MFTL Part 1 (JJBA)

[StrymULTRA]

Alright, this has been coming from a long time.

The argument

The entire thing is, again, based on Dio being weaker than his Part 1 self due to Jonathan's body rejecting him. And as you can see, the regeneration is slowed on the left part of his body, as also shown from Dio's regeneration not being as powerful as it is normally when his head is hit on the left side, when in Part 1 he's fine with his entire body being sliced in half, head included.

Another supportive evidence:

• The Over Heaven novel, where it's stated that Dio cannot control well its vampiric powers due to Jonathan's body rejecting him.
• Dio straight up becoming stronger than he ever was after absorbing Joseph's body, and with the databook saying that Dio becomes stronger the more he is in sync with Jonathan's body.

Meaning that Part 1 Dio and everyone who scales from him should be MFTL, as it does not make sense for him becoming weaker than before, but also getting a bazzillion times faster outta nowhere.

Counter-arguments

Alright, even here, let's counter some shit that can be used against this...

• But Dio got MFTL only after getting a stand

So what? Part 2 Joseph is MFTL due to him upscaling from his Part 3 self due to him no longer being in his prime. Yeah I know the entire "but Joseph had likely Hermit Purple already in Part 2" thing, but the main issue is that Hermit Purple is very weak compared to the other stands, and Joseph himself is much above it. So getting a stand has 0 impact on the physical speed, also because it was never and ever stated that getting a stand makes a user physically stronger or faster.

• But that would make Part 1 > Part 3 in stats

So what (2)? Jojo is not your average Shonen in power creep, this is not Dragon Ball where everyone becomes stronger than the last arc, heck, Part 4 and 5 are generally weaker than Part 3 in physical power for example, so I do not see why would that contradict anything. We have already Part 2 as stronger than Part 3 in physical stats, so why shouldn't Part 1 too?

Conclusion

Dio Brando should be MFTL via upscaling from his (base) Part 3 self.

Post-Deep Pass Overdrive Jonathan Joestar should scale too for obvious reasons, as Dio was causal asf all the time with other characters, and MFTL Straizo implies MFTL Pre-training Joseph with is bad, so only Peak Part 1 Dio and Peak Jonathan should scale from this.

 

[Shmooply]

This seems a little iffy to me, but the argument does make sense. Count me as neutral but leaning to agree.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Bump

 

[Dalesean027]

@Chariot190

 

[Shmooply]

@Chariot190

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I agree MFTL scaling is solid.

 

[Chariot190]

The entire thing is, again, based on Dio being weaker than his Part 1 self due to Jonathan's body rejecting him. And as you can see, the regeneration is slowed on the left part of his body,

There's an issue with this, in that it's only his left side, which indirectly means that his right side is functioning normally and is comparable to his Part 1 self, but we also know that while his left side isn't up to par, they specify explicitly for that to be the case with immortality/healing, not power. And we see from his feats within Part 3 that his left and right side, at least when it comes to performance, aren't notably different in the slightest.
All that changed is his body's vulnerability on the left side, his body isn't perfectly immortal due to that, and he says so himself.

Also wanna point out how the raws say "弱い" for the word "weak", which doesn't mean weak in terms of strength or whatever, but rather, he's saying the left side of his body is more delicate, frail, etc, compared to the right, which the context and various other lines straight up tell us is talking about his immortality and invulnerability, not actual stats. Sauce.

This can't be used as an argument for physical stats.

Dio straight up becoming stronger than he ever was after absorbing Joseph's body,

This is true, but he also becomes more powerful than his Part 3 self and Part 1 self.
This isn't a good indication of anything, he gets stronger after drinking Joseph's blood, but how strong was he initially? He could be just as strong as his Part 1 self, and the statement would still be true, he's more powerful than ever before.
Plus, DIO gets stronger every time he drinks blood, Joseph's just had a bunch of extra benefits and was better than most, though it is in part due to fixing the body rejecting him, this argument can't be used at all to say in this state he's now as strong as his Part 1 self after fixing it, because he's actually even stronger.

The Over Heaven novel, where it's stated that Dio cannot control well its vampiric powers due to Jonathan's body rejecting him.

Bruh, that's a noncanon light novel written by the author of Monogatari with zero input from Araki and takes multiple liberties for the sake of compelling character writing and plot explanation. It's unusable, it's about as usable as Jorge Joestar in terms of canon.

Araki has stated DIO didn't use his vampiric powers in Part 3 simply because DIO felt they were outdated and The World was better.

