Pokemon Discussion Thread - Red & Blue arc

[Sniper670]

i think that'll only give him acausality type 4, type 5 is a bitch to get, not even i'm sure what is enough or not

Agreed. I did search Aca 5 (Seriously they're hard to find). Madoka got it for transcending cause and effect. Which is kind of the case for Arceus here

will it be spiritual nonexistence as well?

Yes. He predates the concept of Spirit.

since arceus will get it by upscaling, think we can use the vortex of chaos in the justif? makes me wonder if they will ever use the vortex for anything, sounds like a good place to create a enemy to fight true arceus since he came from it or a plot device for my meowth fic to make him OP

Uhhh, I'm Lost. You mean Arceus being born from chaos?

 

[theultimate5105]

The type 5 Acasuality bit is at least beyond baseline type 4. It could be Type 5 but I am not an expert on that
Anyways BDE is obvious, NEP type 2 is obvious with him existing outside the distortion and real world system and forming itself from the nothingness which existed before Giratina’s nothingness
Chaos manipulation seems to be correct
I agree with Transduality as well based on the Pokemon Called Gods blog

 

[GyroNutz]

Regarding PMD Dialga it's also worth noting that the time crisis is always referred as "the planet paralysis". Just like with the Tree of Life, PMD clearly limit the characters to the scope of the planet.

I mean it was clearly stated that the sun would stop moving as well, so that wasn't limited to just the planet.

 

[Sniper670]

Okay so, this is my first crt so Uhh, bear with me I guess...

The Distortion World

In Pokémon, there are two different intertwined worlds. The Pokémon reality, and the Distortion world. The Distortion world is a strange place where the laws of the Pokémon reality doesn't apply, and has distorted laws of cause and effect. A place where the world's logic doesn't apply. Describe by Cyrus as like a DNA strand, where one can't exist without the other and they keep each other in balance. Both of the oppositesWhich is what inspired Giratina's battle music. Opposing concepts. Life/death, Front/back.(source: https://www.ign.com/articles/2009/03/21/pokemon-creators-get-personal). Which means the Pokémon world in itself is a Duality.

Theres more. This also means the distortion world in itself is in a non existent state. Dialga and Palkia represent matter, The lake Trio represents Spirit, and Giratina represents the oppoitse. Which in simple terms means Nothingness. An anti world.A paradox of space and time As said by Masudas, the Distortion world exists but doesn't. We only think it exists because we're looking at it with our eyes. It's in a non existent place. Confirmed by Cyrus as lacking even the concept of Spirit. And the example Masuda used was the reflection of the mountain within a lake. Where we see the mountain within the lake alright, but it isnt really there.
A certain poem in PLA: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/CPokemon/pla-text/master/story/en.txt)
"The rift is born of disorder in the opposite world"
"The rules of time and space change within the opposite world"
"That which fills the opposite side of the world can shape the rage and mold it

So yeah, Giratina can mold the Distortion world into anyway he sees fit. He is the Distortion world after all. He has full authority over the place. Chooses what he wants to be there, and what shouldn't


Arceus Position Within the Multiverse
Now to Arceus. Arceus in this case, has been stated several times to be An All encompassing Deity who created the Multiverse. The Three Creation Trio are merely aspects of Arceus. These 3 being fundamental concepts that shape reality. Arceus himself existing In a realm beyond Space and Time( ここは じかんもくうかんもこえたわたしのうちゅう). One Heart that exists Beyond Time and Space. Arcues being the heart.

And from Masude, Arceus is A God Who Transcends All(すべてを超越した神). Note, this is coming from Masuda, the highest authority within the mainline Pokemon games from Gamefreak. So his words have very high validity. And its not contradicted by Arceus nature as the ruler of the multiverse. This would include not just space-time, but the very concepts of space and time. Together with the duality of Pokemon multiverse and the distortion world. Which extends to the causal nature of the pokemon world and acausal nature of the Distortion world. More than backep up by Arceus predating reality and all the systems and laws he made in them
Conclusion

Arceus should have Acausality type 5 for his transcendence(すべてを超越した神) over the the reality he created, and the laws within them. It's True self existing outside the multiverse entirely( ここは じかんもくうかんもこえたわたしのうちゅう). Going beyond the casuality system of the Pokémon world and Acausality system of the Distortion world


