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Naruto/Boruto General Dattebayo Discussion Thread #46

Them is plural, not singular. She feared multiple, not singular. And no it doesn't equate to being stronger. I'm scared if a dog attacks me, but a dog isn't stronger than me.



Kaguya got beat by teamwork too. And they were weakened when they fought Momoshiki, especially Naruto who had been getting his Chakra absorbed by Momoshiki.



In a gravity zone, sure. While Momoshiki was held back by Shikamaru, outsped by a running Darui, had to cross weapons with Darui, his attacked stopped by Gaara, reacted to by Gaara despite trying to blitz and all the Kage survived a direct hit from him and just got up fine after.

He literally has more anti-feats than literal feats which is why the argument stands that he is seen weaker than Kaguya.

I don't think you even bother to actually follow the series, because apart from your horrible analogies, you're making up your own ad hoc to downgrade someone

First, them, as explicitly stated in the movie, manga AND anime (hell even the novel and games) is Momoshiki AND Kinshiki, Kaguya herself WROTE their names in her scroll. Your dog example is stupid, you don't write about a dog coming after you, nor do you create an army to battle the dog after you absorb your children's powers in do you?

They weren't weakened for the billionth time. 50% chakra hasn't been weakening Naruto for ages now. Otherwise ever since Naruto made a Shadow Clone to restrain Madara's limbo he was at 50% power and that kept getting divided, and we should thus upgrade Naruto to Star level or some shit

Gravity zone? Yeah, and in non gravity zones too. Even Naruto and Sasuke got restrained by Shikamaru's Shadow, guess they're Shikamaru level. Momoshiki straight up absorbed it while Sasuke couldn't.

Where was he outsped by Darui? You realise the Kage got knocked tf out for an unkown amount of time and then got up right?


And this isn't even as bad as Kakashi intercepting Ash Bones while weighed down, Obito doing the same and even using Kamui on them, Kaguya barely dodging being beheaded by Sasuke even tho she's supposed to be in an entirely different league, Kaguya's absorbing arms not being able to catch up to Sakura for a while, Sakura intercepting her in FREEFALL even with her Byakugan activated while she outsped Naruto and Sasuke

Momoshiki doesn't have nearly as many anti-feats as Kaguya, stop being dumb because you've a bias against the verse
 
ISins32 said:
Lmao this is why all other people outside of Naruto's supporters listen to IMade
According to all of you, all anti-feats in Naruto are outliers.
Click to expand...
IMade makes arguments like "Boruto tanked a hit from Delta so she doesn't scale to Naruto!"

Obviously everyone except Naruto supporters will listen to that, most people don't like how the verse keeps getting stronger and want some way to downgrade it
 
i think the most logicial answer is they just don't have the power to bust as high as we rate them on vsb. especially not physically their physical ap sucks.
 
I mean, I would of thought the most logical answer is the one that doesn't need to rely on pis/cis or outliers every time to explain why these things consistently occur but hey you do you.
 
just maybe, possibly, one in 'a infinitesimal' number, you are wrong about the series power level in general. maybe.


Sorry I dont argue by an appeal to authority.

Never stated i cant be wrong, but clearly using broken arguments,and fallacies to prove your point isnt good arguments.

"'IMade' is clearly one of the most intelligent people for the 'naruto' fandom on this site."

is entirely subjective on you're part and not a fact
 
Yeah I guess a weaker Naruto will satisfy you because you want everyone to be vaporised everytime a strong threat comes along and hits them
 
Shadowbokunohero said:
because you realize with that argument I could just say "Well The Kage Should be Upgraded to Momoshiki's level than"
and what are you going to tell me as a counter-argument huh?
Click to expand...
I would tell you the same thing I repeated in the 5-B Base Naruto thread that got it rejected due to overwhelming agreements:

So a completely Base Momoshiki has no actual solid 5-B feats. The only one for contention is kicking Adult Base Naruto; however, Adult Base Naruto being 5-B is what we are currently discussing, it can't be used as evidence for Momoshiki since Momoshiki is supposed to be evidence for Adult Base Naruto, otherwise that's even more circular scaling. So there is no feat for Base Momoshiki being 5-B and there is an overwhelming amount of evidence for Base Momoshiki being Tier 7-A to possibly 6-C.

