Professor Paradox Vs Heaven Ascension DIO

[Chariot190]

Jetstream Sam scales to Raiden for being physically comparable to him which I assume comes from locking blades

If I recall they can actually grapple and shit actually. Also Sam has cybernetic enhancements, state of the art, which are drastically above MGS4 Raiden (who's body at the time is considered completely obsolete even compared to his initial body in Rising), with said obsolete body being the body that did the Class G feat, while missing an arm, and suffering from poisoning.
Sam scaling is more like, he's superior to Raiden in every single way and the feat he scales off as is considered an obsolete feat by every character in the game.

Though if Eon isn't Class M, I think that's the more notable issue, well this doesnt really matter, I was just thinking maybe C-Moon could incap Paradox given it has enough range to cover SBA, it's thoughtbased and if used to limit movement, one would need some decent lifting strength to have their mobility not hindered at all.

 

[Greenshifter]

Sam scaling is more like, he's superior to Raiden in every single way

He scales under Raiden in LS though. Everything else you said is fine I guess. Paradox can just teleport with a thought tho, so I don’t think it matters and I doubt C-Moon can see past Paradox’s cloaking tech in the past.

 

[Gohanblanco217]

He scales under Raiden in LS though. Everything else you said is fine I guess. Paradox can just teleport with a thought tho, so I don’t think it matters and I doubt C-Moon can see past Paradox’s cloaking tech in the past.

I wonder if Paradox can travel to the future to see what's gonna happen in the fight during the prep time lol I was thinking about removing the prep time because of this but meh

 

[Chariot190]

Only end game Raiden he scales below, he absolutely curbs any variant or form prior, he's technologically superior to every version of Raiden pre Ch.1 and he's superior in every way till the end.
The profile says "he's comparable but weaker" is talking about end-game Raiden, the Class G feat is done by the 8-A Raiden.

C-Moon can see past Paradox’s cloaking tech in the past.

he can't, at least not without Dio's help. Though I stand by the fact Dio really shouldnt have any issues tracking Paradox based on his own feats.

 

[Greenshifter]

I wonder if Paradox can travel to the future to see what's gonna happen in the fight during the prep time lol I was thinking about removing the prep time because of this but meh

I don't thinks that works or is allowed (since the future depends on his own actions), Paradox would also only see all possible futures, which doesn't tell him much.

 

[AZeron420]

Holy mother of ! This thread is ******* long. So I guess the winner still isn't decided.

 

[Arcker123]

Paradox already won and its on profile kek

 

[AZeron420]

Paradox already won and its on profile kek

Bruh. My bad lel.

 

[Greenshifter]

BFR to his own dimension is thought based activation

It took a while for that one guy in the previously linked vis to get BFR'd though, like a few seconds between the BFR starting and him actually appearing in Dio's dimension. More than enough time for Paradox to dodge.

Everything else though... I watched at a freaking episode of Generator Rex to counter with OP cloaking tech but I didn't find anything. So I guess Dio appears in the right place lol will work along with BFR to his own dimension which is an instant wincon if Dio himself doesn't show up there. I'm not confident anymore that Paradox wins this (could be incon though) so all the votes based on my reasoning should be nulled for the time being... here's to another page or so lol.

 

[manu_zarri]

290 post now,

I don't want get on other 200 posts
so this is a incon? and votes should be removed etc..?

 

[Greenshifter]

Imma wait for Chariot, Dio has waaaay too many variables to account for.

 

[manu_zarri]

also, i know this out of context, but shouldn't HA Dio speed get changed? not saying infinite should be removed.. but..

 

[Chariot190]

also, i know this out of context, but shouldn't HA Dio speed get changed? not saying infinite should be removed.. but..

He's a bit outdated yeah, he needs tweaked speed, AP upgrade for matching GER with TWOH, tk, air manipulation and apparently acausality type 1.

It took a while for that one guy in the previously linked vis to get BFR'd though, like a few seconds between the BFR starting and him actually appearing in Dio's dimension. More than enough time for Paradox to dodge.

no idea what was linked but I only said it had thought based activation, I never said it was instant speed, that's two very different things (Though in the case of JoJo, most thought based abilities are instant, but I recall clarifying it took a moment to Rikki even before I joined the thread so either way).
Though, you say "him", I'm unsure which scene you're talking about, unless you mean the Funny scene? Dio usually brings people enmass given every time he did it, excluding Funny, it was multiple at once.

