One Punch Man General CRT

[ByAsura]

You don't know if it's the first portion. Looking at its shape, it could be ending at any time. What we see is what we see, nothing more.

The bottom floors of the hole have uniform circles, so this is most likely.

Rover is hurt and likely less powerful physically, but who says he's weaker with his energy balls. We don't know how they work so we can't assume his attacks are also less effective.

Who's to say it doesn't? You're the one making this CRT, so prove it. The balls are demonstrably similar, if not consistently lower, than his physicals.

The fact that it was omnidirectional proves it was bigger, because it created a circle, which obviously would be smaller than a straight line.

As I said, bigger doesn't really matter that much here.

If that blast was fired in one direction, it would actually be much larger, despite being as powerful as it is now. And if you compare the stories in each panel, you will count around 15 at most in his fight against Garou (being one-directional blasts) while they engulf over 20 stories against the trio (being omnidirectional, which as I pointed out earlier, would make the area of effect smaller).

My point here is that, damage-wise, they're not incomparable (even though that's a very arbitrary metric), and they're not even that difference size-wise. Ergo, they're probably around a somewhat similar level. And it makes very little sense for a frenzied Rover to hold back significantly in either circumstance.

The main problem is that Bomb tanked a hit from Garou with minimal damage, he didn't even break his nose. If we see our current scaling, Bomb should have been absolutely one shoted and destroyed by that blow.

Our current scaling doesn't follow that conclusion. It just says that Bomb is Mountain level+ and Garou is Large Mountain level, and Garou finished off the fight by immobilising him with a punch to the face.

Remember, there's no specific number after 800 megatons. It's all upscaling and downscaling. Our current scaling doesn't lead at all to one person being above another.

Beast Garou is stronger (to an unknown extent, although I would argue it is his biggest amp yet because it has been the closest he's been to death) than Spiral Garou.

How was he closest to death before becoming a beast?

Bomb matches Beast Garou in a direct move once or twice.

And then gets destroyed, so he's quite a bit weaker. Even finishing someone with 4-direct hits leads to this conclusion.

SG matched Darkshine in AP. Darkshine broke Half Monster Garou's ribcage (which should have killed him if he hadn't his immortality-like abilities, as seen when he thought he was going to die against Rover). A weaker Half Monster Garou could tank the second biggest blast we've seen from Rover yet without much problem, after evolving during their fight. This puts Darkshine's AP massively above Rover's, and Bomb's AP above Darkshine's.

This doesn't put him massively above Rover, actually. Rover's blasts could make Garou bleed heavily from the mouth and heavily scar his own body. Rover's moderately lower than DS, not massively.

This also means Bomb's AP is much higher than HM Garou's. But we keep saying they are around the same level because Bang was surprised he was unscathed after taking Rover's blast. The only way to solve that problem without falling into outlier territory (which should be avoided if things can be logically explained) is by arguing Rover was attacking Bang and Bomb with higher AP (for whatever reason, maybe he was angrier or maybe he had more time to charge).

We already solved this problem in the last thread. It's very simple.

Garou in his initial battle with DS (in which he was curbstomped) has no direct rating or scaling. All we can prove is that Rover Garou took massive damage from Rover, while Bomb and Bang would have taken some amount of damage. So Bang and Bomb are in an unknown spot between Darkshine and Rover Garou.

We've seen that DS' attacks surpass their combos. For example, he massively injured the PsykoJet and one-shot transformed Bug God, whereas a combo from Bomb and Bang failed to do even that much damage to human Garou.

 

[ImposingTiger]

I'll respond later.

 

[ImposingTiger]

As I said, bigger doesn't really matter that much here.

Yes, because when Rover fires small blasts at Garou, they don't do nearly as much as larger ones.

Who's to say it doesn't? You're the one making this CRT, so prove it. The balls are demonstrably similar, if not consistently lower, than his physicals.

No, you have to prove they get weaker, because there is no indication they do.

My point here is that, damage-wise, they're not incomparable (even though that's a very arbitrary metric), and they're not even that difference size-wise. Ergo, they're probably around a somewhat similar level. And it makes very little sense for a frenzied Rover to hold back significantly in either circumstance.

We can't know how much bigger was the last one because it was omidirectional. We can't compare them at all. For all we know, this one could be a super concentrated energy ball. It makes little sense for Rover to hold back, but since in the second fight he's angrier, he probably is firing stronger balls. Plus, he doesn't need to try more, he just needs more time to charge in order for his attacks to be more powerful.

Remember, there's no specific number after 800 megatons. It's all upscaling and downscaling. Our current scaling doesn't lead at all to one person being above another.

If Garou and Darkshine are listed at Large Mountanin level, doesn't that mean they are higher in the scale than Bomb and Bang?

How was he closest to death before becoming a beast?