Base Kinshiki has an overwhelming amount of feats that are Tier 7-A, a severe amount as well. He has only one 5-B feat for AP and Durability while the rest are literally entirely 7-A feats. By definition, the singular 5-B feat would be an outlier, Kinshiki is consistently below that.

Outliers can be a super high-end feat or an extremely low-end feat that is not consistent with the majority of a character's feat. The 5-B feat for Base Momoshiki and Base Kinshiki are an outlier, they are a singular feat that differs from the rest of their consistent majority feats.

No one ever made that 6-B Base Adult Naruto thread sadly. I was waiting for someone to do that since I was supposed to do a CRT for Momoshiki and Kinshiki's rating after Kep had agreed with me and also said they weren't as impressive anymore. I could wait for more anti-feats like Delta and Boruto, they just seem to keep coming now, and proceed without the 6-B Base Adult Naruto CRT, but I don't like being hasty.

Seriously though, someone should get on that supposed 6-B calc as well as the unfinished Jonin revisions (Darui, Samui, Kinkaku and Ginkaku are still all 7-C because they literally scale to each other and an 8-A Ittan).
 
Outliers can be a super high-end feat or an extremely low-end feat that is not consistent with the majority of a character's feat. The 5-B feat for Base Momoshiki and Base Kinshiki are an outlier, they are a singular feat that differs from the rest of their consistent majority feats.

This is a fallacy as it only works when you remove context.

I suggest not creating arguments that rely the absence of information.
 
bleach never bust a country yet they are 5-C here no one complaining about that.

DBS(excluding omni king) never bust a galaxy yet they are low 2-C here

yes vsb just wanking all verses
 
going from the info I have heard about in the recent bleach novels they have feats that put all of naruto's to shame to be honest.

Also we are only discussing naruto here no need to bring up other verses.
 
Sins32 said:
Lmao this is why all other people outside of Naruto's supporters listen to IMade
According to all of you, all anti-feats in Naruto are outliers.
Click to expand...
Yeah, you all have to ask this question to yourself.
 
Omimi said:
bleach never bust a country yet they are 5-C here no one complaining about that.
DBS(excluding omni king) never bust a galaxy yet they are low 2-C here

yes vsb just wanking all verses
Click to expand...
Cry
 
Omimi said:
bleach never bust a country yet they are 5-C here no one complaining about that.

DBS(excluding omni king) never bust a galaxy yet they are low 2-C here

yes vsb just wanking all verses
Click to expand...
Yes they have. About both verses. Multiple Times.

That said nobody talking about busting something as more scaling to someone else.
 
So a completely Base Momoshiki has no actual solid 5-B feats. The only one for contention is kicking Adult Base Naruto

Base Momoshiki Knocked out six paths sage mode Naruto and captured him.

Outliers can be a super high-end feat or an extremely low-end feat that is not consistent with the majority of a character's feat. The 5-B feat for Base Momoshiki and Base Kinshiki are an outlier, they are a singular feat that differs from the rest of their consistent majority feats

you are confusing Outliers with Inconsistencies, those are massively different things in regards to our standards here in the wiki, You are using correlation fallacy to prove Your point.

I was waiting for someone to do that since I was supposed to do a CRT for Momoshiki and Kinshiki's rating after Kep had agreed with me and also said they weren't as impressive anymore

Cool Appeal to Authority, another fallacy.

I could wait for more anti-feats like Delta and Boruto, they just seem to keep coming now,

Nope, either you dont understand how these things work or your being dishonest.
 
GilgaArcuied said:
I mean, IMade is clearly one of the most intelligent people for the naruto fandom on this site.
Click to expand...
I agree. And unlike him he doesn't attack the commenter but the comment.

Edit: also he doesn't use other verses as a scapegoat.
 
