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OPM Downgrades

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RadicalMrR said:
Whoops, sorry. I got the gap between star and large star mixed up.
But heres a detailed blog as to why hes SS level.
Click to expand...
theres no way im going to read all that.

what im asking is this:

EVERYONE here is saying that feats>>>statements/guidebooks.

but we have characters like cell who has ZERO 4-B feats. in fact, his best feats are like island level or something. but because we have statements and guidebooks that says hes solar sytem level, we accepted it. why is that allowed for cell but not OPM characters?
 
@ryu

maybe it was retconned. if its true that ONE took part in writing the script for the OPM anime, then that means he was okay with boros saying he would destroy the entire planet, whereas in the webomic/manga, boros just says that he would destroy the surface. why would ONE be okay with such inconsistency in the writing?

i honestly thinked it was just retconned. this explanation makes perfect sense imo. EVERYTHING after the manga/webcomic statement says that boros is a planet buster.
 
The real cal howard said:
I'm...not gonna comment on that. I've come to accept 4-B Cell.
Click to expand...
So you respect him now? :D

@Jonathanlighter I'm not sure about why we accept the Cell stuff as I did not participate in that, however even if we don't accept that Cell would not be Island level. We have this thing called "scaling".
 
Yeah Blue's right. Cell would be in the Tier 4 range by scaling (since he is very obviously over twice First Form Frieza), even if not 4-B.
 
Thebluedash said:
@Jonathanlighter I'm not sure about why we accept the Cell stuff as I did not participate in that, however even if we don't accept that Cell would not be Island level. We have this thing called "scaling".
Click to expand...
i never said that cell should be 6-C. obviously he scales to high 4-C. all im saying is that cells best feats are like island level at best.

and i skimmed over the 4-B cell blog (didnt wanna read the whole thing) and i LITERALLY SAW A SCAN FROM A VIDEO GAME. WTF? who uses non canon video games as proof/evidence for a character's tier? that blog is basically saying "we have a bunch of sources (some of which arent even canon) that states that cell is 4-B, even though cell has absolutely NO FEATS ON THAT LEVEL. lets just ignore the feats>statements thing and put cell at 4-B cuz we have a couple of random statements and scans that are questionable at best. yay!"

so... we have a dbz character at 4-B (the gap between 4-B and high 4-C is HUGE btw) all because of a couple statements, despite the fact that cell has ZERO FEATS on that level. yet we cant use the same logic for OPM characters?

we literally have FIVE statements (that are all official) that states that saitama/boros is 5-B. we have FIVE STATEMENTS. and we'll ignore ALL OF THAT because the manga is more "primary". ok... great...

im not angry btw.
 
@Jonathan the wiki does accept statements, Kaguya and Yhwach do not have any planet level feats but their feats of destroying dimension/merging three planets is accepted.
 
Joseph619 said:
@Jonathan the wiki does accept statements, Kaguya and Yhwach do not have any planet level feats but their feats of destroying dimension/merging three planets is accepted.
Click to expand...
so why dont we accept any statements from OPM?

we have FIVE planetary statements.

1. saitama says he will blow up earth

2. murata states saitama could blow up earth

3. the manga databook states boros could destroy earth

4. the anime databook states boros could destroy the star (probably meant planet)

5. the anime (which ONE took part in) states that boros could destroy earth.

lets ignore ALL of that because the manga is more "primary".

yet we have our boi cell, who's 4-B cuz of some statements. despite the fact that he constantly gets hurt from attacks that look like they're 8-C or something....
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
We've already agreed on keeping the possibly 5-B (which was because of statements), and those "attacks that look like they're 8-C" are also effected by scaling....
Click to expand...
Agreed entirely.

Also Armored Boros was hurt by an attack that only cracked the wall. Street level confirmed.
 
Just noticed I haven't gave my opinion on the actual topic.

Our guidebook and statement rules are very...case-by-case, to say the least. And this case is weird. Feats/Calcs>Statements is very much true. Statements aren't just disregarded though. You literally can't get above 3-B without statements. While Boris has statements that he's planetary, all the feats happening around the time would up in the 6-A range (I consider highs and lows part of the range for a tier). Possibly may be fine enough for Boros, though I am not fond of straight up 5-B Saitama.
 
Ryukama said:
Agreed entirely.
Click to expand...
Also Armored Boros was hurt by an attack that only cracked the wall. Street level confirmed.
i know you're joking but that made no sense.

boros wasnt hurt by that attack. he was just surprised, there was literally ZERO damage on him. he simply was pushed back. then got up a couple seconds later perfectly fine.

anyways ryu, what do you think about my theory that boros was retconned into 5-B?
 
@Cal I only want "At least High 6-A, possibly 5-B." It's a good compromise which takes everything into account.
 
okay, im seriously confused.

i kinda understand why boros isnt a solid 5-B.

but why shouldnt saitama be a solid 5-B? theres nothing that contradicts saitama being 5-B. saitama states that he could destroy earth, and murata states that saitama could blow up earth. is it because saitama has no 5-B feats? well cell has no 4-B feats but hes still 4-B because of statements. why shouldnt saitama be treated the same? saitama doesnt need to scale to boros to be 5-B.
 
Jonathanlighter said:
i know you're joking but that made no sense.

boros wasnt hurt by that attack. he was just surprised, there was literally ZERO damage on him. he simply was pushed back. then got up a couple seconds later perfectly fine.

anyways ryu, what do you think about my theory that boros was retconned into 5-B?
Click to expand...
It make much more sense than your "looks like 8-C" Cell arguments.