Though, you can't exactly "dodge" Dio bringing you into his realm, it's not a thing where if you move you dodge it or whatever, he doesn't use the rifts to do that, it's not like something that only works if the person stands still, it effects the person even if they move and regardless of what universe or time they're in.
It may take a moment to bring them in, but once it gets going, the target is being brought in whether they like it or not and running away ain't gonna stop it given Dio's 2-A range and temporal effect on the ability.
The rifts may be a thing that can be dodged though, although Dio can spawn rifts ontop of a target so it gets mitigated to an extent, but in regards to being brought into his dimension? You can't really avoid or dodge that, only the rifts.

Edit: Again, unsure if this helps, but Dio was stated to be able to defeat Love Train even pre.

 

[Rikimarox2]

Yeah, it takes a moment. Pretty sure I already said that in my previous replies.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Removed fight from The profiles btw

 

[manu_zarri]

Removed fight from The profiles btw

wait, should you ask in the page before editing?

 

[Greenshifter]

So Paradox's traps work sometime and he defeats Dio and his summons. Sometimes Dio will defeat Paradox (most likely via BFR, keep in mind that BFR'ing Paradox while Dio dies in the main universe by traps still results in Paradox winning, as long as no-one else kills him) without himself dying. Sometimes both die (due to automated traps). Incon?

 

[Chariot190]

So Paradox's traps work sometime and he defeats Dio and his summons. Sometimes Dio will defeat Paradox (most likely via BFR, keep in mind that BFR'ing Paradox while Dio dies in the main universe by traps still results in Paradox winning, as long as no-one else kills him) without himself dying. Sometimes both die (due to automated traps). Incon?

I have absolutely no idea the end result of the match. I'm just answering questions and tossing a few things out that are kinda bottom of the barrel and not overtly obvious, such as, C-Moon.

Though, I will say, it was probably already mentioned, but you kinda have to kill Dio instantly in a single attack, otherwise you're ****** because TWOH can overwrite any damage done to him and make him perfectly fine as if nothing even happened (he can regenerate as well, but that's not exactly the same as outright deleting the damage you had) and if Dio is tipped off and knows how dangerous a foe is, well he isn't stupid, he's an egotistical asshole with his head up his ass, but he isnt stupid, he'd make use of his abilities, and that would include attacking from out of range given his 2-A capabilities on a few attacks.

Also does Paradox have NPI and EP? As in, can he attack or harm TWOH and prevent it from saving Dio's ass? Or even sense it?

 

[StrymULTRA]

wait, should you ask in the page before editing?

Only with really heavy changes.

 

[manu_zarri]

Only with really heavy changes.

cool, also can you remove the space in notable loses (For HA Dio) and the space in notable victories (for Paradox)?

 

[StrymULTRA]

cool, also can you remove the space in notable loses (For HA Dio) and the space in notable victories (for Paradox)?

Already did

 

[Greenshifter]

I have absolutely no idea the end result of the match. I'm just answering questions and tossing a few things out that are kinda bottom of the barrel and not overtly obvious, such as, C-Moon.

Though, I will say, it was probably already mentioned, but you kinda have to kill Dio instantly in a single attack, otherwise you're ****** because TWOH can overwrite any damage done to him and make him perfectly fine as if nothing even happened (he can regenerate as well, but that's not exactly the same as outright deleting the damage you had) and if Dio is tipped off and knows how dangerous a foe is, well he isn't stupid, he's an egotistical asshole with his head up his ass, but he isnt stupid, he'd make use of his abilities, and that would include attacking from out of range given his 2-A capabilities on a few attacks.

Also does Paradox have NPI and EP? As in, can he attack or harm TWOH and prevent it from saving Dio's ass? Or even sense it?

Considering the amount of regenerating aliens in Ben 10 with better regen than Dio the single attack thing ain’t gonna be a problem.

Dio is also barely gonna have any time to figure out just how dangerous his opponent really is. Since Paradox can make automated weapons that fire on the other side of the galaxy and suddenly have their beam appear behind Dio. Giving him practically no time to react (and this applies for the battlefield and wherever Paradox will be hiding, past/alternate timeline).