And if you include other canons, in Capcom's game, DIO can use things like SRSE just fine even in Shadow, and in the Sound Drama, DIO actually uses some of his abilities.
This isn't support and if you bring in non-canon material, there's actually more to say this isn't particularly true.

as also shown from Dio's regeneration not being as powerful as it is normally when his head is hit on the left side, when in Part 1 he's fine with his entire body being sliced in half, head included.

This argument is sussy af ngl, and leaves out an important piece of evidence, in that the latter DIO is bisected sure, but in the former, his head wasn't just "hit on the left side of his head", his Brain was straight up destroyed by that punch (it's more explicit in the raws, but even in the album, DIO himself flat-out says "my brain was destroyed") and as we all know, total destruction of the brain can kill a vampire. That even applies to Part 1 Dio, explicitly.

Star Platinum smashing his skull in and destroying his brain >> Merely having his brain cut in half (bisecting his body is a nonfactor, that isn't lethal in either incarnation), the damage of the former might not seem higher, but contextually, it is, and would have also put Part 1 Dio on his ass.

This also doesn't have any indication of strength even disregarding that context, because we all know his immortality was ******, they explicitly say as much, but power? No such thing, and as outlined already, stat wise, his left and right side aren't that different and if only his left side is ******, it means his right side isn't and by proxy, his left side stat wise can not be that different from his normal strength, merely healing.

So what (2)? Jojo is not your average Shonen in power creep, this is not Dragon Ball where everyone becomes stronger than the last arc, heck, Part 4 and 5 are generally weaker than Part 3 in physical power for example, so I do not see why would that contradict anything. We have already Part 2 as stronger than Part 3 in physical stats, so why shouldn't Part 1 too?

This one isn't even true, Part 3 would still be > Part 1.
We also don't have Part 2 as > Part 3 in terms of physical stats.
Star Platinum outstats all of Part 1 and 2 (ult dont count) from feats alone. And he absolutely dogwalks DIO and even High DIO.

But you are right, Araki has even gone on record stating he basically hates powercreep, and after Part 3 specifically, he started to tone shit down, and made it so even if you could throw a strong punch that doesn't mean you're actually strong or even someone weak could be dangerous, he even got some fanmail bitching about Kira not being shit compared to DIO.
Part 3 was the last real shounen-esque part of JoJo.

But objectively speaking this is wrong, even with the upgrade Part 3 >>> Part 1 still, and HIGH DIO >>> Part 1 Dio upgrade or not.

and with the databook saying that Dio becomes stronger the more he is in sync with Jonathan's body.

This is actually referring to The World, not DIO himself. Not that such a thing isn't true, it's just that scan is talking about HIGH The World.

Meaning that Part 1 Dio and everyone who scales from him should be MFTL, as it does not make sense for him becoming weaker than before, but also getting a bazzillion times faster outta nowhere.

DIO in Part 3 isn't even really any weaker, his immortality is ****** up, but that's all they ever say, and to be specific, it's only his left side that's ******, as in, his right side is fine.

Now despite all this, while I may not agree with the arguments presented and even find a few objectively out of context, I do lowkey agree, literally, no reason exists for why DIO in Part 3 would be faster than Part 1, he might not have gotten physically far weaker statwise, but it's not like he got any better either, he was kind of in a state of limbo, statwise they should be comparable and shit like "well he got a stand so he's faster" doesn't work unless stated.

And luckily, no real anti-feats exist, this would only scale to Peak Part 1 Dio (After he boosted his power via blood) and Post-Deep Pass Jonathan, fortunately, nobody scales to them, and in fact, they're multiple blitzes above the rest of the cast, see Tarkus literally nothin personnel'ing Will Zeppeli, and yet Post-Deep Jonathan and DIO both explicitly being faster than his peak speed.
Not even Petty or Dire scale, Dire was treated as a joke and only got a hit from Dio's blindspot while he was offguard and Dio assumed he was dead most people dont live as just a head, besides Dio and Petty didn't do shit at all. Straizo also didn't do shit, in fact at the time he was kinda new to Hamon training and had far less training than Will be decades, who gets blitzed DBZ style by these two lads.

