Raiden vs 2B

[BruceTheBatman]

High 7-C for both, speed equalized.
Finally I get to see this.

 

[SpookyShadow]

2 times was done and was kinda fair :v

2B has big AP advantage but it barely matters. He can still obliterate her with Ripper Mode and Blade Mode

 

[Twellas]

2B has like a 7x AP advantage that could be covered by RM, that being said, I don't think she really has a way to get past his BM

 

[SpookyShadow]

She is immortal (basically can replace her body with same mind) but I remember it's pretty limited, and Jack has hacking.

 

[Twellas]

Yeah, and the hacking is also passive, so...

 

[Schnee_One]

Raiden is baseline?

 

[SpookyShadow]

Before the questions - yes, hacking works, that's the very thing 9S does

 

[SpookyShadow]

Raiden is baseline?

Above 120 kilotons, and I think Ripper Mode was accepted as 7X, and still he has RPL

 

[Schnee_One]

I don't recall Raidens hacking being particularly notable

 

[SpookyShadow]

Well he can hack cyborgs machines. It's not 9S level but 2B is still an android

 

[Schnee_One]

I don't believe he can actually hack cyborgs in a Combat applicable manner, same reason why he never hacked any of his cyborg opponents in game, Monsoon Mistral etc

 

[SpookyShadow]

Well, they have still completely human mind but I'll give you that.

 

[Schnee_One]

They don't tho, their minds are affectively supercomputers

 

[SpookyShadow]

There is a difference between mind and brain.

Blade Wolf himself stated "is this all that human mind is capable of?" in his battle with Jack.

 

[Schnee_One]

Then it's completely irrelevant they have a mind because they still have a brain that keeps it

 

[SpookyShadow]

Who would give a shit anyway.

 

[Schnee_One]

You brought up hacking

 

[SpookyShadow]

And now that I see it's irrelevant I try something else.

 

[Twellas]

Hacking isn't even needed if she doesn't have a way to get past his BM and Raiden's RPL will eventually fill the gap

 

[ApiesDeathbyLazors]

I've never played automatic tomatoes, but can't 2B endlessly Rez via basically save States of her mind?

 

[Schnee_One]

Actually I think 2B loses her memories after dying unless she saves

 

[ApiesDeathbyLazors]

Would it be in-character for her to back herself up before a fight?

 

[TheRustyOne]

YoRHa falls at the end, meaning 2B isn't capable of backing herself up anymore. When does this fight take place, if it's before YoRHa's fall than she can come back in another body if she backed up her memories of her going to fight. If not than she comes back with no memories of the fight, her saving or not depends on player input, so we don't know if she'll save.

I guess she might save if she thinks she could die in this fight.

Though if it's after YoRHa than she only gets one life.

 

[EnnardTrap1987]

I legit thought you put Raiden up against a 2-B character

I'm so strange. Anyway, Raiden FRA

 

[ShadowWhoWalks]

2B's immortality requires infrastructure which doesn't exist in the standard battle location.

Currently leaning on Raiden FRA. He also has EMP grenades, and if 2B learns Raiden is a human then it would cause her distress as harming him fundamentally goes against her programming.

On the other hand, 2B can counter Blade Mode with the Slow chip, and it is an AoE so she doesn't need to get too close to activate it, and it grant 2B a mobility advantage. She might be able to passively block Raiden's attacks with the Shield Chip as well.

 

[SpookyShadow]

Jack's not a human biologically (though he is completely a human mind-wise) so she can attack him freely

 

[SpookyShadow]

Mobility advantage... Ma, don't know aboutthat

 

[Mister6ame6]

Raiden FRA

 

[ShadowWhoWalks]

Raiden still has a human brain with human memories and experience, which would be an invaliable treasure for 2B, and killing him would be a great loss for her.

The mobility advantage comment wasn't for the general mobility, but for mobility WHILE Raiden is under the effect of Slow; AFAIK Raiden can't simultaneously run circles around his opponent while using Blade Mode, and he'll need Blade Mode to counter Slow which means that he won't be able to run around.

 

[Schnee_One]

2B doesn't actually know he's a Cyborg.

 

[SpookyShadow]

He doesn't have a human brain, he has a fully cyborg brain. About the memories and experience, yup that's right

 

[Twellas]

Pretty sure that BM slowing Raiden to a crawl in terms of walking speed is merely a gameplay mechanic non supported by any canonical explaination

 

[Schnee_One]

Is there anything that contradicts it?

 

[SpookyShadow]

Pretty sure it's Jack's perception of time extremely slowing down so his normal movement speed is so slow it's not even noticeable

 

[Twellas]

Is there anything that contradicts it?

Mainly the fact that the explaination we are given of how BM works wouldn't influence wallking speed at all, also, the fact that this mechanic is never given a proper canonical explaination is very telling in a game where stuff like Mistrall's **** bouncing, Raiden's health not regenerating automatically, HF blade's cutting properties, the fact that enemies explode after being defeated and many more silly details are given extensive explaination

 

[Schnee_One]

<**** bouncing

Dafuq, I'm not saying you're wrong but that was a bit out of nowhere

 

[SpookyShadow]

Do you see nanomachine boobs bouncing everyday?

 

[Twellas]

<**** bouncing
Dafuq, I'm not saying you're wrong but that was a bit out of nowhere

It's an example of an extremely obsolete detail having a complex canonical explaination, basically proof that everything that is not purely gameplay-related is explained by either Dok or some other codec character.

 

[Twellas]

And even then, Raiden is eventually going to grow to a point where 2B can't harm him anymore with AP, 2B has to have an answer for that too

 

[SpookyShadow]

I mean, 2B has a massive AP advantage right now