anyway, upon focusing he knocked her out, and she was strong enough to instabtly kill him moments prior .
 
everything scales in db, the attack didnt because he cant attack the same way he does everything else, can we move above the goku is baseline since it was already proven wrong and move to other points or wait for other people to give their opinion? theres 3 people talking back and forth for the exact same point over and over.
 
The real cal howard said:
Analogies.
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Please stop with those. They get very tiresome after awhile and it assumes everyone knows what you are talking about. Especially when repeated every argument.
 
TheJ-ManRequiem said:
Well cal if ya are talking about speed itd be over 1.2x ovo .

Anyway, upon focusing he knocked her out, and she was strong enough to instabtly kill him moments prior .
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Because a point blank strongest attack going all out is going to hit her hard when she was off-guard.
 
I'm leaning on Ness, since I knew him more than Goku, but I'm not voting for him yet.


I haven't caught up with DBS for awhile and I don't really know that much about Ultra Instinct, so could someone explain it to me?
 
TheJ-ManRequiem said:
This is the stupidest thing i've ever seen in my entire life.
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Ya best explain yourself, because not wrong .

Kefla SSJ= Spirit Bomb SSBKKx20 Goku's Power (AKA, something Jiren toyed with, using his EYES).


Kefla SSJ2 (Full Powered)= Got ****** by U.I Goku.


Jiren= Stronger than his GoD, and has yet to get serious in this Tournament. I mean, he's supposed to be the strongest guy here. I don't think Kefla even comes close to his power.

The GoD's are stronger than Kefla, and they're likely a bit Stronger than U.I Goku AT THIS MOMENT! Jiren is still stronger than them, however. I don't think Beerus, or anyone else is stronger than another GoD. Each GoD is likely limited to the same Power, due to hiarchy balance. Hence, why I say this: If Belmod couldn't beat Jiren, then nobody but the Main Character can beat him (AKA, Goku).

Goku will be the Top Dog in this Tournament by the end of it all. But, as of now, he's not stronger than ******* Jiren, Beerus, or anyone else at this moment. Unless Goku actually defeats Jiren, then he's still weaker. Sorry. Kefla should be right above Zamasu, as well.


Zamasu is weak af. Don't bother with him.
 
Uh, when I stated jiren , I meant a casual , restrained jiren, but casual restrained jiren is also stronger than Belmond.

Jiren >>>>>> Ui2 Goku > kefla > ui Goku > jiren > gods > Zamasu . Better?
 
TheJ-ManRequiem said:
Uh, when I stated jiren , I meant a casual , restrained jiren, but casual restrained jiren is also stronger than Belmond.
Jiren >>>>>> Ui2 Goku > kefla > ui Goku > jiren > gods > Zamasu . Better?
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Nah.

Goku (Mastered Ultra Instinct) > or = Jiren (Actually Trying) >>>>>>>>>>> U.I 2 Goku >>>>>> U.I Goku >>>>> Jiren (Casual af) >>> Gods Of Destruction >>>>>> Kefla >>>> Zamasu.
 
Mastered ultra Goku doesn't exist yet.

And kefla is more powerful than ui1 , it is stated explicitly . Any way, the amount of greater than ya put us implying a huge difference, casual jiren and ui are about equal , not >>>>> .
 
TheJ-ManRequiem said:
Mastered ultra Goku doesn't exist yet.
And kefla is more powerful than ui1 , it is stated explicitly . Any way, the amount of greater than ya put us implying a huge difference, casual jiren and ui are about equal , not >>>>> .
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Not really. Her SSJ power was stated to be at the ranks of Goku's SSB KK Spirit Bomb. Her SSJ2 Power shouldn't really be as different.


Also, during Goku's battle with Jiren, Goku kicked Jiren with regular U.I, and it got him. Infact, he had to unleash his Aura to stop U.I Goku's punch.

Also, we may get to see a Mastered U.I this Arc. Though, it's not confirmed. That's just my speculation.
 
this is damn silly

adding more ">>>>" doesn't give Goku the ability to one shot unless it's actually demonstrated he could actually one shot baseline low 2-C's.

one shot!= defeating a low 2-C with a charged KHH.
 
Elder Kai, after she power up stated that her power was above the power Goku had last time he entered ultra instinct .

One kick , that was it, but yeah , true .

I honestly expect it .
 
AguilaR101 said:
this is damn silly
adding more ">>>>" doesn't give Goku the ability to one shot unless it's actually demonstrated he could actually one shot baseline low 2-C's.

one shot!= defeating a low 2-C with a charged KHH.
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Never said he could 1 shot. Only said his ability was starting to Overpower Casual Jiren. However, that was until he drained out. D:
 
TheJ-ManRequiem said:
Elder Kai, after she power up stated that her power was above the power Goku had last time he entered ultra instinct .
One kick , that was it, but yeah , true .

I honestly expect it .
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Really? I have to go back and check it.

If that's true, then that's some clear bullshit.
 
TheJ-ManRequiem said:
Bullshit yeah, but fact none the less .
Click to expand...
Fact yeah, but bullshit none the less.

Manga SSB Vegito was stated to be around the same lvl as Beerus.

Jiren is stated to be stronger than Belmod, and he got hit by U.I Goku (Though, he was in Casual mode. But, still).

However, Kefla SSJ2 is stronger than Goku when he FIRST went U.I? Wh...wha...what?
 
UI makes you stronger the longer you're in the form, so goku's most likely stronger than he was when he first got the form.
 
Thats the thing, you chose to believe, you are convinced of your beliefs.

Power Shields are literally meaningless in this fight, as shown above.

Ooooooh boooy he will reduce Goku's attack to 25%? 25% of goddamn infinity.

Not to mention you are claiming Ness can spam shields while the speed is equalized, which is wank.
 
No offense, but its becoming clear you don't understand dimensional tiering.

It's only infinite to beings of lower dimensional power. Goku's power is infinite to beings with 3-D power, but perfectly quantifiable to beings of 4-D power. Which Ness falls under. By your logic, because all of tier 2 is infinity, Goku is as strong as Ness, who'd then be as strong as Arceus, or Lavos, or Lucemon, or YHVH. Because infinity is infinity.

Furthermore, shields require a though, Goku requires movement. Shield spamming is very believable.
 
If you want to go the "infinity is infinity" route, we can do UI Goku vs TOAA because both have infinite power. You can reduce the power of a Low 2-C, because it's absolutely finite for other tier 2s
 
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