Even discarding Cal's point and if you're to say Boros wasn't harmed by that attack, then still Carnage Kabuto's rampage was only making craters in the building, Suiryu's angered attacks at at Saitama literally got calced at 8-C and Bakuzan was scared of an punch that only blew away the stadium. All the characters you like can get downgraded with your same reasoning for Cell.

I don't know. I still prefer At least High 6-A, possibly 5-B for now.
 
Let me explain it in very simple terms. You are wondering why Cell is Tier 4 or whatever, he's not there just cause of statements. He scales to other people who have done feats on that level and if you need help on what scaling is, ask Ryu or something. Saitama is not solid 5-B because no one in the series performed a feat on that level ever. It's just a statement.
 
Jonathanlighter said:
what? why're you showing me avengers as if it has any relevance to what i said?

yeah, loki didnt seem to be injured, AT ALL. he looked surprised but not injured.

same with boros, boros was clearly fine after getting hit.
Click to expand...
Uh no, he took a while to crawl out of the hole only to be caught by the Avengers. He even made a pained whine afterward being smacked around by Hulk.
 
The real cal howard said:
Same reason you're bringing up Cell. Don't be hypocritical.
Click to expand...
im bringing up cell because im trying to refute the feats>statements argument, which is totally relevant to this discussion.
 
@Marvel. I'm talking about the "no visible injuries" argument. He clearly was hurt, which is what I was trying to imply.
 
We use statements but we only put up characters to Possibly if they have no feats or scaling to this. Like Rick Sanchez being only possibly 2-A due to WoG.
 
Jonathanlighter said:
im bringing up cell because im trying to refute the feats>statements argument, which is totally relevant to this discussion.
Click to expand...
Man Cell is scaled from other characters who have feats, Cell's personal feats are irrelevant because he's stronger than Frieza and rest. You can use Yhwach for your argument since Yhwach's best feat is multi continent level , yet he's planet level by statement. Cell is not a good argument
 
Thebluedash said:
Let me explain it in very simple terms. You are wondering why Cell is Tier 4 or whatever, he's not there just cause of statements. He scales to other people who have done feats on that level and if you need help on what scaling is, ask Ryu or something. Saitama is not solid 5-B because no one in the series performed a feat on that level ever. It's just a statement.
Click to expand...
dude, what on earth are you even talking about? you're extremely mistakened as to what im talking about.

first of all, im wondering why cell is 4-B. not just tier 4. cell is DEFINITELY tier 4, because he scales to other tier 4 characters. but why 4-B instead of just high 4-C? i KNOW exactly what scaling is dude. NOBODY that cell scales to has ANY 4-B feats, not even close.

cell scales to:

android 17

android 18

android 16

ssj goku

ssj vegeta

ssj2 gohan

etc, NONE of them has ANY feats that are 4-B.

im not saying that cell should only be tier 8 or tier 6. cell is undoubtedly tier 4. but the ONLY reason as to why cell is 4-B is because of statements. NOT FEATS OR SCALING.

this is the EXACT same situation with saitama. he has ZERO FEATS OR SCALING that puts him on 5-B. yet he has several statements that says hes 5-B. if cell is 4-B because of PURELY statements, then why shouldnt saitama be treated the same way?
 
@Johnathan I'm sorry but like always, you're throwing a tantrum when people disagree with you on OPM. Please calm down and stop capsing people out. This isn't a big deal. Thank you.
 
please dont talk to me like i dont know what scaling is, or like im some idiot who thinks cell should only be tier 8 or whatever. i NEVER said that cell shouldnt be tier 4. cell is definitely tier 4.

i wouldnt be on this site if i didnt know what scaling is.
 
Joseph619 said:
Jonathanlighter said:
im bringing up cell because im trying to refute the feats>statements argument, which is totally relevant to this discussion.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Man Cell is scaled from other characters who have feats, Cell's personal feats are irrelevant because he's stronger than Frieza and rest. You can use Yhwach for your argument since Yhwach's best feat is multi continent level , yet he's planet level by statement. Cell is not a good argument
dude.... do you have ANY IDEA how big the gap is between high 4-C and 4-B? cell is scaled to HIGH 4-C characters, not 4-B characters. even if cell was THOUSANDS of times stronger than frieza, he STILL wouldnt be 4-B based on that. frieza is 4-C, cell is 4-B. the gap between 4-B and 4-C is several THOUSANDS of times. just because cell is stronger than frieza or whatever DOESNT WARRANT a 4-B upgrade.

cell is 4-B based on PURELY STATEMENTS. yet we cant do the same for saitama?
 
Jonathanlighter said:
i wouldnt be on this site if i didnt know what scaling is.
Click to expand...
You would be suprised how many people come to this site knowing NOTHING about scaling in the slightest and demand to upgrade characters they like without our consent. Not trying to be rude, but saying you're here on this site proves you know scaling is like me saying staying in the White House makes me know how American Politics work.
 
@ryu

i use capsing for emphasize, not anger. but sorry bout that anyways

its just, literally EVERYONE here has absolutely no idea what im talking about. im constantly repeating myself because people arent reading my posts properly. people think that im disagreeing with tier 4 cell. no, thats not it. im disagreeing with 4-B cell. cell is definitely tier 4, i know that.

then theres guys who have absolutely no idea how big the difference is between 4-C and 4-B. they're saying that cell should be 4-B because hes stronger than characters like frieza. cell could literally be like 2000x times stronger than frieza, and he would only be high 4-C.

all i wanna know is why cell gets to be 4-B cause of just statements, yet we cant do the same for saitama. i asked this like 15 hundred times, and nobody has given me a straightforward answer yet.
 
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