Professor Paradox Vs Heaven Ascension DIO

[StrymULTRA]

If that's so then why he doesn't have TK on his profile?

Can you just change to Post Absorption?

 

[Gohanblanco217]

Can you just change to Post Absorption?

Post absorption would be a stomp as Dio would just power null everything Paradox throws at him with a simple thought, unless he still need to punch things to power null even in the post absorption key then yes I'll change it

 

[StrymULTRA]

Post absorption would be a stomp as Dio would just power null everything Paradox throws at him with a simple thought, unless he still need to punch things to power null even in the post absorption key then yes I'll change it

...are you serious?

Both ahve thought-based stuff, this bias is too high lmao.

 

[Gohanblanco217]

...are you serious?

Both ahve thought-based stuff, this bias is too high lmao.

I just don't think it's a good idea but alright then I'll do as you said

 

[Greenshifter]

Can you just change to Post Absorption?

Post-absorption probably wrecks tho. The only thought-based stuff Paradox has that was useful was getting the **** out of the battlefield. Which isn’t gonna work anymore since Dio’s abilities just “lol it works” from a distance now.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Well, I forgot

 

[Chariot190]

I mean Albedo’d cell door will be created by fodder intelligent people compared to him. Also just how invisible is Dio? Cause Paradox can definitely use tech to see invisible people.

What are you even talking about here? Dio isn;'t invisible, TWOH, and it's not due to invisibility like you're thinking (there's Stands that actually can make things invisible, like Achtung Baby), the invisibility factor is due to only stand users being able to see Stands and some spiritual aspects. And even if that was the case, that's not the point. It's not a matter of can he create tech like that, because I have no doubt he can create something like that with ease, it's a matter of would he create tech like that, because even if he CAN why would he if he has no reason to think it would be needed? And honestly, I see absolutely no reason why he would without being aware ahead of time, and there's nothing to actually tip him off of these types of things so that's a bit sus.

Time bomb, depends on where Paradox detonates the weapon, if he detonates it in the past or another universe Dio probably can’t react. Annihilaargh is an MFTL+ weapon so not so sure about that, depends on how we speed equalize.

Why wouldn't he be able to react? if it expands, it's reactable. If it's in the past, well, that's obviously not going to hurt Dio unless it takes out the whole timeline, and if it takes out the whole time, Paradox is kinda gonna need to escape himself, in which Dio just follows suit because why would Dio stick around in some neutral universe if his opponent just ****** off? He'd do the same as there's zero reason to be there any longer.
It being a MFTL+ weapon doesn't really mean much in speed equal so...

Was a joke m8, just that your definition of “just clarifying stuff” is longer than most people’s definition of “having a debate”.

That's fine, I have a tiny bit of free time for the next day or two.

By studying his enemies, the JoJo’s.

That, isn't going to help at all? We have two cases here, Jonathan, someone who doesn't have a Stand so uh, probably a super bad idea to do that actually, and Jotaro, someone who only uses his Stands in a fight, in which case to an outside viewer without EP, just looks like basic telekinesis. Again, how and why would Paradox assume and deduct it's a supernatural spiritual guardian that cant be touched or seen by outside forces without either it being explained to him by someone who knows what a Stand is or without knowing there's at least something like that prior. Also aren't verse matches supposed to take place in a neutral universe? Also, how would Paradox know about Dio's enemies? Is he really going to spend a chunk of his three days trying to find two random people at specific points in time that have an issue with Dio to oversee them, without anything to go on prior, all the while the character's he's observing have only ever dealt with a different Dio then HA Dio who has a completely different skillset bar time stop. Hell, pray be to god he doesnt get info off dino dio or someone (The World Dio's are of a rare variety, and vampire Dio's even more so).

Apparently the portals taking you where you need to go is a general thing so Paradox can just figure it out by spying on the JoJo’s.