Arceus should have Tranduality type 2, for his transcendence of The Dual nature of the Pokémon world and The Distortion world

Arceus should have BDE 2 for transcending not just space-time, but the very concepts of space and time altogether. Existing outside the multiverse entirely

Arceus should have nep type 2 Apect type 1, 2, 3 for predating the concept of Spirit(Uxie, Mesprit, and Azelf represent spirit. They wished it into being ) , Mind(Uxie, Mesprit, Azelf) and Giratina a conceptual being Paradoxical to The Pokémon world, Non-Existent in nature. and also for preceding existence, and both physical (Matter) and metaphysical (soul, mind) concepts of existence

Note: This Applies to its true Form alone

Giratina should have chaos Manipulation..... The Distortion world is a world of chaos, with no concept of directions or time. The logic of the Normal Pokémon world doesn't apply in the distortion world. The laws of reality doesn't apply there, common sense doesn't apply, which extends to the physics of the world. Which Giratina can control as it likes

Giratina should have Acausality type 4(Remove the "possibly"). It operates on different laws than the Pokémon reality which extends to the causality system that. It's Paradoxical nature means it operates of fundamentally different laws entirely. The world's logic don't apply there

Giratina should have nep type 1 for its nature as non existence. As it is the Distortion world itself

I've made the necessary additions.
Arceus0X?

 

[Arceus0x]

I've made the necessary additions.
Arceus0X?

Welp, might as well try. Could you do it later though? I'd like to at least try and assist but i am gonna go to sleep soon

 

[Sniper670]

Welp, might as well try. Could you do it later though? I'd like to at least try and assist but i am gonna go to sleep soon

Alright then. Let me know when you're up for it

 

[Thelastmlg]

Agreed. I did search Aca 5 (Seriously they're hard to find). Madoka got it for transcending cause and effect. Which is kind of the case for Arceus here

Yes. He predates the concept of Spirit.

since arceus will get it by upscaling, think we can use the vortex of chaos in the justif? makes me wonder if they will ever use the vortex for anything, sounds like a good place to create a enemy to fight true arceus since he came from it or a plot device for my meowth fic to make him OP

Uhhh, I'm Lost. You mean Arceus being born from chaos?

Yeah, arceus was born in the center of the vortex of chaos

 

[XXKINGXX69]

That's flat out wrong and the very reason why we had to make a new blog in the first place.

Since your entire premise is wrong, the other arguments don't need to be adressed too.

Although it should be noted that not only some stuff aren't contradiction (Tapu Koko n Necrozma); the same as in game (Arceus creating everything including Giratina aka Distorsion World) or just aren't the way you portray it (the Red Chain in DP anime used the Lake Trio, and it just means you can create them through other means as well).

Giratina is said to have created the Distortion World in the games

And its already accepted that PMD is canon here. And how are those not contradictions?

The things that are accepted as canon aren't accepted because "Lol multiverse", but because they're either from a first party source, confirmed canon by a first party source, or interacts with a first party source in a meaningful way. None of this is true for Mystery Dungeon, which is a third party source, that has never been acknowledged, or even referenced, by the rest of the media. By this wiki's standards, that means it is not canon.

I posted a link that shows its accepted by the wiki, and I said that PMD was explicitly confirmed to just be a parallel universe to the main games. And PMD is literally a first party source

Giratina should have nep type 1 for its nature as non existence. As it is the Distortion world itself

Giratina is the concept of antimatter, which in Pokemon is literally a void since it erases stuff (see Kukui's CRT on spacetime manipulation for all Pokemon)

 

[Zeifyl]

I posted a link that shows its accepted by the wiki, and I said that PMD was explicitly confirmed to just be a parallel universe to the main games. And PMD is literally a first party source

Except that blog doesn't say that ANYWHERE. It says IQ skills are to be on profiles. That's the only mention of Mystery Dungeon on that blog.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Except that blog doesn't say that ANYWHERE. It says IQ skills are to be on profiles. That's the only mention of Mystery Dungeon on that blog.