There should be NPI in Ben 10 that covers Dio’s stand (well at least physical objects, energy attacks not sure). Albedo’s cell door NPI > Ghostfreak’s intangibility > mana NPI > Big Chill’s intangibility (the mana thing isn’t completely accepted yet). For the invisibility not sure, if it’s above baseline then I don’t know any tech in Ben 10 that can counter it so Paradox would have to start from scratch. That said due to prep he should be aware of stands though and he can just insta-kill Dio rather than target his stand. As for known weapons that can affect his stand then I think the universal+ Annihilaargh and multiversal CTB’s (potentially with EE but also not completely accepted yet) probably counter?

 

[Chariot190]

Dio is also barely gonna have any time to figure out just how dangerous his opponent really is. Since Paradox can make automated weapons that fire on the other side of the galaxy and suddenly have their beam appear behind Dio. Giving him practically no time to react (and this applies for the battlefield and wherever Paradox will be hiding, past/alternate timeline).

Not really a issue. If Dio gets so much as a single moment of awareness, that's a much less drastic issue to begin with. And mind you, it's not "get one off on Dio before he can react" it's "get on off and Dio before he and his Stand reacts".
Because Dio isn't the issue, he's the lesser evil, it's his Stand that's the bigger issue, we keep talking about Dio, but we're ignoring that Dio isn't exactly alone. He has a semi automatic guardian that from the looks of things and Paradox's profile, can't even be touched or seen.
Even if Dio himself isn't aware, if his Stand is aware, it being the same type of Star Platinum, it has self preservation abilities. Also if any and all attacks have a material form, they can be powernulled by TWOH before they reach Dio's body, unless he can create attacks that have NPI/EP? Though that may not matter given TWOH could powernull Act 4 bullets on contact, meaning as long as he's nulling something, he doesn't get hurt by touching it. Also, if, and I do say if here because there is indeed a chance he doesn't, and that's if he picks up on how dangerous his opponent is, if he opts to get away and attack from afar, nothing is gonna reach him anymore because his range is 2-A, compared to Paradox's 2-B, meaning, there is an infinitely high chance that wherever Dio goes to get away, Paradox's attacks can't reach him or his traps weren't placed in that realm.

There should be NPI in Ben 10 that covers Dio’s stand (well at least physical objects, energy attacks not sure). Albedo’s cell door NPI > Ghostfreak’s intangibility > mana NPI > Big Chill’s intangibility (the mana thing isn’t completely accepted yet). For the invisibility not sure, if it’s above baseline then I don’t know any tech in Ben 10 that can counter it so Paradox would have to start from scratch.

Yet he has nothing on his profile that suggests NPI? Has he ever created or shown a device with NPI? Other then the giant **** you ayy bombs that I assume would have killed the entire species of the aliens you mentioned.

That said due to prep he should be aware of stands though and he can just insta-kill Dio rather than target his stand. As for known weapons that can affect his stand then I think the universal+ Annihilaargh and multiversal CTB’s (potentially with EE but also not completely accepted yet) probably counter?

He has prep, not prior knowledge, that's two very different things.
Honestly, Paradox all things considered, would be coming into this thinking he's dealing with a seemingly powerful reality warping homoerotic glamrock man in a banana hammock, he shouldn't be aware that he's also dealing with an invisible noncorporal duplicate of his opponent as well.
It may not be the biggest issue in play here, but it could definitely help Dio out if Paradox's traps and attacks he built other then his biggest universal annihilating attacks (which im assuming have NPI for killing the noncorporal aliens, at least, I'd assume they would do that) can't actually harm TWOH as the traps weren't built with TWOH in mind, basically meaning, TWOH can just facetank all traps and EE the attacks from them with zero issue before they harm Dio.
You two examples as said would likely effect TWOH, though, if they have any travel distance, there could be a saving grace, if the aoe or harmful effect reaches TWOH before it reaches Dio, TWOH could in theory powernull it, though if it does have a aoe, travel time, etc, would Dio just be able to react and teleport away to another reality? Especially of his foe teleports as well to get away before such things explode and the like, Dio may just follow suit and either follow him or recuperate in his own realm and formulate a plan of action.


Basically to summarize.

While it's true Dio shouldn't be instantly aware of how dangerous his foe is, if he gets even one tip off, he's going to make use of that information to the best of his ability.

