Pokemon Discussion Thread - Red & Blue arc

[XitSign]

I know its always been shaky, but working out a way we can add things like TMs/HMs for full documentation would be nice. I'm unsure how we'd handle standards for it, but the profiles, in my opinion, have always felt incomplete since the pokemon has that 'Potential' to know the move, even if in most wild scenarios it wouldn't be applicable.

However, tackling the monster that is our pokemon standards any time soon is way out of my depth at the moment...

But yeah, Egg Moves seem reasonable even by our current rules, given they're 'natural' moves through breeding and we've seen wild pokemon with them in certain situations, IV's CAN be perfect and indexing is about that max potential, natural EVs make logical sense. Tutor moves I forget the justification for, might need reexamined?

 

[Imaginym]

Now that I'm rediscovering it, & that we're on a new page of this thread, what do people think about Cosmog's storm?

Cosmog's Storm

vsbattles.fandom.com

Between it being part of a Legendary line, Environmental Destruction, & the changes on CAPE, weather feats & Pokemon Standards, & the 7 or so years since the Calc's Publication, I'm interested in the ramifications.

 

[Peppersalt43]

Though, if we separate Striking Strength from Lifting Strength to say that any Pokemon can throw Cosmoem, then I'm not sure we can readily use Evolutionary Stage comparability to justify that they "Should be able to throw Cosmoem, which weighs 999.9 kg", especially when it's unlikely for any Pokemon to have encountered or battled one, as it's mostly a Pokemon from another world; There isn't much evidence suggesting there are wild Cosmoem, for other Pokemon to battle. I'm not sure how the Max Raid Den Solgaleo/Lunala appear, nor the Snacksworth ones, but Lunala & Solgaleo canonically have the appeal to open wormholes to other "worlds", be that far away or other unierses.

Well assuming we're not gonna use a legendary, Mudsdale can be used as an alternative. It's a regular mon and it weighs 920 kg which is pretty close to Cosmoem

 

[Imaginym]

Well assuming we're not gonna use a legendary, Mudsdale can be used as an alternative. It's a regular mon and it weighs 920 kg which is pretty close to Cosmoem

That might work.

Although how do we determine who scales to it?

(Also, even without throwing it, Pokemon can hold Big Nugget, right? Do we have any basis for the size of it?)

 

[Peppersalt43]

Although how do we determine who scales to it?

Looking at the Alolan Dex which is when Mudbray is introduced, Mankey and Makuhita who can learn Seismic Toss naturally while Riolu who can learn Circle Throw are present. Plus isn't Alola before the time when they started to cut the dex size?

But anyway as I've said before, this is mainly for the first-stage and baby mons in case nothing better can be found

(Also, even without throwing it, Pokemon can hold Big Nugget, right? Do we have any basis for the size of it?)

Technically, you can argue it's somewhat comparable to Iron Ball due to dealing the same damage via fling. Iron Ball can weigh down Flying Pokemon that can learn Sky Drop so it's probably heavier than Mudsdale

In other words, this can also scale to Pokemon who can learn Fling which is pretty numerous

 

[Imaginym]

Looking at the Alolan Dex which is when Mudbray is introduced, Mankey and Makuhita who can learn Seismic Toss naturally while Riolu who can learn Circle Throw are present. Plus isn't Alola before the time when they started to cut the dex size?

But anyway as I've said before, this is mainly for the first-stage and baby mons in case nothing better can be found

Technically, you can argue it's somewhat comparable to Iron Ball due to dealing the same damage via fling. Iron Ball can weigh down Flying Pokemon that can learn Sky Drop so it's probably heavier than Mudsdale

In other words, this can also scale to Pokemon who can learn Fling which is pretty numerous

Interesting approach. I do wonder what others will think, but okay.

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

Pokémon is really a disaster in this site, like why does profiles about WILD Pokémon said that the WILD Pokémon are assumed to have perfect IVs and EVs, those are things that wild Pokémon can't normally have without the action of trainers, also them knowing every egg move or tutoring move is really questionable

We shouldn't say that they're Level 100 honestly, because depending on the game Level 100 would be enough to stomp Arceus.

