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Overvoid Downgrade

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Abu2411 said:
No. Look at The One Giver, which is quite possibly the strongest 1-A on this site. It is infinite infinities above Outerversal+
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I did say 1A+ bro.
Tarang123 said:
Apologies, I didn't mean to sound angry. I was just a bit confused on what you meant.
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No problem bro it happens.
Tarang123 said:
Again, merely viewing a 1A hierarchy as fiction isn't High 1A. There are other factors that need to come in play.
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Yeah I've been clarified but I meant 1A+ heirachy
Tarang123 said:
Apologies, I didn't mean to sound angry. I was just a bit confused on what you meant.



Again, merely viewing a 1A hierarchy as fiction isn't High 1A. There are other factors that need to come in play.



Again, my point had to do with the fact that Overvoid had to "protect" itself from contact with "story". It would go against High 1A to be completely disconnected from any extension of a 1A hierarchy (which technically isn't even High 1A, tbf) if one can still be affected by said hierarchy.
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From my point of view it didn't know the multiverse existed before till it found a stain or mark on it which is the DC multiverse. Then decides to itself from the seething contact with 'story' and imagines a race of beings, 'angels' or 'monitors' (another word for angel, of course) to function as an interface between its own giant eternal magnificence and this tiny, weird crawling anthill of life and significance that is the DC Multiverse.

From the looks of this,seems it seems the entirety of DC as a speck and the monitor/monitor sphere are just thoughts of the Overvoid but you prolly have a point;).

I don't know ***** about teir 1 cause I refuse to enter such aspects.
 
Tarang123 said:
Even then, it's a bit wonky. High 1A is an extremely strange tier to get to, ngl.
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I know but seeing a 1A+ hierarchy as dream/fiction is high 1A easy. No one should tell me otherwise.

And this isn't the thread for it but we can do it in PMs.
 
Abu2411 said:
Yeah and? The One Giver is literally infinite infinities beyond 1-A+, but it's still 1-A+
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And nothing more. the one giver is infinite infinite beyond 1A and it's different from a character seeing 1A+ hierarchy as dream/fiction.
 
Tarang123 said:
????? Wtf got Overvoid High 1A, then? Merely transcending the 1A cosmology isn't High 1A, nowhere close to it, tbf.
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It was for existing outside of the framework in which 1-A is defined. At least that’s what Ultima said.
Tarang123 said:
first of all, it says the exact same thing that the Overvoid felt the need to protect itself from the multiverse, so the transcendence it has over the multiverse is either not very big at all or nonexistent.
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All it mentions is that it had 0 defenses to story spreading all over it. Although it’s not being literally physically attacked, it’s emptiness is just becoming filled with stuff.
Tarang123 said:
Even then, the main premise of the downgrade is that no evidence for Overvoid gives a High 1A rating. In fact, even Ultima has shown that it's extremely questionable if Overvoid would even apply for such a rating anymore.
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He said, “Unless there's some additional context that prevents it from being that high, which there likely is, in this case.” The problem is that your additional context or evidence against this is false.
 
It was for existing outside of the framework in which 1-A is defined. At least that’s what Ultima said.
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And Overvoid doesn't...at all.

All it mentions is that it had 0 defenses to story spreading all over it. Although it’s not being literally physically attacked, it’s emptiness is just becoming filled with stuff.
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The fact is that Overvoid felt the need to protect itself from contact with the growing multiverse, which is where the Monitors came in.

He said, “Unless there's some additional context that prevents it from being that high, which there likely is, in this case.” The problem is that your additional context or evidence against this is false.
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Right, and you haven't showed how it's false. The best thing you've done is repeat my points over and over again. Then watching over the multiverse was a self-defense mechanism done by Overvoid due to it's shock at discovering the growing multiverse. Besides, it's likely just a layer above 1A, rather than High 1A. Tho, that will likely be changed in the DC downgrade coming soon.
 
