Nagilum VS The Doctor

[Phoenix821]

Both High 1-C

Nagilum : 1 (Aeyu)

The Doctor : 1 (Hellbeast1)

Inconclusive: 1 (SpidermanWins)

 

[Hellbeast1]

Im pretty sure the Doctors got far greater vesatility.

 

[Phoenix821]

Bump

 

[Hellbeast1]

BTW im voting the Doctor for my priorly given reasons.

 

[Aeyu]

Does the Doctor have any way to get past Conceptual Manipulation, very strong Void Manipulation, Invulnerability and High-Godly regen? If not, Nagilum should handily take this.

 

[Hellbeast1]

Sealing should work i believe though ill have another look at his page.

 

[Aeyu]

I don't see sealing anywhere on the Doctor's profile, and what's more, I have doubts at him sealing away an at least 11-D dimensionless, abstract entity with 0 physical or dimensional properties.

 

[Hellbeast1]

Dimensionless? Secondly considering this Doctor likely has access to the Key To Time and Lux Aeterna (which are FAR above conceptual beings like the Six Fold God). Thirdly im not sure how helpful Invulnerability is when its a High 1-C fight though you do have a point on the Regen point, not sure if Theta Sigma can null that lemme do some research.

 

[Aeyu]

Yes, dimensionless. As in, lacks physical parameters entirely. Being outside of a 10 or 26-D series of continuums is only considered 11-D or 27-D though unless the concepts of dimensions have been surpassed. Furthermore, what would stop Nagilum from just entering his mind and killing him with the concept of death itself, like he did to the crewmember of the Enterprise? Invulnerability is persistent in that Nagilum doesn't even register as existing at all and has no properties whatsoever, as well as being able to lose and create a form without any form of effort.

 

[Jamesthetaker]

• patiently wait for a DW expert to come by*

 

[Hellbeast1]

Call up Ever or Azzy

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

The Doctor is on a very high level of High 1-C, as the key to time gives him the power of the conceptual embodiments of a High 1-C multiverse. I vote him.

 

[Aeyu]

Yeah, but killing a High-Godly regen possessing, conceptual manipulatory, invulnerable, non-existent, formless, dimensionless at least 11-D (at the low end) being? Without space and time or physical properties a lot of the Doctor's hax don't really do anything. Did I mention Nagilum's acausal? When you combine all that with literally not existing at all, plus High-Godly regen and the ability to infiltrate and manipulate the foundations of concepts in his void, I don't see how the Doctor could take this. Simply having a powerful object that can channel the power of the embodiments of a multiverse isn't going to lolnope all that hax when you literally exist in an infinite conceptual void outside the multiverse.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

Aeyu makes a lot of sense here.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Nagilum's High-Godly shouldn't be High-Godly. It's the same reason stuff like the Chaos Gods have high-end Mid-Godly.

Aside from that, I don't really have a proper vote, yet. Have to think on it.

 

[Aeyu]

If the Doctor is as powerful as people in this thread are saying he is, and his abilities were elaborated on (explained rather than just going off a profile) you might convince me to switch to inconclusive, although I still think Nagilum's hax is too much, coupled with controlling and embodying an infinite conceptual void.

 

[Phoenix821]

Bump

 

[Phoenix821]

Bump

 

[Phoenix821]

Bump

 

[Phoenix821]

Bump

 

[Udlmaster]

I am interested in this fight, I want to see more!

 

[Phoenix821]

Bump

 

[SpidermanWins]

Yeah, but killing a High-Godly regen possessing, conceptual manipulatory, invulnerable, non-existent, formless, dimensionless at least 11-D (at the low end) being? Without space and time or physical properties a lot of the Doctor's hax don't really do anything. Did I mention Nagilum's acausal? When you combine all that with literally not existing at all, plus High-Godly regen and the ability to infiltrate and manipulate the foundations of concepts in his void, I don't see how the Doctor could take this. Simply having a powerful object that can channel the power of the embodiments of a multiverse isn't going to lolnope all that hax when you literally exist in an infinite conceptual void outside the multiverse.

a lot of what youre saying seems sort of contradictory. How can something be non existent, non physical, dimensionless yet be able to effect anything in the real world? Sounds hyperbolic to me.

 

[Aeyu]

@Spidermanwins

Have you ever seen TNG? Nagilum can easily manipulate concepts and affect anything that comes into contact with it without exerting any external force.

 

[Phoenix821]

Bump

 

[SpidermanWins]

@Spidermanwins

Have you ever seen TNG? Nagilum can easily manipulate concepts and affect anything that comes into contact with it without exerting any external force.

Yeah, but thats different from what you said above. If something literally doesn't exist, then it doesn't exist and therefore can't interact with anything that does exist. So, Nagilum probably does have some sort of existence, which means the Doctor should be able to affect it.

 

[Aeyu]

You may want to look more into profiles related to Void Manipulation and nonexistence in general. There are plenty of "non-existent" characters on this Wiki.

 

[Crzer07]

Data, who is a supergenius android that was able to hack the Enterprise, even says it's non-existent in every conventional sense which would imply it to be abstract and conceptual

 

[Aeyu]

Additionally, a being who's dimensionally superior to the entire multiverse would likely appear as though it were non-existent, even besides the whole non-existence thing. Anyway, Nagilum may receive an upgrade soon, so I might have to close this.

 

[SpidermanWins]

Data, who is a supergenius android that was able to hack the Enterprise, even says it's non-existent in every conventional sense which would imply it to be abstract and conceptual

right, but there's a difference between abstract and conceptual with non existence. I think using the term non existent is essentially useless and offers no meaningful value to the debate.

 

[SpidermanWins]

I guess I'm voting non conclusive simply because both characters probably cannot put each other down. When you're dealing with characters that exist outside of dimensions, time, space, etc. it's hard to quantify how powerful they really are.

 

[Aeyu]

Except that this is a conceptual, abstract, non-existent being. There's plenty of linked resources in the AP description of Nagilum's profile.

 

[SpidermanWins]

Except that this is a conceptual, abstract, non-existent being. There's plenty of linked resources in the AP description of Nagilum's profile.

Yeah, that's all meaningless unless backed up by feats. Simply stating something doesnt have a material existence/is a conceptual being, at best proves they (probably) cant be hurt by regular means. But vs another character that has similar properties? It becomes a guessing game of who can affect who with what ability.

 

[Aeyu]

Except literally one of his feats is being non-existent. He creates the shape of a face in the void, but nothing is detected by sensors that can even pick up higher-dimensional beings.

 

[SpidermanWins]

Except literally one of his feats is being non-existent. He creates the shape of a face in the void, but nothing is detected by sensors that can even pick up higher-dimensional beings.

Even by going by regular scientific/philosphical logic, a "void" like some have speculated spawned our universe, still technically exists and is not "nothingness."

 

[Aeyu]

This is an anomalous void and not comparable to the vacuum which pre-existed our universe.

 

[SpidermanWins]

This is an anomalous void and not comparable to the vacuum which pre-existed our universe.

First of all, its still just one of many theories of how our universe came to be.

Secondly, my point still stands. Voids still have a sort of existence; true non existence is pretty much non applicable and certainly not combat useful.

 

[Phoenix821]

Looks like Q is getting upgraded so this might be a stomp now

 

[Aeyu]

Yep. I'll close this.