It literally has to accept PMD as canon for it to be on the profile

 

[Zeifyl]

It literally has to accept PMD as canon for it to be on the profile

Also, I am 99% sure that blog is outdated. But even if it's not, it isn't that long since I last played SMD, and can confirm that nowhere was it even implied that Dark Matter was gonna Universe Bust, much less Reality Bust. It was going to, at most, end one solar system.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Also, I am 99% sure that blog is outdated. But even if it's not, it isn't that long since I last played SMD, and can confirm that nowhere was it even implied that Dark Matter was gonna Universe Bust, much less Reality Bust.

Its not even a blog, its something that was recently accepted

And why does him not universe busting matter? Do you see ultra beasts destroying galaxies?

 

[Zeifyl]

Its not even a blog, its something that was recently accepted

And why does him not universe busting matter? Do you see ultra beasts destroying galaxies?

Because he does not scale to anything that's at that level, unlike ultra beasts, without applying massive amounts of PIS. Unless you want to argue that condensed negative emotions > The very concept of emotions, both positive and negative. A claim that makes absolutely no logical sense.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Because he does not scale to anything that's at that level, unlike ultra beasts, without applying massive amounts of PIS. Unless you want to argue that condensed negative emotions > The very concept of emotions, both positive and negative, which makes absolutely no logical sense.

Not all of his power is from negative emotions alone, and he is also born from the evil thoughts of Arceus and the creation trio. The Lake Trio can't even use their emotion manipulation on Giratina even though they embody his emotion too

 

[Zeifyl]

Not all of his power is from negative emotions alone, and he is also born from the evil thoughts of Arceus and the creation trio. The Lake Trio can't even use their emotion manipulation on Giratina even though they embody his emotion too

Maybe because Giratina existed before the concept of emotion, and is incompatible with it.
And no, he is made of negative emotions. This was stated REPEATEDLY and CLEARLY, that this was what he was made of. By his very nature, it is impossible for him to be as strong as Mesprit.

Additionally, it matters much more that Dark Matter wasn't destroying reality than it does that Ultra Beasts aren't, because Dark Matter's one and only goal was destruction. So lack of destruction is a sign of limits to its power.

But even if we ignore all that, and say that everything you've said is true, that it has the power to instantly destroy the entire Pokemon reality... You've still not provided any evidence that it's stronger than Arceus (who is already vastly superior to the entire Pokemon reality), which seems to be your goal. In fact, looking at Arceus' own handling of various situations, it considers Dark Matter less threatening than Akari/Rei.

 

[Sniper670]

Giratina is the concept of antimatter, which in Pokemon is literally a void since it erases stuff (see Kukui's CRT on spacetime manipulation for all Pokemon)

I don't remember the last time Giratina erased anything iirc

Anyway, I was looking for the source of this scan. Checking it's validity

I smell immortality type 5 from it......For the CT and LT of course

 

[Aether2734]

Anyway, I was looking for the source of this scan. Checking it's validity

I smell immortality type 5 from it......For the CT and LT of course

i don't get it where's context for type 5, but iirc CT already get type 7 from palkia statue or something that state "alive, not yet alive" Like that

 

[XXKINGXX69]

I don't remember the last time Giratina erased anything iirc

Anyway, I was looking for the source of this scan. Checking it's validity

I smell immortality type 5 from it......For the CT and LT of course

CT already has type 5

Maybe because Giratina existed before the concept of emotion, and is incompatible with it.
And no, he is made of negative emotions. This was stated REPEATEDLY and CLEARLY, that this was what he was made of. By his very nature, it is impossible for him to be as strong as Mesprit.

Additionally, it matters much more that Dark Matter wasn't destroying reality than it does that Ultra Beasts aren't, because Dark Matter's one and only goal was destruction. So lack of destruction is a sign of limits to its power.

But even if we ignore all that, and say that everything you've said is true, that it has the power to instantly destroy the entire Pokemon reality... You've still not provided any evidence that it's stronger than Arceus (who is already vastly superior to the entire Pokemon reality), which seems to be your goal. In fact, looking at Arceus' own handling of various situations, it considers Dark Matter less threatening than Akari/Rei.