In the case of comic book stories, it's the war between white page and ink. And who's to say that the page might want that particular story drawn on it? [laughs] What happens if the page is a bit pissed off at the story that's drawn on it? So I thought of the page as God. The idea being that the Overvoid – as we called it in Final Crisis - of the white page as a space is sort of God. And it's condensing stories out of itself because it finds inside its own gigantic white space, self-absorbed pristine consciousness, it finds this little stain or mark, this DC Multiverse somebody has 'drawn'. And it starts investigating, and it's just shocked with what it sees, with all the crazy activity and signifying going on in there. It then tries to protect itself from the seething contact with 'story' and imagines a race of beings, 'angels' or 'monitors' (another word for angel, of course) to function as an interface between its own giant eternal magnificence and this tiny, weird crawling anthill of life and significance that is the DC Multiverse.

This can literally mean many things but it's best to look at the best logical explanation.
This is from my own point of view.
This could Just could mean that the multiverse is just a flaw in it's magnificence and decides to use story to protect itself from seething contact.

The Overvoid literally can contain all things and all possibilities even Lucifer stated all things could be 0 in the Overvoid. And from the explaination the entire DC is just a speck from it's perspective. Just a stain/mark.

And the monitor sphere is also inaccessible except you were taken their by a monitor. Besides I don't see what the Overvoid is trying to protect itself( apart from the writer who drew on it or the source which I believe was the stain/mark that was shown in JL/doom patrol).

Just my opinion as I stated above I can be wrong.
 
Now we have this I've read the book but came upon it again in Death Battle discord by the rappter.
So now the multiverse is open to other infinite multiverses in the greater omniverse, we now can imagine more multiverses similar to the current one in infinite frontier which got rebooted/restarted by the hands so it's possible more can be like this. We can only make guess but we will get more info as the story continues.
 
Teezar said:
In the case of comic book stories, it's the war between white page and ink. And who's to say that the page might want that particular story drawn on it? [laughs] What happens if the page is a bit pissed off at the story that's drawn on it? So I thought of the page as God. The idea being that the Overvoid – as we called it in Final Crisis - of the white page as a space is sort of God. And it's condensing stories out of itself because it finds inside its own gigantic white space, self-absorbed pristine consciousness, it finds this little stain or mark, this DC Multiverse somebody has 'drawn'. And it starts investigating, and it's just shocked with what it sees, with all the crazy activity and signifying going on in there. It then tries to protect itself from the seething contact with 'story' and imagines a race of beings, 'angels' or 'monitors' (another word for angel, of course) to function as an interface between its own giant eternal magnificence and this tiny, weird crawling anthill of life and significance that is the DC Multiverse.

This can literally mean many things but it's best to look at the best logical explanation.
This is from my own point of view.
This could Just could mean that the multiverse is just a flaw in it's magnificence and decides to use story to protect itself from seething contact.

The Overvoid literally can contain all things and all possibilities even Lucifer stated all things could be 0 in the Overvoid. And from the explaination the entire DC is just a speck from it's perspective. Just a stain/mark.

And the monitor sphere is also inaccessible except you were taken their by a monitor. Besides I don't see what the Overvoid is trying to protect itself( apart from the writer who drew on it or the source which I believe was the stain/mark that was shown in JL/doom patrol).

Just my opinion as I stated above I can be wrong.
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Thing is, it’s protecting itself from the story. The multiverse being zero or whatever is great, but it’s merely another level into 1A
 
More concepts are gonna unfold in this current arc as it seems with other DC crisis events so no problem.
 
The problem is that a reality-fiction difference can be treated different ways by different universes. In DC's case IIRC a reality-fiction difference is Dimensional.
 
All verse,it is done dimentionally.

I read one book 2D beings were a threat to the JL 😅 tho the reason made sense.
 
Teezar said:
Like 3D and 5D doesn't mean much?
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In DC, no it doesn't. Best example of this is when you have guys like Superman, who should be spatially flat for 5D imps, punching said imps through time (I don't remember the exact details of what happened, but I know that he did shit like that). DC's dimensions and whatnot aren't really that solid, tbf.
 
Tarang123 said:
In DC, no it doesn't. Best example of this is when you have guys like Superman, who should be spatially flat for 5D imps, punching said imps through time (I don't remember the exact details of what happened, but I know that he did shit like that). DC's dimensions and whatnot aren't really that solid, tbf.
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dc downgraded to 2-A!!!!!!!
 