Paradox by all accounts shouldn't be aware of Dio's Stand, there's really nothing he would have that would tip him off without granting him prior information but that's not a thing he was given by OP. He'd have a general idea about his opponent as per SBA but things like that, he wouldn't.

Every trap that Paradox lays has to not only get past Dio and instant kill him, but it has to get past TWOH who can powernull before things reach Dio. Instant kill isn't the issue basically, it's the getting past TWOH.

If Paradox doesn't build his traps and attacks with NPI in mind due to his lack of awareness of Dio's Stand, TWOH is more likely able to save Dio in following situations. Even if the traps can annihilate Dio, if they can't even interact with TWOH then TWOH has absolutely nothing to worry about and can cover and negate attacks with less issue.

If Dio survives even a single overkill trap, whether that's through him reacting in time or TWOH covering for his ass, that would be enough to tip him off, at that point the range of traps cease to matter, they won't have the range to hit him wherever he goes toward.

While universal and multiversal attacks may be able to get past TWOH, if they have an expansion or need to travel, the chances of them hitting Dio lowers, given Dio can just teleport away, and nothing Paradox has has the range to hit Dio after he teleports as well as TWOH possibly being able to powernull.

And one final thing I thought of when typing but, are the traps Paradox lays material or enough to be considered one thing? I say this because, TWOH, when he EE's something, can in turn delete every copy of that thing in existence or things that are heavily integral to that being (See Funny, deleting one Funny made Funny cease to exist in any reality ever, it also for some reason deleted his family heirloom because **** Funny in particular I guess?).

Don't know how much any of this matters but hey, I'm just tossing out ideas because I was asked. If I'm not being overly concise my bad, just woke up a few minutes ago, still a little hazy.

 

[Rikimarox2]

homoerotic glamrock man in a banana hammock.

ಠ_ಠ

 

[Gohanblanco217]

Bump

 

[manu_zarri]

shouldn't vote be removed for avoid people confusion?

 

[Gohanblanco217]

shouldn't vote be removed for avoid people confusion?

Removed all the votes

 

[Greenshifter]

Not really a issue. If Dio gets so much as a single moment of awareness, that's a much less drastic issue to begin with. And mind you, it's not "get one off on Dio before he can react" it's "get on off and Dio before he and his Stand reacts".
Because Dio isn't the issue, he's the lesser evil, it's his Stand that's the bigger issue, we keep talking about Dio, but we're ignoring that Dio isn't exactly alone. He has a semi automatic guardian that from the looks of things and Paradox's profile, can't even be touched or seen.
Even if Dio himself isn't aware, if his Stand is aware, it being the same type of Star Platinum, it has self preservation abilities. Also if any and all attacks have a material form, they can be powernulled by TWOH before they reach Dio's body, unless he can create attacks that have NPI/EP? Though that may not matter given TWOH could powernull Act 4 bullets on contact, meaning as long as he's nulling something, he doesn't get hurt by touching it. Also, if, and I do say if here because there is indeed a chance he doesn't, and that's if he picks up on how dangerous his opponent is, if he opts to get away and attack from afar, nothing is gonna reach him anymore because his range is 2-A, compared to Paradox's 2-B, meaning, there is an infinitely high chance that wherever Dio goes to get away, Paradox's attacks can't reach him or his traps weren't placed in that realm.



Yet he has nothing on his profile that suggests NPI? Has he ever created or shown a device with NPI? Other then the giant **** you ayy bombs that I assume would have killed the entire species of the aliens you mentioned.



He has prep, not prior knowledge, that's two very different things.
Honestly, Paradox all things considered, would be coming into this thinking he's dealing with a seemingly powerful reality warping homoerotic glamrock man in a banana hammock, he shouldn't be aware that he's also dealing with an invisible noncorporal duplicate of his opponent as well.
It may not be the biggest issue in play here, but it could definitely help Dio out if Paradox's traps and attacks he built other then his biggest universal annihilating attacks (which im assuming have NPI for killing the noncorporal aliens, at least, I'd assume they would do that) can't actually harm TWOH as the traps weren't built with TWOH in mind, basically meaning, TWOH can just facetank all traps and EE the attacks from them with zero issue before they harm Dio.
You two examples as said would likely effect TWOH, though, if they have any travel distance, there could be a saving grace, if the aoe or harmful effect reaches TWOH before it reaches Dio, TWOH could in theory powernull it, though if it does have a aoe, travel time, etc, would Dio just be able to react and teleport away to another reality? Especially of his foe teleports as well to get away before such things explode and the like, Dio may just follow suit and either follow him or recuperate in his own realm and formulate a plan of action.