No he can't? There's no portals used in main JoJo, only eyes of heaven, they aren't actually portals, the moment he gets involved even slightly with them, even briefly, would tip Dio off ahead of time as the only time any joestar had access to a corpse in EOH, they were under watch and being spied on by Dio. And that's without getting into the fact, why would this matter? Even ignoring how the joestars dont have this ability normally and the only time they did is when they were going against HA Dio, why would someone else having an ability make it so Paradox would prep against Dio as if he knew Dio had that ability as well? It simply doesnt make any sense, why would he assume Dio has that power and it works the same, and how would he figure out that extremely specific attribute of the rifts from mere observation? Why would he assume that opposed to it just being teleportation? Or portals? Why assume the anywhere you want aspect?

Because my analysis was based on what Paradox would do against a guy with thought-based soulhax with regular teleporting capabilities. Both of which ended up being misinformation.

Fair I suppose but, that last bit wrong though? Dio does have thoughtbased soulhax and teleportation, just not pre key. And his teleportation (at least his own) is still actually quite quick, it can be as quick as a fraction of a second when he himself uses it (as in literally, I counted like 25 frames in one scene out of a 60fps video, there's some variance, sometimes it takes a second, but sometimes it's less, guess it just depends on how much of a hurry he's in tbh), without getting into TWOH. It's his BFR via rifts that take a a second or two, which I mentioned above. Though, it's also true his teleportation isnt as quick as it would be in his post key, so that's still true.

My analysis is based on Paradox making optimal moves depending on the information he can get, which is a lot of information (for reference Paradox know pretty much everything in Ben 10).

Which is where the issue lies, see below. And yeah, but he has infinite time to have learned all that information, he only has three days here and only has "gay banana man bowie as a lead", which to be fair is a pretty good lead but not when we're talking all of time and infinite universes and billions of potential info sources per time period. He can likely deduct and reduce those numbers drastically but even then, 3 days?

I think by SBA Paradox would be aware of what version he is fighting, could be wrong though. He can also assume worst case scenario and prep for that.

He'd know his opponent, but that's about it, if you're getting time travel involved here, well that's when it stops being fair game, he could easily gather misinformation or faulty info. But in regards to HA Dio, gathering information isnt exactly easy, even Funny Valentine, one of Dio's right hand men, who was in direct contact with Dio, and was actively going out of his way to figure out a way to beat Dio and figure out his abilities and weaknesses, couldn't even get that far. Dio is extremely secretive, he kills anyone who knows about his powers and abilities, and the people that DO know are either so loyal that they'd sooner die then speak or would even kill themselves to prevent the spread of information or tend to be implanted with flesh buds that will kill them, sometimes even if they would die for him (like Enya, and that's in canon too). Worse case he can and probably would prepare, but what's worse case to him? With the information he can readily gather without straight up going up to someone like Funny and asking for a complete breakdown of what he knows (which again, is probably a bit sus he'd even be able to find Funny in time or know who or what to look for to gather that intel), I simply don't see Paradox learning about these things from simple observation feasible, whether that due to anyone who knows about Dio's abilities either being dead, (and even with time travel, they wouldn't know because they die as soon as they find out), would sooner kill themselves then speak, are rigged to die upon speaking, or would have a complete mental breakdown and go insane from the fear of talking. The fact that observing HA Dio or the joestars within the timeframe of EOH being nearly impossible as the joestars were also being observed and spied on by Dio at all times, and an outside force jumping through time and spying on the heroes would be a red flag to Funny, Dio and the like. The fact what Paradox can observe either won't really tell him much or can easily be misinterpreted due to, well, Stands being impossible to observe in the first place for him hence the issue to begin with. And the issues regarding the abilities that Paradox can reasonably observe, wont actually tell him highly specific quirks of it, given even people who do use it arent overly aware of such things.
To be blunt, with only three days prep time, I dont see him learning of such information, even with time travel without walking up to people and outright asking for details on his opponent, who may not even give that info given context. And that's without getting into the fact, how and why would Paradox know the exact places and times where certain people are to observe and all the while knowing he should observe in the first place? This may seem like nitpicking, but this is kinda a real issue here, when regarding a 2-A multiverse he has to figure out all this shit on a time limit, all the while still needing to make use of that information he gathered to set traps and the like.

Which isn’t gonna work anymore since Dio’s abilities just “lol it works” from a distance now.