Giratina has emotion, even Arceus and the original one does

Yes, he was made of emotion, but its also from the negative emotion of the lake trio, CT, and Arceus

Dark Matter was being stopped by the protagonists, and the Ultra Beasts were trying to destroy stuff in the anime, so was Arceus

Its because Dark Matter used the energy of Xerneas, which includes the original spirit's energy, since Xerneas has the life energy of all Pokemon in PMD at the time

Arceus has never considered Akari and Rei as threatening

 

[Sniper670]

i don't get it where's context for type 5, but iirc CT already get type 7 from palkia statue or something that state "alive, not yet alive" Like that

Alive yet nor alive is type 5. Unbound by life and death....but I was corrected here that in the Japanese translation, it means all things, alive or not, arrive in the same universe

Type 5 in this instance is the fact that Xerneas/Yvelta are said to represent the cycle of life(symbolizes two opposites, life and death) which keeps the universe in balance. CT and LT predates it, since they existed before the multiverse and everything within them was created. I guess

 

[Sniper670]

CT already has type 5

They don't have it

 

[Zeifyl]

Giratina has emotion, even Arceus and the original one does

Yes, he was made of emotion, but its also from the negative emotion of the lake trio, CT, and Arceus

Dark Matter was being stopped by the protagonists, and the Ultra Beasts were trying to destroy stuff in the anime, so was Arceus

Its because Dark Matter used the energy of Xerneas, which includes the original spirit's energy, since Xerneas has the life energy of all Pokemon in PMD at the time

Arceus has never considered Akari and Rei as threatening

The only time in the Anime Arceus tried to destroy anything was in a movie where it, for no explained reason went from casual, possibly accidental multiversal showings, to unable to one-shot a temple. It has also reset a Universe for no other reason than to flex (the latter feat happened in the primary canon). Arceus HAS shown destruction at that level. Dark Matter hasn't.

The original spirit can only be considered a pokemon in the loosest sense of the word. Xerneas does not have any hold over it whatsoever, even with maximum wank. Especially since 100% of the Tree of Life's power comes from a fraction of the Original Spirit's power.

Arceus also never considered Dark Matter a threat to it. Otherwise it would have actively fought it, rather than sitting behind and telling others what to do.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

The only time in the Anime Arceus tried to destroy anything was in a movie where it, for no explained reason went from casual, possibly accidental multiversal showings, to unable to one-shot a temple. Arceus HAS shown destruction at that level. Dark Matter hasn't.

The original spirit can only be considered a pokemon in the loosest sense of the word. Xerneas does not have any hold over it whatsoever, even with maximum wank. Especially since 100% of the Tree of Life's power comes from a fraction of the Original Spirit's power.

Arceus also never considered Dark Matter a threat to it. Otherwise it would have actively fought it, rather than sitting behind and telling others what to do.

That's just lack of AP. Doesn't contradict his AP

The original spirit appears in Pokedex entries. Where's the scan of all of the tree of life's power coming from the Original Spirit?

Maybe its because he actually can't do anything about Dark Matter, which is why he was killed? Even if what you said was true, Arceus would have been downplaying Dark Matter since he lost to Dark Matter. And if you think that greater threat = more power, you must be willing to believe the Ultra Beasts are stronger than Arceus since he threatened the whole world including Alola but the UBs are considered a greater threat

 

[Zeifyl]

That's just lack of AP. Doesn't contradict his AP

The original spirit appears in Pokedex entries. Where's the scan of all of the tree of life's power coming from the Original Spirit?

Maybe its because he actually can't do anything about Dark Matter, which is why he was killed? Even if what you said was true, Arceus would have been downplaying Dark Matter since he lost to Dark Matter. And if you think that greater threat = more power, you must be willing to believe the Ultra Beasts are stronger than Arceus since he threatened the whole world including Alola but the UBs are considered a greater threat

1. That makes no grammatical sense.
2. The whole thing about 100% of all space and time, and everything within it being powered by the Plates, and the Plates being powered by Arceus. And this includes the Tree of Life, Eternamax Eternatus, Leon's Charizard, Silvally, Dark Matter, Zygarde, the entire Lake and Creation Trios, and everything else you might try to argue is somehow above Arceus. Existing in Pokemon means that you, by definition, are below Arceus.
3. Arceus lost to Dark Matter because Arceus did not fight Dark Matter. If Dark Matter was a big enough deal for Arceus to want to fight, Dark Matter would have been oneshot since it, too, is powered BY Arceus, and therefore, by definition, cannot EXCEED Arceus. And the Ultra Beasts were not worth Arceus's attention. They were for Zygarde and Silvally to deal with.