(And also Pokemon can get to 150 in Masters)

 

[Imaginym]

We shouldn't say that they're Level 100 honestly, because depending on the game Level 100 would be enough to stomp Arceus.

By game mechanics, though, no?

(And also Pokemon can get to 150 in Masters)

Isn't Masters: Ex not canon to the main games, but only to itself?

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

By game mechanics, though, no?

Even through the weakest possible interpretation, a Level 100 unevolved Pokemon would still be like Multi-Continent.

Isn't Masters: Ex not canon to the main games, but only to itself?

Literally the only "evidence" of that is that it's a mobile game, which Pokemon GO also is and yet is canon, albeit in a parallel universe.

 

[Imaginym]

Even through the weakest possible interpretation, a Level 100 unevolved Pokemon would still be like Multi-Continent.

Even the Level 100 Wild Magikarp that can be fished up at the vacation resort in the Sinnoh games?

Literally the only "evidence" of that is that it's a mobile game, which Pokemon GO also is and yet is canon, albeit in a parallel universe.

IIRC, there was a statement in news or such that the games are canon to Masters, specifically, but not the other way around.

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

Even the Level 100 Wild Magikarp that can be fished up at the vacation resort in the Sinnoh games?

Gee, what could a maxed out Pokemon found in a postgame area in Pokemon Platinum possibly scale to?

IIRC, there was a statement in news or such that the games are canon to Masters, specifically, but not the other way around.

People only say that because Pasio isn't mentioned in any "mainline" game, because it can't be because Masters takes place after all of them.

 

[koopa3144]

Even through the weakest possible interpretation, a Level 100 unevolved Pokemon would still be like Multi-Continent.

I'm pretty sure we only go off evolution stages and not levels. For example, even if a Pichu is level 100 it would still only scale to baby Pokémon feats cause no matter how many levels it has its still gonna be weaker than evolved mon and won't scale to their feats.

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

I'm pretty sure we only go off evolution stages and not levels. For example, even if a Pichu is level 100 it would still only scale to baby Pokémon feats cause no matter how many levels it has its still gonna be weaker than evolved mon and won't scale to their feats.

Unevolved Pokemon defeat evolved Pokemon, like... all the time.

 

[Peppersalt43]

I guess I accidentally revived the thread. Anyway, here's the CRT! Let's hope it helps for now

 

[Imaginym]

Gee, what could a maxed out Pokemon found in a postgame area in Pokemon Platinum possibly scale to?

1 of the weakest Pokemon there is, & the only evidence we have it's trained -As opposed to experienced/long-lived- is its level & location.
& said postgame location is an area designed for people to relax.

There are some trainers there, but outside the Battle Facilities & Flint & co., who, IIRC, most trainers don't interact with, the Level 100 Magikarp are the exception, not the norm
So what's the basis that being in this "postgame area" means a Pokemon there is Champion Level, especially when most 'mons there are closer to the levels of mid-game mons?

People only say that because Pasio isn't mentioned in any "mainline" game, because it can't be because Masters takes place after all of them.

I could have sworn I recall it being from a news article, as opposed to people's rhetoric.

But at the moment, I can't recall the original source.

Nonetheless, I do apologize for any bother.

Unevolved Pokemon defeat evolved Pokemon, like... all the time.

Even in the games, this is true.

IIRC, from the Pokedex, there was Mareanie preying on Corsola (Which, prior to Galar was single stage.), Elekid & Morpeko, Taillow & Skarmory. Although the latter pairs are more comparability, IIRC.
Still, there's probably other examples.

Although, those are wild Pokemon, not ones with trainers, & none are on the level of the Creation Trio.
In theory, a protagonist-trained Pichu could take on Arceus's Avatar & defeat it; It's very much possible according to PL:A.

But that isn't necessarily possible because it's Level 100, I'd say. I'd say it accomplished that because Pokemon, primarily with good/exceptional trainers, can be trained to such extremes.

 

[SamanPatou]

Y'know I was thinking about our current LS situation and I kinda have an idea. Throwing things should technically constitute for LS, right? After all, you do still need to lift or even just hold said object before throwing it (Which means they're not like, striking at it).