He literally had the whole MA in his back, along with his insides fighting against him. That is way worse than getting stabbed or momentarily burned.

And then gets destroyed, so he's quite a bit weaker.

No, because the point is, he should have exploded with that hit. And he may be weaker than the constantly evolving Garou, but the moment he went toe to toe with him, they were equals, which should put Bomb immediately at High 7-A.

Rover's blasts could make Garou bleed heavily from the mouth and heavily scar his own body. Rover's moderately lower than DS, not massively.

No, because that was Garou in the start of the fight. The last attack he takes (which is also the biggest one), he get back up without any major injuries, while the first one almost kills him, which is the one you are referring to.

So Bang and Bomb are in an unknown spot between Darkshine and Rover Garou.

Except Bomb= Beast Garou > Spiral Garou = Darkshine, for the reasons I said above.

We've seen that DS' attacks surpass their combos. For example, he massively injured the PsykoJet and one-shot transformed Bug God, whereas a combo from Bomb and Bang failed to do even that much damage to human Garou.

Psykojet had a weird durability and shape-shifting abilities, so we don't really know whether one inflicted more damage than the other. Even PPP seemed to do more damage than CFDSF, and we both know that's not true.

They were not trying to kill him. Many people say Bang stated he wasn't going easy on him, but the look on his eyes makes me think he is regretful. Even Bomb, who was attacking Garou at the same time as Bang, was convinced they didn't go all out, and that's why he asked Bang in the first place.

 

[Dual_Binoculars]

Except Bomb= Beast Garou > Spiral Garou = Darkshine, for the reasons I said above.

While I agree with u some what I think it would make more sense for Bomb to just downscale to at least 7-A+ because Garou clearly low diffed Bomb. At the same time however he wasn't completely helpless and managed to block a few shots before going down. For Bomb to be High 7-A he would have had to actually deal damage which he didn't, match Garou physically which he didn't and not get two shot which he did. On top of that Garou wasn't going all out until he started to fight AB Bang so at best (7-A+) Bomb<(1 gigaton High 7-A) DS=SP Garou<AB Bang=<Beast Garou going all out.

 

[ByAsura]

Yes, because when Rover fires small blasts at Garou, they don't do nearly as much as larger ones.

They absolutely do similar damage. Besides, as I've said, it's a very arbitrary metric. In fact, this singular ball here is the only one that does that has that kind of size, so I highly doubt it's actually supposed to be his absolute most powerful attack.

No, you have to prove they get weaker, because there is no indication they do.

He's explicitly stated to be in a weakened state and nothing contradicts it. It's 100% up to you to prove.

We can't know how much bigger was the last one because it was omidirectional. We can't compare them at all.

Yes we can. We can compare the rough volume and damages, and both are largely similar.

For all we know, this one could be a super concentrated energy ball. It makes little sense for Rover to hold back, but since in the second fight he's angrier, he probably is firing stronger balls. Plus, he doesn't need to try more, he just needs more time to charge in order for his attacks to be more powerful.

They're charged for pretty much just as long, to our knowledge.

If Garou and Darkshine are listed at Large Mountanin level, doesn't that mean they are higher in the scale than Bomb and Bang?

Higher doesn't mean so much higher that they'll break their bones.

He literally had the whole MA in his back, along with his insides fighting against him. That is way worse than getting stabbed or momentarily burned.

When is it stated that he got hit by the MA directly? I thought he escaped like everyone else.

No, because the point is, he should have exploded with that hit. And he may be weaker than the constantly evolving Garou, but the moment he went toe to toe with him, they were equals, which should put Bomb immediately at High 7-A.

You're still missing the point here. Mountain level+ to Large Mountain level is a moderate difference. It can even be a hair shy of 0.

No, because that was Garou in the start of the fight. The last attack he takes (which is also the biggest one), he get back up without any major injuries, while the first one almost kills him, which is the one you are referring to.

I'd argue Garou gets stronger, but he still took no damage while Bomb was very much at his limit and needed to rely on his absolute last resort.

Except Bomb= Beast Garou > Spiral Garou = Darkshine, for the reasons I said above.

Except nothing.

Psykojet had a weird durability and shape-shifting abilities, so we don't really know whether one inflicted more damage than the other. Even PPP seemed to do more damage than CFDSF, and we both know that's not true.

Firstly, PsykoJet's weird durability means nothing in this case. If character A can't rip a glass cannon in half, but character B can, then character B > character A. Secondly, no it didn't. PPP's attack basically just shattered her dome, while their combo rendered the remaining body useless.

Adding to this, Darkshine's strength and durability is considered as being at the top of the hero world, while only Bang's skills are held to a similar degree.

They were not trying to kill him. Many people say Bang stated he wasn't going easy on him, but the look on his eyes makes me think he is regretful. Even Bomb, who was attacking Garou at the same time as Bang, was convinced they didn't go all out, and that's why he asked Bang in the first place.