IMade is clearly one of the most intelligent people for the naruto fandom on this site.

sure but its not like other knowledgeable member never read the manga

10 knowledgeable member vs 1 knowledgeable member = 10 wins
 
Omimi said:
IMade is clearly one of the most intelligent people for the naruto fandom on this site.
sure but its not like other knowledgeable member never read the manga

10 knowledgeable member vs 1 knowledgeable member = 10 wins
Click to expand...
since when does quantity perservere over quality.
 
Shadowbokunohero said:
So a completely Base Momoshiki has no actual solid 5-B feats. The only one for contention is kicking Adult Base Naruto Base Momoshiki Knocked out six paths sage mode Naruto and captured him.
Click to expand...
That wasn't Base Momoshiki, that was an amped Momoshiki. I literally explained that in my link, but I can't blame you since you weren't in the 5-B Base Naruto thread the entire time so you obviously didn't see why no one contended that.

Outliers can be a super high-end feat or an extremely low-end feat that is not consistent with the majority of a character's feat. The 5-B feat for Base Momoshiki and Base Kinshiki are an outlier, they are a singular feat that differs from the rest of their consistent majority feats you are confusing Outliers with Inconsistencies, those are massively different things in regards to our standards here in the wiki, You are using correlation fallacy to prove Your point.
I literally copy/pasted the wiki's definitions in the link and thread. Again, why it was accepted.

I was waiting for someone to do that since I was supposed to do a CRT for Momoshiki and Kinshiki's rating after Kep had agreed with me and also said they weren't as impressive anymore Cool Appeal to Authority, another fallacy.
That's just staff support and agreement. I'm not appealing to an authority and saying their view is law, I'm saying they gave me support to go ahead with a future CRT.

I could wait for more anti-feats like Delta and Boruto, they just seem to keep coming now, Nope, either you dont understand how these things work or your being dishonest.
I understand perfectly, I run a battleboard like VS Wiki. through the wiki's own definitions of consistency, outlier and anti-feats, it's going along great and helped in the past already with Naruto, such as the 5-B thread that had numerous staff in it to help with definitions and their own opinions on the matter.
 
That wasn't Base Momoshiki, that was an amped Momoshiki. I literally explained that in my link, but I can't blame you since you weren't in the 5-B Base Naruto thread the entire time so you obviously didn't see why no one contended that.

it would still fall under Base Momoshiki, unless your willing to make a CRT to create another key for Momoshiki.

I literally copy/pasted the wiki's definitions in the link and thread. Again, why it was accepted.

simply pointing to something doesn't make your argument correct, and your arguments dont match the point you are making.

I understand perfectly, I run a 'battleboard' like VS Wiki. through the wiki's own definitions of consistency, outlier 'and' anti-feats.

I know, but you dont apply these very standards to every verse, Your intentions are far to transparent Imade.
 
I'm going to drop the Momoshiki thing now, I'm tired of arguing the same thing over and over.

id rather discuss the narrative itself instead of the power scaling.

If you want to argue something with me specifically, feel free to post it on my wall.
 
Shadowbokunohero said:
That wasn't Base Momoshiki, that was an amped Momoshiki. I literally explained that in my link, but I can't blame you since you weren't in the 5-B Base Naruto thread the entire time so you obviously didn't see why no one contended that. it would still fall under Base Momoshiki, unless your willing to make a CRT to create another key for Momoshiki.
Click to expand...
It wouldn't and I don't have to. He literally took Chakra Pills to amp himself as well as the Jutsu of those who had fired upon him recently. That's not a base since base does not include Chakra Pills. Unless you want to make a CRT and say his base is with Chakra Pill amps.

I literally copy/pasted the wiki's definitions in the link and thread. Again, why it was accepted. simply pointing to something doesn't make your argument correct, and your arguments dont match the point you are making.
My argument was accurate definition here, thus why I pointed to me copy/pasting the actual definitions. It would seem you forgot the point of this part of the discussion.

'I understand perfectly, I run a 'battleboard' like VS Wiki. through the wiki's own definitions of consistency, outlier 'and' anti-feats.'I know, but you dont apply these very standards to every verse, You're intentions are far to transparent Imade.
That's where a lot of people go wrong with me. I don't like to entertain these comments about me since the tend to derail and it would involve such discussing my history, but I'll play ball this one time.