And then there is, of course, the whole thing in PLA, where Dialga or Palkia (depends on who you sided with) tried to take the form of Arceus, when gunning for ultimate power. Not Eternatus. Not Dark Matter. Even though BOTH had had events in the past, so there is no way Dialga and Palkia didn't know about them. The reason for this decision from these two deities is, of course, that Arceus' form is stronger.

 

[Arceus0x]

The original spirit appears in Pokedex entries. Where's the scan of all of the tree of life's power coming from the Original Spirit?

In the part where it says that he created everything and transcends everything like 20 times?

And if you think that greater threat = more power, you must be willing to believe the Ultra Beasts are stronger than Arceus since he threatened the whole world including Alola but the UBs are considered a greater threat

Some random hyperbole anime statement that could simply mean in history of alola.
Also the Jewel of life isn't canon to the main anime plotline and thus Arceus never threatened alola. This is proven by the fact that Arceus' portrayala after that are 100% different from his portrayal there. Ash also never acknowledges meeting him before. Arceus also never talks at all in the mainline anime while the movie Arceus doesn't shut up.

 

[Zeifyl]

Made a quick, small CRT, if you guys wouldn't mind giving it a peek.

 

[Sniper670]

Okay so, this is my first crt so Uhh, bear with me I guess...

The Distortion World

In Pokémon, there are two different intertwined worlds. The Pokémon reality, and the Distortion world. The Distortion world is a strange place where the laws of the Pokémon reality doesn't apply, and has distorted laws of cause and effect. A place where the world's logic doesn't apply. Describe by Cyrus as like a DNA strand, where one can't exist without the other and they keep each other in balance. Both of the oppositesWhich is what inspired Giratina's battle music. Opposing concepts. Life/death, Front/back.(source: https://www.ign.com/articles/2009/03/21/pokemon-creators-get-personal). Which means the Pokémon world in itself is a Duality.

Theres more. This also means the distortion world in itself is in a non existent state. Dialga and Palkia represent matter, The lake Trio represents Spirit, and Giratina represents the oppoitse. Which in simple terms means Nothingness. An anti world.A paradox of space and time As said by Masudas, the Distortion world exists but doesn't. We only think it exists because we're looking at it with our eyes. It's in a non existent place. Confirmed by Cyrus as lacking even the concept of Spirit. And the example Masuda used was the reflection of the mountain within a lake. Where we see the mountain within the lake alright, but it isnt really there.
A certain poem in PLA: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/CPokemon/pla-text/master/story/en.txt)
"The rift is born of disorder in the opposite world"
"The rules of time and space change within the opposite world"
"That which fills the opposite side of the world can shape the rage and mold it

So yeah, Giratina can mold the Distortion world into anyway he sees fit. He is the Distortion world after all. He has full authority over the place. Chooses what he wants to be there, and what shouldn't


Arceus Position Within the Multiverse
Now to Arceus. Arceus in this case, has been stated several times to be An All encompassing Deity who created the Multiverse. The Three Creation Trio are merely aspects of Arceus. These 3 being fundamental concepts that shape reality. Arceus himself existing In a realm beyond Space and Time( ここは じかんもくうかんもこえたわたしのうちゅう). One Heart that exists Beyond Time and Space. Arcues being the heart.

