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misconceptions about rimuru's abilities

Starfeldway said:
you guys disagreeing is funny so I'll wait for staffs
  • author Confirms veldanava isn't holy spirit>he said Holy spirit is big bang, veldanava arose after the big bang, so he doesn't show any superiority over great spirits in this case
  • no where in all of web novels was it directly stated he is> literally nowhere, world of emptiness≠nothingness where the holy spirit or before the big bang itself
  • rimuru didn't survive the death of anything since they never died> it was a mis-translation it's the death and the replacement of the great spirit using the their source the holy spirit [the one way current of life and death, new spirit are born when others die, until the very day the world=reality ends, rimuru was just sent to the future where there's no more energy for space and time to flow through author uses law of entropy for a reason and author himself said rimuru was never sent beyond reality only to end of time In just that one universe
  • rimuru never showed superiority over the dual great spirits>never implied he did, the rules of the world were created by veldanava in the first place so he is just beyond everyone including veldanava the holy spirit isn't a being with will or any attribute
  • you guys arguments are veldanava created the world along with the great spirits which was never said>never ever
  • and I showed you turn null is a condensed energy that was swirling in the primordial world which veldanava uses to maintain and create worlds, turn null as the name imply is just energy which birthed life and control the flow of space and time
  • no canonical evidence veldanava is the very creator of the great spirits>so it's head canon to speak of anything beyond the plot and words of author
  • so author words here too are valid>doesn't contradict the plot
Click to expand...
Add this in OP.
 
Guretodesu said:
Yea i know, I'm talking about the translation
Click to expand...
translation have no issues, thunderian translation was off.
he also only showed the part that great spirit of light and darkness are yin-yang but cut off the part that great spirit were never killed by any new spirit, he relied on the other one which said great spirits were killed by some new spirit
so yeah
to be Trans-dual
you have to show feat that the character is superior over any system of duality
which rimuru nor veldanava ever seem to have done.
end of the universe doesn't mean anything as per provided the world just lost energy the world itself was still there, everything is provided in the OP anyways so there's no need to frat about it now
 
To be transdual, you need to show qualitative superiority over specific nonduals or show immunities against attacks that are reliant on nondual. In our case, neither of them are shown.
 
Can I know where you got confirmation from Fuse Sensei? I had searched for it in Syosetu but never found that Fuse Sensei confirmed it.

I may not have evidence of Wn because I have left him for a long time, but I still remember that Ramiris once said that Veldanava created the world with Turn Null, if the World and Reality were born first then what should the evidence of Ramiris' words be?

Even Veldanava's death is also mentioned by the world system he created himself, Veldanava died because he did not behave like a creator God, namely loving all creatures not equally.

Remember you can’t use false statements
 
ImmortalDread said:
To be transdual, you need to show qualitative superiority over specific nonduals or show immunities against attacks that are reliant on nondual. In our case, neither of them are shown.
Click to expand...
How can Veldanava not? As far as I remember Great Spirit is what made Reality created, of course we already know about the existence of duality in Great Spirit.





Veldanava is said to have created the World with Turn Null, although it is not mentioned directly, isn't it clear that the Great Spirit that made reality exist emerged from Turn Null because it is said that Veldanava Created the World through Turn Null.





Even in the Rimuru section sent to a world that has become a pure void there is also no Great Spirit, then Ciel also confirmed that he can recreate the world with Turn Null which means Great Spirit will also be created through Turn null.





How is it possible that it does not make Veldanava enter a NonDual state?
 
Starfeldway said:
Japanese author blog bruh
Click to expand...
Then? What I know is that he never answered a single question, he doesn't have social media or anything like that. After all, how can a creature who is called the creator of the Tensura World but Veldanava exist after the world was created is illogical. Then it is said that he appeared after the world was created means that he existed before the tensura world was created, and he created everything in tensura.. I disagree
 
karzen said:
then? What I know is that he never answered a single question, he doesn't have social media or anything like that. After all, how can a creature who is called the creator of the tensura world but Veldanava actually exist after the world was created illogically, then it is said that he appeared after the world was created which means that he existed before the tensura world was created, and he created everything in tensura.. I disagree
Click to expand...
Well, Fuse Sensei doesn't have social media so far for us fans can talk to him other than on the Syosetu site
 
Starfeldway said:
Japanese author blog bruh
Click to expand...
If you want to use the Author's statement then you must also put evidence that he said it directly.