With that in-mind, can we just use Seismic Toss or Circle Throw on some really heavy mon like Cosmoem (Who is almost a ton) as justification for at least Class 1? I do know that Riolu can learn Circle Throw and Machop can learn Seismic Toss naturally so even if we find better feats, we at least have a good LS feat for the babies and first-stagers

The problem with finding a standard ground for LS is tricky, because Pokémon have explicitly different levels of physical strength depending on the species, and some feats are locked behind certain moves, like Strength, implying mons receive a muscle boost when learning some specific attacks.

 

[Peppersalt43]

The problem with finding a standard ground for LS is tricky, because Pokémon have explicitly different levels of physical strength depending on the species, and some feats are locked behind certain moves, like Strength, implying mons receive a muscle boost when learning some specific attacks.

The thing about LS though, is that it's usually separate from AP. You can be a mountain buster with only Superhuman LS because your author forgot to give an LS feat. With that in-mind, wouldn't that mean we can just look past issues of stats and stuff?

The one behind specific moves I kinda deal with on the CRT. I have a whole paragraph discussing how Rufflet being able to Sky Drop Mudsdale scales to everyone

 

[SamanPatou]

The thing about LS though, is that it's usually separate from AP. You can be a mountain buster with only Superhuman LS because your author forgot to give an LS feat. With that in-mind, wouldn't that mean we can just look past issues of stats and stuff?

It's not a matter of stats, it's a matter of fiction contradicting itself. Theoretically you have a real life comparison with the different type of muscles, work etc... that marks a clear difference between striking and lifting, but more times than not you can't make a comparison.
With mons is even weirder, because usually those with good LS feats are regarded as exceptional, something that wouldn't occur if that was the norm.

 

[Zyurtunder13]

I'm pretty sure we only go off evolution stages and not levels. For example, even if a Pichu is level 100 it would still only scale to baby Pokémon feats cause no matter how many levels it has its still gonna be weaker than evolved mon and won't scale to their feats.

Then what's the point of assuming that all Pokémon are Level 100 as a standard? If the levels don't affect the feats themselves in any way, then it's useless and unnecessary to assume that they'll have to be level 100 as a standard

 

[koopa3144]

Then what's the point of assuming that all Pokémon are Level 100 as a standard? If the levels don't affect the feats themselves in any way, then it's useless and unnecessary to assume that they'll have to be level 100 as a standard

Them being at level 100 ensures that they have all their level-up moves and that the profiles covers the mons at their maximum potential.

 

[Zyurtunder13]

Them being at level 100 ensures that they have all their level-up moves and that the profiles covers the mons at their maximum potential.

Sounds dumb, just say that they're able to use all the movements that they learn naturally throughout leveling up

 

[SamanPatou]

I'm pretty sure we only go off evolution stages and not levels. For example, even if a Pichu is level 100 it would still only scale to baby Pokémon feats cause no matter how many levels it has its still gonna be weaker than evolved mon and won't scale to their feats.

This has been a matter for awhile and it admittedly is still pending. For example, you have cases of wild first and second stages found at high levels, or Red's Pikachu being among other strong mons and being intended as strong, even if it falls easily due to game mechanics.
There was a proposal some time ago to unify the tiering and separate only for abilities, but it went nowhere.

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

1 of the weakest Pokemon there is, & the only evidence we have it's trained -As opposed to experienced/long-lived- is its level & location.
& said postgame location is an area designed for people to relax.

There are some trainers there, but outside the Battle Facilities & Flint & co., who, IIRC, most trainers don't interact with, the Level 100 Magikarp are the exception, not the norm
So what's the basis that being in this "postgame area" means a Pokemon there is Champion Level, especially when most 'mons there are closer to the levels of mid-game mons?

Being Level 100 is very good evidence that it's trained.

I could have sworn I recall it being from a news article, as opposed to people's rhetoric.

But at the moment, I can't recall the original source.

Nonetheless, I do apologize for any bother.

It's alright, a lot of people assume mobile games are noncanon.

Even in the games, this is true.

IIRC, from the Pokedex, there was Mareanie preying on Corsola (Which, prior to Galar was single stage.), Elekid & Morpeko, Taillow & Skarmory. Although the latter pairs are more comparability, IIRC.
Still, there's probably other examples.