Basically to summarize.

While it's true Dio shouldn't be instantly aware of how dangerous his foe is, if he gets even one tip off, he's going to make use of that information to the best of his ability.

Paradox by all accounts shouldn't be aware of Dio's Stand, there's really nothing he would have that would tip him off without granting him prior information but that's not a thing he was given by OP. He'd have a general idea about his opponent as per SBA but things like that, he wouldn't.

Every trap that Paradox lays has to not only get past Dio and instant kill him, but it has to get past TWOH who can powernull before things reach Dio. Instant kill isn't the issue basically, it's the getting past TWOH.

If Paradox doesn't build his traps and attacks with NPI in mind due to his lack of awareness of Dio's Stand, TWOH is more likely able to save Dio in following situations. Even if the traps can annihilate Dio, if they can't even interact with TWOH then TWOH has absolutely nothing to worry about and can cover and negate attacks with less issue.

If Dio survives even a single overkill trap, whether that's through him reacting in time or TWOH covering for his ass, that would be enough to tip him off, at that point the range of traps cease to matter, they won't have the range to hit him wherever he goes toward.

While universal and multiversal attacks may be able to get past TWOH, if they have an expansion or need to travel, the chances of them hitting Dio lowers, given Dio can just teleport away, and nothing Paradox has has the range to hit Dio after he teleports as well as TWOH possibly being able to powernull.

And one final thing I thought of when typing but, are the traps Paradox lays material or enough to be considered one thing? I say this because, TWOH, when he EE's something, can in turn delete every copy of that thing in existence or things that are heavily integral to that being (See Funny, deleting one Funny made Funny cease to exist in any reality ever, it also for some reason deleted his family heirloom because **** Funny in particular I guess?).

Don't know how much any of this matters but hey, I'm just tossing out ideas because I was asked. If I'm not being overly concise my bad, just woke up a few minutes ago, still a little hazy.

First off... Chariot: I’m just gonna clarify some stuff.

Also Chariot: wall of text that’s longer than my average college paper.

Second off, I must apologize... cause I’m pretty sure all of this is irrelevant. You see Paradox has 4-A AP for this: “Moved an entire nebula” and he can basically splice that thing apart, so he can just rip Dio apart (past his regen) by pointing at him or snapping his fingers most likely.

As for the matter of prep time and being aware of stands:

• An individual with prep time can use it to research their opponent and their abilities (through media, magical abilities, or other), but would not be able to see the opponent's use of prep time, if applicable.

Comes from this thread and time travel should fall under the “other” section. This isn’t really applied anywhere as far as I’m aware but it’s the best thread/explanation regarding prep time that we have. Obviously stands fall under “opponent and their abilities”.

Certain traps could be considered somewhat of the “same thing” but not all of them obviously.

So since Paradox will know before the battle starts that a cloaking shield isn’t gonna work. He just stays on the battlefield and points at Dio/snaps his fingers. Dio’s teleportation takes a few seconds so he’s dead before Paradox gets BFR’d. The only problem would be his summons. Who wins if Dio is dead, his summons alive and Paradox BFR’d? How easily can Paradox deal with his summons assuming he isn’t BFR’d?

 

[manu_zarri]

Removed all the votes

nice.

 

[Arcker123]

Is the debate restarting?

 

[Ned_the_outer_god]

Is the debate restarting?

Pretty much

 

[Arcker123]

Why though

 

[Ned_the_outer_god]

Because the old argument was kinda wrong

 

[Arcker123]

Good enough I guess... so how good is paradoxes time stop resistance

 

[Chariot190]

First off... Chariot: I’m just gonna clarify some stuff.

That's true, I'll continue doing so if needed.

Also Chariot: wall of text that’s longer than my average college paper.

Well may as well go in all right? Though, as said, I'm just tossing ideas out now that may not have been mentioned, though if it escalates into an actual debate I'm out, I don't have the time to make this thread my main priority.