And from Masude, Arceus is A God Who Transcends All(すべてを超越した神). Note, this is coming from Masuda, the highest authority within the mainline Pokemon games from Gamefreak. So his words have very high validity. And its not contradicted by Arceus nature as the ruler of the multiverse. I know I'll hear the song and dance within the comment section referring to it as"flowery" and "hyperbole". But there's a difference between calling Captain America transcendent, and calling a actual Creator God transcendent over its creation. Still not enough? I did a little digging on what transcendence meant. Now let's crosscheck what we have of Arceus, and the meaning.
"In religion, transcendence refers to the aspect of God's nature and power which is wholly independent of the material universe, beyond all physical laws"

Now we have Arceus who exists beyond the multiverse. Being independent of it because his existence predates the Pokémon reality, which extends to the laws/concepts that apply to them. An omnipresent being for an added bonus due to being all-encompassing Deity. Even the name Arceus is what humans choose to call him, implying that his True name holds no equivalence in human tongue. With Arceus simply being the avatar of his true self. All this serves as supporting evidence for Masuda's statement of Arceus's transcendence

This would include not just space-time, but the very concepts of space and time. Together with the duality of Pokemon multiverse and the distortion world. Which extends to the causal nature of the pokemon world and acausal nature of the Distortion world. Including the very cycle of Life and Death

To back that up, Showing us just a glimpse of its power, it recreated Dialga, Palkia or Giratina (Depending on player choice). Dialga and Palkia being the very concepts of Space And Time that shape the multiverse. Arceus is referred to as the "Absolute Existence", highlighting his authority over creation.


Conclusion

Arceus should have Acausality type 5 for his transcendence(すべてを超越した神) over the the reality he created, and the laws within them. It's True self existing outside the multiverse entirely( ここは じかんもくうかんもこえたわたしのうちゅう). Transcendent on both the casuality system of the Pokémon reality and the Acausality system of the Distortion world


Arceus should have Tranduality type 2, for his transcendence of The Dual nature of the Pokémon world and The Distortion world

Arceus should have BDE 2 for transcending all things within his creation. An Absolute Existence, that exists independent of the multiverse entirely. Predating the very concepts of dimensions, Entirely

Arceus should have nep type 2 Apect type 1, 2, 3 for predating the concept of Spirit(Uxie, Mesprit, and Azelf represent spirit. They wished it into being ) , Mind(Uxie, Mesprit, Azelf) and Giratina a conceptual being Paradoxical to The Pokémon world, Non-Existent in nature. and also for preceding existence, and both physical (Matter) and metaphysical (soul, mind) concepts of existence. Arceus himself being borne from chaos. Chaos here refers to the void that precedes creation of the universe. Which is more or less confirmed by the games

Note: All these apply to its true Form only

Giratina should have chaos Manipulation..... The Distortion world is a world of chaos, with no concept of directions or time. The logic of the Normal Pokémon world doesn't apply in the distortion world. The laws of reality doesn't apply there, common sense doesn't apply, which extends to the physics of the world. It's a place of disorder, where rules of time and space change Which Giratina can control as it likes

Giratina should have Acausality type 4(Remove the "possibly"). It operates on different laws than the Pokémon reality which extends to the causality system. It's Paradoxical nature means it operates of fundamentally different laws entirely. The world's logic don't apply there

Giratina should have nep type 1 for its nature as non existence. As it is the Distortion world itself

I added a lot more info on this CRT about Arceus Nature and Transcendence. It answers XXKINGXX questions. No one within the Pokémon world is superior to Arceus. PERIOD

I rest my Case. You can go through the scans and let me know what corrections have to be made

 

[Aether2734]

Arceus literally a being that predate everything, source of everything and become a "heart" concept that a fundamentally in pokemon verse, encompass everything and the creator of very universes

and how do you can say tree of life didn't come from arceus just because it didn't state?

 

[Sniper670]

Arceus literally a being that predate everything, source of everything and become a "heart" concept that a fundamentally in pokemon verse, encompass everything and the creator of very universes

and how do you can say tree of life didn't come from arceus just because it didn't state?

He seemed to have missed the part where Arceus existed before creation of everything in the Multiverse .

I wonder who created the multiverse and everything in them

 

[Sniper670]

and how do you can say tree of life didn't come from arceus just because it didn't state?

I dunno about you bro but I'm a firm believer the Tree Of Life came before Arceus. Heh

The tree of life rules over the multiverse. In a higher dimensional plane beyond the reaches of Arceus. Arceus is completely bound by it

 

[Arceus0x]

I dunno about you bro but I'm a firm believer the Tree Of Life came before Arceus. Heh

The tree of life rules over the multiverse. In a higher dimensional plane beyond the reaches of Arceus. Arceus is completely bound by it

???