The only real arguments I can see is that Part 3 DIO drinking blood from a bunch of women everyday boosted his speed, given that's literally how it works, but it was also presented in Part 3 that due to his body rejecting him he was kind of in a state of limbo and he needed Joestar Blood in specific to fix the body and get a boost.
There's also how The World and DIO might have shared senses much like Plat and Jotaro, and thus DIO could mooch off TW's reactions, but that's never hinted at to be the case.
The last thing is how, narratively, Part 1 had no FTL shit and is only becoming that fast retroactively due to FTL shit becoming more of a thing down the line, because let's be real, while writing Part 1 Araki obviously had zero intention of Part 1 dudes being FTL, the issue comes with the fact he obviously wanted Part 3 dudes to be FTL like Plat, and DIO explicitly scales, and as such we have an intended FTL DIO and a not intended FTL Dio both scaling to each other because obviously. Though as an argument that's kind of a "who gives a shit lmao".

There are some issues with this tho, probably in part due to the narrative thing mentioned prior, but that's no fault of Jonathan or Dio (Part 1), so fuckm, Likely or flatout should be aight. But if we want to be conservative, possibly could work just say that araki is a backpedaling mf and keep with what we got
Personally, I'm fine with likely MFTL reactions or whatever for those two. Nobody in Part 1 scales though, at all.
im already working on a jonathan and dio sandbox tho, with human keys and the fabled pipe bomb and swaying so would rather just update it then instead of now, would allow me to get all the relevant scans, interviews and what not cited as well. They're actually almost completely done, just need to gather hamon scans from part 2 that apply to Part 1 like certain mechanics to finish up.

@Chariot190

Already discussing it with the boys in chat which you're apart of
The conclusion was it checks out for them, but only them

 

[Chariot190]

 

[StrymULTRA]

Ayeee I ain't replying to all of this holy shit.

But some stuff I'd like to double check.

This is true, but he also becomes more powerful than his Part 3 self and Part 1 self.
This isn't a good indication of anything, he gets stronger after drinking Joseph's blood, but how strong was he initially? He could be just as strong as his Part 1 self, and the statement would still be true, he's more powerful than ever before.
Plus, DIO gets stronger every time he drinks blood, Joseph's just had a bunch of extra benefits and was better than most, though it is in part due to fixing the body rejecting him, this argument can't be used at all to say in this state he's now as strong as his Part 1 self after fixing it, because he's actually even stronger.

What I meant is that he never considered himself stronger than his past self, just with his regenerative powers messed up, he does not point out that he is physically stronger than his P1 self until absorbing Joseph's blood, he only said he "surpassed new heights with his Stand" and that mumbo jumbo.

So I do not think it's that useless of an evidence, it can point out that Dio did not get any increase in physical power until becoming HIGH.

This argument is sussy af ngl, and leaves out an important piece of evidence, in that the latter DIO is bisected sure, but in the former, his head wasn't just "hit on the left side of his head", his Brain was straight up destroyed by that punch (it's more explicit in the raws, but even in the album, DIO himself flat-out says "my brain was destroyed") and as we all know, total destruction of the brain can kill a vampire. That even applies to Part 1 Dio, explicitly.

Star Platinum smashing his skull in and destroying his brain >> Merely having his brain cut in half (bisecting his body is a nonfactor, that isn't lethal in either incarnation), the damage of the former might not seem higher, but contextually, it is, and would have also put Part 1 Dio on his ass.

This also doesn't have any indication of strength even disregarding that context, because we all know his immortality was ******, they explicitly say as much, but power? No such thing, and as outlined already, stat wise, his left and right side aren't that different and if only his left side is ******, it means his right side isn't and by proxy, his left side stat wise can not be that different from his normal strength, merely healing.

Wouldn't that remove the "likely" from the High 8-C rating his Part 3 self has on the profile, btw?

Now despite all this, while I may not agree with the arguments presented and even find a few objectively out of context, I do lowkey agree, literally, no reason exists for why DIO in Part 3 would be faster than Part 1, he might not have gotten physically far weaker statwise, but it's not like he got any better either, he was kind of in a state of limbo, statwise they should be comparable and shit like "well he got a stand so he's faster" doesn't work unless stated.

And luckily, no real anti-feats exist, this would only scale to Peak Part 1 Dio (After he boosted his power via blood) and Post-Deep Pass Jonathan, fortunately, nobody scales to them, and in fact, they're multiple blitzes above the rest of the cast, see Tarkus literally nothin personnel'ing Will Zeppeli, and yet Post-Deep Jonathan and DIO both explicitly being faster than his peak speed.
Not even Petty or Dire scale, Dire was treated as a joke and only got a hit from Dio's blindspot while he was offguard and Dio assumed he was dead most people dont live as just a head, besides Dio and Petty didn't do shit at all. Straizo also didn't do shit, in fact at the time he was kinda new to Hamon training and had far less training than Will be decades, who gets blitzed DBZ style by these two lads.