Second off, I must apologize... cause I’m pretty sure all of this is irrelevant. You see Paradox has 4-A AP for this: “Moved an entire nebula” and he can basically splice that thing apart, so he can just rip Dio apart (past his regen) by pointing at him or snapping his fingers most likely.

That's probably the worst possible thing Paradox could do, because the moment Dio starts getting telekinetic shredded, his Stand is gonna RO the damage while it's happening and then they're both gonna immediately **** off beyond the ability of Paradox to reach them, and at that point, Dio can still fight and attack, Paradox can't. And it just becomes a game of how long can Paradox last.

Comes from this thread and time travel should fall under the “other” section. This isn’t really applied anywhere as far as I’m aware but it’s the best thread/explanation regarding prep time that we have. Obviously stands fall under “opponent and their abilities”.

And how is he going to figure that out exactly? If he can reasonably figure out what Dio can do or what he has that's one thing, but prep isn't exactly going to help him at all in figuring this out, even with time travel and the like. He can't exactly research Dio in a book, or ask people, given everyone is either dead, or if time travel is used, they don't know anything about him. Dio, except to very few people, even knew he had a Stand and even less knew what it could do, and that's before he had heaven, and in regards to heaven Dio, only two people in existence knew his Stand's capabilities. And one is basically on Dio's ass at all times. And the other just gambles all day and is barely involved with Dio. Secondly, he's going to research his opponent, realistically speaking, he's not going to find out anything about Stands, there's absolutely nothing that would logically tip him off or make him aware of they're existence unless he's outright told that they exist ahead of time by someone (Which is doubtful given how people treat Stands in-universe, as some ultra secret you dont tell anyone or anything). Because let me remind you, Paradox doesn't have EP, he can't sense or see Stands to begin with, and if there's absolutely nothing, even while researching, that would suggest Dio has some invisible spiritual guardian that can be summoned at a thought, Paradox isn't going to find out untill it's to late, and even then, I doubt his first guess would be of that and he'd just assume Dio has range or telekinetic abilities first before deducting it's what a Stand is.

Certain traps could be considered somewhat of the “same thing” but not all of them obviously.

Well whatever traps those are would probably be rendered moot.

So since Paradox will know before the battle starts that a cloaking shield isn’t gonna work.

How would he know that? Prep time isn't going to tell him what is and isn't gonna work unless he goes to **** with HA Dio and test some shit while prepping, and at that point he's just getting into a fight with HA Dio while far less prepared. There's absolutely no way Paradox would know ahead of time that his cloaking shield likely won't work against HA Dio because there's literally no way for him to figure that out unless he tests it himself.

He just stays on the battlefield and points at Dio/snaps his fingers. Dio’s teleportation takes a few seconds so he’s dead before Paradox gets BFR’d. The only problem would be his summons. Who wins if Dio is dead, his summons alive and Paradox BFR’d? How easily can Paradox deal with his summons assuming he isn’t BFR’d?

I'm going to be honest here, why is Paradox's game plan suddenly so drastically different?
Nothing has change in regards to him, his prep time wont tell him his cloaking shield wont work and he'd be extremely unlikely to find out Dio has a Stand and what a Stand is if he isn't going in with the assumption of Dio already having something akin to one and supergenius or not, I don't think that's something one would just assume. The worst part being if he actually does use time travel to figure out what Dio can do, there's the chance he may gather bad intel given how Dio's powers have changed, if goes in thinking he's only fighting Shadow Dio or something, that's gonna end badly.
And no to mention, if Paradox stays on the battlefield now as his new game plan, what's stopping Dio from like,
Dio's teleport pre key takes like half a second, though if he uses TWOH, he could likely make that instant.
The summons aren't really an issue to be blunt, only like 4 are a issue, and one needs prep time, and the rest need Dio's help, except maybe Cream and King Crimson but i doubt any would get the chance and King Crimson is mostly just useful here because he can delete actions assuming the time aspect fails to work.

Though I did go and check and unfortunately a few of Dio's moves like GoB, eyesight removal and the like are post only, though luckily it doesnt effect anything, though the sense removal would have been helpful.

To summarise.

I stand by what I said, even with prep time, there's no real feasible way he'd learn what a Stand is, what Dio's can do and so on with just three days of prep unless he's going in already under the assumption that Dio has something similar given how Stands are treated in universe and how secret Dio's was.