Although, those are wild Pokemon, not ones with trainers, & none are on the level of the Creation Trio.
In theory, a protagonist-trained Pichu could take on Arceus's Avatar & defeat it; It's very much possible according to PL:A.

But that isn't necessarily possible because it's Level 100, I'd say. I'd say it accomplished that because Pokemon, primarily with good/exceptional trainers, can be trained to such extremes.

I mean, all you'd need to test that is to get a Pokemon with no EVs.

 

[Bobsican]

I could use some input here.

 

[Lou_change]

I mean the only grappling move that doesn't deal damage is octo lock if I am not mistaken

 

[Bobsican]

Went ahead and also made a revamp CRT on the Nincada line.

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

Is there anyone who’s played Gates to Infinity? I’m looking into making a profile about the Bittercold.

 

[Imaginym]

Is there anyone who’s played Gates to Infinity? I’m looking into making a profile about the Bittercold.

I played... the demo.
I unfortunately don't have the game itself.

 

[StekFence]

Being Level 100 is very good evidence that it's trained

That’s a lot of pressing B…

 

[Bobsican]

@Imaginym As I recall you're working on a Terastal Phenomena P&A page, what do you think of the idea of Terastallized types, unlike regular types, having their immunities (say, Ground being "immune" to Electric) scale as high as Terapagos does?

I say this as unlike regular types, Terastallized types can't be overriden by any means but Terapagos itself (in its boss battle as its Stellar forme, it can absorb Terastal energy from foes to remove their Terastal state, as well as overriding its own type while already Terastallized), notably including Roost, Burn Up, Double Shock, Protean, Libero, Conversion, Conversion 2, Reflect Type, and most notably Multitype, Arceus's ability.

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

I think we should finish the general Pokemon Physiology first before the subsections like Shadow and Tera.

 

[Bobsican]

Is there any progress beyond what I can find here? In any case, what's missing?

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

Is there any progress beyond what I can find here? In any case, what's missing?

I don't really know what's missing since I haven't seen every Pokemon material ever, but I do want it to be heavily comprehensive and in a postable state.

 

[Bobsican]

I mean, nothing of note has been a thing on the series ever since on this regard beyond the whole Tera stuff.

Only stuff to possibly add would be details on what each move, ability and IQ Skill falls as P&A-wise, but I'd think something like that would be better as another page out of being more of a general explanation page than verse-specific P&As per-say.

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

I mean, nothing of note has been a thing on the series ever since on this regard beyond the whole Tera stuff.

Only stuff to possibly add would be details on what each move, ability and IQ Skill falls as P&A-wise, but I'd think something like that would be better as another page out of being more of a general explanation page than verse-specific P&As per-say.

Most likely, but I like to be extremely thorough. I wish I could help with Tera, but I haven't played Violet yet.

If you know anything about my next project, I'm throwing together a profile on psychic power in Pokemon too.

 

[Imaginym]

@Imaginym As I recall you're working on a Terastal Phenomena P&A page,

I research, but I almost never create pages. In that regard, sloth is a shameful vice of mine.

what do you think of the idea of Terastallized types, unlike regular types, having their immunities (say, Ground being "immune" to Electric) scale as high as Terapagos does?

I say this as unlike regular types, Terastallized types can't be overriden by any means but Terapagos itself (in its boss battle as its Stellar forme, it can absorb Terastal energy from foes to remove their Terastal state, as well as overriding its own type while already Terastallized), notably including Roost, Burn Up, Double Shock, Protean, Libero, Conversion, Conversion 2, Reflect Type, and most notably Multitype, Arceus's ability.

Scale as high in what regard? How much damage they reduce? How difficult they are to remove/override?

Some could call that override inability Game Mechanics, or just GM for Multitype specifically. Personally, I'm neutral, & would like to know what others think.

I don't really know what's missing since I haven't seen every Pokemon material ever, but I do want it to be heavily comprehensive and in a postable state.

Tackle what we can when we can.
If other stuff comes up, why not implement it through revisions later?

It's always painful to see a 'verse go into stasis for years because people want to spend years creating a "perfect" revision.


BTW, here are some of my posts where I went over Terastal stuff:

https://vsbattles.com/threads/pokemon-discussion-thread-red-blue-arc.107702/page-88#post-5388668 (This post had me attempt to list Terastallization related abilities.)

