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Scaling to Shawn killing the dweller and how is killian 8-a or mhs?
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MCU Phase 4 General Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Valiant_Abyss
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He scales to Iron Man, did you forget Iron Man 3 exists?
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Nah I just remember stark having ptsd and producing crappy suits if I remember correctly
Baken384
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ReeeeeeeeeeeYes
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Wenwu would be likely stronger than Killian
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I mean, unless we have solid proof of that, he's unfortunately weaker
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Apparently we were robbed of getting to see Wanda attack Thanos with his own army in Endgame. Not sure why they went with random debris instead.
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Why is Thanos wearing Jughead's beanie? And when you said "Attack Thanos with his own army" I thought you meant that Wanda mind haxxed Thanos' literal army, not that she just used the same trick as Thanos on Titan
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Oh no, now I can't unsee that
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I mean, in-lore the Rings alone make him stronger I think, shame we don't see that in terms of feats
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I mean, do we have statements for that?
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I mean, no but considering the Rings are super powerful artifacts apparently not from Earth...
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Ooh nice
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Hmm, I wonder if we could upgrade Hawkeye and Black Widow, plus others that scale to them. Even Nick Fury destroyed one by driving a piece of debris through its head, through it was visibly damaged already.
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And ib what if rusty widow easily decapitated one
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I hope so
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The baseline for 8-C is 0.25 tons, which is about 134% of the results of the 9-A+ calc, which comes out to 0.186 tons. I don't think upscaling Cap and other super soldier tiers to 8-C would be too far fetched, though I'm not sure what the general policy on upscaling is.
If we go with the 8-C calc, the results of 0.85 tons is 3.4 times baseline 8-C, and not overly far off from the midpoint of the tier, which should be 1.125 tons. Super soldiers in that case would probably be "At least 8-C" or "8-C+" if we consider upscaling to the midpoint acceptable in that case.
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I think the general conensus is like, 1.2x or lower
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In that case, super soldier tiers would probably just be "At least 9-A+" or "At least 8-C", depending on whether we use the 9-A+ or 8-C version of the calc.
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I thought we already have other 8-C calcs to scale them to.
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Which ones? I thought there was some dispute over whether the Wakandan spears being stated to stop tanks would be considered 9-A or 8-C, and I thought I remembered something being mentioned about a Spider-Man Far From Home feat, but I don't recall seeing any calcs come out of that.
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8-C Sonic spears would be from this calc
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Ok then
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The Fate of 8-C MCU
Baken384
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what will happen to 8-C MCU?The Fate of 8-C MCU
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The main scaling for it comes from agents of shield, which has questionable canoncitywhat will happen to 8-C MCU?
Baken384
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i dont like the sound of that
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So if we don't have any other 8-C calcs that are usable, unless the 8-C end of the Ultron Sentry calc is accepted, or we get new 8-C calcs elsewhere, Cap and others that scale to him only seem to have a bunch feats no higher than 9-A. Also, some of the AP justifications on Cap's page seem wonky at this point. Let's go through them:
Can harm Black Panther, who could tank blasts capable of destroying tanks without his suit. (Again, this doesn't seem to be a solid justification for 8-C considering how vague the tank stopping statement was)
Nearly comparable to Iron Man and Ultron. (Unless we suddenly decide to massively upgrade Cap, this should be removed considering Iron Man and Ultron have been upgraded to 8-A)
Defeated Spider-Man, and could have easily beaten him if he wanted to according to Iron Man. Fought against Red Skull, who can draw blood from him. Harmed Winter Soldier. (Scaling statements, but none of these characters seem to have any 8-C calcs themeselves)
Superior to Centipede soldiers who can blast open shipping containers. (I'm pretty sure this is not 8-C. Also, this should only be kept if we consider Agents of SHIELD canon. It should be noted that I do think an argument for that isn't impossible, but it would be confusing, considering there have been official statements supporting both ends of that argument.)
Can break reinforced glass with no trouble. Destroyed a jeep by throwing a bike at it. (These should be well below 8-C)
Harmed his past version, though he was eventually overpowered he was likely holding back. (Evidence he can harm himself at least)
Destroyed part of a highway pillar by throwing Ultron into it. Can easily shatter Ultron Sentries (Nothing above 9-A, though the Ultron Sentry calc will likely be replaced by the new one if it's accepted, in which case we'll have justification for 9-A+ at least, if not 8-C)
Can harm Black Panther, who could tank blasts capable of destroying tanks without his suit. (Again, this doesn't seem to be a solid justification for 8-C considering how vague the tank stopping statement was)
Nearly comparable to Iron Man and Ultron. (Unless we suddenly decide to massively upgrade Cap, this should be removed considering Iron Man and Ultron have been upgraded to 8-A)
Defeated Spider-Man, and could have easily beaten him if he wanted to according to Iron Man. Fought against Red Skull, who can draw blood from him. Harmed Winter Soldier. (Scaling statements, but none of these characters seem to have any 8-C calcs themeselves)
Superior to Centipede soldiers who can blast open shipping containers. (I'm pretty sure this is not 8-C. Also, this should only be kept if we consider Agents of SHIELD canon. It should be noted that I do think an argument for that isn't impossible, but it would be confusing, considering there have been official statements supporting both ends of that argument.)
Can break reinforced glass with no trouble. Destroyed a jeep by throwing a bike at it. (These should be well below 8-C)
Harmed his past version, though he was eventually overpowered he was likely holding back. (Evidence he can harm himself at least)
Destroyed part of a highway pillar by throwing Ultron into it. Can easily shatter Ultron Sentries (Nothing above 9-A, though the Ultron Sentry calc will likely be replaced by the new one if it's accepted, in which case we'll have justification for 9-A+ at least, if not 8-C)
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Ultron is "At least 8-C" and Iron Man Mark 1 - 5 are 8-C - 8-C+, but yeah
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Ultron is At least 8-C via scaling to Cap, not Iron Man
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He's consistently much lower in terms of feats and scaling, and he himself doesn't have much to scale to Iron Man level characters
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Huh, I had thought Ultron was still downscaling to Iron Man. Still, this causes Ultron's durability justification to look weird:
Durability: At least Building level (Survived hits from Iron Man, took no damage from the Quinjet's minigun) So Ultron's justification for having at least 8-C durability is from surviving hits from the Mark 43 Iron Man, which is 8-A?
Also, Cap never even interacted with an Iron Man armor earlier than the Mark 6, so I'm not sure why he would specifically scale to those suits.
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