I've never once went against my own words and have held a sole standard. You may think I'm biased for one verse or the other due to holding them to a different standard and you'd be correct... on the latter.

Not all works of fiction share the same standard. Some authors value their words or statements over their art, some the reverse. I hold a standard depending on the work of fiction and it's creator how they value it.

But there is something I do generally favor and always favor for all verses: Consistency.

It actually ties back to my point about authors and their standard for their verse based on their value. Some authors are more consistent with their statements and not so with their arts, clearly they hold more value in the statements than the art since they don't care to be consistent with the latter. I shall do the same then.

You can try to say I'm not consistent myself or biased in certain aspects, but I can assure you that I could even find a comment from myself that disproves that. Like yesterday, I didn't entertain Omimi on this (partially cause it's hard to understand him and he derails so much), but he kept saying I was a hypocrite and biased for not agreeing with Class Z physical strength lifting for Naruto characters but I am in agreement for Class P physical strength for Yhwach. I joined the site after that was added in (I couldn't argue against it), I never once said anything about being in agreement for it since I never even talked about it (I honestly didn't even know it was there) and I have literally said before that I am against TK being equated to physical lifting strength.
 
I mean it all kinda ties together. SO6P Naruto isn't immediately oneshotting some random using ninja tech. that is very scary indeed..
 
IMadeThisOn8-1-2017 said:
That's where a lot of people go wrong with me. I don't like to entertain these comments about me since the tend to derail and it would involve such discussing my history, but I'll play ball this one time.

I've never once went against my own words and have held a sole standard. You may think I'm biased for one verse or the other due to holding them to a different standard and you'd be correct... on the latter.

Not all works of fiction share the same standard. Some authors value their words or statements over their art, some the reverse. I hold a standard depending on the work of fiction and it's creator how they value it.

But there is something I do generally favor and always favor for all verses: Consistency.

It actually ties back to my point about authors and their standard for their verse based on their value. Some authors are more consistent with their statements and not so with their arts, clearly they hold more value in the statements than the art since they don't care to be consistent with the latter. I shall do the same then.

You can try to say I'm not consistent myself or biased in certain aspects, but I can assure you that I could even find a comment from myself that disproves that. Like yesterday, I didn't entertain Omimi on this (partially cause it's hard to understand him and he derails so much), but he kept saying I was a hypocrite and biased for not agreeing with Class Z physical strength lifting for Naruto characters but I am in agreement for Class P physical strength for Yhwach. I joined the site after that was added in (I couldn't argue against it), I never once said anything about being in agreement for it since I never even talked about it (I honestly didn't even know it was there) and I have literally said before that I am against TK being equated to physical lifting strength.
Click to expand...
The Problem is you are forcing your own personal criteria as an Objective standard and thats the problem, you bring up nonsensical arguments that can be debunked using our very own system. we dont use a standard that changes for every verse we use a stadard that can be applied to every verse.

Im not sure about lifting strength wasnt's active in that thread all that much.

the reason I pointed to the transperecny thing is because I know your feelings towards naruto in regards to powerscaling and feats based upon our shared histroy of debating,going back years.
 
I would recommend that we keep the arguing to the actual CRT threads or feel free to post on my wall if you feel I lack some information that might change my stance.
 
Shadowbokunohero said:
The Problem is you are forcing your own personal criteria as an Objective standard and thats the problem, you bring up nonsensical arguments that can be debunked using our very own system. we dont use a standard that changes for every verse we use a stadard that can be applied to every verse.
Click to expand...
He says just as we are changing Dimensional Tiering to be a standard not applied to all verses and authors.


the reason I pointed to the transperecny thing is because I know your feelings towards naruto in regards to powerscaling and feats based upon our shared histroy of debating,going back years.
No you don't. I've never said my opinions on verses beyond "I have an interest in them". But it's obvious what my opinions are about battleboarding, debating and such. Yet people still don't understand them and think there's a bias.
Madara's first appearance is the goat entrance of all of Naruto. Nothing will ever have such an impact as him casually defeating an army.
 
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