Pokemon Discussion Thread - Red & Blue arc

vsbattles.com

Here's a repost of the text from the first link:

"So yeah. Tons of Light Manipulation (Emits strange light, turns Tera Crystals black; Changing the colour of something is Light Manipulation, IIRC.), Energy Manipulation (the Great Crater of Paldea has Tera Energy emissions "from time to time" that are slowly growing.), & probably a bunch of basis for Statistics Amplification & scaling based on the Tera Raid Pokemon & statements, as well as whatever Crystal Manipulation or whatever is."

....but I wanna put in more of an effort right now:

Light Manipulation (Emits strange light, especially strong blasts of Terastal Energy can cause Tera Raid Crystals, which are crystallized energy, to turn black, Tera Pokemon shine & glitter like gemstones.)
Energy Manipulation (Tera Crystals & Glimmora's Tera Jewel-like petals are made of crystallized energy, when the time machine is gathering Terastal Energy, the AI Professor begins taking on an appearance resembling Terastallization.)
Statistics Amplification (Powers up moves of the same type, Tera Raid Pokemon are stated repeatedly to be powerful, with Jacq even warning the protagonist about Black Tera Raid Crystal Pokemon, despite the protagonist having become Champion & cleared the Academy Ace Tournament by that point. The energy from the crystals in Area Zero is stated by the professor to be tremendous, & to have made their experiments much more unstable, & is stated by the AI Professor to be the same as what allows Pokemon to Terastallize, & to "alter the functions of living things and optimize the performance of machinery".)
Likely Technology Manipulation & possibly Organic Manipulation (Made the professor's experiments much more unstable, stated by the AI Professor to "alter the functions of living things and optimize the performance of machinery." The AI Professor stated that humanity lacks the knowledge to build such a sophisticated AI.)
Either the Tera Crystals or the Tera Raid Pokemon likely have Empowerment for a bunch of abilities (Grants several abilities to Tera Raid Pokemon. Trainers' cheers in Tera Raid Battles. The 'raidon vs 'raidon battle against the AI Professor seems to deliberately resemble a Tera Raid Battle.)
The Tera Raid Pokemon have those abilities that Bobsican listed earlier that I'm too lazy to list right now.
Possibly Limited Memory Manipulation (The AI Professor has the professor's memories & knowledge, seemingly up to a point, & was seemingly created by the professor through the use of Tera Crystals, but what, if any, other technologies were used to do so is unknown.)
Possibly Enhanced Sealing (Like other projects, the professor seems to have developed the Poke Ball Lock System through the use of Terastal Energy, & it seems to use it, as the Paradise Protection Protocol gathers Terastal Energy before initializing the program that seems to be the Poke Ball Lock System, which prevents Pokemon exiting their Poke Balls.)

& all the Elemental Manipulation abilities relevant for Pokemon types, presumably, since Terastallization can make a Pokemon Terastallize into any type, although any given Pokemon can only have one, preset Tera Type at a time.

I THINK that's most everything. Mind Manipulation is arguable, but it'd be based on 2 of the pages from the Scarlet/Violet Book, both seemingly written by Heath, analysis of the original professor's behaviour, the Time Machine/PPP taking control of the AI Professor, & Ms. Dendra saying that Tera Pokemon "sometimes act differently than regular Pokémon". (Which could just be in regards to game mechanics.)


It alludes to a post of @Bobsican 's as well: https://vsbattles.com/threads/pokemon-discussion-thread-red-blue-arc.107702/post-5388559

Can you list off all abilities that are granted to Pokémon via Tera?

Tera Raid Battle

bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net

• Power Null (abilities, stat amp/reduction)
• Self-Purification (status effects, stat reduction)
• Forcefield Creation
• Energy Projection (if the timer runs out the Tera'd mon just fires a beam that yeets everyone out)
• Stat amp (Teras retain the original STAB boost of previous types, can stack like Adaptability)

From one of my own posts, there's also a lot of dialogue from Dendra about Tera Pokemon:

"These crystals are actually collections of Terastal energy that’s seeped up out of the ground!"
"The Tera Pokémon you’ll face off against in Tera Raid Battles are crazy tough! They sometimes act differently than regular Pokémon, so you’ll need to be on your guard!"
"Luckily, Trainers can also use a special action in Tera Raid Battles. It’s called cheering! And there are three different cheers you can use!"
"You can cheer up to three times during a single Tera Raid Battle. Also, cheering uses up a turn in battle, so you won’t be able to have your Pokémon use any of their moves when you cheer!"

