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MULTIVERSAL BLEACH UPGRADE
- Thread starter Arc7Kuroi
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countless can just mean very many, not neccessarily infinite, the term infinite can be used hyperbolically and there are definitions of infinity that mean approaching a limitless value or simply an extremely great value in general.
so disagree, i dont think the evidence is sufficient enough
so disagree, i dont think the evidence is sufficient enough
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Literally stated to be infinite in the novel. Not sure why you guys are "coincidentally." forget and rather focus on one miniscule part of the argument.
Anyone who's focusing on the countless statement as the main support should put the bong down.
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i literally addressed the infinite part in my reply... it was literally two sentences long theres no reason to have not read it
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We have multiple statements of countless futures existing within Bleach and we even have a direct statement from a credible source that infinite futures exist within Bleach.
The onus is on you to prove its hyperbolic given nothing supports nor even implies it's hyperbolic.
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The first line of your reply was already completely addressed in my first comment.
The second portion seems to be misinterpreting what i'm saying, im introducing the possibility of it being hyperbolic, because within the english language or even japanese manga it is common to use exaggerate values of things, especially but not limited to the use of the word infinite. So unless theres a concrete reason or basis its to be taken literally, i am not inclined to agreeing, hence me disagreeing.
- 18,950
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- Thread starter
- #129
Yes
- 18,950
- 27,772
- Thread starter
- #130
Worst case scenario, the interpretation would be “2-B, likely 2-A hax”; however, as the others have pointed it, there’s a high preponderance of evidence towards the 2-A interpretation. Furthermore, when the narrator calls it infinite it’s not in a bombastic way that would indicate hyperbole, it’s in an explanatory way.
Edit: if the majority ends up finding 2-B, likely 2-A hax more agreeable that’s fine too btw
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It didn't, you basically just said infinite can be interpreted in different ways, you have to debunk our interpretation, you haven't done that yet.
You have to prove its hyperbolic, just stating that it could is a literal non sequitur and isn't a counter to what we're proposing at all.
Also you shouldn't be disagreeing 2-A as a whole, you'd inherently have to concede to at least "at least 2-B, Possibly/Likely 2-A" since both arguments are based around presumed equal interpretations going by your line of logic, unless you're willing to prove your interpretation is so vastly above ours, which i heavily doubt you can.
So do you at least agree with that compromise?
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Braking
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i forgot blazblue existed
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Hyperboles don't necessarily need to be portrayed in a "bombtastic" way and the evidence you presented doesn't inherently lean towards the literally infinite interpretation, explained earlier. But yeah since this wiki for some odd reason considers countless automatically 2-B then sure I'd be all for 2-B precog, 2-B possibly 2-A is an OK compromise.
If you agree we can use that exact same evidence and interpret it several different ways, the argument becomes the textbook definition of non sequitur? Unless theres further evidence outside of what was presented in the scans that support your interpretation as the greatest possible one, then i'd be for an outright 2-A.
Thats a repetition of what you said before and what I already addressed.. If you think im asserting it is, you aren't understanding what i'm saying. And introducing the possibility is not non sequitur and is extremely relevant because it means your evidence doesn't lead to only the conclusion presented in this thread. I can use this exact same evidence as justification for a 2-b, and the fact that I can makes this line of reasoning fallacious.
Yeah sure I'm fine with that.
- 18,950
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- Thread starter
- #137
It’s the narrator stating there are infinite futures. It’s backed up by another scan about time earlier that Deceived is snagging tho.
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- 18,950
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- Thread starter
- #139
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I am. I'll grab the raws at that.
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- Thread starter
- #141
Giriko refers to the torrents of time as infinite as well. Supporting the notion of innumerable branching paths, as each torrent would account for different future paths.
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Besides, burden of proof would not be on us to prove word does mean what's it supposed to mean anyways....
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Ok I think it's fine to use then
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- breathes in -
How does precognition, in this specific instance, involve "multiversal hax"? Furthermore, how does someone unaffiliated with Yhwach; someone who was talking in the context of wanting to show Hikone a life beyond what Tokinada had offered, in any way provide support for this?
At its most basic, its most fundamental, "The Almighty" is a causality hax. He can see possible futures, and he can choose what "future"/"effect" he wants to happen in the present.