If you want to say from Japan then you have to give a video that he said that but if it's not a video but just a writing you also have to prove that Fuse Sensei said that.

So far Fuse Sensei has only answered someone's question from Syosetu
 
Rizkykarbit said:
How can Veldanava not? As far as I remember Great Spirit is what made Reality created, of course we already know about the existence of duality in Great Spirit.





Veldanava is said to have created the World with Turn Null, although it is not mentioned directly, isn't it clear that the Great Spirit that made reality exist emerged from Turn Null because it is said that Veldanava Created the World through Turn Null.





Even in the Rimuru section sent to a world that has become a pure void there is also no Great Spirit, then Ciel also confirmed that he can recreate the world with Turn Null which means Great Spirit will also be created through Turn null.





How is it possible that it does not make Veldanava enter a NonDual state?
Click to expand...
he didn't create great spirits he used turn null as bases of management to create and emphasise <space-time>

like I showed you rimuru was sent to a world with no energy are you saying veldora is now trans-dual?
@ImmortalDread am sure I cleared all of this up in the OP why these guys repeating arguments
 
everything is literally in OP oh my god 😭
fuse being the one who answered is there
it not contradicting the plot is also there
the website to see fuse blogs are there
as he was doing Q&A for web novel at that time which is 2013-15
rimuru sent to place without Great spirits is also clarified he was sent to a place with no energy can't you even ******* read, my guy read the op first before complaining am not answering anything again which have already been clarified
 
karzen said:
Then? What I know is that he never answered a single question, he doesn't have social media or anything like that. After all, how can a creature who is called the creator of the Tensura World but Veldanava exist after the world was created is illogical. Then it is said that he appeared after the world was created means that he existed before the tensura world was created, and he created everything in tensura.. I disagree
Click to expand...
honestly speaking, those who disagreed their arguments are flawed
Well, since you have no perfect argument against mine, I'll only wait for the staffs and what they have to say about the Trans-duality and nep downgrade
 
The issue is, there is another statement declaring Veldanava created the world in chapter 248, which was published on the 6th of July 2014 at syosetsu. 7 months after Fuse's answer. Either he retconned it/changed his mind near the end of the story, or he forgot (again).
 
Starfeldway said:
Click to expand...
Starfeldway said:
he didn't create great spirits he used turn null as bases of management to create and emphasise <space-time>

like I showed you rimuru was sent to a world with no energy are you saying veldora is now trans-dual?
@ImmortalDread am sure I cleared all of this up in the OP why these guys repeating arguments
Click to expand...
That's tantamount to saying that Rimuru will not recreate all life and the world that has become 0 through Turn Null.





Rimuru will create a world that has become 0 and it is also mentioned, how did he create Information without creating Great Spirit Sky?





How did he create the Great Spirit Sky etc without other Great Spirits being created?





Fundamental Information arises from the Great Spirit Sky, if there is no such thing then there will be no Skill, there will be no soul and so on
 
Catpija said:
The issue is, there is another statement declaring Veldanava created the world in chapter 248, which was published on the 6th of July 2014 at syosetsu. 7 months after Fuse's answer. Either he retconned it/changed his mind near the end of the story, or he forgot (again).
Click to expand...
to clarify this
- your scan said "veldanava was alone in this empty world, blah blah blah created life" which still doesn't go against the plot and notion of author as well
-world here means <space-time> like I said
through this ;
《その通りです。ユウキの攻撃により、我々は時空の彼方へと飛ばされました。星の寿命はとっくに尽きておりましたが、世界の崩壊へは至っていませんでした。その事から推測するに、ユウキは世界そのものを崩壊させる事は出来なかったのでしょう。連続時空体としての星を全て破壊した段階で、彼の寿命も尽きたのだと推測します。ですが、それで彼の望みが果たされたのかは判断出来かねます。その後は漂うように宇宙を彷徨い、この宇宙の終わりを見届けたのです》
Click to expand...
is enough piece of evidence+all of my arguments on td1 downgrade in op that rimuru+veldanava≠trans-dual over the yin-yang great spirits
 
If Rimuru wants to create a world with Turn null then the world must have a Great Spirit, while when Rimuru is thrown all the Great Spirits have been destroyed so of course he must create all the Great Spirits so that there is another life there.