"Tera Pokémon are super strong! And the more difficult ones will use an even tougher tactic that you’ll need to deal with. I’m talking about their Tera Shield! What happens while a Pokémon has its Tera Shield up, you ask? Well, it’ll take WAAAY less damage, for one! It has a big effect on morale, too! When Trainers see that shield go up, they feel doomed—like there’s no way to win the battle!"
(Note: It's dubious if this "effect on morale" bit indicates any ability, as opposed to just in-universe noting of a typical reaction to what could seem like a sudden & insurmountable obstacle.)

"Regular attacks don’t work so well against Pokémon that have their Tera Shield up. But having your Pokémon Terastallize is an effective method to overcome that issue! A Terastallized Pokémon will do more damage to shielded Pokémon—especially if it uses moves that match its Tera Type! Dealing enough damage to a Pokémon with its Tera Shield up can destroy the shield and break the Pokémon’s stance! This means that it’s important to properly time your Terastallizing in Tera Raid Battles. In conclusion! As they say, fight fire with fire and Tera Pokémon with Tera Pokémon! Be sure to work together with your teammates to\nsmash through your opponent’s Tera Shield!"


I'd like people's opinions about the "effect on morale" parts.
Also, we'd probably want to make note of the Tera Weakness for Raid/Shield Pokemon.

Anyway, sorry about all the words. Thoughts, all?

 

[Bobsican]

Scale as high in what regard? How much damage they reduce? How difficult they are to remove/override?

Currently, type "immunities" are limited relatively to the same tier a Pokémon in question scales, so for example, Zorua isn't "immune" to Ultra Necrozma's Light that Burns the Sky, so if we scale this detail up to Terapagos, then this'd translate to Terastallized type immunities being far more practical against stronger opponents, it'd also be worth reminding that Terapagos's innate Ghost immunity has more priority than Tera Shell, adding more credibility to the argument.

Some could call that override inability Game Mechanics, or just GM for Multitype specifically. Personally, I'm neutral, & would like to know what others think.

Besides Florian (the player character in SV) having some lore pointing at him being a reincarnation of the protagonist of past Switch games (more specifically, Let's Go, Sword and Shield, Brilliand Diamond/Shining Pearl and Legends Arceus), and by extension leaning on HOME transfers being a real possibility (especially as there's some lore tying up Bank to the core series over just being a meta thing, then HOME), there's the matter of Tera Stellar Arceus being really good for Tera Raids in general, so I don't think this was done by accident.

There's also the matter of Terastallizing in general being very similar to Arceus's gimmick with Multitype, so things seem to match way too much to be a coincidence.

Either the Tera Crystals or the Tera Raid Pokemon likely have Empowerment for a bunch of abilities (Grants several abilities to Tera Raid Pokemon. Trainers' cheers in Tera Raid Battles. The 'raidon vs 'raidon battle against the AI Professor seems to deliberately resemble a Tera Raid Battle.)

Considering that Tera Stellar retains its boost to all types indefinitely in such battles (which doesn't happen outside of them unless the user is Terapagos), this should be a flat-out thing with no "likely".

& all the Elemental Manipulation abilities relevant for Pokemon types, presumably, since Terastallization can make a Pokemon Terastallize into any type, although any given Pokemon can only have one, preset Tera Type at a time.

Worth noting that Ogerpon is an exception as her masks let her dynamically change Tera type, in fact during the boss battle she cycles between each mask and Terastallizes as well.

I THINK that's most everything. Mind Manipulation is arguable, but it'd be based on 2 of the pages from the Scarlet/Violet Book, both seemingly written by Heath, analysis of the original professor's behaviour, the Time Machine/PPP taking control of the AI Professor, & Ms. Dendra saying that Tera Pokemon "sometimes act differently than regular Pokémon". (Which could just be in regards to game mechanics.)