The only real arguments I can see is that Part 3 DIO drinking blood from a bunch of women everyday boosted his speed, given that's literally how it works, but it was also presented in Part 3 that due to his body rejecting him he was kind of in a state of limbo and he needed Joestar Blood in specific to fix the body and get a boost.
There's also how The World and DIO might have shared senses much like Plat and Jotaro, and thus DIO could mooch off TW's reactions, but that's never hinted at to be the case.
The last thing is how, narratively, Part 1 had no FTL shit and is only becoming that fast retroactively due to FTL shit becoming more of a thing down the line, because let's be real, while writing Part 1 Araki obviously had zero intention of Part 1 dudes being FTL, the issue comes with the fact he obviously wanted Part 3 dudes to be FTL like Plat, and DIO explicitly scales, and as such we have an intended FTL DIO and a not intended FTL Dio both scaling to each other because obviously. Though as an argument that's kind of a "who gives a shit lmao".

There are some issues with this tho, probably in part due to the narrative thing mentioned prior, but that's no fault of Jonathan or Dio (Part 1), so fuckm, Likely or flatout should be aight. But if we want to be conservative, possibly could work just say that araki is a backpedaling mf and keep with what we got
Personally, I'm fine with likely MFTL reactions or whatever for those two. Nobody in Part 1 scales though, at all.
im already working on a jonathan and dio sandbox tho, with human keys and the fabled pipe bomb and swaying so would rather just update it then instead of now, would allow me to get all the relevant scans, interviews and what not cited as well. They're actually almost completely done, just need to gather hamon scans from part 2 that apply to Part 1 like certain mechanics to finish up.

I forgot the edit out the "all Part 1 charas scale" from the OP as I forgot the bs I did, I know that only Dio himself and Post-Deep Pass Overdrive Jonathan scale, I just have messed up at start due to me being a bit confused from the "eh all of them are Hypersonic+ so why not lol".

Some scans about Part 1 Dio blitzing the Hypersonic+ characters while being serious would be nice though.

 

[Chariot190]

What I meant is that he never considered himself stronger than his past self, just with his regenerative powers messed up, he does not point out that he is physically stronger than his P1 self until absorbing Joseph's blood, he only said he "surpassed new heights with his Stand" and that mumbo jumbo.

Doesn't need to say that tho, why would he? He obviously isn't stronger, but that doesn't mean he's physically weaker either.
He explicitly goes and explains what the issue is, they never say speed, they never say power, they explain that its due to the immortality, and even the exact wording used in the raws reflects this with the word being used to indicate delicateness and whatnot, not strength. The argument that Part 3 Dio is weaker than Part 1 is made up (in power), and coupled with the fact it'd only be his left side that would be physically weaker even if it was true, that by proxy means his right side isn't weaker at all, and we see throughout his fights both sides, physically, are comparable, or at least no noticeable enough difference to say it's a difference worth a damn.

He doesn't need to say he's stronger than his Part 1 self (I'm not saying Part 3 DIO > Part 1 Dio btw, just that they're in the same ballpark or comparable), but he does need to say his physical stats took a blow for this to be an argument, he could be the exact same strength for all we know, and based on what we do know, that would be the case. Matter of fact is, they never say he got physically weaker and he's honestly demonstrably not.

I kinda agree with the end result of the CRT anyway though so not like it matters much.

Wouldn't that remove the "likely" from the High 8-C rating his Part 3 self has on the profile, btw?

probably, kinda plan on doing so for every character that wounded his right side too just to be safe, which really only results in 3 changes tbh. Though ultimate that's only a slight difference of 0.004 tons.

Some scans about Part 1 Dio blitzing the Hypersonic+ characters while being serious would be nice though.

Less him, more Tarkus who both Jonathan and Dio meme on so like, they actually scale above dudes who blitz Hypersonic+ dudes.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Doesn't need to say that tho, why would he? He obviously isn't stronger, but that doesn't mean he's physically weaker either.
He explicitly goes and explains what the issue is, they never say speed, they never say power, they explain that its due to the immortality, and even the exact wording used in the raws reflects this with the word being used to indicate delicateness and whatnot, not strength. The argument that Part 3 Dio is weaker than Part 1 is made up (in power), and coupled with the fact it'd only be his left side that would be physically weaker even if it was true, that by proxy means his right side isn't weaker at all, and we see throughout his fights both sides, physically, are comparable, or at least no noticeable enough difference to say it's a difference worth a damn.