The Great Spirit Sky creates the lives of humans and monsters, and Information that forms many things important for life, while the Great Spirit Sky must be born from Great Spirit Darkness and Light, Great Spirit Light will also not exist without the Great Holy Spirit.

In other words, without the Great Spirit there will also be no life there and there is no world
 
Rizkykarbit said:

That's tantamount to saying that Rimuru will not recreate all life and the world that has become 0 through Turn Null.





Rimuru will create a world that has become 0 and it is also mentioned, how did he create Information without creating Great Spirit Sky?





How did he create the Great Spirit Sky etc without other Great Spirits being created?





Fundamental Information arises from the Great Spirit Sky, if there is no such thing then there will be no Skill, there will be no soul and so on
Click to expand...
Starfeldway said:
to clarify this
- your scan said "veldanava was alone in this empty world, blah blah blah created life" which still doesn't go against the plot and notion of author as well
-world here means <space-time> like I said
through this ;

is enough piece of evidence+all of my arguments on td1 downgrade in op that rimuru+veldanava≠trans-dual over the yin-yang great spirits
Click to expand...
@ImmortalDread Even if we consider the Author's Statement to exist, it existed before 2014 where chapter 248 appeared which means Fuse updated the word yes with evidence that Veldanava was born in a pure void with nothing and he created the world, it should have refuted the evidence
 
gosh well since you guys didn't really read op here:
And the last contradiction-ish thing.

＞Verdanava, the "Star King Dragon. The creator of this world.


Isn't this a to the story?


The owner of the King of Justice is uncomfortable with creation. Does he have the ultimate version of Yuki's creator? I mean, he's a dragon species too, right? How can a being that's all out of magical elements be a holy spirit? He has a proper will to begin with, he is not a "source of power that just exists," and he is not one of those two great spirits.

Submitted by: ZeroUrashima
---- ----
November 07, 2013 at 03:37 pm

—

The world creation is difficult to explain.
　Veldanava arose after the world was created.
　After that, he was the one who adjusted the energy swirling in the primordial world and created life.
　A detailed explanation would be redundant, so I have omitted that part.
Fuse
November 07, 2013 11:49 pm
Click to expand...
here he declares veldanava use the void energy swirling around the primordial world the primordial world is 原始宇宙 the world that spun around without purpose an empheral existence after light and darkness were born
fuse also didn't really forget anything because;
After all, [Turn Null] , as indicated by its name, was pure and super dense energy that destroyed everything. A super-tier level ability that allowed the destruction of the existing world and even the creation of a new world.

it was said that Veldanava lost [Turn Null] after he created this world, and was left with essence breeder reactor
Click to expand...
just energy that's all, as for evenveldora is fine this entails turn null regulates space time nothing more than this, he created the world- space time but didn't create reality - the holy spirit happened to just exist aanyways and turn null is name of the ability what the ability do is regulate energy from primordial world- voided space then use it how they want to use it
with enough energy they can create a world
 
I don't use argument of author which contradicts plot anyways
so this doesn't contradict anything
 
Starfeldway said:
gosh well since you guys didn't really read op here:

here he declares veldanava use the void energy swirling around the primordial world the primordial world is 原始宇宙 the world that spun around without purpose an empheral existence after light and darkness were born
fuse also didn't really forget anything because;

just energy that's all, as for evenveldora is fine this entails turn null regulates space time nothing more than this, he created the world- space time but didn't create reality - the holy spirit happened to just exist aanyways and turn null is name of the ability what the ability do is regulate energy from primordial world- voided space then use it how they want to use it
with enough energy they can create a world
Click to expand...
In the November 07 publication, 2013 it is the statement you use.