Is there a possible future where Ichigo's Bankai is broken? Where he breaks Ichigo's Bankai? He makes it happen, skipping the "cause" and going straight for the "effect". It's why Tensa Zangetsu and Ichigo's Hollow horn both appear in Yhwach's hands. Because, in separate possible futures, Yhwach broke both.
That's the constraint. It has to be within Yhwach's physical capabilities to do so. There are no multiverse shenanigans happening with "The Almighty" because that doesn't exist within the context of the series. It's analogies and flowery language that are taken too literally.
Hard disagree.
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- Thread starter
- #149
The narrator made that statement. Narrator states there are infinite futures. Yhwach states he can intervene and see every single future. Logic dictates he can affect infinite futures.
Don’t see the relevance in this. I’m not claiming the Almighty gives Yhwach Multiversal AP. Which seems to be what you’re implying.
Arcker123
He/Him- 8,080
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They’re support because they show how many futures there are. Yhwach’s ability is just manipulating these futures. It’s precog over an infinite amount of futures, so that’s why it’s 2-A.
Also the narrator made some of the statements.
We need to put this in the dictionary of Head Canon. Holy shit. There is no basis for any of these claims, if you have it, show it.
Yhwach isn’t manipulating Causality. That’s not accepted anywhere. You made that up and haven’t given any reason to think so. Yhwach is manipulating all the infinite futures he sees in his eyes to create outcomes he desires in his own. That’s fate manip. Yhwach sees and manipulated actual futures, his ability doesn’t work if it’s merely “unactualized possibilities.”
Yhwach broke Ichigo’s Bankai in every future, something repeatedly established to be 2-A. Scans are in the OP. You didn’t offer a rebuttal, just head canon.
Wanna prove this is flowery? How can you see such consistent statements from the narrator and other reputable sources in the verse and come to the conclusion it’s flowery when it’s repeatedly said there are infinite futures in Bleach. The rest of the stuff you said about “physical constraint” is more head canon. The Almighty isn’t even related to his physicals anyway.
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Because Yhwach's Precognition allows him to see infinite futures/possibilities? infinite futures/possibilities is 2-A and Yhwach's Fate Manipulation can affect all these futures at once, like literally read the ******* tiering system dude.
Being unaffilated with Yhwach doesn't mean she doesn't know the capabilities of his Almighty, terrible argument.
Because the statement heavily implies that infinite pathways (ala futures) exist within Bleach? the context of what she's saying this to doesn't matter, what matters is what she's implying, you haven't debunked that implication.
The Almighty isn't Causality Manipulation the **** are you talking about? its most base fundamental level is Fate Manipulation, like i know you're a goon against Bleach but even people who try to downplay the verse know that Yhwach's Almighty is Fate Manipulation.
No, he's able to see infinite possible futures and manipulate them all as once as stated by Yhwach and Orihime/Rukia and shown by Yhwach, he doesn't jump from "one grain of sand to another", re-read his explanation carefully this time instead of bursting into this thread like you got somesort of gotcha.
This is a counter how? like dude, what you're saying isn't a counter to what at all we're arguing.
Yes Yhwach has Fate Manipulation, good observation.
Yhwach's Fate Manipulation literally has nothing to do with his physicals.
Yes it does, you haven't disproved that at all.
Of ******* course you would pull the "flowery language" bullshit, dude until you haven an actual argument that isn't based around your personal feelings regarding the series and misrepresentations of literally everything we're talking about you shouldn't be posting in this thread.
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Nah its just Catalyst being Catalyst.
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- Thread starter
- #155
Unfortunately my shenanigans might be biting my ass but it’s too funny to change lol, but yes people should read the OP fully, I make it clear it’s just hax not AP
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Add this to the CRT Text
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mrk
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In fact, anything that proves infinite futures should be added to the CRT text, so the information doesn't become a mess.
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He literally said that he rewrites the future, in one of scans in the OP it says he destroyed Ichigo's sword in every future .. you saying he just chose one future to happen while the manga says he manipulated all the futures/possibilities
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Don't wanna be that guy but the "counter arguments." here that are being presented as horde shit for lack there of a better word.
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