He doesn't need to say he's stronger than his Part 1 self (I'm not saying Part 3 DIO > Part 1 Dio btw, just that they're in the same ballpark or comparable), but he does need to say his physical stats took a blow for this to be an argument, he could be the exact same strength for all we know, and based on what we do know, that would be the case. Matter of fact is, they never say he got physically weaker and he's honestly demonstrably not.

Meh, this would mean that we change his justification to " Large Building level (Shouldn't be too different than his peak during Part 1 power-wise. Consistently deflected Emerald Splash, even with just one finger) " or something.

Less him, more Tarkus who both Jonathan and Dio meme on so like, they actually scale above dudes who blitz Hypersonic+ dudes.

Dio has blitzed Dire, with Dire hitting him only due to Dio being off-guard later.



Tho I would not call this a blitz.

 

[Chariot190]

Meh, this would mean that we change his justification to " Large Building level (Shouldn't be too different than his peak during Part 1 power-wise. Consistently deflected Emerald Splash, even with just one finger) " or something.

There are better ways to go about it than just that, also needs proper scans explaining as such, and deflecting the ES is support, not a good enough foundation.

Dio has blitzed Dire, with Dire hitting him only due to Dio being off-guard later.

I already mentioned the latter bit in my first post, but wouldn't exactly call that a blitz. He just flash froze him before he finished the attack, but his attack by nature has stages. Especially the first bit where the lunge is deliberately made slow, so his foes catch it, leaving them open for the cross attack.

This is by definition a blitz, Will attacks, and his kick is mere inches away from landing but Tarkus dodges it completely, moving like a blur, and appearing behind Zeppeli.
He covered substantially more distance compared to Will, before the attack hit.
If you don't think of that as a blitz, then, unfortunately, there's a lack of actual blitzing involved.


Perhaps this will convey what's happening in that scene a bit better.

 

[StrymULTRA]

There are better ways to go about it than just that, also needs proper scans explaining as such, and deflecting the ES is support, not a good enough foundation.

That's just what was in the profile tho :x

I already mentioned the latter bit in my first post, but wouldn't exactly call that a blitz. He just flash froze him before he finished the attack, but his attack by nature has stages. Especially the first bit where the lunge is deliberately made slow, so his foes catch it, leaving them open for the cross attack.

But Dio called Dire slow as ****, so Idk about that chief.

This is by definition a blitz, Will attacks, and his kick is mere inches away from landing but Tarkus dodges it completely, moving like a blur, and appearing behind Zeppeli.
He covered substantially more distance compared to Will, before the attack hit.
If you don't think of that as a blitz, then, unfortunately, there's a lack of actual blitzing involved.

Perhaps this will convey what's happening in that scene a bit better.

So, you're telling me that in speed we have Post-Boostorwhateverthefuckiscalled Jonathan > Tarkus > Will ≈ Pre-Boost Jonathan.

 

[Chariot190]

That's just what was in the profile tho :x

profile stinky

doesnt even have blood manip & stat amp due to it as if that wasn't a critical part of both part 1 and 3

But Dio called Dire slow as ****, so Idk about that chief.

So did Jonathan, the way the move works is he lunges at people with a slow kick, due to being so slow people grab it thinking nothing of it, when they grab it he begins his real attack fr, spreading their arms open, preventing them from blocking as their hands will be preoccupied with his fake out kick, and then he cross splits them while they can't block.

That isn't to say Dire ain't slow as **** compared to Dio, he is, it's just that Dio calling him slow in that specific instance there was a deliberate move on Dire's part.

So, you're telling me that in speed we have Post-Boostorwhateverthefuckiscalled Jonathan > Tarkus > Will ≈ Pre-Boost Jonathan.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Checked again the fight, and it's not like Jonathan has truly blitzed Tarkus lol.

Not like Tarkus scales from Jonathan but heh.

 

[Chariot190]

?????
He doesn't need to? When did anyone, ever, in this thread say Jonathan blitzed Tarkus, what was said was Tarkus blitzed Will, which is objectively true.
it's like you're arguing against your own thread now

 

[StrymULTRA]

?????
He doesn't need to? When did anyone, ever, in this thread say Jonathan blitzed Tarkus, what was said was Tarkus blitzed Will, which is objectively true.
it's like you're arguing against your own thread now

I just wanted an excuse to bump the thread + point something out lol.