Can you be more specific on how this could refer to a game mechanic?

"Tera Pokémon are super strong! And the more difficult ones will use an even tougher tactic that you’ll need to deal with. I’m talking about their Tera Shield! What happens while a Pokémon has its Tera Shield up, you ask? Well, it’ll take WAAAY less damage, for one! It has a big effect on morale, too! When Trainers see that shield go up, they feel doomed—like there’s no way to win the battle!"
(Note: It's dubious if this "effect on morale" bit indicates any ability, as opposed to just in-universe noting of a typical reaction to what could seem like a sudden & insurmountable obstacle.)

I'd lean on the morale bit being mundane and thus just Social Influencing at best, lol.

 

[Imaginym]

Currently, type "immunities" are limited relatively to the same tier a Pokémon in question scales, so for example, Zorua isn't "immune" to Ultra Necrozma's Light that Burns the Sky, so if we scale this detail up to Terapagos, then this'd translate to Terastallized type immunities being far more practical against stronger opponents, it'd also be worth reminding that Terapagos's innate Ghost immunity has more priority than Tera Shell, adding more credibility to the argument.

The immunity might take priority for coding reasons - Why multiply by half when you're going to multiply by 0 anyway?
To not call this Game Mechanics, I think there needs to be an answer for that.

Besides Florian (the player character in SV) having some lore pointing at him being a reincarnation of the protagonist of past Switch games (more specifically, Let's Go, Sword and Shield, Brilliand Diamond/Shining Pearl and Legends Arceus), and by extension leaning on HOME transfers being a real possibility (especially as there's some lore tying up Bank to the core series over just being a meta thing, then HOME),

I have no idea the basis for the S/V player character being a reincarnation of previous player characters.

there's the matter of Tera Stellar Arceus being really good for Tera Raids in general, so I don't think this was done by accident.

Being useful in a metagame, especially one where Tera Stellar is meant to be used in (SE against Terastallized Pokemon.) does not mean there was an intended lore connection.
I think something more solid is needed.

There's also the matter of Terastallizing in general being very similar to Arceus's gimmick with Multitype, so things seem to match way too much to be a coincidence.

Other than the "way too much to be a coincidence", I agree. I'm not sure what GF was cooking. Maybe there was content they scrapped before implementing?

Considering that Tera Stellar retains its boost to all types indefinitely in such battles (which doesn't happen outside of them unless the user is Terapagos), this should be a flat-out thing with no "likely".

No opposal from me here on this matter.

Worth noting that Ogerpon is an exception as her masks let her dynamically change Tera type, in fact during the boss battle she cycles between each mask and Terastallizes as well.

Indeed, the capabilities & limitations of its Tera Jewel encrusted (IIRC) masks are interesting.

As an aside, I don't like being the one doing this, so I apologize, but I'm a stickler for adherence to the official presentation.

"It seems scared... Maybe it's not good with new people, Kiki."
"I don't think it'll take the mask if I'm the one giving it back. You should be the one to do it,"
& so on & so forth.


Ogerpon, The Loyal 3, & Pecharunt are all single-specimen species. Ogerpon is monogenderedly female, & The Loyal 3 are monogenderedly male.

All of them are referred to with "it", in story, by characters, & Pokedex entries.

Because it is the precedent set by the official media, I feel it is proper to follow suit. Apologies.

Can you be more specific on how this could refer to a game mechanic?

Dendra says that Tera Pokemon "sometimes act differently than regular Pokémon".
IIRC, I think this may be referring to that Tera Pokemon often act in specific patterns/loops of actions.
I think that could be game mechanics, unless we have evidence that Tera Raid Pokemon have their behaviour influenced.

I'd lean on the morale bit being mundane and thus just Social Influencing at best, lol.

It couldn't be Social Influencing, the effect on morale is from a shield going up.

 

[Bobsican]

The immunity might take priority for coding reasons - Why multiply by half when you're going to multiply by 0 anyway?
To not call this Game Mechanics, I think there needs to be an answer for that.

Regarding Tera Shell? Well, going by the implementation in Showdown, which reverse-engineers this stuff, it just checks manually for certain conditions, including a innate type immunity (and if they apply it does nothing), then otherwise triggers it as normal, or in other words it doesn't work like that and actually bothers filtering that first, requiring more effort to do than just having the ability trigger on innate immunities and making them counterintuitively stronger.