IIRC, that's webcomic only.

 

[ImposingTiger]

They absolutely do similar damage. Besides, as I've said, it's a very arbitrary metric. In fact, this singular ball here is the only one that does that has that kind of size, so I highly doubt it's actually supposed to be his absolute most powerful attack.

No, they don't, they don't even break a single floor. And which ball are you talking about?

They're charged for pretty much just as long, to our knowledge.

Rover had time to charge while the trio had a full conversation, while Rover charged his attack probably in under a second, because Garou didn't even have time to get out of range.

When is it stated that he got hit by the MA directly? I thought he escaped like everyone else.

The MA starts falling apart and he gets crushed by kilometers of rocks.

I'd argue Garou gets stronger, but he still took no damage while Bomb was very much at his limit and needed to rely on his absolute last resort.

He took no damage because his durability is just that high. All I'm comparing is their AP, and in 3 moments, they clash fist to fist. Even if we said the difference between these 7-A+ and High 7-A chaarters were of 0, it still wouldn't be enough because a 7-A + is likely (depends on the difference between SG and Beast Garou) massively above a High 7-A.

PPP's attack basically just shattered her dome, while their combo rendered the remaining body useless.

It was already useless when Psykos got out of there, so we can't really compare. The same happens with Darkshine.

Adding to this, Darkshine's strength and durability is considered as being at the top of the hero world, while only Bang's skills are held to a similar degree.

Darkshine's durability is, and I believe base Bang and Bomb can't do anything to Darkshine's body if it's not with technique (as SG did), but his strength isn't. TTM and PPP are considered strong and muscular fighters but they are not stronger than Bang. The only thing that implies something is "his strength can't be measured", which as I pointed out is contradicted by the scaling, and has no backup, because it could be referring to LS (which is the only was we see him training), and having High 7-A AP they are not going to go all out in a HA lab.

IIRC, that's webcomic only.

No, it's in the manga. They have this conversation when they go to the HQs to get a new phone iirc.

Anyway, I'm tired of arguing this point. We could be like this all day tbh. I'll throw this point, just know I don't agree with all of your reasonings.

Just curious: what do you think of PPP's feat against Psykojet? Is it an outlier?

 

[ImposingTiger]

For Bomb to be High 7-A he would have had to actually deal damage which he didn't,

That's dura, not AP.

match Garou physically which he didn't

which he did in 3 occasions, while low of energy.

On top of that Garou wasn't going all out until he started to fight AB Bang

He was in base, it's just that he used AB against AB Bang.

 

[ByAsura]

No, they don't, they don't even break a single floor. And which ball are you talking about?

Both balls he fired at Garou, which probably do even more damage.

Rover had time to charge while the trio had a full conversation, while Rover charged his attack probably in under a second, because Garou didn't even have time to get out of range.

All we see are two panels. He's firing off multiple blasts while looking for them, so it wasn't one blast charged for the length of that convo.

The MA starts falling apart and he gets crushed by kilometers of rocks.

What chapter? Also, every Dragon level survived getting crushed.

He took no damage because his durability is just that high. All I'm comparing is their AP, and in 3 moments, they clash fist to fist. Even if we said the difference between these 7-A+ and High 7-A chaarters were of 0, it still wouldn't be enough because a 7-A + is likely (depends on the difference between SG and Beast Garou) massively above a High 7-A.

I agree they're close enough to probably come out of Mountain level and just get a +. At this point, scaling supports it. EC's probably the only one who should stay with a possibly.

It was already useless when Psykos got out of there, so we can't really compare. The same happens with Darkshine.

So, basically, they did less damage to an even more useless body.

No it blatantly doesn't.

Darkshine's durability is, and I believe base Bang and Bomb can't do anything to Darkshine's body if it's not with technique (as SG did), but his strength isn't.\

It refers to strength and durability.

TTM and PPP are considered strong and muscular fighters but they are not stronger than Bang.

The TTM and PPP quote was about their muscles, and how DS trained himself in a different way.

The only thing that implies something is "his strength can't be measured", which as I pointed out is contradicted by the scaling, and has no backup, because it could be referring to LS (which is the only was we see him training), and having High 7-A AP they are not going to go all out in a HA lab.

The first part refers to his lifting strength (it's, of course, a crock of bs).

DS has feats above Bang and Bomb, as I've pointed out. Plus, portrayal and statements.

No, it's in the manga. They have this conversation when they go to the HQs to get a new phone iirc.

I'll have to look for it, because I vaguely remember something of the sort.

Just curious: what do you think of PPP's feat against Psykojet? Is it an outlier?

It's just not impressive, in all honesty.

 

[Dual_Binoculars]

I agree they're close enough to probably come out of Mountain level and just get a +. At this point, scaling supports it. EC's probably the only one who should stay with a possibility

I agree with this ^