 

[Damage3245]

I'm neutral on this.

 

[StrymULTRA]

@Chariot190

Ur opinion btw?

 

[Dalesean027]

Ur opinion btw?

Neutral as well I suppose

 

[Baken384]

MFTL Pre Training Joseph oh hell naaahh
that is the only thing ruining it for me

 

[Chariot190]

MFTL Pre Training Joseph oh hell naaahh
that is the only thing ruining it for me

Literally nobody said that was a thing.

 

[It_is_i_wyatt]

not a super well thought out argument, just my thoughts on this

i generally find it hard to take part 1 characters being randomly 23 shitfuckzillion times slower than every single other character from any part down to the 2 episode long fodder villains seriously, every other part is bare minimum relativistic (or apparently MHS for part 6?) so the strongest vampire ever (right?) and the greatest hamon users of their time being only hyper+ is strange, they should at least scale to untrained joseph dodging the aja laser, cause hes, yknow, untrained

 

[Chariot190]

i generally find it hard to take part 1 characters being randomly 23 shitfuckzillion times slower than every single other character from any part down to the 2 episode long fodder villains seriously, every other part is bare minimum relativistic (or apparently MHS for part 6?) so the strongest vampire ever (right?) and the greatest hamon users of their time being only hyper+ is strange,

That's an argument from incredulity ngl, they get what they get, if they have no reason to scale, they just don't, and if they don't got feats to fall back on, they just kinda ******. Will also explicitly caps at Hyper+.

At least they aren't Part 6 tbh.

untrained joseph dodging the aja laser, cause hes, yknow, untrained

This is untrue, he performed that feat at the very end of his training, immediately after the feat lisa says once they get back they'll fight Messina and Loggins for the final test, literally same day he fought Acdc.

 

[Omegabronic]

chariot proving once again why he is the absolutely best user on this wiki, he achieves being rude without effending anyone and never fails to make me unconciously giggle and be happy, this was you gaining a simp btw

yeah, i agree for chariot's reasons mostly, but since there isn't any conclusive evidende for him being weaker or stronger, can't we setle with a "possible" or "likely" rating?

 

[Chariot190]

It's fine, Strym knows how it be.

I think that's the wrong way to go about this tho, instead of assuming he got stronger or weaker, we should just treat it as we're told and is demonstrated, nothing more, nothing less, no need to make extra assumptions for things for the sake of it.

Personally I'm fine with likely, but it's also true that's just me being kinda cautious to be safe rather than a concrete foundation to doubt it at least one that has to do with them being MFTL, I can think of issues unrelated to the actual speed, but those exist whether they're MFTL, FTL, Hypersonic or even just basic human

 

[It_is_i_wyatt]

This is untrue, he performed that feat at the very end of his training, immediately after the feat lisa says once they get back they'll fight Messina and Loggins for the final test, literally same day he fought Acdc.

oh, i thought they did that on the way to lisa lisas island

 

[StrymULTRA]

chariot proving once again why he is the absolutely best user on this wiki, he achieves being rude without effending anyone and never fails to make me unconciously giggle and be happy, this was you gaining a simp btw

yeah, i agree for chariot's reasons mostly, but since there isn't any conclusive evidende for him being weaker or stronger, can't we setle with a "possible" or "likely" rating?

Just straight up to be honest. Only two characters get this and there are no anti feats either lol.

 

[Rakih_Elyan]

I agree yeah.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Bump

 

[Omegabronic]

Just straight up to be honest. Only two characters get this and there are no anti feats either lol.

I get that, but it is better to be safe than sorry, right?

 

[StrymULTRA]

I get that, but it is better to be safe than sorry, right?

Meh, none seems to really push towards likely tho.

 

[Axl233]

All of this just for jolyne to get soloed and blitzed even by a standless part 1.

 

[Chariot190]

All of this just for jolyne to get soloed and blitzed even by part 1.

So nothing changes then.

 

[Axl233]

So nothing changes then.

Chariot i can't

 

[Omegabronic]

All of this just for jolyne to get soloed and blitzed even by a standless part 1.

don't forget josuke too

 

[StrymULTRA]

Bump

 

[Psychomaster35]

This should be fine

 

[StrymULTRA]

bump

 

[StrymULTRA]

Added the changes as it seems not not be controversial enough to Jonathan and Dio.

This can be closed.