I think that's only for teleportation given that's the only thing that has any evidence for it, an argument could be made for one other of his abilities, that being drawn into his dimension but even then, that's only a maybe. The rest I'd assume based on showings he would need at least a general idea of where his target is through time and space.

To summarize, the main point of this post, because the rest is only like a few sentences long.
Idk chief I find it a bit sus who could gather all this info in the time limit or where to even begin looking to gather intel under such circumstances.

But I'm not going to say it's outright impossible, so instead I'll just ask a few questions one a time and we can figure out if that's a legit possibility or if it's just way to unlikely, so first off.
In regards to the JoJo's, how would Paradox know who to look for, who they are, and when they existed in order to observe them?

 

[Chariot190]

Because it’s outdated
I’ll scan ya later.

I feel you bro, it's always something that's missing and you only ever notice way after the fact, it's happened to all of us.

 

[Greenshifter]

Ben 10 revisions currently go at a speed of 1 ability/month. So yeah don’t have to tell you why stuff tends to be outdated. There’s basically so much the revise and nowhere is a good starting point since most people only care about Alien X, at least when it comes to being worthy/controversial enough to give input.

 

[Chariot190]

Ben 10 revisions currently go at a speed of 1 ability/month. So yeah don’t have to tell you why stuff tends to be outdated. There’s basically so much the revise and nowhere is a good starting point since most people only care about Alien X, at least when it comes to being worthy/controversial enough to give input.

 

[Greenshifter]

ben-10-ultimate-alien-episode-16-the-forge-of-creation-2 6:35, Paradox makes the nebula appear and then disappear. Imma be honest I have no idea what exactly that ability is (I also misremembered since after that the entrance to the Nebula is right in front of the team) and whether it should scale to AP or not (since he doesn't destroy the Nebula when it disappears) and whether it's useful here. (But I don't think it's moving a nebula outside of space and time since I think Paradox only built a time field around the Nebula)

 

[Chariot190]

I thought you said he like, could slice it up though?

 

[Greenshifter]

Yeah I misremembered since I thought it was a nebula that was around the forge of creation, but in fact the forge is inside the nebula. But it seemed he somehow made a hole/the entrance appear rather than moving the nebula itself (although one could still argue he teleported or moved it I guess). So disregard what I said earlier I think?

 

[Chariot190]

So disregard what I said earlier I think?

Ok so where are we back to then?

 

[Greenshifter]

No idea, I’m currently seeing if Paradox’ goggles could see stuff like stands.

 

[Greenshifter]

ben-10-ultimate-alien-season-2-episode-10-2 6:06: Paradox looks at his Chrono Navigator and says that past Ben is already doing something to defeat Eon after Ben 10000 just BFR'd Eon to the past. So one could conclude that Paradox can see what people are doing in the past/future and alternate timelines just by looking at his navigator, although Ben 10 takes place in a time loop so eh... who knows.

13:16 same episode: I'm thinking Paradox' goggles make him see events happening in the time stream without being inside of it. This is pretty much speculation though but otherwise how would he know what Kevin just said? (Or it's just for bright lights since he uses it for eye protection a few moments after that...)

Nothing for stands though. Still could be useful to spy on people in this fight.

 

[Chariot190]

Paradox looks at his Chrono Navigator and says that past Ben is already doing something to defeat Eon after Ben 10000 just BFR'd Eon to the past. So one could conclude that Paradox can see what people are doing in the past/future and alternate timelines just by looking at his navigator, although Ben 10 takes place in a time loop so eh... who knows.

Isnt it more likely he just has it set to watch Ben given, well, it's Ben? Is there an example of Paradox using his navigator to watch someone he doesnt know the name, looks, or anything of or even the timeframe or universe they exist in? Or at the very least, him using it to look up someone random?

I'm thinking Paradox' goggles make him see events happening in the time stream without being inside of it. This is pretty much speculation though but otherwise how would he know what Kevin just said? (Or it's just for bright lights since he uses it for eye protection a few moments after that...)

This one is fair, though while it may help watch others, does it tell him who to watch?

 

[Gohanblanco217]

Bump

 

[Gohanblanco217]

Bump

 

[Gohanblanco217]

Bump

 

[manu_zarri]

this is pretty dead