I have no idea the basis for the S/V player character being a reincarnation of previous player characters.

Yeah, it comes from this, to be exact, the amount of regions brought up depend on the mainline save files in the console used, so this can vary.

Being useful in a metagame, especially one where Tera Stellar is meant to be used in (SE against Terastallized Pokemon.) does not mean there was an intended lore connection.
I think something more solid is needed.

I meant more so on general design intent, as otherwise it'd be trivial to just prevent Arceus from Terastallizing in the first place. Also, as Arceus is a mythical, it's generally banned from all official competitive formats anyways.

Other than the "way too much to be a coincidence", I agree. I'm not sure what GF was cooking. Maybe there was content they scrapped before implementing?

Clearly a regional gimmick to make the series more popular, this has been a trend since Gen 6 with megas.

Because it is the precedent set by the official media, I feel it is proper to follow suit. Apologies.

Oh, that, it doesn't particularly matter here except when actually indexing stuff, but I can see from where you're coming from.

Dendra says that Tera Pokemon "sometimes act differently than regular Pokémon".
IIRC, I think this may be referring to that Tera Pokemon often act in specific patterns/loops of actions.
I think that could be game mechanics, unless we have evidence that Tera Raid Pokemon have their behaviour influenced.

Seems more like a case of general vagueness over just game mechanics, not every stuff that's hindering scaling-wise is a game mechanic just because the media in question is a video game.

It couldn't be Social Influencing, the effect on morale is from a shield going up.

Hence why I said "at most", I'd lean on this not being anything of note.

 

[Imaginym]

Regarding Tera Shell? Well, going by the implementation in Showdown, which reverse-engineers this stuff, it just checks manually for certain conditions, including a innate type immunity (and if they apply it does nothing), then otherwise triggers it as normal, or in other words it doesn't work like that and actually bothers filtering that first.

Checking for a type immunity, AKA, a multiplier of 0, otherwise, trigger as normal.

& nonetheless this doesn't seem to me like strong evidence of a connection to immunities.

I think other basises are needed.

Yeah, it comes from this, to be exact, the amount of regions brought up depend on the mainline save files in the console used, so this can vary.

Interesting. I think we would need to check with other timeline evidence however, to see if it is plausible someone of the S/V player character's apparent age could be reincarnated in the time between those, though.
In the event of a possible contradiction from such, it may be worth noting that Pokemon has a variety of weird NPCs.

I meant more so on general design intent, as otherwise it'd be trivial to just prevent Arceus from Terastallizing in the first place. Also, as Arceus is a mythical, it's generally banned from all official competitive formats anyways.

But they still design Tera Raids & promote online competitions, including timed event 7 Star Raid Battles. To say there isn't a designed meta for this is silly.
Plus, many rare, often Legendary or Mythical Pokemon have been featured in Raids, IIRC.

They also haven't restricted Terastallization for almost any Pokemon.

The idea that Arceus & Tera Stellar have a connection because it's good specifically in Tera Raids, when Tera Stellar was designed for Tera Raids seems like weak evidence to me.

Clearly a regional gimmick to make the series more popular, this has been a trend since Gen 6 with megas.

You suspect they scrapped a 2nd regional gimmick for Paldea?

Oh, that, it doesn't particularly matter here except when actually indexing stuff, but I can see from where you're coming from.

Fair enough. Sorry for any bother.

Seems more like a case of general vagueness over just game mechanics, not every stuff that's hindering scaling-wise is a game mechanic just because the media in question is a video game.

Perhaps? Dendra says it in the context of a class, which has courses focused on Tera Raids; As a series of large tutorials, or very similar, I could believe game mechanics being involved in explaining this aspect.

Though, it not being game mechanics might mean that Tera Raid Pokemon are prone to patterned, specific sets of actions, no?

Hence why I said "at most", I'd lean on this not being anything of note.

Well if it's not anything supernatural nor persuasiveness, that gives the unfortunate implication that trainers in Tera Raids are easily dismayed by Tera Shields.
Perhaps plausible, but a little disappointing, I suppose, no?