Xearsay said:
It's shown to us that beings in comic book limbo are reading the lower beings of reality like a story.
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You're editorializing the evidence. It says "they're reading our story." Likewise, that evidence is both incredibly vague and outdated. Modern evidence proves that there's no R>F difference between Perpetua and the Justice League, and Perpetua is above Limbo.

Xearsay said:
The Cathexis see the world across flat screens from their realm.

The eonymous see the world across a tv screen.

And universes appear as screens from Bleed space.
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And I watch the Super Bowl on a TV Screen. That doesn't mean it's fictional to me.
 
Deagonx said:
You're editorializing the evidence. It says "they're reading our story." Likewise, that evidence is both incredibly vague and outdated. Modern evidence proves that there's no R>F difference between Perpetua and the Justice League, and Perpetua is above Limbo.


And I watch the Super Bowl on a TV Screen. That doesn't mean it's fictional to me.
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Since DC and Marvel are getting downgraded as shown in this thread: https://vsbattles.com/threads/thanos-with-the-heart-of-the-universe-downgrade.121545/. What tier would you put Overvoid at?
 
San-Kakarot said:
What tier would you put Overvoid at?
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In modern DC canon I don't even think it'd be appropriate to give Overvoid it's own profile. The handful of feats that Overvoid had were retconned. It's no longer the progenitor of the Monitor race, it didn't create the Orrery, etc. It doesn't seem to be sentient in any of it's appearances that weren't written by Morrison, so essentially Final Crisis and Multiversity only.

However within those it's feats are pretty limited. So the main question is "Do we consider it appropriate to tier a sentient void based on what exists within it, even if it hasn't demonstrated an ability to destroy, manipulate, or create on the scale of what's within it?"
 
Deagonx said:
In modern DC canon I don't even think it'd be appropriate to give Overvoid it's own profile. The handful of feats that Overvoid had were retconned. It's no longer the progenitor of the Monitor race, it didn't create the Orrery, etc. It doesn't seem to be sentient in any of it's appearances that weren't written by Morrison, so essentially Final Crisis and Multiversity only.

However within those it's feats are pretty limited. So the main question is "Do we consider it appropriate to tier a sentient void based on what exists within it, even if it hasn't demonstrated an ability to destroy, manipulate, or create on the scale of what's within it?"
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With all that has been retconned, is the Overvoid more of a location rather than an actual entity?
 
Abu2411 said:
With all that has been retconned, is the Overvoid more of a location rather than an actual entity?
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Aside from it's origin story offered in Final Crisis: Superman Beyond (and re-hashed in Multiversity), it has only ever been a location.
 
Deagonx said:
Aside from it's origin story offered in Final Crisis: Superman Beyond (and re-hashed in Multiversity), it has only ever been a location.
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Also, why are the staffs ignoring the fact that Mandrakk could not one shot 52 universes and needed preparation and servants to do it. That makes him 2-C at best ignoring the small star level feat from CAS.
 
Tarang123 said:
In DC, no it doesn't. Best example of this is when you have guys like Superman, who should be spatially flat for 5D imps, punching said imps through time (I don't remember the exact details of what happened, but I know that he did shit like that). DC's dimensions and whatnot aren't really that solid, tbf.
Click to expand...
I didn't specify DC and neither did he refrence DC comics. Yes 3D characters are spatially flat to 5D characters same way 3D characters see 2D characters as spatially flat. Can I see the scan and book where superman punched an imp through time. The fact the use R-F shows it's solid and most platforms use DC and umineko to refrence standard dimensionality. Cause I know every book gives context on how and why lower-D beings affect higher-D beings.
Abu2411 said:
With all that has been retconned, is the Overvoid more of a location rather than an actual entity?
Click to expand...
It's actually an entity, it's seen as a being where all DC multiverses are in.
San-Kakarot said:
Also, why are the staffs ignoring the fact that Mandrakk could not one shot 52 universes and needed preparation and servants to do it. That makes him 2-C at best ignoring the small star level feat from CAS.
Click to expand...
Really bro, you always do something like this. You can simply make a downgrade thread bro. No one's stopping you.
 
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