While chapter 248 in the publication 2014/07/06 https://gyazo.com/4c1c1a62bca021b1cc9ecb0811218f5a
 
ImmortalDread said:
To be transdual, you need to show qualitative superiority over specific nonduals or show immunities against attacks that are reliant on nondual. In our case, neither of them are shown.
Click to expand...
funny they still think rimuru was sent to a place with no great spirit
when we provided raws
虚無に力が満ちている。
　これが聖霊である。大いなる聖霊は、ただ存在するだけの力の源。
　そんな中、光と闇、２柱の大精霊が生じた。
　世界が誕生した瞬間であった。
　しかし、世界はただ、漂うだけの存在である。
　光と影、陰と陽。互いに交わろうとしても叶わぬ存在。
　ある時、時の大精霊が生まれる。
　それは、光と闇の子としての存在。
　そして、世界は動き出した。
　動き出した世界は回る。目的も無くぐるぐると。
　その、生と死、一方通行に進む流れの中で。
　地・水・火・風・空という５柱の大精霊が誕生する。
　世界は、相互に干渉しあい、やがて安定する。
　これが、大いなる８柱の大精霊。
　そして、世界に光が満ち、闇に覆われて。
　新たな精霊達が誕生し、消えていく。
　生と死。
　世界がいつか終わりを迎えるその時まで……”
Click to expand...
you can use any translation at all and it won't give you "a new spirit is born erasing all"
thunderian only use the part where they are yin-yang but cut off part they didn't die but they are replaced by new ones
he then used that ass translation which said new spirit can and erase all
this @Rizkykarbit guy argues rimuru survived the death of great spirits which makes him unaffected by dual or something and he can create new world with great spirits which was never shown

Veldanava merely took control of the primordial energy/cosmic soup/imaginary collapse and sorted it into the universe/s.
Click to expand...
I find it hard to see how this contradicts everything I said
 
Starfeldway said:
funny they still think rimuru was sent to a place with no great spirit
when we provided raws

you can use any translation at all and it won't give you "a new spirit is born erasing all"
thunderian only use the part where they are yin-yang but cut off part they didn't die but they are replaced by new ones
he then used that ass translation which said new spirit can and erase all
this @Rizkykarbit guy argues rimuru survived the death of great spirits which makes him unaffected by dual or something and he can create new world with great spirits which was never shown


I find it hard to see how this contradicts everything I said
Click to expand...
Thunderian uses translations from the web that have translated Web Novels and does not use Raw because if you use Raw it will often occur errors then Thunderian uses translations from a direct web
 

Read Light Novels Online For Free | Web Novel Pub

Special platform where you can read the translated versions of world famous Japanese Light Novels, Chinese Light Novels and Korean Light Novels in English. Start reading now to explore this mysterious fantasy world.
www.webnovelpub.com

This is what I found, and they both use the word ‘Until a new spirit is born, erasing all’ I don’t know if this is the same as what Thunderian uses or not but if this is different then other sites also use the word
 
Starfeldway said:
to clarify this
- your scan said "veldanava was alone in this empty world, blah blah blah created life" which still doesn't go against the plot and notion of author as well
-world here means <space-time> like I said
through this
Click to expand...
You missed the part that said Veldanava created the world. You also just send a scan which support this 🗿

After all, [Turn Null] , as indicated by its name, was pure and super dense energy that destroyed everything. A super-tier level ability that allowed the destruction of the existing world and even the creation of a new world.

it was said that Veldanava lost [Turn Null] after he created this world, and was left with essence breeder reactor
Click to expand...
 
Starfeldway said:
translation have no issues, thunderian translation was off.
he also only showed the part that great spirit of light and darkness are yin-yang but cut off the part that great spirit were never killed by any new spirit, he relied on the other one which said great spirits were killed by some new spirit
so yeah
Click to expand...
That's literally what i just said...
 
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