 

[Zeifyl]

I dunno about you bro but I'm a firm believer the Tree Of Life came before Arceus. Heh

The tree of life rules over the multiverse. In a higher dimensional plane beyond the reaches of Arceus. Arceus is completely bound by it

The Tree of Life is Xerneas.

 

[QuasiYuri]

Giratina is said to have created the Distortion World in the games

He is said to BE the Distortion World. And who created Giratina? Our llama.

I posted a link that shows its accepted by the wiki, and I said that PMD was explicitly confirmed to just be a parallel universe to the main games. And PMD is literally a first party source

It never was, no.

 

[Sniper670]

???

Sarcasm.

 

[Zeifyl]

And PMD is literally a first party source

PMD is not a first party source, nor is it a primary source.
Primary sources: Core games (Red, Green, Blue, Yellow, Gold, Silver, Crystal, Ruby, Sapphire, Firered, Leafgreen, Emerald, Diamond, Pearl, Platinum, Heartgold, Soulsilver, Black, White, Black 2, White 2, X, Y, Sun, Moon, Ultra Sun, Ultra Moon, Sword, Shield, Legends: Arceus, Scarlet, and Violet, and any games that interacts with them in a meaningful way, such as by being able to transfer Pokémon to/from them)
First party sources: Direct statements from, and products directly made by, The Pokémon Company, Creatures, Inc, and/or GameFreak.
Secondary source: Anime (IIRC. Either this, or Adventures)
Teritary source: Pokémon Adventures (IIRC. Either this, or the Anime)
Quaterary sources: Everything else that is part of the Pokémon franchise.
Mystery Dungeon (Made by Spike Chunsoft, a third party developer) falls under a quaterary source.
Pokémon Masters (Made by Dena Co., ltd, a third party developer) is also a quaterary source, but a bit closer to teritary than other quaterary sources.
If there are disagreements over things that can't be explained away with alternate universes (E.G. the cosmology as a whole, multiversal constants, and such), quaterary sources loses to teritary sources loses to secondary sources loses to primary sources.
Arceus falls into the "multiversal constants" category, and the primary sources repeatedly insists that it stands above everything else, transcends reality as a whole, fuels all of reality, and so on.

 

[Thelastmlg]

Speaking of arceus, which we do all the time, the low 1-C was rejected because the poem in legends was english only right?

If so, the god blog has scans where a hiker, in both languages, implies that the heart created the world through awareness, idk if that is legit but is worth a shot asking

 

[Arceus0x]

Speaking of arceus, which we do all the time, the low 1-C was rejected because the poem in legends was english only right?

If so, the god blog has scans where a hiker, in both languages, implies that the heart created the world through awareness, idk if that is legit but is worth a shot asking

No it's a lack of evidence

 

[Zeifyl]

Speaking of arceus, which we do all the time, the low 1-C was rejected because the poem in legends was english only right?

If so, the god blog has scans where a hiker, in both languages, implies that the heart created the world through awareness, idk if that is legit but is worth a shot asking

A lack of evidence that is still there. You need a LOT of evidence to go from 2-A to Low 1-C.

 

[Arceus0x]

A lack of evidence that is still there. You need a LOT of evidence to go from 2-A to Low 1-C.

Or a legitimate R>F difference

 

[Sniper670]

Speaking of arceus, which we do all the time, the low 1-C was rejected because the poem in legends was english only right?

No one has made a low 1c arceus crt tho. I don't have the Japanese files. But the English has different interpretations of that statement on several occasions

If so, the god blog has scans where a hiker, in both languages, implies that the heart created the world through awareness, idk if that is legit but is worth a shot asking

In the Japanese translation of PLA, it's said that creation exist because the heart(Arceus?) is there to perceive it. That's about the same thing the biker said:
Yes! The heart was born and it began to perceive (認識) the world!

But tbh I have no interest in getting Arceus to low 1C. It's going to be a pain to get that accepted. Not enough

 

[Aether2734]

So about arceus world that was state transcend time and space , what it give? 2x baseline 2-A cosmology?