There's no way he'd know if his cloak would work or wouldnt work either, at all, I don't think there's anyway at all for him to even figure that out, even with time fuckery, without actually testing it against HA Dio.

Though, if Paradox can reasonably figure put certain parts of Dio's capabilities within his time limit, that should be fine. Things like him being a vampire and the like should be extremely easy to figure out for example.

Paradox's TK could be a issue, in fact, it's a huge issue, but opening with that isn't exactly a good idea, all that would do is have TWOH instantly heal Dio and then they'd both **** off immediately. If his tk isn't going to instantly kill him, it's a bad move and only makes it so he can longer reach Dio. TK would be a issue if TWOH was already busy or rendered incapicated, even if briefly, at that point TK would be a winning move, but given the above two points, that may not be super likely, at least not intentionally.

HA Dio's teleport, at least when used on himself, can be as quick as just a split second, though if he uses TWOH to teleport (unsure how likely this is, it's not exactly something he does often, it's just something he can do, but if he's getting torn apart, that could become a very real possibility), it'd be instant the moment TWOH activates it on contact.

Dio's summons are real only useful if they work together with Dio. By themselves they shouldn't be an issue outside of real specific ones like MIH just making them so incredibly fast they proceed to blitz, though that's only helpful if Paradox sticks around to start, because none can traverse alternate universes except Funny, and Funny isnt gonna do **** all if he isnt forced.

 

[Gohanblanco217]

Paradox's TK could be a issue, in fact, it's a huge issue.......

Paradox doesn't have TK, it's just him teleportating an entire nebula outside of space and time (BFR that has multi solar system level range) well this could be useful if Paradox teleported an entire planet to crush Dio tho

 

[Greenshifter]

Yet he has nothing on his profile that suggests NPI? Has he ever created or shown a device with NPI? Other then the giant **** you ayy bombs that I assume would have killed the entire species of the aliens you mentioned.

I mean Albedo’d cell door will be created by fodder intelligent people compared to him. Also just how invisible is Dio? Cause Paradox can definitely use tech to see invisible people.

Dio, TWOH could in theory powernull it, though if it does have a aoe, travel time, etc, would Dio just be able to react and teleport away to another reality?

Time bomb, depends on where Paradox detonates the weapon, if he detonates it in the past or another universe Dio probably can’t react. Annihilaargh is an MFTL+ weapon so not so sure about that, depends on how we speed equalize.

Well may as well go in all right? Though, as said, I'm just tossing ideas out now that may not have been mentioned, though if it escalates into an actual debate I'm out, I don't have the time to make this thread my main priority.

Was a joke m8, just that your definition of “just clarifying stuff” is longer than most people’s defintion of “having a debate”.

That's probably the worst possible thing Paradox could do, because the moment Dio starts getting telekinetic shredded, his Stand is gonna RO the damage while it's happening and then they're both gonna immediately **** off beyond the ability of Paradox to reach them, and at that point, Dio can still fight and attack, Paradox can't. And it just becomes a game of how long can Paradox last.

Paradox’s TK is MFTL+ for moving that nebula though technically. So if we relatively equalize speed then Dio nor TWOH can react (although that’s kinda unfair since TWOH has infinite speed).

And how is he going to figure that out exactly?

By studying his enemies, the JoJo’s.

How would he know that?

Apparently the portals taking you where you need to go is a general thing so Paradox can just figure it out by spying on the JoJo’s.

I'm going to be honest here, why is Paradox's game plan suddenly so drastically different?

Because my analysis was based on what Paradox would do against a guy with thought-based soulhax with regular teleporting capabilities. Both of which ended up being misinformation. My analysis is based on Paradox making optimal moves depending on the information he can get, which is a lot of information (for reference Paradox know pretty much everything in Ben 10). I think by SBA Paradox would be aware of what version he is fighting, could be wrong though. He can also assume worst case scenario and prep for that.

 

[Greenshifter]

Paradox doesn't have TK, it's just him teleportating an entire nebula outside of space and time (BFR that has multi solar system level range) well this could be useful if Paradox teleported an entire planet to crush Dio tho

He moved the nebula on screen as well though IIRC.

 

[Gohanblanco217]

He moved the nebula on screen as well though IIRC.

If that's so then why he doesn't have TK on his profile?

 

[Greenshifter]

Because it’s outdated
I’ll scan ya later.